New Breton Furnishing plans

AllenaNightWood · July 6

is is me or are the new plans from u50 got a really low drop

ESO_player123 · July 6

Yes, both Glenumbra and Summerset new furnishing plans have an abysmally low drop chance.

j3z3b3l · July 12

The worst of all updates for plan drop rates. Course that will probably change over time. Considering dropping this update until later for the plans.

LunaFlora · July 12

super low drop chances sadly

BretonMage · July 20

Super happy to see this!

LunaFlora · July 20

BretonMage wrote: »

Super happy to see this!

that is awesome

MidnightDuel · August 3

Players are not seeing "Significantly increased" drops of the new Breton-themed furnishing plans. What percentage of an increase is "Significant" to ZOS anyway? After all, zero times anything is still zero.

Since theU50 incremental patch 2, I've seen more of the old Breton plans drop in Rivenspire, Stormhaven, and Glenumbra but none of the new plans. "None," as in "ZERO."

If there was a meaningful increase in the drop rates of the new plans, there should also be more plans available on the Guild Traders. There aren't. Since U50 dropped, I've seen exactly two plans for the Blueprint: Secret Door, Bookcase plans go up for sale on Guild Traders. Same for the Pattern: Breton Drapes, Maroon and the none for the Sage variant.

One should note that the old drape plan (Pattern: Breton Drapes, Grand) is selling on traders for ten times what it was selling before U50, because it's a purple plan and the new plans are so extremely rare.

Unlike new plans introduced with new zones, there are few base-game locations with a reliable supply of loot-able containers that players can farm for new plans. And the few new locations added with the Thieves Guild story in Glenumbra are both content-locked but overrun with players. Every container is usually already empty or dropping useless recipes and ten-year-old plans.

To simply "match other furnishing recipe drop rates" for new plans is not good enough, especially when the loot tables are already saturated with thousands of worthless green and blue quality plans. It should be a given that Breton plans drop in Breton-themed zones, but instead players get worthless Khajiit, Redguard and Argonian plans far more frequently. Suggesting a rework of loot tables to match each zone is foolhardy given the recent staff cuts.

New plans should have drop-rates greater than existing plans, not the same as or less than other plans. Paying extortionist prices from traders when one of the plans actually shows up isn't an option. Waiting a year for the new plans to show up in Faustina's purchasable documents only to buy a chance at the new plans with vouchers is also not something players enjoy. Once again, housing-related items are locked behind impossible drop rates and grind.

Dalsinthus · August 3

BretonMage wrote: »

Super happy to see this!

I don't think they actually increased the drop rates with this update. I suspect something is bugged with the patch. Since this went into effect, I've received zero drops of the new plans. There are now fewer plans in the guild traders before this was changed. Seems like something has gone wrong here. It's wild how rare the new plans are, particularly the purples.

ESO_player123 · August 4

MidnightDuel wrote: »

Players are not seeing "Significantly increased" drops of the new Breton-themed furnishing plans. What percentage of an increase is "Significant" to ZOS anyway? After all, zero times anything is still zero.

Since theU50 incremental patch 2, I've seen more of the old Breton plans drop in Rivenspire, Stormhaven, and Glenumbra but none of the new plans. "None," as in "ZERO."

If there was a meaningful increase in the drop rates of the new plans, there should also be more plans available on the Guild Traders. There aren't. Since U50 dropped, I've seen exactly two plans for the Blueprint: Secret Door, Bookcase plans go up for sale on Guild Traders. Same for the Pattern: Breton Drapes, Maroon and the none for the Sage variant.

One should note that the old drape plan (Pattern: Breton Drapes, Grand) is selling on traders for ten times what it was selling before U50, because it's a purple plan and the new plans are so extremely rare.

Unlike new plans introduced with new zones, there are few base-game locations with a reliable supply of loot-able containers that players can farm for new plans. And the few new locations added with the Thieves Guild story in Glenumbra are both content-locked but overrun with players. Every container is usually already empty or dropping useless recipes and ten-year-old plans.

To simply "match other furnishing recipe drop rates" for new plans is not good enough, especially when the loot tables are already saturated with thousands of worthless green and blue quality plans. It should be a given that Breton plans drop in Breton-themed zones, but instead players get worthless Khajiit, Redguard and Argonian plans far more frequently. Suggesting a rework of loot tables to match each zone is foolhardy given the recent staff cuts.

