Maintenance for the week of December 1:
• PC/Mac: No maintenance – December 1
• NA megaservers for patch maintenance – December 3, 3:00AM EST (8:00 UTC) - 12:00PM EST (17:00 UTC)
• EU megaservers for patch maintenance – December 3, 8:00 UTC (3:00AM EST) - 17:00 UTC (12:00PM EST)
• PC/Mac: No maintenance – December 1
• NA megaservers for patch maintenance – December 3, 3:00AM EST (8:00 UTC) - 12:00PM EST (17:00 UTC)
• EU megaservers for patch maintenance – December 3, 8:00 UTC (3:00AM EST) - 17:00 UTC (12:00PM EST)
Vengeance starts on the 3rd. So, no Cyrodiil?
ShutUpitsRed
✭✭✭✭
Now that replacing normal Cyrodiil with Vengeance is on the table apparently, this upcoming Vengeance campaign is likely going to be used as a part of that final decision. Personally, I'm against Vengeance replacing normal Cyrodiil. So, those of us who don't want to add to anything that might be used to support the idea that this is an acceptable replacement, and therefore don't want to participate in this upcoming Vengeance... are we out of luck for the first week of December? Do we just not get to play Cyrodiil, lest our presence in Vengeance be taken as statistical proof that replacing normal Cyrodiil is ok?
I didn't mind playing Vengeance when it was supposed to be just a test, but now that Vengeance population numbers are being used against normal Cyrodiil and even to propose that normal Cyrodiil be abandoned altogether, it seems that people who want to keep normal Cyrodiil just don't get to play, lest their participation be taken as acquiescence.
I didn't mind playing Vengeance when it was supposed to be just a test, but now that Vengeance population numbers are being used against normal Cyrodiil and even to propose that normal Cyrodiil be abandoned altogether, it seems that people who want to keep normal Cyrodiil just don't get to play, lest their participation be taken as acquiescence.
19
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xR3ACTORx✭✭✭Doesn't matter anyway. I mean who guarantees us that ZOS doesn't create a chart with blurred numbers and saying it was a success even when no one ever logs in during vengeance?
I'm used to illusions, but I don't need to believe em.Edited by xR3ACTORx on 30 November 2025 17:1013 -
LPapirius✭✭✭✭✭I will never again play a mandated vengeance campaign. I feel like a total fool for having participated in the ruse in the past. Vengeance was never just a test. It was always intended to replace Grey Host, which is the only reason I log on to play and the only reason I PvE is to get gear for PvP.
I'm not boycotting vengeance, as that's against the ToS apparently. I just won't be playing it ever again, for any reason.13 -
tomofhyrule✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭They straight up said that Grey Host would be active alongside Vengeance for the latter half of that test. If you are interested in keeping Grey Host, the best thing to do is to go into GH during that time while it coexists with vengeance to prove that Vengeance will not be able to compete.
We should get an article introducing the next test in the next two days.19 -
katanagirl1✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Everything is very uncertain right now, and most are hoping for the best but expecting the worst it seems.
I plan to participate in Vengeance, though I have mixed feelings about it right now, because it will be the only Cyrodiil option for the first half. Once Gray Host is back I will likely go there, unless the population split makes it virtually unpopulated. On PS NA it is already one bar until sometime in the late afternoon most days.
Khajiit Stamblade main
Dark Elf Magsorc
Redguard Stamina Dragonknight
Orc Stamplar PVP
Breton Magsorc PVP
Dark Elf Necromancer
Dark Elf Magden
Khajiit Stamblade
Khajiit Stamina Arcanist
PS5 NA1 -
Gabriel_H✭✭✭✭✭
✭katanagirl1 wrote: »On PS NA it is already one bar until sometime in the late afternoon most days.
That's a function of demographics more than anything else. 50% of MMO players are in full time employment, a further 25% are full time students. Average age is around 26, but the largest age groups is 25 - 40.
Also, only 50% play more than 18 hours a week.Edited by Gabriel_H on 30 November 2025 19:30PC EU
Never get involved in a land war in Asia - it's one of the classic blunders!0 -
ArchMikem✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭ShutUpitsRed wrote: »Personally, I'm against Vengeance replacing normal Cyrodiil.
I'd rather have Vengeance Cyro than Subclassed Cyro.CP2,100 Master Explorer - AvA Two Star Warlord - Console Peasant - Khajiiti Aficionado - The Clan
Quest Objective: OMG Go Talk To That Kitty!11 -
SneaK✭✭✭✭✭
✭ShutUpitsRed wrote: »Personally, I'm against Vengeance replacing normal Cyrodiil.
