Writhing Wall Event Update

AzuraFan · November 20

agelonestar wrote: »

And while the 8,000 Seals are appreciated, I do think there’s an unanswered question here around players who bought the 2025 Season Pass, since they were the most invested and the most affected. Those players paid extra specifically for this content and got the roughest version of it. It would help morale tremendously if ZOS could clarify whether there’s any form of make-good planned for those customers beyond the universally offered Seals.

Good point. Those who bought the season pass are also facing story quest bugs and skyshard bugs. It does seem odd that everyone will get 8000 seals (which I have no problem with), but there's nothing extra for those who paid good money for the content pass. After all, it was only content pass holders who had access to the writhing fortress in its buggy state.

So while I understand the compensation for everyone for phase 1 and 2 of the event, phase 3 was the most disappointing because of the inability of many to complete the fortress when it became available, followed by the bugs in Eastern Solstice, which is also only available to content pass holders. Since the 8000 seals are being given to everyone, it means there's no compensation for the fortress and Eastern Solstice problems, which doesn't seem right.

xencthlu · November 20

ZOS_NickG wrote: »

First, as a thank you for your patience throughout all of this, we’re adding 8,000 Seals of Endeavor on Day 1 of the December Daily Login Reward Calendar rewards.

I can be bribed. Guys, the Writhing Wall is a good event. For another 8k seals, or a free house, I'm willing to say the season pass is a good purchase. There is no corner of my soul I will not turn over for fake game currencies.

Last'One · November 20

AzuraFan wrote: »

agelonestar wrote: »

And while the 8,000 Seals are appreciated, I do think there’s an unanswered question here around players who bought the 2025 Season Pass, since they were the most invested and the most affected. Those players paid extra specifically for this content and got the roughest version of it. It would help morale tremendously if ZOS could clarify whether there’s any form of make-good planned for those customers beyond the universally offered Seals.

Good point. Those who bought the season pass are also facing story quest bugs and skyshard bugs. It does seem odd that everyone will get 8000 seals (which I have no problem with), but there's nothing extra for those who paid good money for the content pass. After all, it was only content pass holders who had access to the writhing fortress in its buggy state.

So while I understand the compensation for everyone for phase 1 and 2 of the event, phase 3 was the most disappointing because of the inability of many to complete the fortress when it became available, followed by the bugs in Eastern Solstice, which is also only available to content pass holders. Since the 8000 seals are being given to everyone, it means there's no compensation for the fortress and Eastern Solstice problems, which doesn't seem right.

Huh!? The Writhing Wall Event is part of the Season Pass. Only players who paid for the content experienced the bugs throughout the Solstice event. No?
What bugs did the Writhing Wall Event cause outside Solstice? I mean, for players who did NOT buy the content pass, what bugs did they get? None?

Then why will they also get 8k Endeavors? I paid for the content, and I get the same reward as players who didn’t pay? And since I paid, I even got more bugs… lol!
Well, like I said earlier in this event, this just shows the "quality standards" we’re getting from ZOS

Gingaroth · November 20

ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »

amuridee wrote: »

I’m very thankful and appreciative of the developers for addressing this issue.

However, please underline one thing: do not plan to bring back the Writhing Wall event, because doing so would remove the sense of exclusivity from it being a one-time event.

Instead, consider creating a similar event in the future—either an improved version or a “lite” version of the Writhing Wall event—as a recurring event. It could even become a daily activity or a new game mode, such as two teams of 12–24 players racing to complete tasks similar to those in the Writhing Wall event.

Hey @amuridee, thank you for sharing your thoughts. We wanted to provide some clarity on your first point. We do not plan on bringing back the Writhing Wall event. The only part we are bringing back early next year is just the Writhing Fortress, to give those who tried to run it and ran into issues another chance to experience it.

@ZOS_JessicaFolsom Thanks for the information!

Could you clear one more thing up? Will the Writhing Fortress be brought back permanently or temporarily? And if temporarily, for how long?

(Speaking for myself, I don't care much for the exclusivity of any event, drop or what have you. I.m.o. such things only cause unnecessary stress and frustration, they don't make things more fun.)

twisttop138 · November 20

agelonestar wrote: »

@ZOS_NickG @ZOS_JessicaFolsom

I appreciate Nick taking the time to post a direct and honest message. The apology is welcome, and the 8,000 Seals of Endeavor is a generous gesture for the community as a whole.

That said, I think the Writhing Wall situation highlights some wider concerns that many of us have had for quite a while now.

The state of the event strongly suggests ongoing QA issues and, more importantly, that PTS feedback isn’t being incorporated as effectively as it could be.