New plans should have drop-rates greater than existing plans, not the same as or less than other plans. Paying extortionist prices from traders when one of the plans actually shows up isn't an option. Waiting a year for the new plans to show up in Faustina's purchasable documents only to buy a chance at the new plans with vouchers is also not something players enjoy. Once again, housing-related items are locked behind impossible drop rates and grind.

Many of the new plans drop outside of Glenumbra/Stormheaven/Rivenspire too. Someone reported pulling a new mushroom barrel plan from a container in starter the room in AI. I had several plans while looting containers in Outcast Inn in West Weald and Broken Light temple in Solstice (including that secret door bookcase).

MidnightDuel · August 4

ESO_player123 wrote: »

Many of the new plans drop outside of Glenumbra/Stormheaven/Rivenspire too. Someone reported pulling a new mushroom barrel plan from a container in starter the room in AI. I had several plans while looting containers in Outcast Inn in West Weald and Broken Light temple in Solstice (including that secret door bookcase).

Good to know about the new plans dropping from other locations. A couple of the new birdhouse plans dropped for me from outside the Breton zones, but that was the case with the other birdhouse blueprints from before U50.

BretonMage · August 4

Yeah I'm getting some of the new plans like the birdhouse ones, I'm just not getting the new Breton plans. And neither are lots of people is anyone else from the look of the market listings.

Edit: Only one listing for the "Praxis: Breton Amphora, Marble" on PCNA, at 3.99M. Awesome.

Dalsinthus · August 4

BretonMage wrote: »

Yeah I'm getting some of the new plans like the birdhouse ones, I'm just not getting the new Breton plans. And neither are lots of people is anyone else from the look of the market listings.

Edit: Only one listing for the "Praxis: Breton Amphora, Marble" on PCNA, at 3.99M. Awesome.

It's similar on Xbox NA. Before the fix you could find the Breton purples from 1-9M in many guild traders, with most priced at 1M. Now there are almost none. The very few that are available are 3M+.

Dalsinthus · August 4

@ZOS_Kevin can you please ask the team to take a look at this? Something seems very wrong here.

Roctan · August 6

@ZOS_Kevin @ZOS_JessicaFolsom @ZOS_NickD

Could you please have a look at this and confirm it if necessary?

Players are leaving the game again because hardly anything new seems to be working properly (the Favour completion quest, green gems, etc.).
For example, after searching Glenumbra for many many days, I’ve found 0 new blueprints. ZERO!

Please fix these issues more quickly, otherwise we’ll keep losing players and, in the end, we’ll lose our game and you’ll lose your jobs. :-(

MidnightDuel · August 6

ESO_player123 wrote: »

Many of the new plans drop outside of Glenumbra/Stormheaven/Rivenspire too. Someone reported pulling a new mushroom barrel plan from a container in starter the room in AI. I had several plans while looting containers in Outcast Inn in West Weald and Broken Light temple in Solstice (including that secret door bookcase).

With a map as large as Tamriel, players rely on good information from patch notes to effectively and efficiently use their play time. Sharing the location(s) of potential drops and their drop rates is only part. Players have to trust that information is accurate.

Recently the Recipe for Granny's Eel Pie and its key ingredient weren't dropping from the Dynamic Encounter in Stonefalls. After nearly a month of farming the DEs, a forum post confirmed the source and that the drops weren't happening---at least not at the super-secret rates known only to the development team. After a supposed "fix" goes in that is purportedly increasing the drop rate, the recipe is still not dropping for most players and the ingredient that was dropping has all but stopped dropping for many. For me, I feel the weeks farming the new plan was wasted time, and I now resent the fact and the encounters themselves. What was a fun encounter the first time is now hated after countless runs.

For players who want to own and use the newest furnishing plans we've come to expect some grind, although we despise it. When the sources are known, players trust that a reasonable amount of time farming will yield results. Whether that's farming daily boxes or looting in a specific zone. With Solstice players welcomed the results from farming the dailies and knew the Worm Cult plans only dropped in that zone. While the drop rates were still rare, players at least knew where they could focus their efforts and spend their time. And there was a new area in Solstice one could farm a lot of containers to make their farming of Worm Cult plans more efficient. With the most recent round of plans, the dailies were dropping the Ancient High Elf plans at significantly lower rates, and no one can reliably tell where the new Breton plans actually drop. While the original patch notes said that "29 [plans] can be found across the Glenumbra Zone," players should be able to trust that's where they can spend their time farming. When a later incremental patch announces that rates have been increase in two not-before-mentioned base-game zones, it raises a lot of questions about where exactly players can find the new plans.

