Big nerf: velothi ur-mage's amulet

rosendoichinoveb17_ESO · April 13

The dammage done to monsters that the amulet was giving is 15% which was changed from multiplicative to additive. This means that for the average player (who has other sources of additive damage such as minor berserk, damage from chapion points ..) this will lower our overall damage by about 5%.

We know beam builds are easier but they are no way near the top builds. It provided a way for mid skill players to be able to run group PvE content in a decent way withough being overpowered.

The amulet needs either a buff from 15% to 20% or it needs its penalty to Light and heavy attack damage to be halved from 99% to 50% (as at 99% you can still proc weapon enchants with no damage loss).

What I am most afraid is that without a buff to the amulet we might need to kick players from trials if they run a beam build as their damage will be even lower than before and it is just not worth it keeping them around.

But for trial finder groups: man, those groups will struggle with damage as at least half of the players there are beam builds and they will not be able to finish any vet content.

(for me its fine I will just go to anyother of my other classes: DK, or pure sorc or pure nightblade or purre templar build is fine as long as people would know how to light attack weave)

But as a lot of people run beam builds with Velothi, nerfing their core item would make a drop in player enjoyment and can lead to less player base down the road which none of us want for this game.

CameraBeardThePirate · April 13

My guy Arcanist got a 30% flat damage buff at all times this next patch. It's okay if Velothi takes a slight hit. Your damage on a beam build will still go up substantially even with the nerf.

Elendildur · April 13

This honestly reads as really elitist. Beam builds still hit better than most other builds

YandereGirlfriend · April 13

This is simply correcting an error that should have never existed in the first place.

rosendoichinoveb17_ESO · April 13

no no we will just run Huntsman's Warmask instead ( it now gives the same additive 15%+ minor berserk+ no penalties to light attacks) with pure class and deal more damage than before.

I am just saying that Velothi is no longer viable

Elendildur · April 13

rosendoichinoveb17_ESO wrote: »

no no we will just run Huntsman's Warmask instead ( it now gives the same additive 15%+ minor berserk+ no penalties to light attacks) with pure class and deal more damage than before.

I am just saying that Velothi is no longer viable

Huntsman nerfs your damage to other targets, so for fights where you need a lot of cleave, Velothi would still be better

I feel like you don't understand the meaning of the word viable. From https://www.dictionary.com/browse/viable , viable means "practicable, workable". Velothi is absolutely workable in most scenarios. Just because not the best option in every scenario doesn't mean it's bad

rosendoichinoveb17_ESO · April 13

The question for all of you is: do you want an arcanist on your team to be selfish with single target damage, or do you want them to help clearing trash adds in fights

Elendildur · April 13

rosendoichinoveb17_ESO wrote: »

The question for all of you is: do you want an arcanist on your team to be selfish with single target damage, or do you want them to help clearing trash adds in fights

You know you can swap gear before a boss fight, right? You can easily run Velothi with beam for trash, and Huntsman with runeblades for bosses. The only sticking point is Cephaliarch's Flail vs Tentacular Dread, but you could always use runeblades to build crux for beam

Nyseto · April 14

Elendildur wrote: »

This honestly reads as really elitist. Beam builds still hit better than most other builds

Tone policing is not a valid/logical argument. What he's saying is objectively true-beam builds are easier to play.

Nemesis7884 · April 14

CameraBeardThePirate wrote: »

My guy Arcanist got a 30% flat damage buff at all times this next patch. It's okay if Velothi takes a slight hit. Your damage on a beam build will still go up substantially even with the nerf.

What is the point of making beam builds even stronger if the main complaimt is thats what everybody already is playing and that they kill build diversity???????

Renato90085 · April 14

it good change

BretonMage · April 14

CameraBeardThePirate wrote: »

My guy Arcanist got a 30% flat damage buff at all times this next patch. It's okay if Velothi takes a slight hit. Your damage on a beam build will still go up substantially even with the nerf.

Would that be pure classed Arcanist? Because if this is about Class Mastery, it doesn't help subclassed beam users.