This wasn’t a minor issue or two — this was an entire multi-phase feature in a highly promoted “once-in-a-lifetime” event that simply wasn’t ready. Multiple major bugs, repeated blocking issues, and whole mechanics being removed mid-event speak to underlying process problems, not just bad luck.

And while the 8,000 Seals are appreciated, I do think there’s an unanswered question here around players who bought the 2025 Season Pass, since they were the most invested and the most affected. Those players paid extra specifically for this content and got the roughest version of it. It would help morale tremendously if ZOS could clarify whether there’s any form of make-good planned for those customers beyond the universally offered Seals.

A second point I hope ZOS will address is the value proposition of this year’s content.

The 2024–25 cycle delivered:
1. a noticeably smaller zone
2. fewer quests and gameplay hours than any recent chapter
3. and a headline event that launched in a broken state.

All of this came at a higher price than previous years.

I think it’s fair for players to ask: How does ZOS plan to restore player confidence and ensure that next year’s content justifies its cost?

Speaking personally, I enjoy ESO and want it to succeed — we all do, or we wouldn’t be here giving feedback after 10+ years. But events like this shake trust, and it would go a long way to hear more about:
A) what internal changes are being made
B ) how PTS feedback will be used more effectively
C) and how future annual content will meet (or exceed) the quality bar players have come to expect

I appreciate the communication, and I hope this is the start of a more open and transparent dialogue.

(Edit : typo)

This is a very succinct summation of how I've been feeling. Zos very much needs to let us know, and soon. I don't think the usual end of year back patting and self aggrandizing will cut it this year. Neither will talk of "oh we have such amazing stuff we just would love to tell you about but alas we can't. You just wait though. We wish we could say but we can't." I think this year has moved us far past that.

This year really brings things into stark contrast. Gone are chapters. Gone is knowing without a doubt that we will get a place to explore, lots of great side quests, a trial, 6 delves, 6 world bosses, 2 public dungeons and a new system. On top of new plans, antiquity stuff, companions etc. Long gone is the Q4 story dlc. Say what you want about Zos being predictable but I like knowing what the amount of content is and knowing that if I buy it it's worth my money.

Zos I think really needs to blow us away. They can't expect the community to pay more for less. They tried it this year and it didn't quite pan out. Let us hope that @ZOS_NickG has shown us Zos is different under this new leadership. I could never imagine the last guy coming out here and being so open and honest. I want to hope that this year was the last gasps of that era of ESO and that the ship is turning around. Ships can take time to turn but with real open and honest communication and a good road map for next year, I think the community will be understanding of that. I know I will be.

LousyTourist2 · November 20

ZOS is milking us, those invested in the game.

Any poorly managed sw program will eventually die from code bloat. This one seems to be on life support.

Exchanging electrons for cash is one sided, especially in the form of the dozen different currencies established in the game. We need a great deal more than just 8000 endeavors. We need something much more expensive, dedicated staff with the tools and resources to do the work.

Use our content pass dollars to work on your system, ZOS.

LootAllTheStuff · November 20

Last'One wrote: »

AzuraFan wrote: »

agelonestar wrote: »

And while the 8,000 Seals are appreciated, I do think there’s an unanswered question here around players who bought the 2025 Season Pass, since they were the most invested and the most affected. Those players paid extra specifically for this content and got the roughest version of it. It would help morale tremendously if ZOS could clarify whether there’s any form of make-good planned for those customers beyond the universally offered Seals.

Good point. Those who bought the season pass are also facing story quest bugs and skyshard bugs. It does seem odd that everyone will get 8000 seals (which I have no problem with), but there's nothing extra for those who paid good money for the content pass. After all, it was only content pass holders who had access to the writhing fortress in its buggy state.

So while I understand the compensation for everyone for phase 1 and 2 of the event, phase 3 was the most disappointing because of the inability of many to complete the fortress when it became available, followed by the bugs in Eastern Solstice, which is also only available to content pass holders. Since the 8000 seals are being given to everyone, it means there's no compensation for the fortress and Eastern Solstice problems, which doesn't seem right.

Huh!? The Writhing Wall Event is part of the Season Pass. Only players who paid for the content experienced the bugs throughout the Solstice event. No?
What bugs did the Writhing Wall Event cause outside Solstice? I mean, for players who did NOT buy the content pass, what bugs did they get? None?

I guess that depends on whether the abysmal drop rates for shard fragments, issues with the invasion bosses in base game delves/dungeons, or the huge variability in whether vitrified souls dropped are considered bugs. IOW players who participated in the event outside of the specific season pass content were actually affected too.

