You've nerfed the worst class in this PTS
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YandereGirlfriend✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Huge agree with the need to buff Shadow and Siphon and to get NB out of the one-trick-pony Bowproc jail that it has been in for years.2 -
Urzigurumash✭✭✭✭✭
✭I think a big reason Assassination has been so strong in subclassing is its Passives, especially how its big Crit Chance goes with Monomyth, with the Crit Damage on top. Like 5 other lines give Crit Damage, but they don't give the Chance too.
So I believe it's partly an effect of the Monomyth Meta.Xbox NA AD / Day 1 ScrubDK / Wood Orc Cuisine Enthusiast0 -
Urzigurumash✭✭✭✭✭
✭One thing I don’t see people complaining about with NB is how squishy it is. It’s the main reason I don’t like playing (I hate clutching on invisibility). That’s the real problem with NB, it has never been a lack of damage. Stop trying to mislead people.
NB needs an actual skill that applied major resolve and through passive. When I’m on a NB I always forget proccing it.
Then for the God's sake tell us what makes NB's damage good. I've asked this multiple times, why didn't you answer? Because it's obviously bad, there is nothing that would reinforce your statement because it's just simply wrong, you just always change subjest or reply "no it's good". I've texted multiple arguments and reasons why NB's damage is poor and all you do is say "no it's good". You just want class you don't like nerfed. It's probably because you just don't read my messeges considering you said that nobody talks about NB survivability when it was literally the first thing I mentioned in my original post.
Also NB doesn't need any skill to proc resolve, it's automatically uptimed with path and NB really needs that because of the lack of slots since NB skills mostly just give you 1 thing. Your sustain skill is just a sustain skill, your brutality skill is just a brutality skill, your special damage skill is just a damage skill etc. For example warden's sustain skill also gives brutality and warden's special damage skill also applies major AND minor breach
I prefer race against time when I’m on a NB for minor force. So it doesn’t really help. NB needs a dedicated skill for major resolve
“What makes a NB damage good?” Seriously? Second best spammable (after DK), high crit chance, high crit damage, best execute (Jesus beam is ahh now), element of surprise (with invisibility), second best burst damage after DK if not the best burst, need I say more?…
I say it again
One thing I don’t see people complaining about with NB is how squishy it is. It’s the main reason I don’t like playing (I hate clutching on invisibility). That’s the real problem with NB, it has never been a lack of damage. Stop trying to mislead people.
Yeah you need to say more because nothing you said makes sence
"Second best spammable" - no it's not, DK's and necro's spammable are better, BFB(universal spammale btw) is better. Nothing makes it special it's avg dmg and just applies minor breach and off balance
"high crit chance" - yes but no good skills to crit with
"high crit damage" - no. It's just 10% passive, DK's, arcanist's, templar's and warden's passive grant more crit damage
"best execute" - first - no it's not, and second there is no way you can slot it because NB heavily lacks free skill slots, it's impossible to keep other important things and slot execute at the same time
"element of surprise" is this a joke? NB is the most predictable class possible, there is no element of surprise whatsoever and out of invisibility you can't possibly deal enough damage to kill someone properly geared unless you have a full gank build
"second best burst damage after DK if not the best burst" - this is a straight up lie, I explained why it is multiple times but even there you don't say how come NB has some sort of "burst". You just say it does but it doesn't, I proved and explained why but you refuse to read my messages and just say "no it's good". WHAT burst does NB have? Tell us. How can NB BURST someone? Let's make a simulation: I just stand doing nothing and you are NB. What will you press to "burst" me?
Skulls is better than Surprise? Arc is better than NB? These are absurd and hyperbolic claims that undermine any good argument you have.Xbox NA AD / Day 1 ScrubDK / Wood Orc Cuisine Enthusiast4 -
MincMincMinc✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭YandereGirlfriend wrote: »Huge agree with the need to buff Shadow and Siphon and to get NB out of the one-trick-pony Bowproc jail that it has been in for years.
Refreshing, someone who isn't just a blatantly biased nb main asking for nonsensical buffs to merciless resolve. While trying to claim everyone has been using blastbones and restoring light as the meta.
Guys it does like 20% more damage than take flight does.....its ok to redistribute some of merciless resolve's damage back to the rest of the kit.Urzigurumash wrote: »One thing I don’t see people complaining about with NB is how squishy it is. It’s the main reason I don’t like playing (I hate clutching on invisibility). That’s the real problem with NB, it has never been a lack of damage. Stop trying to mislead people.
NB needs an actual skill that applied major resolve and through passive. When I’m on a NB I always forget proccing it.
Then for the God's sake tell us what makes NB's damage good. I've asked this multiple times, why didn't you answer? Because it's obviously bad, there is nothing that would reinforce your statement because it's just simply wrong, you just always change subjest or reply "no it's good". I've texted multiple arguments and reasons why NB's damage is poor and all you do is say "no it's good". You just want class you don't like nerfed. It's probably because you just don't read my messeges considering you said that nobody talks about NB survivability when it was literally the first thing I mentioned in my original post.
Also NB doesn't need any skill to proc resolve, it's automatically uptimed with path and NB really needs that because of the lack of slots since NB skills mostly just give you 1 thing. Your sustain skill is just a sustain skill, your brutality skill is just a brutality skill, your special damage skill is just a damage skill etc. For example warden's sustain skill also gives brutality and warden's special damage skill also applies major AND minor breach
I prefer race against time when I’m on a NB for minor force. So it doesn’t really help. NB needs a dedicated skill for major resolve
“What makes a NB damage good?” Seriously? Second best spammable (after DK), high crit chance, high crit damage, best execute (Jesus beam is ahh now), element of surprise (with invisibility), second best burst damage after DK if not the best burst, need I say more?…
I say it again
One thing I don’t see people complaining about with NB is how squishy it is. It’s the main reason I don’t like playing (I hate clutching on invisibility). That’s the real problem with NB, it has never been a lack of damage. Stop trying to mislead people.
