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What if the Lore told us about our character?
Tornaad
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This is meant as a what if game. It started off with the idea that we walk up to a random bookshelf, grab one book, and read it. Obviously, in real life, that represents nothing more than code. But in game terms, that book stood out to the character I am playing. If we assume that there are more books in the world than we read and what we read says something about our character, then what would that say about our character?
I did not have the time to try to do a deep dive into the wonderful world of Elder Scrolls Lore to create a personality profile for my character, but I still liked the idea of getting a possible insight, so I used an AI to speed things up. Then I got curious about what everyone else thought the books say about this topic. If we assume that the books we pick up from the shelves and such represent our character's interests, what do they say about our character?
From a surface level, if we assume that the books represent the interests of our character, then our character has some really weird interests.
For those interested, this is what the AI (in this case Grok) had to say when I asked
Edit:
This is not a request to figure out how to play my character. This is meant to be a light hearted exploration of what the lore of the game might say about our character, if we were to choose to apply said insights to our character. I have zero intentions of ever applying this to any situation outside of this conversation.
Edited by Tornaad on 4 June 2025 22:44 I did not have the time to try to do a deep dive into the wonderful world of Elder Scrolls Lore to create a personality profile for my character, but I still liked the idea of getting a possible insight, so I used an AI to speed things up. Then I got curious about what everyone else thought the books say about this topic. If we assume that the books we pick up from the shelves and such represent our character's interests, what do they say about our character?
From a surface level, if we assume that the books represent the interests of our character, then our character has some really weird interests.
For those interested, this is what the AI (in this case Grok) had to say when I asked
The Elder Scrolls Player Characters: Interests Reflected Through Lore Books
In the Elder Scrolls series, the books and lore materials available to the player character serve as a window into their interests, shaped by their role as a hero in Tamriel’s tumultuous history. Assuming the texts they engage with reflect their curiosities, we can construct detailed profiles of the protagonists from Arena, Daggerfall, Morrowind, Oblivion, Skyrim, and The Elder Scrolls Online. Each character’s interests—drawn from the themes of history, magic, religion, politics, and adventure in the books—reveal a unique blend of pragmatism, intellectual hunger, and narrative destiny, evolving with the series’ growing emphasis on immersive lore.
1. The Agent of Arena
Role and Context: In The Elder Scrolls: Arena (1994), the player is an agent of Emperor Uriel Septim VII, tasked with recovering the Staff of Chaos to defeat the usurper Jagar Tharn. As a prisoner-turned-hero in a continent-spanning quest, their journey is one of loyalty and action in a fledgling Tamriel.
Lore Materials and Interests: Arena lacks readable in-game books, with lore delivered through the game manual, quest dialogue, and notes (e.g., maps or inscriptions about the Staff). These materials highlight:
Imperial Politics: The manual’s focus on the Empire’s founding under Tiber Septim and Tharn’s betrayal suggests the Agent is curious about the political crisis threatening Cyrodiil’s stability.
Magical Artifacts: Details about the Staff of Chaos indicate an interest in powerful magical relics, essential for understanding and countering Tharn’s sorcery.
Tamriel’s Geography: Descriptions of provinces (e.g., Skyrim, High Rock) in the manual reflect a traveler’s need to understand the diverse lands they traverse.
Heroic Duty: The narrative of restoring the Emperor points to an interest in tales of loyalty and epic quests, even if not explicitly through books.
Profile: The Agent is a straightforward, duty-bound hero with a practical curiosity about the Empire’s political structure and the magical forces they must overcome. Their engagement with lore is limited by Arena’s design, but their focus on imperial stability and artifact lore paints them as a loyal operative, driven by action rather than introspection. They are a proto-hero, setting the stage for the series’ more complex protagonists.
2. The Agent of Daggerfall
Role and Context: In The Elder Scrolls II: Daggerfall (1996), the player is an agent sent by Uriel Septim VII to the Iliac Bay to investigate King Lysandus’ ghost and a lost letter, becoming entangled in political intrigues involving the Totem of Tiber Septim and the Numidium. The game introduces readable books, marking a leap in lore depth.
Lore Books and Interests: Books found in bookstores, libraries, or containers reveal the Agent’s curiosities:
Political Intrigue: Texts like A History of Daggerfall and The War of Betony show a fascination with the Iliac Bay’s rivalries (e.g., Daggerfall vs. Sentinel), reflecting a need to navigate High Rock and Hammerfell’s complex politics.
Magical and Daedric Lore: On Oblivion and Mysticism suggest an interest in arcane forces, particularly relevant to the Totem and Numidium’s supernatural power.
Heroic Legends: King Edward and The Real Barenziah indicate a curiosity about legendary figures, possibly for inspiration in their own heroic journey.
Cultural Diversity: Books like The First Scroll of Baan Dar highlight an interest in the Bretons and Redguards, essential for working with diverse factions.
Philosophical Questions: The Light and the Dark and The Firmament point to a budding curiosity about Tamriel’s cosmology and divine forces.