I'd rather have Vengeance Cyro than Subclassed Cyro.
Just give us a mode with no hybridization, scribing, or subclassing.
Call it:
Haderus/Scourge"IMO"Aldmeri Dominion1 Nightblade - 1 Templar - 7 Hybrid Mutt Abominations4 -
Gabriel_H✭✭✭✭✭
✭ShutUpitsRed wrote: »Personally, I'm against Vengeance replacing normal Cyrodiil.
I'd rather have Vengeance Cyro than Subclassed Cyro.
Just give us a mode with no hybridization, scribing, or subclassing.
Call it:
Haderus/Scourge
You mean Vengeance?!PC EU
Never get involved in a land war in Asia - it's one of the classic blunders!4 -
SneaK✭✭✭✭✭
✭
Nope.
Notice I didn’t say “no builds, theorycrafting, uniqueness, or playstyles”."IMO"Aldmeri Dominion1 Nightblade - 1 Templar - 7 Hybrid Mutt Abominations6 -
Gabriel_H✭✭✭✭✭
✭
Nope.
Notice I didn’t say “no builds, theorycrafting, uniqueness, or playstyles”.
Like I said, you mean Vengeance?!
You have access to all the skill lines, just not hybridized morphs.
You have different perks that are PvP orientated rather than the more general CP.
Between the skills and the perks you can have different playstyles.PC EU
Never get involved in a land war in Asia - it's one of the classic blunders!5 -
BardokRedSnow✭✭✭✭
Nope.
Notice I didn’t say “no builds, theorycrafting, uniqueness, or playstyles”.
Like I said, you mean Vengeance?!
You have access to all the skill lines, just not hybridized morphs.
You have different perks that are PvP orientated rather than the more general CP.
Between the skills and the perks you can have different playstyles.
Listen dude you're not getting us on board with vengeance, you want it so be it but please stop pretending what he's saying is asking for vengeance. I want to be able to theorycraft and try out new builds, there's no such thing in vengeance. Its a zerg fest that showcases the overhealing issue.
Im not playing a game that takes away all gear grinding progression and tells me what skills I am allowed to use in pvp, there's no argument here, less options in vengeance doesn't = more build diversity. Stop it.Edited by BardokRedSnow on 30 November 2025 22:22Zos then: Vengeance is just a test bro
Zos now: Do you want Vengeance permanent or permanent...14 -
Gabriel_H✭✭✭✭✭
✭BardokRedSnow wrote: »
Nope.
Notice I didn’t say “no builds, theorycrafting, uniqueness, or playstyles”.
Like I said, you mean Vengeance?!
You have access to all the skill lines, just not hybridized morphs.
You have different perks that are PvP orientated rather than the more general CP.
Between the skills and the perks you can have different playstyles.
Listen dude you're not getting us on board with vengeance, you want it so be it but please stop pretending what he's saying is asking for vengeance. I want to be able to theorycraft and try out new builds, there's no such thing in vengeance. Its a zerg fest that showcases the overhealing issue.
Im not playing a game that takes away all gear grinding progression and tells me what skills I am allowed to use in pvp, there's no argument here, less options in vengeance doesn't = more build diversity. Stop it.
I'm not trying to do anything other than point out the flaws in arguments. Flaws such as "Its a zerg fest that showcases the overhealing issue." - like Cyro isn't that now. I don't particularly like Vengeance. I think there were more elegant solutions to the problems.
And who is taking away the gear grinding progression? The tests aren't finished yet. They have intimated that sets will be re-introduced but with lighter procs, and there will be a new mid-size PvP zone with full access to current everything.PC EU
Never get involved in a land war in Asia - it's one of the classic blunders!4 -
xylena_lazarow✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭
You mean normal build Cyro?BardokRedSnow wrote: »Its a zerg fest that showcases the overhealing issue.PC/NA || Cyro/BGs || retired until Dagon brings a new dawn of PvP metas7 -
Oblivion_Protocol✭✭✭✭✭xylena_lazarow wrote: »You mean normal build Cyro?
There are nowhere near as many zergs in normal Cyro. As a solo player, I can do just fine fighting in regular Cyro. In Vengeance, everything is either a zerg or someone who runs away until they can join a zerg.