TheMrPancake · April 14

Velothi has been the most popular set across end game raiding since the patch it was released.

Why is it suddenly an issue?

Answer: because ZOS finally understood the maths of how they programmed it to be.

Don't help ZOS. Don't tell ZOS anything. Never report a bug or anything you want to stay in the game.

flizomica · April 14

TBH Im happy to see Velothi and Ansuul nerfed a bit. It doesnt feel great that boring % damage done sets outperform most other things. Like at this point, Ansuul + Velothi is the starting point for any of my builds because they are all-around strong with almost no downsides. Id just like to see more buffs for underutilized sets at the same time.

rosendoichinoveb17_ESO · April 14

lets be honest here, wil this change cause more arcanists to focus on single target damage with huntsman or will they prefer to deal less damage with velothi so that they can help the group with AOE.
Unless the group is organized i have never seen anyone to prefer to be a support DD. My guess is that cleave damage is going to go down for trial groups unless either velothi is buffed or if the cleave power is transferred to another class that can do it better.
I certainly won't run velothi anymore if there are better alternatives just for the sake of helping the group (unless we are in an organized group).

And I bet when the youtubers start posting videos for beam builds without velothi, then others will follow suit. And then in pug groups we will have a problem (not that many prople use that addon to change gear between fights, and most people won't bother doing so manually)

Major_Toughness · April 14

5% nerf, to fix a mistake, for AFK damage builds that the lowest of skill players use, is not going to be noticeable or effect anyones group

ceruulean · April 14

Velothi still offers 1k pen and minor force which frees up a skill slot and/or not needing to wear Tzovgin set.

YandereGirlfriend · April 14

Major_Toughness wrote: »

5% nerf, to fix a mistake, for AFK damage builds that the lowest of skill players use, is not going to be noticeable or effect anyones group

THIS.

Cominfordatoothbrush · April 14

rosendoichinoveb17_ESO wrote: »

lets be honest here, wil this change cause more arcanists to focus on single target damage with huntsman or will they prefer to deal less damage with velothi so that they can help the group with AOE.
Unless the group is organized i have never seen anyone to prefer to be a support DD. My guess is that cleave damage is going to go down for trial groups unless either velothi is buffed or if the cleave power is transferred to another class that can do it better.
I certainly won't run velothi anymore if there are better alternatives just for the sake of helping the group (unless we are in an organized group).

And I bet when the youtubers start posting videos for beam builds without velothi, then others will follow suit. And then in pug groups we will have a problem (not that many prople use that addon to change gear between fights, and most people won't bother doing so manually)

Warmask is already stronger on the dummy and on single target fights tho

Meredy · April 14

Beam builds nerfed? Hell yes.

To answer your question later in this thread. Yup, I'd like to contribute something too when it comes to trash pulls as a non-beaming DD, thank you very much.

allochthons · April 14

The problem for players like me, who are just on the edge of end-game content, nerfing Velothi, Ansuuls, and Tide-born hits really hard. These are all sets that help out people who aren't great at weaving, for whatever reason, or have issues with accessibility. Many people play beam builds because they're easy, but there is a significant number of people who run beams because that's what their physical limits allow.

Set and forget items like these, and the forever now nerfed oakensoul, let us play at a higher level. Not end game, but close. And that's only good for the game.

Before these patch notes, I was inching towards the DPS to get into a few progs in my main trial guild. As of U50, those groups will be out of reach.

ETA: typo

YandereGirlfriend · April 14

allochthons wrote: »

The problem for players like me, who are just on the edge of end-game content, nerfing Velothi, Ansuuls, and Tide-born hits really hard. These are all sets that help out people who aren't great at weaving, for whatever reason, or have issues with accessibility. Many people play beam builds because they're easy, but there is a significant number of people who run beams because that's what their physical limits allow.

Set and forget items like these, and the forever now nerfed oakensoul, let us play at a higher level. Not end game, but close. And that's only good for the game.

Before these patch notes, I was inching towards the DPS to get into a few progs in my main trial guild. As of U50, those groups will be out of reach.