Yeah you need to say more because nothing you said makes sence
"Second best spammable" - no it's not, DK's and necro's spammable are better, BFB(universal spammale btw) is better. Nothing makes it special it's avg dmg and just applies minor breach and off balance
"high crit chance" - yes but no good skills to crit with
"high crit damage" - no. It's just 10% passive, DK's, arcanist's, templar's and warden's passive grant more crit damage
"best execute" - first - no it's not, and second there is no way you can slot it because NB heavily lacks free skill slots, it's impossible to keep other important things and slot execute at the same time
"element of surprise" is this a joke? NB is the most predictable class possible, there is no element of surprise whatsoever and out of invisibility you can't possibly deal enough damage to kill someone properly geared unless you have a full gank build
"second best burst damage after DK if not the best burst" - this is a straight up lie, I explained why it is multiple times but even there you don't say how come NB has some sort of "burst". You just say it does but it doesn't, I proved and explained why but you refuse to read my messages and just say "no it's good". WHAT burst does NB have? Tell us. How can NB BURST someone? Let's make a simulation: I just stand doing nothing and you are NB. What will you press to "burst" me?
Skulls is better than Surprise? Arc is better than NB? These are absurd and hyperbolic claims that undermine any good argument you have.
Yeah this guy is making some wild claims. Apparently Offbalance being able to stun off GCD with a medium attack is also not strong and its somehow the weakest stun in the game. Even though you have Assassination letting you pair surprise attack guaranteed crit and sunder proc into a medium weave animation canceled stun into your now undodgeable merciless proc with a roughly 56% assassination crit chance.........Dont worry restoring light and blastbones is the real meta apparentlyEdited by MincMincMinc on 28 April 2026 19:46I only use insightful
BG MMR should NOT reset, zos sponsored smurfing is a terrible design choice.
PvP needs more incentives, even simple potion mats or gold would be better than rewards for the worthy inventory bloat5 -
Prionyx✭✭✭✭Urzigurumash wrote: »One thing I don’t see people complaining about with NB is how squishy it is. It’s the main reason I don’t like playing (I hate clutching on invisibility). That’s the real problem with NB, it has never been a lack of damage. Stop trying to mislead people.
NB needs an actual skill that applied major resolve and through passive. When I’m on a NB I always forget proccing it.
Then for the God's sake tell us what makes NB's damage good. I've asked this multiple times, why didn't you answer? Because it's obviously bad, there is nothing that would reinforce your statement because it's just simply wrong, you just always change subjest or reply "no it's good". I've texted multiple arguments and reasons why NB's damage is poor and all you do is say "no it's good". You just want class you don't like nerfed. It's probably because you just don't read my messeges considering you said that nobody talks about NB survivability when it was literally the first thing I mentioned in my original post.
Also NB doesn't need any skill to proc resolve, it's automatically uptimed with path and NB really needs that because of the lack of slots since NB skills mostly just give you 1 thing. Your sustain skill is just a sustain skill, your brutality skill is just a brutality skill, your special damage skill is just a damage skill etc. For example warden's sustain skill also gives brutality and warden's special damage skill also applies major AND minor breach
I prefer race against time when I’m on a NB for minor force. So it doesn’t really help. NB needs a dedicated skill for major resolve
“What makes a NB damage good?” Seriously? Second best spammable (after DK), high crit chance, high crit damage, best execute (Jesus beam is ahh now), element of surprise (with invisibility), second best burst damage after DK if not the best burst, need I say more?…
I say it again
One thing I don’t see people complaining about with NB is how squishy it is. It’s the main reason I don’t like playing (I hate clutching on invisibility). That’s the real problem with NB, it has never been a lack of damage. Stop trying to mislead people.
Yeah you need to say more because nothing you said makes sence
"Second best spammable" - no it's not, DK's and necro's spammable are better, BFB(universal spammale btw) is better. Nothing makes it special it's avg dmg and just applies minor breach and off balance
"high crit chance" - yes but no good skills to crit with
"high crit damage" - no. It's just 10% passive, DK's, arcanist's, templar's and warden's passive grant more crit damage
"best execute" - first - no it's not, and second there is no way you can slot it because NB heavily lacks free skill slots, it's impossible to keep other important things and slot execute at the same time
"element of surprise" is this a joke? NB is the most predictable class possible, there is no element of surprise whatsoever and out of invisibility you can't possibly deal enough damage to kill someone properly geared unless you have a full gank build
"second best burst damage after DK if not the best burst" - this is a straight up lie, I explained why it is multiple times but even there you don't say how come NB has some sort of "burst". You just say it does but it doesn't, I proved and explained why but you refuse to read my messages and just say "no it's good". WHAT burst does NB have? Tell us. How can NB BURST someone? Let's make a simulation: I just stand doing nothing and you are NB. What will you press to "burst" me?
Skulls is better than Surprise? Arc is better than NB? These are absurd and hyperbolic claims that undermine any good argument you have.
Prove me wrong. Arc with class mastery is better, skulls are better if you have some hard CC. Why would literally 90% of these storm+grave+assassination guys run skulls over suprise if it's better huhEdited by Prionyx on 28 April 2026 19:450 -
Urzigurumash✭✭✭✭✭
✭Come to Xbox NA and hit me up. The reality you need to accept is that so long as NB is so potent at 2 tapping the 90% of players who don't dodge Merciless 100% of the time, it's never going to be stronger against the 10% that do.
