Yeah I admit I'm already worried about nerfs with what we have now, which is why I'm not thrilled about asking for anything more until that aspect feels more settled.

All I want is Werewolf to be viable in PvE, it's all I ever asked for this game for my nine years of playing.

Werebeasts should be the speediest predators on the battlefield, able to catch up with streakers and mounted foe alike. Hircine designed us to be top hunters, and what top hunter can’t keep up with its prey?

Celas_Dranacea wrote: »

Grizzly bears can reach 35-40 mph and wolves around 35 mph.

They are quadrapeds. Werewolves are bipeds. The comparison would be something like a gorilla, which weighs more than a human, but is slower.

The more I think about it, I think the dissonance that I’m feeling is that there already exists a case where another class can exceed the movement speed cap without having to gap close onto a targeted enemy.(sorc w streak).

Any player with a gap closer can generally stay on on a streaking sorc for a little bit of time before resources run out, that is not unique to werewolf.

But in a pure foot race without the use of a gap closer requiring a target, no other build would come close to a max speed + streak build.

So when I think about that case, I think that there reasonably might be other cases where there would be justifiable similar treatment, and I think werewolf is such a case.

If ZOS has factored this into the sorc / stormcalling “power budget” and has conscious reasoning behind this then I accept it. But if not, then I’m just highlighting this balance difference.

Turtle_Bot wrote: »

Celas_Dranacea wrote: »

The more I think about it, I think the dissonance that I’m feeling is that there already exists a case where another class can exceed the movement speed cap without having to gap close onto a targeted enemy.(sorc w streak).

Any player with a gap closer can generally stay on on a streaking sorc for a little bit of time before resources run out, that is not unique to werewolf.

But in a pure foot race without the use of a gap closer requiring a target, no other build would come close to a max speed + streak build.

So when I think about that case, I think that there reasonably might be other cases where there would be justifiable similar treatment, and I think werewolf is such a case.

If ZOS has factored this into the sorc / stormcalling “power budget” and has conscious reasoning behind this then I accept it. But if not, then I’m just highlighting this balance difference.

Players have been complaining about Sorcerer/Streak since the beginning without understanding the reason Sorcerer is so dependent on that ability or the aspect of needing to out-speed the other classes in PvP.

Keeping distance has been Sorcerers entire defensive design and balance since the games beginning, it's why:
- the pets (matriarch especially) have a long cast time to summon them, can be killed and take 2 bar slots
- dark exchange has a cast time and gives so much sustain
- the class has shields instead of heals as it's main form of "healing" and "blocking"

Unfortunately most ESO players don't care about these balancing aspects to Sorcerer, they only see Streak and just default to complaining about the entire class being OP when the entire class was designed around streak and is actually extremely underpowered (both offensively and defensively) when the ability to keep distance is removed from the equation (which is also why CC and gap closers have always been hard counters to sorcerer because it removes the capability to create that needed distance).

This kind of summary makes a lot of sense. I see the logic that you are explaining behind sorc class design. Sorc is a cool class and I guess to clarify, I don't want streak to go away per se. In fact, since subclassing has come out, on my subclassed builds I run stormcalling 75% of the time because streak + hurricane is pretty darn OP.

And that kinda highlights one of the issues here - subclassing, which kind of negates a lot of the original class design logic. Perhaps the class masteries will reinforce these class identities more, time will tell - but currently, now that I think about it, the only class that is effectively locked out of exceeding the movement speed cap using streak is werewolf.

Everyone here is bringing up valid balance concerns that I respect and am absorbing. TY for chiming in and discussing!

My argument is a principled argument - and that is that in my view, a werewolf is something that should be exceedingly fast, one of the fastest options in the game - perhaps alongside a streaking sorc. Currently with the state of movement speed in ESO, subclassing and the use of streak etc. + the recent impressions I've gotten from PTS, it doesn't really feel that way. To me it feels justifiable to consider any ways that this could be addressed.

Thank you for listening to my Ted Talk - I certainly think all of you are smart and raise good points

Panderbander wrote: »

I feel it would be sufficient for werewolf to be able to surpass the speed cap only by the unique speed buffs it receives, meaning buffs non-unique to werewolf would only bring it up to speed cap but no further (major/minor expedition, Wild Hunt, sprinting, armor, etc.)

I agree. It doesn’t have to be something nuts, just something