4 -
James-Wayne✭✭✭✭✭
✭Both Cryo and Vengeance are still high latency for Aussie players so it doesn't really matter what they do with open PvP.PERTH, AUSTRALIA | PC | NA | @Aussie-Elders
TENTH ANNIVERSARY - Thanks for sticking with us for 10 years.
James-Wayne you earned this badge 9:56AM on 4th of February 2024.
529 people have also earned this badge.2 -
SneaK✭✭✭✭✭
✭BardokRedSnow wrote: »
Nope.
Notice I didn’t say “no builds, theorycrafting, uniqueness, or playstyles”.
Like I said, you mean Vengeance?!
You have access to all the skill lines, just not hybridized morphs.
You have different perks that are PvP orientated rather than the more general CP.
Between the skills and the perks you can have different playstyles.
Listen dude you're not getting us on board with vengeance, you want it so be it but please stop pretending what he's saying is asking for vengeance. I want to be able to theorycraft and try out new builds, there's no such thing in vengeance. Its a zerg fest that showcases the overhealing issue.
Im not playing a game that takes away all gear grinding progression and tells me what skills I am allowed to use in pvp, there's no argument here, less options in vengeance doesn't = more build diversity. Stop it.
I'm not trying to do anything other than point out the flaws in arguments. Flaws such as "Its a zerg fest that showcases the overhealing issue." - like Cyro isn't that now. I don't particularly like Vengeance. I think there were more elegant solutions to the problems.
And who is taking away the gear grinding progression? The tests aren't finished yet. They have intimated that sets will be re-introduced but with lighter procs, and there will be a new mid-size PvP zone with full access to current everything.
Here we go again.
What was my argument again? While I’m sure ZOS appreciates the white knighting I doubt they appreciate approaching every comment about PvP as an argument, or maybe they do I dunno. I don’t though, you consistently show up in basically every thread regurgitating *your* facts while failing to understand people are different, with different preferences, point of views, and experiences. And we all think it’s neat that they “intimated” theorycrafting might survive on life support for a while longer.Edited by SneaK on 30 November 2025 23:27"IMO"Aldmeri Dominion1 Nightblade - 1 Templar - 7 Hybrid Mutt Abominations8 -
edward_frigidhands✭✭✭✭✭ShutUpitsRed wrote: »Now that replacing normal Cyrodiil with Vengeance is on the table apparently, this upcoming Vengeance campaign is likely going to be used as a part of that final decision. Personally, I'm against Vengeance replacing normal Cyrodiil. So, those of us who don't want to add to anything that might be used to support the idea that this is an acceptable replacement, and therefore don't want to participate in this upcoming Vengeance... are we out of luck for the first week of December? Do we just not get to play Cyrodiil, lest our presence in Vengeance be taken as statistical proof that replacing normal Cyrodiil is ok?
I didn't mind playing Vengeance when it was supposed to be just a test, but now that Vengeance population numbers are being used against normal Cyrodiil and even to propose that normal Cyrodiil be abandoned altogether, it seems that people who want to keep normal Cyrodiil just don't get to play, lest their participation be taken as acquiescence.
You nailed it.4 -
edward_frigidhands✭✭✭✭✭BardokRedSnow wrote: »
Nope.
Notice I didn’t say “no builds, theorycrafting, uniqueness, or playstyles”.
Like I said, you mean Vengeance?!
You have access to all the skill lines, just not hybridized morphs.
You have different perks that are PvP orientated rather than the more general CP.
Between the skills and the perks you can have different playstyles.
Listen dude you're not getting us on board with vengeance, you want it so be it but please stop pretending what he's saying is asking for vengeance. I want to be able to theorycraft and try out new builds, there's no such thing in vengeance. Its a zerg fest that showcases the overhealing issue.
Im not playing a game that takes away all gear grinding progression and tells me what skills I am allowed to use in pvp, there's no argument here, less options in vengeance doesn't = more build diversity. Stop it.
I'm not trying to do anything other than point out the flaws in arguments. Flaws such as "Its a zerg fest that showcases the overhealing issue." - like Cyro isn't that now. I don't particularly like Vengeance. I think there were more elegant solutions to the problems.
And who is taking away the gear grinding progression? The tests aren't finished yet. They have intimated that sets will be re-introduced but with lighter procs, and there will be a new mid-size PvP zone with full access to current everything.
i feel like you're not reading the entire post and selecting specific parts taken out of context that you can easily counter while misrepresenting the idea behind the posts you are attempting to address.
What's odd is I see you doing this in every thread concerning this subject.8 -
edward_frigidhands✭✭✭✭✭
Nope.