If you need better delayed burst, dots, debuffs, and stuns, time for a new class bud sorry.
If that's not how it is on PC just wait for crossplay, you'll see.
Edited by Urzigurumash on 28 April 2026 19:48Xbox NA AD / Day 1 ScrubDK / Wood Orc Cuisine Enthusiast1 -
Prionyx✭✭✭✭MincMincMinc wrote: »YandereGirlfriend wrote: »Huge agree with the need to buff Shadow and Siphon and to get NB out of the one-trick-pony Bowproc jail that it has been in for years.
Refreshing, someone who isn't just a blatantly biased nb main asking for nonsensical buffs to merciless resolve. While trying to claim everyone has been using blastbones and restoring light as the meta.
Guys it does like 20% more damage than take flight does.....its ok to redistribute some of merciless resolve's damage back to the rest of the kit.
And it doesn't stun and it's impossible to use it in a combo whatsoever. Why are you just repeating yourself with "ohh but it hits more than bb/shalks/put whatever you want there". If you are a very new player and didn't learn to block or dodge yet NB isn't the problem here0 -
Prionyx✭✭✭✭Urzigurumash wrote: »Come to Xbox NA and hit me up. The reality you need to accept is that so long as NB is so potent at 2 tapping the 90% of players who don't dodge Merciless 100% of the time, it's never going to be stronger against the 10% that do.
If you need better delayed burst, dots, debuffs, and stuns, time for a new class bud sorry.
If that's not how it is on PC just wait for crossplay, you'll see.
Xbox na, should have started with that tbh. I've heard that there are almost no good players so it KINDA makes sence, but on PC EU 99% of players dodge merciless after incap. It's not NB issue, it's a skill issue. But even if bow was guaranteed it still deals less damage than other classess' combos and literally any other class has way better survivabilityEdited by Prionyx on 28 April 2026 19:510 -
Prionyx✭✭✭✭Urzigurumash wrote: »Come to Xbox NA and hit me up. The reality you need to accept is that so long as NB is so potent at 2 tapping the 90% of players who don't dodge Merciless 100% of the time, it's never going to be stronger against the 10% that do.
If you need better delayed burst, dots, debuffs, and stuns, time for a new class bud sorry.
If that's not how it is on PC just wait for crossplay, you'll see.
If you need better delayed burst, dots, debuffs, and stuns, time for a new class bud sorry. - yeah that's the whole point of NB, it's dead to the point when there is to option to play it
0 -
Urzigurumash✭✭✭✭✭
✭Urzigurumash wrote: »Come to Xbox NA and hit me up. The reality you need to accept is that so long as NB is so potent at 2 tapping the 90% of players who don't dodge Merciless 100% of the time, it's never going to be stronger against the 10% that do.
If you need better delayed burst, dots, debuffs, and stuns, time for a new class bud sorry.
If that's not how it is on PC just wait for crossplay, you'll see.
Xbox na, should have started with that tbh. I've heard that there are almost no good players so it KINDA makes sence, but on PC EU 99% of players dodge merciless after incap. It's not NB issue, it's a skill issue. But even if bow was guaranteed it still deals less damage than other classess' combos and literally any other class has way better survivability
Yeah well that's the reality. You're down in the mud with us Xbox slugs and that's how it will always be.Xbox NA AD / Day 1 ScrubDK / Wood Orc Cuisine Enthusiast1 -
Urzigurumash✭✭✭✭✭
✭Honestly I think there might need to be some dev work about breaking free on xbox. Someone who plays both platforms would know.Xbox NA AD / Day 1 ScrubDK / Wood Orc Cuisine Enthusiast1 -
Prionyx✭✭✭✭Urzigurumash wrote: »Honestly I think there might need to be some dev work about breaking free on xbox. Someone who plays both platforms would know.
They just should've made relentless focus(just one morph) melee skill so nobody can dodge it and balance NB around it, not whatever we ended up with. Idk about controllers tho, never tried it personally but I met a few console transfers on PC EU who break free and dodge everything perfectly fine while still playing on the controllerEdited by Prionyx on 28 April 2026 20:040 -
Prionyx✭✭✭✭Urzigurumash wrote: »Urzigurumash wrote: »Come to Xbox NA and hit me up. The reality you need to accept is that so long as NB is so potent at 2 tapping the 90% of players who don't dodge Merciless 100% of the time, it's never going to be stronger against the 10% that do.
If you need better delayed burst, dots, debuffs, and stuns, time for a new class bud sorry.
If that's not how it is on PC just wait for crossplay, you'll see.
Xbox na, should have started with that tbh. I've heard that there are almost no good players so it KINDA makes sence, but on PC EU 99% of players dodge merciless after incap. It's not NB issue, it's a skill issue. But even if bow was guaranteed it still deals less damage than other classess' combos and literally any other class has way better survivability
Yeah well that's the reality. You're down in the mud with us Xbox slugs and that's how it will always be.
Not what I meant, didn't mean to offend you. If I accidently did - sorry0 -
MincMincMinc✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Urzigurumash wrote: »Come to Xbox NA and hit me up. The reality you need to accept is that so long as NB is so potent at 2 tapping the 90% of players who don't dodge Merciless 100% of the time, it's never going to be stronger against the 10% that do.
If you need better delayed burst, dots, debuffs, and stuns, time for a new class bud sorry.
If that's not how it is on PC just wait for crossplay, you'll see.