Profile: The Daggerfall Agent is a cunning, politically savvy operative with a growing intellectual streak. Their engagement with regional history and magical lore reflects a strategic mind, adept at maneuvering through factional conflicts. Their interest in heroic tales and cosmology suggests they see themselves as part of a larger narrative, blending pragmatism with a curiosity about Tamriel’s deeper truths. They are a bridge between Arena’s simplicity and the scholarly heroes of later games.
3. The Nerevarine (Morrowind)
Role and Context: In The Elder Scrolls III: Morrowind (2002), the Nerevarine is an outlander prisoner in Vvardenfell, potentially the reincarnation of Indoril Nerevar, destined to confront the Tribunal and Dagoth Ur. The game’s rich book system immerses the character in Dunmer culture.
Lore Books and Interests: Books found on shelves, in temples, and in ruins reveal a complex character:
Prophecy and Destiny: The 36 Lessons of Vivec and Nerevarine Prophecy show an obsession with their fated role, questioning whether they are truly Nerevar reborn.
Dunmer Culture and Politics: The War of the First Council and Great House records (The Brown Book of 3E 426) indicate a deep interest in Vvardenfell’s Great Houses, Tribunal Temple, and Ashlander traditions, crucial for navigating local tensions.
Mysticism and Philosophy: Sithis and Vivec and Mephala reflect a fascination with metaphysical truths, exploring the nature of divinity and reality in a world of living gods.
Practical Skills: Skill books like The Wraith’s Wedding Dowry (Speechcraft) suggest a pragmatic need to master abilities for survival and influence.
Profile: The Nerevarine is a reflective, scholarly outsider, blending philosophical depth with practical survival instincts. Their focus on prophecy and Dunmer lore reveals a character wrestling with identity and destiny in an alien land. They are a thinker-hero, seeking to unravel Vvardenfell’s mysteries while mastering the skills to thrive in its dangers, making them the most introspective of the series’ protagonists.
4. The Champion of Cyrodiil (Oblivion)
Role and Context: In The Elder Scrolls IV: Oblivion (2006), the Champion is a prisoner who escapes during Uriel Septim VII’s assassination, tasked with stopping the Oblivion Crisis and aiding Martin Septim against Mehrunes Dagon. Cyrodiil’s cosmopolitan setting shapes their interests.
Lore Books and Interests: Books found in homes, guilds, and Oblivion gates highlight their priorities:
Daedric Threats: On Oblivion and The Mythic Dawn Commentaries show a strategic interest in understanding Mehrunes Dagon and the Oblivion Crisis to combat the Daedric invasion.
Imperial History: A Brief History of the Empire and The Amulet of Kings reflect a curiosity about Cyrodiil’s political legacy, aligning with their role in preserving the Septim dynasty.
Religion and Cosmology: The Monomyth and Varieties of Faith in the Empire indicate an interest in divine forces, likely spurred by their encounter with Akatosh’s avatar and Uriel’s prophecy.
Adventure and Folklore: The Real Barenziah and The Lusty Argonian Maid suggest a lighter curiosity about Tamriel’s heroes and cultural quirks.
Profile: The Champion is a pragmatic, duty-driven hero with a cosmopolitan outlook, balancing strategic needs with intellectual curiosity. Their focus on Daedric lore and imperial history reflects a commitment to saving Cyrodiil, while their engagement with religion and folklore shows a broader quest for meaning in a divine crisis. They are less esoteric than the Nerevarine but more politically engaged, embodying Cyrodiil’s imperial ethos.
5. The Dragonborn (Skyrim)
Role and Context: In The Elder Scrolls V: Skyrim (2011), the Dragonborn is a prisoner who discovers they can absorb dragon souls and use the Thu’um, destined to defeat Alduin, the World-Eater, amid Skyrim’s civil war. The game’s Nordic setting shapes their heroic identity.
Lore Books and Interests: Books in longhouses, colleges, and ruins reveal their focus:
Dragon Lore: The Book of the Dragonborn and The Dragon War show a deep interest in their unique powers and the ancient dragon conflict, essential for facing Alduin.
Nordic Culture: The Songs of the Return and Children of the Sky reflect a fascination with Nord heroism, history, and spirituality, aligning with their role in Skyrim’s war-torn landscape.
Mystical Forces: The Lunar Lorkhan and The Arcanum indicate curiosity about Tamriel’s cosmology, particularly the gods tied to their destiny (e.g., Kyne, Lorkhan).
Combat Skills: Skill books like The Black Arrow (Archery) highlight a practical focus on mastering abilities to survive Skyrim’s dangers.
Profile: The Dragonborn is a bold, mythic warrior rooted in Skyrim’s rugged culture. Their obsession with dragon lore and Nord traditions reflects their role as a legendary savior, while their interest in cosmology and combat skills balances heroic destiny with practical survival. They are less scholarly than the Nerevarine but more action-oriented, embodying Skyrim’s warrior ethos.
6. The Vestige (The Elder Scrolls Online)
Role and Context: In The Elder Scrolls Online (2014–present), the Vestige is a soul-shriven hero who escapes Coldharbour to oppose Molag Bal’s Planemeld and navigate the Alliance War in Tamriel’s Second Era. The game’s continent-wide scope shapes their diverse interests.