When patch notes say "Significantly increased the chance of looting a Breton themed furniture crafting recipe while in Rivenspire, Stormhaven, and Glenumbra to match other furnishing recipe drop rates," does that mean only those three zones? Were Rivenspire and Stormhaven locations added later, or were they always potential drop zones for the new plans? What, if anything, said in patch notes can be taken at face value anymore?

During U50 PTS, feedback was given around the low drop rates for the plans dropping from Summerset coffers. The player feedback was originally ignored. No one really knows if ZOS "Increased the chance of getting a new Ancient Summerset furniture crafting recipe in all the Summerset daily coffers" or not, because anyone that was farming those gave up long before the incremental patch. For the new plans coming with U51 we have no way of knowing the drop rates and zero trust that the patch will go live with reasonable and player-friendly drop rates.

ESO_player123 · August 6

MidnightDuel wrote: »

ESO_player123 wrote: »

Many of the new plans drop outside of Glenumbra/Stormheaven/Rivenspire too. Someone reported pulling a new mushroom barrel plan from a container in starter the room in AI. I had several plans while looting containers in Outcast Inn in West Weald and Broken Light temple in Solstice (including that secret door bookcase).

With a map as large as Tamriel, players rely on good information from patch notes to effectively and efficiently use their play time. Sharing the location(s) of potential drops and their drop rates is only part. Players have to trust that information is accurate.

Recently the Recipe for Granny's Eel Pie and its key ingredient weren't dropping from the Dynamic Encounter in Stonefalls. After nearly a month of farming the DEs, a forum post confirmed the source and that the drops weren't happening---at least not at the super-secret rates known only to the development team. After a supposed "fix" goes in that is purportedly increasing the drop rate, the recipe is still not dropping for most players and the ingredient that was dropping has all but stopped dropping for many. For me, I feel the weeks farming the new plan was wasted time, and I now resent the fact and the encounters themselves. What was a fun encounter the first time is now hated after countless runs.

For players who want to own and use the newest furnishing plans we've come to expect some grind, although we despise it. When the sources are known, players trust that a reasonable amount of time farming will yield results. Whether that's farming daily boxes or looting in a specific zone. With Solstice players welcomed the results from farming the dailies and knew the Worm Cult plans only dropped in that zone. While the drop rates were still rare, players at least knew where they could focus their efforts and spend their time. And there was a new area in Solstice one could farm a lot of containers to make their farming of Worm Cult plans more efficient. With the most recent round of plans, the dailies were dropping the Ancient High Elf plans at significantly lower rates, and no one can reliably tell where the new Breton plans actually drop. While the original patch notes said that "29 [plans] can be found across the Glenumbra Zone," players should be able to trust that's where they can spend their time farming. When a later incremental patch announces that rates have been increase in two not-before-mentioned base-game zones, it raises a lot of questions about where exactly players can find the new plans.

When patch notes say "Significantly increased the chance of looting a Breton themed furniture crafting recipe while in Rivenspire, Stormhaven, and Glenumbra to match other furnishing recipe drop rates," does that mean only those three zones? Were Rivenspire and Stormhaven locations added later, or were they always potential drop zones for the new plans? What, if anything, said in patch notes can be taken at face value anymore?

During U50 PTS, feedback was given around the low drop rates for the plans dropping from Summerset coffers. The player feedback was originally ignored. No one really knows if ZOS "Increased the chance of getting a new Ancient Summerset furniture crafting recipe in all the Summerset daily coffers" or not, because anyone that was farming those gave up long before the incremental patch. For the new plans coming with U51 we have no way of knowing the drop rates and zero trust that the patch will go live with reasonable and player-friendly drop rates.

I'm not saying that everything is allright with the drop rates. In fact, I said quite the opposite in this same thread.

I simply shared with you that instead of pointlessly grinding in Glenumbra/Rivenspire/Stormhaven which lack good farming locations, we can go to eveyone's favorite Outcast Inn and Broken Light temple. At first, I also relied on the information from the patch notes. Once people started posting their findings on the forums, I abandoned Glenumbra/Rivenspire/Stormhaven and switched to the locations mentioned above.