Xbox na, should have started with that tbh. I've heard that there are almost no good players so it KINDA makes sence, but on PC EU 99% of players dodge merciless after incap. It's not NB issue, it's a skill issue. But even if bow was guaranteed it still deals less damage than other classess' combos and literally any other class has way better survivability
Yeah on PCNA there is next to nobody using restoring or grave at all, this is our obvious difference. The hard meta builds (other than DK) for subclassing were:
assassin animal storm running a pen set like stuhns frontbar with rally backbar and mono+balorgh. Which is absurdly responsive and the most stat dense that you dont even use ult in most combos. Usually most people just fold to a SA into a medium weave merciless+deep fissure. Then you just have your ult or second merciless for cleanup. For instance I just have dawnbreaker for the passives and extra aoe cleanup for if they live and panic roll.
or
Aedric animal storm running acuity frontbar with rally, mono, bloodspawn. Which on this you use onslaught for all your pen. Which this was popularized by pelican, but as most people found out it really only works for 1vX and dueling because in bgs or group pvp the timing of acuity doesnt sync up well with most situations.
I appreciate the unnecessary belittlement from you though, really strengthened your argument.Edited by MincMincMinc on 28 April 2026 20:04I only use insightful
BG MMR should NOT reset, zos sponsored smurfing is a terrible design choice.
PvP needs more incentives, even simple potion mats or gold would be better than rewards for the worthy inventory bloat2 -
Prionyx✭✭✭✭MincMincMinc wrote: »Urzigurumash wrote: »Come to Xbox NA and hit me up. The reality you need to accept is that so long as NB is so potent at 2 tapping the 90% of players who don't dodge Merciless 100% of the time, it's never going to be stronger against the 10% that do.
If you need better delayed burst, dots, debuffs, and stuns, time for a new class bud sorry.
If that's not how it is on PC just wait for crossplay, you'll see.
Xbox na, should have started with that tbh. I've heard that there are almost no good players so it KINDA makes sence, but on PC EU 99% of players dodge merciless after incap. It's not NB issue, it's a skill issue. But even if bow was guaranteed it still deals less damage than other classess' combos and literally any other class has way better survivability
Yeah on PCNA there is next to nobody using restoring or grave at all, this is our obvious difference. The hard meta builds (other than DK) for subclassing were:
assassin animal storm running a pen set like stuhns frontbar with rally backbar and mono+balorgh. Which is absurdly responsive and the most stat dense that you dont even use ult in most combos. Usually most people just fold to a SA into a medium weave merciless+deep fissure. Then you just have your ult or second merciless for cleanup. For instance I just have dawnbreaker for the passives and extra aoe cleanup for if they live and panic roll.
or
Aedric animal storm running acuity frontbar with rally, mono, bloodspawn. Which on this you use onslaught for all your pen. Which this was popularized by pelican, but as most people found out it really only works for 1vX and dueling because in bgs or group pvp the timing of acuity doesnt sync up well with most situations.
I appreciate the unnecessary belittlement from you though, really strengthened your argument.
There are way less people that are often referred as "sweaty tryhards" on PC NA, restoring is popular because there are a lot more meta proc players(which was OP and had no counterplay until DK's rework) on PC EU and if people don't wear procs restoring isn't that mandatory, but even still it's good because it allows you to drop every def cp possible, gives you endless sustain, purge, no risk on trades etc. Grave lord is good because it counters restoring in a way and just provides more overall pressure and slightly better burst since it deals a bit more dmg than shalks, + it's way easier to catch someone in the right moment with BB than with shalks since it hits each 3 seconds and not each 90 -
Urzigurumash✭✭✭✭✭
✭Urzigurumash wrote: »Urzigurumash wrote: »Come to Xbox NA and hit me up. The reality you need to accept is that so long as NB is so potent at 2 tapping the 90% of players who don't dodge Merciless 100% of the time, it's never going to be stronger against the 10% that do.
If you need better delayed burst, dots, debuffs, and stuns, time for a new class bud sorry.
If that's not how it is on PC just wait for crossplay, you'll see.
Xbox na, should have started with that tbh. I've heard that there are almost no good players so it KINDA makes sence, but on PC EU 99% of players dodge merciless after incap. It's not NB issue, it's a skill issue. But even if bow was guaranteed it still deals less damage than other classess' combos and literally any other class has way better survivability
Yeah well that's the reality. You're down in the mud with us Xbox slugs and that's how it will always be.
Not what I meant, didn't mean to offend you. If I accidently did - sorry
Oh no offense taken. We are all worse players probably yes. And we deserve our fun. EU players are widely known as being better, they're coming over to us from xbox EU and absolutely shredding in BGs. We got some issues goin on in americaXbox NA AD / Day 1 ScrubDK / Wood Orc Cuisine Enthusiast1 -
Urzigurumash✭✭✭✭✭
✭Urzigurumash wrote: »Honestly I think there might need to be some dev work about breaking free on xbox. Someone who plays both platforms would know.
They just should've made relentless focus(just one morph) melee skill so nobody can dodge it and balance NB around it, not whatever we ended up with.
Yeah thats my read of it. For a quick demo of the disparity, play while listening to music and while not? Yeah if you're AWARE a Merciless is flying your direction it does 0 damage. If you're not, you're respawning. That's its own sort of imbalanceXbox NA AD / Day 1 ScrubDK / Wood Orc Cuisine Enthusiast1 -
Prionyx✭✭✭✭MincMincMinc wrote: »Urzigurumash wrote: »Come to Xbox NA and hit me up. The reality you need to accept is that so long as NB is so potent at 2 tapping the 90% of players who don't dodge Merciless 100% of the time, it's never going to be stronger against the 10% that do.
If you need better delayed burst, dots, debuffs, and stuns, time for a new class bud sorry.
If that's not how it is on PC just wait for crossplay, you'll see.
