Can you please stop being SO exhausting ?

Vulkunne · July 12

darkriketz wrote: »

Sarannah wrote: »

You are looking at this the wrong way. The reason players complain about things is because they have a passion for ESO and love ESO. Therefor they post things that bother them and want to see changed or improved, only to better the game.

This may seem to be a negative thing, because those who are fine with things will be playing. But it is actually a good thing, as this feedback may improve the game for everyone. Which makes ESO better, may attract more players, and makes ESO grow.

Granted, with so many players we have so many different opinions and viewpoints, that these sometimes clash between players. But as long as we remain respectful, post feedback, and understand we all love ESO, it will be fine.

PS: Personally I love ESO, but that does not mean I think the game is perfect or can't be improved in many ways. So I often leave feedback, mostly with ideas to fix or change things, and with as many facts as I can.
PPS: This is also why I try to help with as many technical problems as possible, so those players will also be able to enjoy ESO.

[snip]

As I said, I also have wishes and complaints, but I explain them (again, daily rewards and the waw effect), I send as kind and constructive possible feedback when I feel the need to, I even bring useful information when I can (I recently answered to a thread regarding rewards in the Golden Pursuits with relevant screenshots).

Someone also said before you that since they pay for the game, they're entitled to complain. True.
[snip] I see way more posts about minor problems and complaints than posts thanking Bethesda for their good work and the amazing gaming experience they offered us (...for a price, yeah), for ten years now.

Words matter meet Actions matter.

Calling us "whining children" has guaranteed I will not listen to anything else you have to say.

For me your arguments on here lost any credibility when you refer to all of us collectively in that manner. I'm an adult. There are also 'young adults' people with degrees and jobs and families and you're putting us all into this same hateful bucket.

Hostility.

I'm no stranger to this, sadly hah. But your posts are full of it. Quick question. If you knew coming in here that people are not happy about things like U47, though not limited to those changes, how has this thread done any different. In other words, people were not happy before and you've done nothing to change that. So why this thread? [snip]

Empathy.

I don't see it my friend. Your posts seem void of empathy. You can't be so hateful and accusatory and then say you're listening and respecting how others feel. If anything, our feelings are under assault by threads like this one. You're not proving to me that you are being empathetic. Can't be overly harsh & critical and show empathy. It doesn't work that way.

Eagle.

It's interesting you have an AD Eagle icon there. By default, I guard my values as I would guard my own life. So, if someone were to show extreme contempt towards me for one reason, I view that the same as a threat against my life itself. Because it's simply not enough to exist, it's our identity, it's the ability to articulate. All of it is tied to together and people should be free to speak their mind. Now if they too are full of it, surely that will prove itself in short order. I think you need to learn how to respect the person and not necessarily what they might say is my advice. Relationships are built on Trust and Trust is built on growing respect between one and another. This is not how you build Trust by crushing people who already weighted down by even more unwanted changes.

I have people against me often, but I love and respect every one of them and I try to listen. But if you're treating us all like trash then it doesn't matter if you're right. Because you are doing things the wrong way. And ZOS is smart enough to know this. Everyone is NOT (and nor should they) going to agree with one another. I wouldn't feed my enemies trash, no, sometimes people we look down on, well I don't look down on anyone (but those who seem the least) can have the most wisdom.

Truth.

The truth points to itself. No need to apologize for people on here presenting the things that matter to us, which are really only fathomable to us, and no one asked you to apologize for us. This is why the US Constitution has things like Article 7. I took an oath to uphold and protect the Constitution so this type of thread will never win over someone like me, not here or in game, especially with Guilds and Cyrodiil. I've left factions and associations in game for that reason. Reasons they caused.

If anyone cannot show a basic level of civility and tolerance towards me, in the same manner as others would do for others under any average day or normal circumstance, then they don't need my time or money. Why? Because they don't deserve it. I do not wake up and work hard (on any given day) to have myself in a position to be consistently treated less than other people. And I make no apology for feeling this way and this is something that will never ever change.

[edited for baiting & to remove quote]

moderatelyfatman · July 12

Dear @darkriketz ,

Your arguments would have more weight if ESO had the quality control of other MMOs out there. As someone who plays other MMOs, most of these game devs are very reluctant to change classes that are in a good place. Most of the heavy buffs and nerfs cycles tend to occur early on in new content.

The problem with ESO is that buffs and nerfs tend to swing from one extreme to another and nothing gets resolved. Even after 10 years, how many of the classes in this game could have been considered to be in a good place: maybe DK and Arcanist?

It is a running joke that this game can't do non-pet sorcs! Or consider the nightblade, the assassin/ninja class, and what role did they play in endgame over the last 3 years: healer!