ETA: typo

That is a sympathetic argument.

But this was essentially a programming mistake that was artificially privileging a small class of items in an unintended way.

Just wait to see where the meta shakes-out. There's always a "next-best" that everyone moves to.

CalamityCat · April 14

Much as I hate arcanists and the beam meta thing, Velothi is also useful for those of us who play non beam builds and just like a bit more oomph to compensate for not LA weaving like a nutcase. I can do the LA thing, but I play to relax too sometimes.

Now, I realise it won't be a catastrophy for my girls, so I'm not whining about the change. BUT I really wish that when an issue was specifically linked to a certain class, the fix should also be made to that actual class. I hate when there is collateral damage to builds that weren't actually a problem. It's hit me umpteen times since subclassing arrived and it's frustrating. Again I know it won't cripple me to the point I stop using it, I'm just disappointed that this change is also affecting non-beam players. Unless I'm missing something, as I haven't visited the test server to look at it properly.

Orbital78 · April 14

I didn't see this in the notes?

NM I see it in a different section now, was empower really good enough to begin with? At least I am not paying anything for this game anymore, so if it dies, it dies.

YandereGirlfriend · April 14

CalamityCat wrote: »

Much as I hate arcanists and the beam meta thing, Velothi is also useful for those of us who play non beam builds and just like a bit more oomph to compensate for not LA weaving like a nutcase. I can do the LA thing, but I play to relax too sometimes.

Now, I realise it won't be a catastrophy for my girls, so I'm not whining about the change. BUT I really wish that when an issue was specifically linked to a certain class, the fix should also be made to that actual class. I hate when there is collateral damage to builds that weren't actually a problem. It's hit me umpteen times since subclassing arrived and it's frustrating. Again I know it won't cripple me to the point I stop using it, I'm just disappointed that this change is also affecting non-beam players. Unless I'm missing something, as I haven't visited the test server to look at it properly.

It's not targeted at a class or playstyle. It's fixing a programming mistake.

LittlePinkDot · April 14

allochthons wrote: »

The problem for players like me, who are just on the edge of end-game content, nerfing Velothi, Ansuuls, and Tide-born hits really hard. These are all sets that help out people who aren't great at weaving, for whatever reason, or have issues with accessibility. Many people play beam builds because they're easy, but there is a significant number of people who run beams because that's what their physical limits allow.

Set and forget items like these, and the forever now nerfed oakensoul, let us play at a higher level. Not end game, but close. And that's only good for the game.

Before these patch notes, I was inching towards the DPS to get into a few progs in my main trial guild. As of U50, those groups will be out of reach.

ETA: typo

Playing as tank or healer is the best. I only DD casual pug.
The single player versions of dungeons is going to be the best for DD

Prionyx · April 15

rosendoichinoveb17_ESO wrote: »

The dammage done to monsters that the amulet was giving is 15% which was changed from multiplicative to additive. This means that for the average player (who has other sources of additive damage such as minor berserk, damage from chapion points ..) this will lower our overall damage by about 5%.

We know beam builds are easier but they are no way near the top builds. It provided a way for mid skill players to be able to run group PvE content in a decent way withough being overpowered.

The amulet needs either a buff from 15% to 20% or it needs its penalty to Light and heavy attack damage to be halved from 99% to 50% (as at 99% you can still proc weapon enchants with no damage loss).

What I am most afraid is that without a buff to the amulet we might need to kick players from trials if they run a beam build as their damage will be even lower than before and it is just not worth it keeping them around.

But for trial finder groups: man, those groups will struggle with damage as at least half of the players there are beam builds and they will not be able to finish any vet content.

(for me its fine I will just go to anyother of my other classes: DK, or pure sorc or pure nightblade or purre templar build is fine as long as people would know how to light attack weave)

But as a lot of people run beam builds with Velothi, nerfing their core item would make a drop in player enjoyment and can lead to less player base down the road which none of us want for this game.

Any nerf to beam builds is welcome, healthy and needed change, what's not to like?