Xbox na, should have started with that tbh. I've heard that there are almost no good players so it KINDA makes sence, but on PC EU 99% of players dodge merciless after incap. It's not NB issue, it's a skill issue. But even if bow was guaranteed it still deals less damage than other classess' combos and literally any other class has way better survivability
Yeah on PCNA there is next to nobody using restoring or grave at all, this is our obvious difference. The hard meta builds (other than DK) for subclassing were:
assassin animal storm running a pen set like stuhns frontbar with rally backbar and mono+balorgh. Which is absurdly responsive and the most stat dense that you dont even use ult in most combos. Usually most people just fold to a SA into a medium weave merciless+deep fissure. Then you just have your ult or second merciless for cleanup. For instance I just have dawnbreaker for the passives and extra aoe cleanup for if they live and panic roll.
or
Aedric animal storm running acuity frontbar with rally, mono, bloodspawn. Which on this you use onslaught for all your pen. Which this was popularized by pelican, but as most people found out it really only works for 1vX and dueling because in bgs or group pvp the timing of acuity doesnt sync up well with most situations.
I appreciate the unnecessary belittlement from you though, really strengthened your argument.
Animal+restoring+assassination was a common build on PC EU, comfortable, huge sustain and good survivability, but restoring+aedric+grave lord/storm+grave lord+assassination were eating them alive0 -
MincMincMinc✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭MincMincMinc wrote: »Urzigurumash wrote: »Come to Xbox NA and hit me up. The reality you need to accept is that so long as NB is so potent at 2 tapping the 90% of players who don't dodge Merciless 100% of the time, it's never going to be stronger against the 10% that do.
If you need better delayed burst, dots, debuffs, and stuns, time for a new class bud sorry.
If that's not how it is on PC just wait for crossplay, you'll see.
Xbox na, should have started with that tbh. I've heard that there are almost no good players so it KINDA makes sence, but on PC EU 99% of players dodge merciless after incap. It's not NB issue, it's a skill issue. But even if bow was guaranteed it still deals less damage than other classess' combos and literally any other class has way better survivability
Yeah on PCNA there is next to nobody using restoring or grave at all, this is our obvious difference. The hard meta builds (other than DK) for subclassing were:
assassin animal storm running a pen set like stuhns frontbar with rally backbar and mono+balorgh. Which is absurdly responsive and the most stat dense that you dont even use ult in most combos. Usually most people just fold to a SA into a medium weave merciless+deep fissure. Then you just have your ult or second merciless for cleanup. For instance I just have dawnbreaker for the passives and extra aoe cleanup for if they live and panic roll.
or
Aedric animal storm running acuity frontbar with rally, mono, bloodspawn. Which on this you use onslaught for all your pen. Which this was popularized by pelican, but as most people found out it really only works for 1vX and dueling because in bgs or group pvp the timing of acuity doesnt sync up well with most situations.
I appreciate the unnecessary belittlement from you though, really strengthened your argument.
There are way less people that are often referred as "sweaty tryhards" on PC NA, restoring is popular because there are a lot more meta proc players(which was OP and had no counterplay until DK's rework) on PC EU and if people don't wear procs restoring isn't that mandatory, but even still it's good because it allows you to drop every def cp possible, gives you endless sustain, purge, no risk on trades etc. Grave lord is good because it counters restoring in a way and just provides more overall pressure and slightly better burst since it deals a bit more dmg than shalks, + it's way easier to catch someone in the right moment with BB than with shalks since it hits each 3 seconds and not each 9
For reference here is the PCNA "metahumper" build layout for the vast majority of subclassing. (minus reverse slice, people use executioner instead. I use reverse slice for BG group cleanups.)
Edited by MincMincMinc on 28 April 2026 20:17I only use insightful
BG MMR should NOT reset, zos sponsored smurfing is a terrible design choice.
PvP needs more incentives, even simple potion mats or gold would be better than rewards for the worthy inventory bloat1 -
Prionyx✭✭✭✭Urzigurumash wrote: »Urzigurumash wrote: »Honestly I think there might need to be some dev work about breaking free on xbox. Someone who plays both platforms would know.
They just should've made relentless focus(just one morph) melee skill so nobody can dodge it and balance NB around it, not whatever we ended up with.
Yeah thats my read of it. For a quick demo of the disparity, play while listening to music and while not? Yeah if you're AWARE a Merciless is flying your direction it does 0 damage. If you're not, you're respawning. That's its own sort of imbalance
There is 1.5+ second to react, while I definitely agree that it's harder to dodge while you have music on... Is it NB issue that someone's playing with music on?0 -
Prionyx✭✭✭✭MincMincMinc wrote: »MincMincMinc wrote: »Urzigurumash wrote: »Come to Xbox NA and hit me up. The reality you need to accept is that so long as NB is so potent at 2 tapping the 90% of players who don't dodge Merciless 100% of the time, it's never going to be stronger against the 10% that do.
If you need better delayed burst, dots, debuffs, and stuns, time for a new class bud sorry.
If that's not how it is on PC just wait for crossplay, you'll see.
Xbox na, should have started with that tbh. I've heard that there are almost no good players so it KINDA makes sence, but on PC EU 99% of players dodge merciless after incap. It's not NB issue, it's a skill issue. But even if bow was guaranteed it still deals less damage than other classess' combos and literally any other class has way better survivability
Yeah on PCNA there is next to nobody using restoring or grave at all, this is our obvious difference. The hard meta builds (other than DK) for subclassing were:
assassin animal storm running a pen set like stuhns frontbar with rally backbar and mono+balorgh. Which is absurdly responsive and the most stat dense that you dont even use ult in most combos. Usually most people just fold to a SA into a medium weave merciless+deep fissure. Then you just have your ult or second merciless for cleanup. For instance I just have dawnbreaker for the passives and extra aoe cleanup for if they live and panic roll.
or
Aedric animal storm running acuity frontbar with rally, mono, bloodspawn. Which on this you use onslaught for all your pen. Which this was popularized by pelican, but as most people found out it really only works for 1vX and dueling because in bgs or group pvp the timing of acuity doesnt sync up well with most situations.