And I won't even bother talking about ZOS's inability to fix basic bugs after years of reporting. Then there is the general poor performance of the game that has gotten progressively worse over the last 3 years. I've seen so many guild trial runs either struggle for completion or be abandoned due to login bugs.

Players aren't angry because ZOS is meeting some impossible standard, players are angry that ZOS is not meeting the basic standards which are the norm in other MMOs out there. And no, I'm not denying other games don't have their own issues but things tend to get better over time, not worse.

Iriidius · July 12

darkriketz wrote: »

[snip] You're dealing much more damage than I do whatever you're fighting, and I'm not even pushing it ! What are you complaining about exactly ?!? Your toxic need for numbers, as high as possible to the point it's becoming absurd to increase them again ? Quick remember : it's TESO, not an edgy JRPG with secret bosses who deal a million HP damage in a single strike.

PvP, Dungeons and Trials are like this edgy JRPG and only because you decide to ignore them doesnt mean everyone else does. Like you said other people do more dmg because you not even try to. So what is enaugh DPS for you is not enaugh for competitive players.
Rather than ignoring players of content you ignore you belittle and mock them for beeing competitive expecting them to stop competing themselve. Bad META changes force players to adapt to keep competing making competition harder and worse not better.

darkriketz wrote: »

Renato90085 wrote: »

I just want say you're the least susceptible player type..

I feel about other people feelings before I care about mine. It's not about being susceptible, it's about empathy.

You only care/feel about feelings of players sharing your opinion and ZOS(which arent even hurt if they not read or care for critic ignoring it and still get money)

[edited to remove quote]

AzuraFan · July 12

RMW wrote: »

Sometimes people on the forums overreact. That's normal for an MMO.
But calling others whinning children and then complaining that there isn't constructive critisim is equally exhausting.

Agreed. At least we're whining about the game, and not about forum posters. Kind of pointless to whine about people whining.

Sarannah wrote: »

You are looking at this the wrong way. The reason players complain about things is because they have a passion for ESO and love ESO. Therefor they post things that bother them and want to see changed or improved, only to better the game.

This may seem to be a negative thing, because those who are fine with things will be playing. But it is actually a good thing, as this feedback may improve the game for everyone. Which makes ESO better, may attract more players, and makes ESO grow.

Granted, with so many players we have so many different opinions and viewpoints, that these sometimes clash between players. But as long as we remain respectful, post feedback, and understand we all love ESO, it will be fine.

PS: Personally I love ESO, but that does not mean I think the game is perfect or can't be improved in many ways. So I often leave feedback, mostly with ideas to fix or change things, and with as many facts as I can.
PPS: This is also why I try to help with as many technical problems as possible, so those players will also be able to enjoy ESO.

Exactly. If I didn't care about the game, I wouldn't bother posting. I don't spend time discussing games that are just "meh", or when I don't care whether they improve.

WreckfulAbandon · July 12

Lol, just saw this silly QQ of a thread attacking the playerbase after posting my own long winded balance QQ in the official feedback thread. Glad I'm doing it right 🫡

OP, you can think what you like, but openly insulting the playerbase at large when everyone already has their pitchforks out perhaps wasn't the best call. Unless you are just revelling in the chaos

valenwood_vegan · July 12

The really cool thing is that one doesn't even have to read posts they don't like. I definitely didn't read this one.

But as a customer, I'll be continuing to provide my feedback to ZoS on whatever subjects I deem necessary, until the day when I move on to other games. That's the real time to worry btw - when there's no longer any feedback being posted at all, because there's no one left who cares.

Malyore · July 12

What's exhausting is being dragged through the same nonsense for years in a game that should instead be fun.

darkriketz · July 12

Malyore wrote: »

What's exhausting is being dragged through the same nonsense for years in a game that should instead be fun.

There are many other videogames, you're free to abandon TESO if you don't like it anymore. Nobody is putting an edge to your throat so you must play again and again.

Desiato · July 12

Malyore wrote: »

What's exhausting is being dragged through the same nonsense for years in a game that should instead be fun.

I would contact the authorities if I was being forcefully tortured like that! Like that guy being forced to do endeavors and golden pursuits. Those monsters!

Seriously though, I understand it's not always that easy, so I'm just going to throw this out there. If you have a problem, if no one else can help, and if you can find them....maybe you can hire The A-Team.

Heren · July 12

Well I was exhausted before finishing to read the op.

On a more serious note, it seems like a bit of mixed things, and i would agree that some post being made are for silly things, in my opinion at least. I won't say much about that, these kind of queries are often answered rather quickly and sunk as well.

