ToT How is this possible?

SilverBride · November 4

I was first to choose a Patron and I chose Pelin. My opponent chose Hlaalu and Crow. I finished with Orgnum.

By the third hand my opponent was generating 11 gold. They did it again their next hand, then the next. That is when I conceded and left.

There is no way they had enough coins to buy the right cards to generate that many coins, and I didn't even see any of the higher coin cards in the tavern yet. And if they somehow had picked one up that I didn't notice (which I am sure they didn't) this card would not come up again in every hand.

How is this possible?

Necrotech_Master · November 5

hlaalu and crow can both generate some pretty high amounts of coins depending on the cards chosen

upgraded crow cards, with even like 3 or so making a combo could easily be 6 coins themselves + any others from remainder of their hands

some hlaalu cards can also generate 6-8 coins directly, though some of those can be more expensive

some hlaalu cards allow just grabbing cards from the tavern for free if its under a certain cost (i dont remember the name of the card but the one with the picture of boxes on it is cheap (4 coins) and can, for free, grab another card of 4 or less cost, which would be a lot of the crow ones)

without seeing how the game played out, its hard to tell exactly what happened though

SilverBride · November 5

They hadn't picked up a lot of crow cards or any of the 6 to 8 hlaalu cards. This was only round 3 when this started. No one had enough coins yet for really good cards. And to generate exactly 11 coins 3 hands in a row? As though they were playing the same exact cards every turn, which cannot happen.

Necrotech_Master · November 5

if it was only the 3rd round, they could have picked up some crow cards

the default starting hand is 10 cards (4 faction cards + 6 coin cards)

some possible hlaalu cards that could give them massive coins cheaply would be the luxery exports card (costs 2 to buy, and generates 3 coin when played)

even on turn 1 they could have the potential to buy up to 2 of those cards pretty easily if the tavern RNG started with those

if they picked up 2 of those cards, their 3rd turn they could have easily drawn both as they might only have 13 cards in the deck (around 50% chance to draw both exports cards), with all other coin cards that would have generated 3+3+3 coins in 1 turn, even more if they picked up the kwama egg mine contracts which would generate their combos (costs 3 but gain 5 with the combo 3, netting 2 more coins)

since i dont know what happened, thats one guess i could make using hlaalu cards that would have been able to generate 11+ coins by turn 3

its usually not possible to generate that many coins on 1 or 2 since you havent shuffled the deck yet at that point

SilverBride · November 5

Well I have never seen anyone generate that many coins by the 3rd round. Then do the exact same thing 2 more times consecutively. Something wasn't right.

SolarRune · November 5

It's absolutely possible with the right combination of crow and hlaalu and contract cards. It does need good luck in the card draw, but if you get that luck on turn two and three and the tavern is good to you its almost hard not to pull that high from r4.

Calastir · November 5

Had something similar happen to me where human opponent kept playing the same 3 agents over and over again after the second hand while I never even saw him buy those cards or gain any patron favor. Since there was no logic to it, I conceded.

Altera0x · November 5

Just yesterday I had a game where my opponent chose Hlaalu, and Kwama Egg Mine plus Ebony Mine landed on a starting table. I was going first and had 5 coins with a Hlaalu starter in my hand. After buying both contracts, I had 10 gold on my first turn.
With enough luck from tavern, it is possible for Hlaalu cards in the deck to sync for multiple turns in a row, so you can have Luxury Shipment + starter + contract (7-8 gold from 2 cards) on one turn, then Luxury Shipment#2 + Hostile Takeover + contract (8-9 gold from 2 cards) on the next, or just double Luxury Shipment with double Writ of Coin (10 gold from 4 cards without any contract help).

Calastir · November 5

Aaand it just happened again. Other player keeps buying any and every card they can while I focus on agents, acquiring gold and patron favor, nevertheless they get to play agent after agent after agent while getting multiple actions every round taking their sweet time doing so. Had to concede again, this is maddening.

SilverBride · November 5

Calastir wrote: »

Had something similar happen to me where human opponent kept playing the same 3 agents over and over again after the second hand while I never even saw him buy those cards or gain any patron favor. Since there was no logic to it, I conceded.

That is similar to what happened in my game. I never saw them buy any high coin generating cards yet they kept playing them each hand.

There is no way any player would have enough coins in the first 2 hands to buy a high coin card even if one was available.

Necrotech_Master · November 6

the most coin a player could have on turn 1 is 6 coins if you were player 2 and had all +1 coin cards in your hand (no power deck starters)

theres a lot of reasonably powerful cards for under 6 coin cost, i would actually say the vast majority of cards cost around 4

as a first turn player 2, my ideal action is buy a 4 cost card and then treasury one of the 1 coin cards

that would spend all of my coins for the turn, only adding +1 to my deck due to the bought card, but significantly increasing my overall buying power for the next time the deck is shuffled

Calastir wrote: »

Aaand it just happened again. Other player keeps buying any and every card they can while I focus on agents, acquiring gold and patron favor, nevertheless they get to play agent after agent after agent while getting multiple actions every round taking their sweet time doing so. Had to concede again, this is maddening.

honestly, buying any available decent card is usually ideal way to play most of the time, especially if its a card that can synergize with your current deck

patron favor is more like a bonus action, agents are OK, but if they keep killing the agent, its not providing much benefit

the main benefit of agents is if they can stay on the field a long time as it is equivalent to +1 card draw, but if its dying every time you play it, its not any different than a standard action card

Northwold · November 6

This really sounds like something is glitching. I can't imagine it's a cheat or anything because (I assume) it's run server side. But the statistical likelihood of what @SilverBride described in particular happening I would imagine is very, very low.

NoSoup · November 6

Been playing ToT again the last few nights and haven't seen any issues at all. There are a lot of seemingly "not great cards" in ToT that if you don't fully understand the mechanics of the card, can become quite powerful quickly.

If you genuinely believe there are bugs/exploits then you need to start recording your games. Without video replays we cannot see what's happened and whether its a case of you simply getting outplayed (which is unfortunately the most likely situation) or a genuine bug.

Calastir · 3:23PM

Human opponent just gained 34 power points obliterating me in one round, after pulling 4 power tops every hand up until then. Make it make sense.

SilverBride · 3:49PM

Last night I played a game and I reached over 40 points. My opponent had around 20. Then they started dropping mass cards that I hadn't seen them use before and their hand went on forever, until they ended up with 50 something.

Something isn't right.