I appreciate the unnecessary belittlement from you though, really strengthened your argument.
There are way less people that are often referred as "sweaty tryhards" on PC NA, restoring is popular because there are a lot more meta proc players(which was OP and had no counterplay until DK's rework) on PC EU and if people don't wear procs restoring isn't that mandatory, but even still it's good because it allows you to drop every def cp possible, gives you endless sustain, purge, no risk on trades etc. Grave lord is good because it counters restoring in a way and just provides more overall pressure and slightly better burst since it deals a bit more dmg than shalks, + it's way easier to catch someone in the right moment with BB than with shalks since it hits each 3 seconds and not each 9
For reference here is the PCNA "metahumper" build layout for the vast majority of subclassing. (minus reverse slice, people use executioner instead. I use reverse slice for BG group cleanups.)
It's viable but grave+storm+assassination or restoring+aedric+grave would demolish this build0 -
Wuuffyy✭✭✭✭✭
✭
That divide will become even worse as times goes on without those inflated passives ^-^
This of course means it is the case regarding any non-reworked spec that isn’t on the subclassing meta really.Edited by Wuuffyy on 28 April 2026 20:22Wuuffyy,
WEREWOLF FINALLY GOT A REWORK AHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH (sorry I mean... NERF WW, one-bar BAD, DESTROY one-bar builds)
ESO player since 2014 (Xbox and PC for PTS)
-new players, feel free to DM for guidance!0 -
Urzigurumash✭✭✭✭✭
✭Urzigurumash wrote: »Urzigurumash wrote: »Honestly I think there might need to be some dev work about breaking free on xbox. Someone who plays both platforms would know.
They just should've made relentless focus(just one morph) melee skill so nobody can dodge it and balance NB around it, not whatever we ended up with.
Yeah thats my read of it. For a quick demo of the disparity, play while listening to music and while not? Yeah if you're AWARE a Merciless is flying your direction it does 0 damage. If you're not, you're respawning. That's its own sort of imbalance
There is 1.5+ second to react, while I definitely agree that it's harder to dodge while you have music on... Is it NB issue that someone's playing with music on?
Whether music, controller irresponsiveness, player skill, whatever, it's Merciless holding back the rest of the kit yes. But we could've said the same thing about Graverobber since that had a similar issue, unfortunately after its nerf Necro was never compensated.
Still a way better class than NB tho 😂
Edited by Urzigurumash on 28 April 2026 20:20Xbox NA AD / Day 1 ScrubDK / Wood Orc Cuisine Enthusiast3 -
Prionyx✭✭✭✭Urzigurumash wrote: »Urzigurumash wrote: »Urzigurumash wrote: »Honestly I think there might need to be some dev work about breaking free on xbox. Someone who plays both platforms would know.
They just should've made relentless focus(just one morph) melee skill so nobody can dodge it and balance NB around it, not whatever we ended up with.
Yeah thats my read of it. For a quick demo of the disparity, play while listening to music and while not? Yeah if you're AWARE a Merciless is flying your direction it does 0 damage. If you're not, you're respawning. That's its own sort of imbalance
There is 1.5+ second to react, while I definitely agree that it's harder to dodge while you have music on... Is it NB issue that someone's playing with music on?
Whether music, controller irresponsiveness, player skill, whatever, it's Merciless holding back the rest of the kit yes. But we could've said the same thing about Graverobber since that had a similar issue, unfortunately after its nerf Necro was never compensated.
Still a way better class than NB tho 😂
While necro was pretty much dead prior to subclassing, this PTS it's probably 3rd strongest class atm. Obviously DK and sorc are op and nobody is on their level but excluding these obvious outliers necro is probably 3rd best1 -
MincMincMinc✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭MincMincMinc wrote: »MincMincMinc wrote: »Urzigurumash wrote: »Come to Xbox NA and hit me up. The reality you need to accept is that so long as NB is so potent at 2 tapping the 90% of players who don't dodge Merciless 100% of the time, it's never going to be stronger against the 10% that do.
If you need better delayed burst, dots, debuffs, and stuns, time for a new class bud sorry.
If that's not how it is on PC just wait for crossplay, you'll see.
Xbox na, should have started with that tbh. I've heard that there are almost no good players so it KINDA makes sence, but on PC EU 99% of players dodge merciless after incap. It's not NB issue, it's a skill issue. But even if bow was guaranteed it still deals less damage than other classess' combos and literally any other class has way better survivability
Yeah on PCNA there is next to nobody using restoring or grave at all, this is our obvious difference. The hard meta builds (other than DK) for subclassing were:
assassin animal storm running a pen set like stuhns frontbar with rally backbar and mono+balorgh. Which is absurdly responsive and the most stat dense that you dont even use ult in most combos. Usually most people just fold to a SA into a medium weave merciless+deep fissure. Then you just have your ult or second merciless for cleanup. For instance I just have dawnbreaker for the passives and extra aoe cleanup for if they live and panic roll.
or
Aedric animal storm running acuity frontbar with rally, mono, bloodspawn. Which on this you use onslaught for all your pen. Which this was popularized by pelican, but as most people found out it really only works for 1vX and dueling because in bgs or group pvp the timing of acuity doesnt sync up well with most situations.