As for the Summerset plans, I have not tried farming them after the supposed fix. I decided that the drop rates are simply not worth my time after doing dailies on several alts before the fix.

MidnightDuel · August 7

ESO_player123 wrote: »

I'm not saying that everything is allright with the drop rates. In fact, I said quite the opposite in this same thread.

I simply shared with you that instead of pointlessly grinding in Glenumbra/Rivenspire/Stormhaven which lack good farming locations, we can go to eveyone's favorite Outcast Inn and Broken Light temple. At first, I also relied on the information from the patch notes. Once people started posting their findings on the forums, I abandoned Glenumbra/Rivenspire/Stormhaven and switched to the locations mentioned above.

As for the Summerset plans, I have not tried farming them after the supposed fix. I decided that the drop rates are simply not worth my time after doing dailies on several alts before the fix.

@ESO_player123 Thanks for the information about the inn and temple farm locations. It really is good to know what you've shared.

The biggest pain point with drops in ESO is the combination of saturated loot tables and nested RNG. Whether it's furnishing plans that get added to existing base zones or Antiquity leads that are double-locked behind rare zone Treasure Chest Maps, low drop rates are made worse by large lists of possible loot. So what may have started as a 1:10 or 1:100 chance is more like 1:1M.

Moreover, the chances for plans and other housing loot has not had the same treatment as combat gear. Gear sets have clear locations where they drop, whether that's dungeons, trials or zones. Players wanting to farm gear can easlily identify where to go.The introduction of transmutation of traits and recreation of gear has reduced the amount of time and effort to collect and use armor sets. Also, curation of gear drops and the introduction of the stickerbook mean the amount of time needed to farm and assemble a set has been greatly reduced over time.

Comparitively, as more furnishing plans get added to the game, they are lumped into the same loot tables as every other possible plan and recipe. There is no curation. The only saving grace is that most furnishing plans are tradable.

Where is the curation of furnishing plans?

Where is the clear and dependable (and dare we say "logical") distribution of plans by zones?

For the few (and exceedingly rare) Ayleid, Dwemer and Elsweyr plans that do have limited drop locations, the chances for those drops are severly dilluted by the overwhelming list of every other possible plan and recipe that can drop from that same container or enemy.

It's truly past time for ZOS to address this huge imbalance with respect to how furnishings and their plans are sourced.

Lugaldu · August 7

MidnightDuel wrote: »

(...)
For the few (and exceedingly rare) Ayleid, Dwemer and Elsweyr plans that do have limited drop locations, the chances for those drops are severly dilluted by the overwhelming list of every other possible plan and recipe that can drop from that same container or enemy.
(...)

One of the things that annoys me most about this is the fact that every (new) event brings with it yet more new cooking recipes.
I hate that moment: "Yeah, a purple plan! Urgh, another pointless cooking recipe..."
I really do hope they’ll finally stop wasting their creativity on coming up with yet more recipes...

MidnightDuel · August 7

Lugaldu wrote: »

One of the things that annoys me most about this is the fact that every (new) event brings with it yet more new cooking recipes.
I hate that moment: "Yeah, a purple plan! Urgh, another pointless cooking recipe..."
I really do hope they’ll finally stop wasting their creativity on coming up with yet more recipes...

To be fair, most of the purple recipes that have been dropping from events, such as Zeal of Zenithar and the Jubilee, are just lower level plans that already exist in the game. Because they are low level, they are kind of worthless except for completionists collecting them. Nonetheless, this underscores the problem of saturated loot tables: there are so many possible drops that the ones players want are exceptionally rare and never seem to drop. For every level 15 purple recipe that drops from an event is one less rare furnishing plan, style motif or Aetheric Cipher that won't drop.

The recipe for Granny's Eel Pie is the first truly new recipe that has been added to the game in years. Before that, it was the upgrades to the Colovian War Torte recipe, which upgrade parts are now "extremely rare" drops from the current Whitestrakes Mayhem event. While I've collected the Molten War Torte recipe, the White-Gold War Torte recipe still eludes me. Two challenges with new recipes being added to the game are 1) the rarity of the plans themselves and 2) the rarity of new ingredients required to actually use the recipe. What good is knowing a recipe if players can't get the ingredients to craft the consumable food?