That said, I would personally rank these as being significantly less of an issue compared to the bugs in the event that were exclusive to the season pass (especially since some had easy workarounds), and I do think ZOS should address those that paid for that content specifically. I'll note that they've already said that they will make the fortress available again at some point, which presumably would only be for paid season pass holders. That is good, but I'm not sure it quite meets the mark in terms of compensation, though - that's something only those who paid for the content can answer.

AzuraFan · November 20

LootAllTheStuff wrote: »

I guess that depends on whether the abysmal drop rates for shard fragments, issues with the invasion bosses in base game delves/dungeons, or the huge variability in whether vitrified souls dropped are considered bugs. IOW players who participated in the event outside of the specific season pass content were actually affected too.

That said, I would personally rank these as being significantly less of an issue compared to the bugs in the event that were exclusive to the season pass (especially since some had easy workarounds), and I do think ZOS should address those that paid for that content specifically. I'll note that they've already said that they will make the fortress available again at some point, which presumably would only be for paid season pass holders. That is good, but I'm not sure it quite meets the mark in terms of compensation, though - that's something only those who paid for the content can answer.

Agreed. For the first two phases, it was the abysmal drop rates that got everyone down, and the other things mentioned. So I understand wanting to give everyone some compensation. Adding something to the daily login rewards is an easy way to distribute it.

But the bugged fortress and the bugs in Eastern Solstice did not affect people who didn't buy the content pass. So they should not receive the same compensation as content pass holders. There will hopefully be another announcement from ZOS about how they will compensate people who paid for the content pass (not something insulting like a non-combat pet or oroboros crate - a substantial amount of seals or something equivalent to that). If there isn't another announcement, it means content pass holders are receiving zero compensation for the fortress and the bugs in Eastern Solstice, which as I said earlier, doesn't seem right.

(and no, bringing back the fortress is not compensation.)

Destai · November 20

agelonestar wrote: »

The state of the event strongly suggests ongoing QA issues and, more importantly, that PTS feedback isn’t being incorporated as effectively as it could be.

This wasn’t a minor issue or two — this was an entire multi-phase feature in a highly promoted “once-in-a-lifetime” event that simply wasn’t ready. Multiple major bugs, repeated blocking issues, and whole mechanics being removed mid-event speak to underlying process problems, not just bad luck.

For me, it's not even a strong suggestion of QA issues, it's a revelation. I feel like there's a few possibilities for how this was released in this condition:

ZOS wasn't aware of the issues because they didn't see the PTS feedback. This is bad because that says people aren't reading their own forums.
ZOS couldn't replicate the issues on internal builds. If this is the case, then DevOps needs to be vastly improved.
ZOS could replicate them but deemed them negligible enough to push live. Again, this is a DevOps issue and reflective of their technical management.
ZOS couldn't fix them in time before release and decided to fix them after release. This what I believed happened, based on the statements made by ZOS so far. I get the impression that they adhere to their release schedules at the expense of everything else. Aside from crossplay, I can't recall any single feature that was postponed because it wasn't ready.

This event is just one of many that felt outright dismissive or ignorant of player feedback, until it was too late. And while we've been seeing more of the CMs, it's hard not to feel like it's performative when the things we all complain about just keep happening. Things go-live and then the CMs waltz on in asking for feedback that was already provided on PTS. It paints ZOS as careless and aloof.

agelonestar wrote: »

And while the 8,000 Seals are appreciated, I do think there’s an unanswered question here around players who bought the 2025 Season Pass, since they were the most invested and the most affected. Those players paid extra specifically for this content and got the roughest version of it. It would help morale tremendously if ZOS could clarify whether there’s any form of make-good planned for those customers beyond the universally offered Seals.

I don't know what else they could do. I think everyone's affected by the quality issues this year. Maybe another 8000 seals or something for those who bought the expansion. I dunno. Kickback doesn't matter much to me if the underlying issues aren't fixed.

agelonestar wrote: »

I think it’s fair for players to ask: How does ZOS plan to restore player confidence and ensure that next year’s content justifies its cost?

Given the way they've treated their own game and community over the years, I don't see myself ever paying full price for an ESO release again. We've had moments like U35, the Jabs changes, the PermaGlow changes, and now the recent animation changes. I've seen at least one ZOS leader demonstrate an "I know better" or "it will blow over" attitude.

Because of that, and the persistent QA issues, I feel like ZOS is comfortable with lower quality releases and the subsequent blowback. One doesn't do keep doing something if they're not comfortable with it. Whether they mean to or not, they're treating their own game as a wait-for-sale value. That's my impression, it's on them to dispute it.