I appreciate the unnecessary belittlement from you though, really strengthened your argument.
There are way less people that are often referred as "sweaty tryhards" on PC NA, restoring is popular because there are a lot more meta proc players(which was OP and had no counterplay until DK's rework) on PC EU and if people don't wear procs restoring isn't that mandatory, but even still it's good because it allows you to drop every def cp possible, gives you endless sustain, purge, no risk on trades etc. Grave lord is good because it counters restoring in a way and just provides more overall pressure and slightly better burst since it deals a bit more dmg than shalks, + it's way easier to catch someone in the right moment with BB than with shalks since it hits each 3 seconds and not each 9
For reference here is the PCNA "metahumper" build layout for the vast majority of subclassing. (minus reverse slice, people use executioner instead. I use reverse slice for BG group cleanups.)
It's viable but grave+storm+assassination or restoring+aedric+grave would demolish this build
Yeah just PCNA I dont think I have seen a blastbones in years. When subclassing first came out I was running animal+grave+storm which when timed right BB and deep fissure basically 1 shots anything with dawnbreaker. I think people just didnt like the timing game, especially in BGs where near everyone is moving at 200% movement speed.I only use insightful
BG MMR should NOT reset, zos sponsored smurfing is a terrible design choice.
PvP needs more incentives, even simple potion mats or gold would be better than rewards for the worthy inventory bloat1 -
Prionyx✭✭✭✭MincMincMinc wrote: »MincMincMinc wrote: »MincMincMinc wrote: »Urzigurumash wrote: »Come to Xbox NA and hit me up. The reality you need to accept is that so long as NB is so potent at 2 tapping the 90% of players who don't dodge Merciless 100% of the time, it's never going to be stronger against the 10% that do.
If you need better delayed burst, dots, debuffs, and stuns, time for a new class bud sorry.
If that's not how it is on PC just wait for crossplay, you'll see.
Xbox na, should have started with that tbh. I've heard that there are almost no good players so it KINDA makes sence, but on PC EU 99% of players dodge merciless after incap. It's not NB issue, it's a skill issue. But even if bow was guaranteed it still deals less damage than other classess' combos and literally any other class has way better survivability
Yeah on PCNA there is next to nobody using restoring or grave at all, this is our obvious difference. The hard meta builds (other than DK) for subclassing were:
assassin animal storm running a pen set like stuhns frontbar with rally backbar and mono+balorgh. Which is absurdly responsive and the most stat dense that you dont even use ult in most combos. Usually most people just fold to a SA into a medium weave merciless+deep fissure. Then you just have your ult or second merciless for cleanup. For instance I just have dawnbreaker for the passives and extra aoe cleanup for if they live and panic roll.
or
Aedric animal storm running acuity frontbar with rally, mono, bloodspawn. Which on this you use onslaught for all your pen. Which this was popularized by pelican, but as most people found out it really only works for 1vX and dueling because in bgs or group pvp the timing of acuity doesnt sync up well with most situations.
I appreciate the unnecessary belittlement from you though, really strengthened your argument.
There are way less people that are often referred as "sweaty tryhards" on PC NA, restoring is popular because there are a lot more meta proc players(which was OP and had no counterplay until DK's rework) on PC EU and if people don't wear procs restoring isn't that mandatory, but even still it's good because it allows you to drop every def cp possible, gives you endless sustain, purge, no risk on trades etc. Grave lord is good because it counters restoring in a way and just provides more overall pressure and slightly better burst since it deals a bit more dmg than shalks, + it's way easier to catch someone in the right moment with BB than with shalks since it hits each 3 seconds and not each 9
For reference here is the PCNA "metahumper" build layout for the vast majority of subclassing. (minus reverse slice, people use executioner instead. I use reverse slice for BG group cleanups.)
It's viable but grave+storm+assassination or restoring+aedric+grave would demolish this build
Yeah just PCNA I dont think I have seen a blastbones in years. When subclassing first came out I was running animal+grave+storm which when timed right BB and deep fissure basically 1 shots anything with dawnbreaker. I think people just didnt like the timing game, especially in BGs where near everyone is moving at 200% movement speed.
Blastbones is just not comfortable and clunky but it's strong as hell if used correctly0 -
MincMincMinc✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭MincMincMinc wrote: »MincMincMinc wrote: »MincMincMinc wrote: »Urzigurumash wrote: »Come to Xbox NA and hit me up. The reality you need to accept is that so long as NB is so potent at 2 tapping the 90% of players who don't dodge Merciless 100% of the time, it's never going to be stronger against the 10% that do.
If you need better delayed burst, dots, debuffs, and stuns, time for a new class bud sorry.
If that's not how it is on PC just wait for crossplay, you'll see.
Xbox na, should have started with that tbh. I've heard that there are almost no good players so it KINDA makes sence, but on PC EU 99% of players dodge merciless after incap. It's not NB issue, it's a skill issue. But even if bow was guaranteed it still deals less damage than other classess' combos and literally any other class has way better survivability
Yeah on PCNA there is next to nobody using restoring or grave at all, this is our obvious difference. The hard meta builds (other than DK) for subclassing were:
assassin animal storm running a pen set like stuhns frontbar with rally backbar and mono+balorgh. Which is absurdly responsive and the most stat dense that you dont even use ult in most combos. Usually most people just fold to a SA into a medium weave merciless+deep fissure. Then you just have your ult or second merciless for cleanup. For instance I just have dawnbreaker for the passives and extra aoe cleanup for if they live and panic roll.
or
Aedric animal storm running acuity frontbar with rally, mono, bloodspawn. Which on this you use onslaught for all your pen. Which this was popularized by pelican, but as most people found out it really only works for 1vX and dueling because in bgs or group pvp the timing of acuity doesnt sync up well with most situations.