But for other things, really, I understand you don't like having the forum filled with subjects you don't like, but, I would say, chill, get over it. And trust me, your post won't change anything, people who dislike the changes announced will still express their views, and I would say it's not because they old a grudge against ZOS, but most likely because they like ESO, they care for ESO, and they're concerned about ESO's future.

Sure, some people will express their concerns in a rather dramatic fashion ( or maybe childish, as you seemed to view it ), and I understand it's annoying for you, but really, get over it. You ( apparently ) like ESO current state and trust it's future, and I'm happy for you, and if you make a post inviting people to share their happiness about ESO, I would contribute if I have some concording relevant feelings, and I will abstain if I don't.

This forum is a place to express our views, our feelings, and so on - in a civilised manner, or at least in a manner that is not against the TOS. I'm sorry you're exhausted to see so many people conveying negative feelings recently, but these feelings are ( I think ) genuinely expressed ( even if they could be more condensed in fewer posts ). Just like your feelings are genuine. And both have legitimacy to be expressed, even if it displease you.

So, chill, get over it. I too hope to see less negative posts in the future, because I also care for this game. But the difference between us is, I guess, that I don't really like the way it is going, at least in the short term, and I will express my concerns. Sorry if it exhaust you.

Iriidius · July 12

darkriketz wrote: »

Liukke wrote: »

So yeah, your "chill out" call is understandable but kinda tells me you are either new or just don't care about the game going down a spiral of "build these 2 specific builds and that's it".
Class identity is gone, you find always the same builds in the random groups, even in trials there are always the same tanks, all dps can now focus 100% on damage because any support they might have needed is now 100% on the tanks.

I've been playing TESO on a regular basis since 2018, thank you.
And no, I don't care about TESO "putting the focus on 2 builds" because it isn't. There always has been many builds, many crafted and looted sets to offer players a huge diversity in terms of passive bonuses, effects, play style and so on. It's not Bethesda's fault is players suddenly decided to drop their brain, follow "the meta" like in any other online game (hello League of Legends) and use the same items instead of actually finding their own style.

Again, I have six characters, from six different races, four different classes (NB, DK, Sorcerer and Templar, I've tried Warden and Necro but I don't like them, although I like the subclassing system that let me pick specific skill lines from classes that I don't play), six different builds (one magical and one physical in each faction). Even if, again, I'm a PvE player, which obviously isn't as demanding as PvP, I imagine.
Diversity is a thing and again, if you're not using it, that's your problem.

Regarding the fact that nightblades are dealing damage because the support has been shifted to tanks.... hello, have you ever played a MMORPG ? That's basically the essence of it.
One of many particularities of TESO, that has always made me think that it's more an online RPG than an actual MMORPG, is that you can play it completely alone (as I do) without the need of other players to support you. You can tank, deal damage, heal and support with any class (more or less), and if you're good enough, you can even solo group dungeons (again : as I do).

The fact that classes/characters begin (at last) to become more specialized with one player fully playing a tanking role in a group while another is purely focused on damage dealing, well... it's normal. That's how MMORPGs work. If you want to be able to fill every role by yourself, have you ever heard of The Elder Scrolls V Skyrim ?

You want play game alone but defend specialisation and want others stop criticizing it when specialisation requre building to play in group and more sozial interaction than playing in group with solobuilds which is already too much sozial interaction for you.
You defend bad changes to destroy competitive content just to spite competitive players althought these changes even effect noncompetitive players in noncompetitive content negatively.

SkaiFaith · July 12

darkriketz wrote: »

Hello, Tamriel adventurers !
I'm pretty sure my post won't last long on the forum but it's a personal thought that I've been these last days, nourished by years of play and reflection in TESO. I'll try to express it as kindly as possible.

OK, you noticed that Update 47 has been recently released (or will be soon), that we're currently deeply plunged in a Golden Pursuit event (I mean, you, not me, I have completed it) and TESO being a MMORPG, it requires regular adjustments to work as fine as possible.
And even if developpers are doing their best to improve everything and repair what needs to be, there are still DOZENS of players complaining A LOT about EVERYTHING. OMG that's so annoying and exhausting. Not everyone is in cause, of course, I've seen players like DenverRalphy answering calmly and explaining why some complaints aren't really legitimate, but still, I feel like every player who takes part on the official forums has a personal grudge with Zenimax. Don't get me wrong, I also participated in that problem, I complained about daily rewards that I don't find very interesting and I clearly explained, with calm and respect, why I wish that we can sometimes get a "waw effect" from the daily rewards calendar, but this time complaints has reached a new level.