But in the spirit of constructive criticism, here's how they could restore my confidence:

An honest recognition of their mistakes. Yes, the Writhing Wall event has this; that's a great start. Now we need to delve into what happened with U48, the PVP Q&A, and the host of other unwelcome changes we've received.
Actual developer engagement on PTS. I truly do appreciate Kevin and Jessica, they're wonderful, but I take no comfort in the phrase "we're passing along your feedback". I want to see a developer log in to their game, replicate the issue after someone shows them it, and then talk about it. There's been some bugs where the only way you're not seeing it, is if you don't play the game. I want an actual developer to explain why things like the Jabs changes or U48 animations have to happen at all costs right now despite no one wanting it.
An actual roadmap for where combat is going. Especially after the AUA, I have no confidence in the combat team right now. I don't feel like there's any long term vision; there's just a whack-a-mole approach. It feels like they introduce new playstyles and then nerf them a patch or two later. Things like bash builds, frost builds, Oakensoul, etc.
The game clearly focuses on long-term, permanently available rewards. The rewards have always been a pain point for this game. There's such a focus on events and the Crown Store rotation, that after a certain point, I have nothing to do but log in and take out my credit card. Given the other issues with the game, there's simply no way I'm doing that.
A roadmap for the work done in response to the Pain Points thread. I've asked Kevin quite a few times for a recap of various threads, just so I know we're all being understood, and it's yet to happen. I want to see what they think of that thread as a company. They've said they're working on it, so I think it's fair to see what that list is and what's the priority of each item. No one would ask for these things if their track record had more considerate delivery.

In any case, I'm happy to see Nick being open and transparent. It's a welcome change from the previous leadership.

squishy_mcbunbuns · November 20

By chance is anyone else still experiencing issues with the zone story? I keep having to abandon and restart Mor Naril because I’m getting trapped in the arena where manimarco is supposed to be 😩😩

Hotdog_23 · November 21

squishy_mcbunbuns wrote: »

By chance is anyone else still experiencing issues with the zone story? I keep having to abandon and restart Mor Naril because I’m getting trapped in the arena where manimarco is supposed to be 😩😩

No idea; personally, I am waiting until after the first update to do the new zone. Hopefully by then enough bug fixes will be in so the zone is playable and enjoyable at the same time.

Unfortunately, it sounds like this will not happen until the new year for console players. Which is sad to have to wait until the 1st quarter update to make the fourth quarter update playable.

Stay safe

StihlReign · November 21

Console players have to wait until the 1st quarter update to make the fourth quarter update playable?

That's bananas. Just...Wow

Ingenon · November 21

squishy_mcbunbuns wrote: »

By chance is anyone else still experiencing issues with the zone story? I keep having to abandon and restart Mor Naril because I’m getting trapped in the arena where manimarco is supposed to be 😩😩

Yes the Final Dark quest is still buggy, at least on PS/NA yesterday.

On PS/NA I was fighting Mannimarco during the Final Dark and he became impossible to damage. No "screen" around him, just no visible health bar, so none of my attacks would show that I was bringing down his health. When Mannimarco became "unkillable", I even tried destroying the alter "gem". My heavy attacks were each doing like 0.1k damage and the health of the "gem" started at like 80k. So I stood next to it holding heavy attack for multiple minutes. And the "gem" broke - and Mannimarco was still "unkillable". I ended up letting him kill me by standing in stupid, and after respawn at wayshrine I was able to fight him and bring him down. It was like the battle reset to a different set of conditions, and this new set of conditions allowed Mannimarco to be fought and eventually killed.

Separately, there is a stone "statue" in the room for the final battle, but there was no way for me to put in the eyes on that statue, so I had to bring down Mannimarco myself. Yes I walked up the ramp to the stone statue multiple times during the fight, yes I tried clicking on it from multiple different directions, but there was no way to do the action which I had already had to do multiple times before during the Final Dark quest to activate the stone statue.

Vonnegut2506 · November 21

StihlReign wrote: »

Console players have to wait until the 1st quarter update to make the fourth quarter update playable?

That's bananas. Just...Wow

But just wait until you see the second quarter update. It will be a once-in-a-lifetime, historic event.

Danikat · 10:20AM

IMO the two main take-aways from this should be:

1) Players don't like being made to compete with each other outside of PvP. A community event should be about the whole community, not trying to divide us up and fight amongst ourselves.

2) A severely time-limited event like this is more trouble than it's worth. Even without the bugs it would have been restictive for players and dissapointing that the only interesting part of the event was available for such a short time and then removed from the game, wasting all the time and effort put into it. The fact that, like most new releases, there were bugs which made it difficult or impossible to complete early on just made it worse. Giving yourselves more time to get things working after release and players more time to enjoy it is a win-win situation with no downsides IMO.

(Yes I know the ideal is for bugs to be fixed before the release, and of course that would be better. But allowing time to address unexpected problems is only sensible.)