I appreciate the unnecessary belittlement from you though, really strengthened your argument.
There are way less people that are often referred as "sweaty tryhards" on PC NA, restoring is popular because there are a lot more meta proc players(which was OP and had no counterplay until DK's rework) on PC EU and if people don't wear procs restoring isn't that mandatory, but even still it's good because it allows you to drop every def cp possible, gives you endless sustain, purge, no risk on trades etc. Grave lord is good because it counters restoring in a way and just provides more overall pressure and slightly better burst since it deals a bit more dmg than shalks, + it's way easier to catch someone in the right moment with BB than with shalks since it hits each 3 seconds and not each 9
For reference here is the PCNA "metahumper" build layout for the vast majority of subclassing. (minus reverse slice, people use executioner instead. I use reverse slice for BG group cleanups.)
It's viable but grave+storm+assassination or restoring+aedric+grave would demolish this build
Yeah just PCNA I dont think I have seen a blastbones in years. When subclassing first came out I was running animal+grave+storm which when timed right BB and deep fissure basically 1 shots anything with dawnbreaker. I think people just didnt like the timing game, especially in BGs where near everyone is moving at 200% movement speed.
Blastbones is just not comfortable and clunky but it's strong as hell if used correctly
Animal vs Grave is fairly even too as class choices. Although animal gets you expedition. Grave's regen is also locked behind having to use the tether.
Which on PCNA people are more prone to do quick in/out moving engagementsI only use insightful
BG MMR should NOT reset, zos sponsored smurfing is a terrible design choice.
PvP needs more incentives, even simple potion mats or gold would be better than rewards for the worthy inventory bloat0 -
Prionyx✭✭✭✭MincMincMinc wrote: »MincMincMinc wrote: »MincMincMinc wrote: »MincMincMinc wrote: »Urzigurumash wrote: »Come to Xbox NA and hit me up. The reality you need to accept is that so long as NB is so potent at 2 tapping the 90% of players who don't dodge Merciless 100% of the time, it's never going to be stronger against the 10% that do.
If you need better delayed burst, dots, debuffs, and stuns, time for a new class bud sorry.
If that's not how it is on PC just wait for crossplay, you'll see.
Xbox na, should have started with that tbh. I've heard that there are almost no good players so it KINDA makes sence, but on PC EU 99% of players dodge merciless after incap. It's not NB issue, it's a skill issue. But even if bow was guaranteed it still deals less damage than other classess' combos and literally any other class has way better survivability
Yeah on PCNA there is next to nobody using restoring or grave at all, this is our obvious difference. The hard meta builds (other than DK) for subclassing were:
assassin animal storm running a pen set like stuhns frontbar with rally backbar and mono+balorgh. Which is absurdly responsive and the most stat dense that you dont even use ult in most combos. Usually most people just fold to a SA into a medium weave merciless+deep fissure. Then you just have your ult or second merciless for cleanup. For instance I just have dawnbreaker for the passives and extra aoe cleanup for if they live and panic roll.
or
Aedric animal storm running acuity frontbar with rally, mono, bloodspawn. Which on this you use onslaught for all your pen. Which this was popularized by pelican, but as most people found out it really only works for 1vX and dueling because in bgs or group pvp the timing of acuity doesnt sync up well with most situations.
I appreciate the unnecessary belittlement from you though, really strengthened your argument.
There are way less people that are often referred as "sweaty tryhards" on PC NA, restoring is popular because there are a lot more meta proc players(which was OP and had no counterplay until DK's rework) on PC EU and if people don't wear procs restoring isn't that mandatory, but even still it's good because it allows you to drop every def cp possible, gives you endless sustain, purge, no risk on trades etc. Grave lord is good because it counters restoring in a way and just provides more overall pressure and slightly better burst since it deals a bit more dmg than shalks, + it's way easier to catch someone in the right moment with BB than with shalks since it hits each 3 seconds and not each 9
For reference here is the PCNA "metahumper" build layout for the vast majority of subclassing. (minus reverse slice, people use executioner instead. I use reverse slice for BG group cleanups.)
It's viable but grave+storm+assassination or restoring+aedric+grave would demolish this build
Yeah just PCNA I dont think I have seen a blastbones in years. When subclassing first came out I was running animal+grave+storm which when timed right BB and deep fissure basically 1 shots anything with dawnbreaker. I think people just didnt like the timing game, especially in BGs where near everyone is moving at 200% movement speed.
Blastbones is just not comfortable and clunky but it's strong as hell if used correctly
Animal vs Grave is fairly even too as class choices. Although animal gets you expedition. Grave's regen is also locked behind having to use the tether.
Which on PCNA people are more prone to do quick in/out moving engagements
Animal is better in every way possible excluding blastbones. Nobody runs tether tho, it was used on storm+grave+assassination because it was the only way to get crit but when zos added crit on merciless everyone dropped tether. Sometimes shalks are better but if it's a small enconter or a duel blastbones is miles better, to the point where it outweights other animal's benefits0 -
Urzigurumash✭✭✭✭✭
✭gravelord + assassination + aedric has been my favorite stack the whole subclass era
death knell goes with monomyth really wellXbox NA AD / Day 1 ScrubDK / Wood Orc Cuisine Enthusiast0 -
Prionyx✭✭✭✭Urzigurumash wrote: »gravelord + assassination + aedric has been my favorite stack the whole subclass era
death knell goes with monomyth really well
I really liked this one too but unfortunately it can't compete with meta setups0