Notice I didn’t say “no builds, theorycrafting, uniqueness, or playstyles”.
Like I said, you mean Vengeance?!
You have access to all the skill lines, just not hybridized morphs.
You have different perks that are PvP orientated rather than the more general CP.
Between the skills and the perks you can have different playstyles.
That isn't enough. People want to be able to play the actual game, which a lot of players correctly identify the Vengeance campaign as not being.4 -
katanagirl1✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭katanagirl1 wrote: »On PS NA it is already one bar until sometime in the late afternoon most days.
That's a function of demographics more than anything else. 50% of MMO players are in full time employment, a further 25% are full time students. Average age is around 26, but the largest age groups is 25 - 40.
Also, only 50% play more than 18 hours a week.
No, it didn’t used to be like this. I queued into Cyrodiil early afternoon years ago so I could avoid a long queue. Now I can queue instantly unless it is after dinnertime on weekend nights.
Average age for the people in my faction is closer to 40-50, based on zone chat. Many people on disability too.
Khajiit Stamblade main
Dark Elf Magsorc
Redguard Stamina Dragonknight
Orc Stamplar PVP
Breton Magsorc PVP
Dark Elf Necromancer
Dark Elf Magden
Khajiit Stamblade
Khajiit Stamina Arcanist
PS5 NA5 -
edward_frigidhands✭✭✭✭✭katanagirl1 wrote: »On PS NA it is already one bar until sometime in the late afternoon most days.
That's a function of demographics more than anything else. 50% of MMO players are in full time employment, a further 25% are full time students. Average age is around 26, but the largest age groups is 25 - 40.
Also, only 50% play more than 18 hours a week.
I have to ask where you're getting these numbers.4 -
fizzybeef✭✭✭✭✭I will not play vengeance and if it becomes permanently as only one option i will not play the game anymore.
I have only bought chapters and farmed stuff for pvp. I do pve for better pvp sets.
Taking that away, even only considering it, feels like a massive scam4 -
OleResinHead✭✭✭
That’s a really good idea, I don’t want grayhost to be removed and be stuck with just vengeancetomofhyrule wrote: »They straight up said that Grey Host would be active alongside Vengeance for the latter half of that test. If you are interested in keeping Grey Host, the best thing to do is to go into GH during that time while it coexists with vengeance to prove that Vengeance will not be able to compete.
We should get an article introducing the next test in the next two days.1 -
SolarRune✭✭✭The bigger issues created with most skills not firing properly since the animation updates is seriously going to compromise any results they want to get from this 'test'. Don't really see the point in it going ahead until that is resolved.3 -
Gabriel_H✭✭✭✭✭
✭while failing to understand people are different, with different preferences, point of views, and experiences.
Not even remotely true. Pointing out that an opinion has no evidence to back it up, or pointing out something isn't remotely true is none of those things. Things such as:And we all think it’s neat that they “intimated” theorycrafting might survive on life support for a while longer.
There are dozens of skills and dozens of perks. How can you not theorycraft?PC EU
Never get involved in a land war in Asia - it's one of the classic blunders!0 -
Gabriel_H✭✭✭✭✭
✭katanagirl1 wrote: »I queued into Cyrodiil early afternoon years ago so I could avoid a long queue.
Which years? 2020 - 2023 ish?
PC EU
Never get involved in a land war in Asia - it's one of the classic blunders!0 -
Gabriel_H✭✭✭✭✭
✭edward_frigidhands wrote: »katanagirl1 wrote: »On PS NA it is already one bar until sometime in the late afternoon most days.
That's a function of demographics more than anything else. 50% of MMO players are in full time employment, a further 25% are full time students. Average age is around 26, but the largest age groups is 25 - 40.
Also, only 50% play more than 18 hours a week.
I have to ask where you're getting these numbers.
I know how to read studies and use Google.PC EU
Never get involved in a land war in Asia - it's one of the classic blunders!1 -
xR3ACTORx✭✭✭edward_frigidhands wrote: »I have to ask where you're getting these numbers.
AI...lol
According to DC 100% of EP are unemployed.Edited by xR3ACTORx on 1 December 2025 10:342 -
moderatelyfatman✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭ShutUpitsRed wrote: »Personally, I'm against Vengeance replacing normal Cyrodiil.
I'd rather have Vengeance Cyro than Subclassed Cyro.
That's like having to choose between sleeping the park or sleeping in the bus shelter. Not exactly a real option here.0