"U47 will nerf everything" "Golden Pursuits aren't retroactive" "I can't complete them and get the rewards", "stop wrecking the game" "this PvP campaign is a nightmare" and so on...
GUYS. BREATHE. CHILL DOWN. And before everything else : READ THE FORUM to check if someone has already written a post regarding what you have to say (spoiler : someone has ! you don't need 24 differents topics to complain about the GP that you can't complete because you already did the questline with your hundred characters).

The thing is, I love the Elder Scrolls games and what Bethesda does, two of my five favorite games of all times are called Fallout 4 and TESO (Subnautica, Subnautica Below Zero and Eastshade, in case you wonder), but I'm mostly a solo player, I don't believe in competitive videogames for social and philosophic reasons (I don't think videogames should add to the already existing toxic competitive spirit in society and I don't think competition is necessary at all in a functioning society), I've been a PvE player in TESO from my very beginnings.
My main character is a bosmeri huntress, nightblade with bow and dual daggers, I've followed a guide years ago to get a solo-nearly invincible werewolf build, and it works perfectly. Recently, subclassing even helped me be play in a more diverse and comfortable way without relying on the WW transformation, I love it. What I'm saying is : I'm a PvE player able to roll on most quests, World Bosses and group dungeons that I cross, difficulty isn't a problem for me. On rare occasions I went in Cyrodiil and Imperial City and was crushed by PvP players who are, obviously, much more skilled than I am in competitive fights. The very same players who often complain that the game is nerfed and their skills will be rendered useless.
[snip] You're dealing much more damage than I do whatever you're fighting, and I'm not even pushing it ! What are you complaining about exactly ?!? Your toxic need for numbers, as high as possible to the point it's becoming absurd to increase them again ? Quick remember : it's TESO, not an edgy JRPG with secret bosses who deal a million HP damage in a single strike.

"I can't complete the Golden Pursuits because I've already did the quests with my 20 characters."
OK, first : yes you can, DenverRalphy patiently explained it several times in several threads, and second : REALLY ?!? The game isn't easy as it is, you REALLY needed to endure the long Scribing questline with TWENTY characters, the base game skills weren't enough for you to play comfortably in diverse fighting styles ?!? There are more skills in the base game and its Chapters than there will ever be in Scribing ! Why do you even need so many characters in the first place ? I have six and I've barely completed most of the game content with two ! I love TESO but there isn't enough classes and weapons to create enough diversity, I don't think it's possible to have twenty UNIQUELY DIFFERENT characters (and yes each of my six characters is unique).

Again : GUYS. CHILL OUT. Go out in the sun (drink fresh water and wear a hat), touch some grass before it's completely dried up by draughts. Microsoft is doing nonsense with its studios, people have lost their jobs and you're complaining that your favorite MMORPG characters will kill enemies slightly less brutally than before. You're complaining that you can't get free rewards from workers who spend all their time studying the game to improve it. TESO works perfectly fine, it's beautiful, there's a whole world to explore, it's not buggy, ok sometimes loading screens are long but it never lasts, [snip]

This is my love cry to Bethesda workers : while many players seem unable to find the slightest satisfaction in what you're doing, many players are. Again, it's the noisy few versus the silent many. You're working hard to make this beautiful Tamriel (and beyond) world a reality, as you've been doing for years, and I thank you for that.
I have complaints, like anyone else, but they're based on wishes (housing, daily rewards and the return of Whiterun, mostly), but for the rest TESO quickly became my one and favorite MMORPG, and for a player who has always played solo games, I think that's something. I've taken some TESO breaks along the years when I got slightly bored, tried other MMORPGs to compare, but none of them had everything TESO has to offer.
You're doing great, I support you and I always will. [snip]

OP, how dare you forget to demand "NERF BEAM!"? /Sarcasm

I love ESO and I get exhausted too by the forum, basically reading every PTS cycle "PLEASE DON'T GO LIVE WITH THIS, YOU'RE KILLING THE GAME" oh c'mon... It's been years. I agree OP, everyone should chill a bit.

I know people will rightly say "take a break from the forum", and it's good advice, but as OP said, it still hurts 'cause of empathy for the devs who have to go through reading all this every single time. In their shoes I would burn out and lose passion for my job, constantly hearing just yelled complaints.

Good to have people pushing for some positivity from time to time. Especially since - no, the game/change isn't bad for everyone; many still appreciate the devs' work and show it playing daily, subbing and spending.

(With this I'm not saying no one should ever complain: it's not my point and neither OP's.)

[edited to remove quote]

ZOS_Icy · July 12

Greetings,

After review, we have decided it best to close this thread as it provides nothing constructive. When making threads, we ask that they be civil, constructive, and kept within the Community Guidelines. If there may be any questions in regards to the rules, please feel free to review them here.

The Elder Scrolls Online Team