Lore Books and Interests: The expansive library across Tamriel’s zones reveals a versatile character:
Daedric Lore: The Slave Pits of Coldharbour and On Oblivion show a pressing need to understand Molag Bal and Daedric mechanics, tied to their soul-shriven nature.
Cultural Diversity: The Code of Malacath, The Green Pact, and Varieties of Faith in Tamriel reflect a broad curiosity about Tamriel’s races and societies, essential for working with the Covenant, Dominion, and Pact.
Prophecy and Religion: The Monomyth and The Nerevarine Prophecy suggest an interest in divine forces and their anomalous existence as a hero without a soul.
Adventure and Skills: Wulfmare’s Guide to Better Thieving and The Argonian Account indicate a practical and adventurous spirit, mastering skills and enjoying Tamriel’s tales.
Profile: The Vestige is a resilient, adaptable wanderer with a global perspective, shaped by their unique condition and Tamriel’s diversity. Their focus on Daedric lore reflects a personal stake in resisting Molag Bal, while their cultural curiosity enables them to bridge warring factions. Philosophical yet practical, they embody exploration and survival in a chaotic era, making them the most versatile of the series’ heroes.
Synthesis and Evolution
Across the Elder Scrolls series, the player characters share common threads but evolve with the games’ increasing lore depth:
Destiny and Prophecy: All are drawn to texts about fate (e.g., Nerevarine Prophecy, The Book of the Dragonborn), reflecting their roles as chosen heroes grappling with divine mandates.
Practical Knowledge: From Daggerfall’s The Wraith’s Wedding Dowry to Skyrim’s The Black Arrow, each seeks skills to survive Tamriel’s dangers, showing pragmatism.
Cultural Engagement: Whether it’s Arena’s provinces, Daggerfall’s Iliac Bay, or ESO’s Tamriel, all are curious about the societies they navigate, adapting to local politics and traditions.
Mysticism and Philosophy: Texts like The Firmament (Daggerfall) and Sithis (Morrowind) reveal a recurring interest in Tamriel’s cosmology, growing more pronounced in later games.
Evolution:
Arena’s Agent is a simple, duty-driven hero, limited by the game’s sparse lore but curious about the Empire and artifacts.
Daggerfall’s Agent introduces scholarly depth, blending political savvy with magical and mythic interests.
The Nerevarine (Morrowind) is a philosophical outsider, obsessed with prophecy and Dunmer lore.
The Champion (Oblivion) is a cosmopolitan savior, focused on imperial stability and Daedric threats.
The Dragonborn (Skyrim) is a mythic warrior, rooted in Nord heroism and dragon lore.
The Vestige (ESO) is a versatile wanderer, embracing Tamriel’s diversity and Daedric challenges.
This progression reflects the series’ shift from action-driven RPG to immersive, lore-rich worlds, with each protagonist becoming more complex and reflective of their setting’s cultural and narrative depth.
In the Elder Scrolls series, the books and lore materials available to the player character serve as a window into their interests, shaped by their role as a hero in Tamriel’s tumultuous history. Assuming the texts they engage with reflect their curiosities, we can construct detailed profiles of the protagonists from Arena, Daggerfall, Morrowind, Oblivion, Skyrim, and The Elder Scrolls Online. Each character’s interests—drawn from the themes of history, magic, religion, politics, and adventure in the books—reveal a unique blend of pragmatism, intellectual hunger, and narrative destiny, evolving with the series’ growing emphasis on immersive lore.
1. The Agent of Arena
Role and Context: In The Elder Scrolls: Arena (1994), the player is an agent of Emperor Uriel Septim VII, tasked with recovering the Staff of Chaos to defeat the usurper Jagar Tharn. As a prisoner-turned-hero in a continent-spanning quest, their journey is one of loyalty and action in a fledgling Tamriel.
Lore Materials and Interests: Arena lacks readable in-game books, with lore delivered through the game manual, quest dialogue, and notes (e.g., maps or inscriptions about the Staff). These materials highlight:
Imperial Politics: The manual’s focus on the Empire’s founding under Tiber Septim and Tharn’s betrayal suggests the Agent is curious about the political crisis threatening Cyrodiil’s stability.
Magical Artifacts: Details about the Staff of Chaos indicate an interest in powerful magical relics, essential for understanding and countering Tharn’s sorcery.
Tamriel’s Geography: Descriptions of provinces (e.g., Skyrim, High Rock) in the manual reflect a traveler’s need to understand the diverse lands they traverse.
Heroic Duty: The narrative of restoring the Emperor points to an interest in tales of loyalty and epic quests, even if not explicitly through books.
Profile: The Agent is a straightforward, duty-bound hero with a practical curiosity about the Empire’s political structure and the magical forces they must overcome. Their engagement with lore is limited by Arena’s design, but their focus on imperial stability and artifact lore paints them as a loyal operative, driven by action rather than introspection. They are a proto-hero, setting the stage for the series’ more complex protagonists.
2. The Agent of Daggerfall
Role and Context: In The Elder Scrolls II: Daggerfall (1996), the player is an agent sent by Uriel Septim VII to the Iliac Bay to investigate King Lysandus’ ghost and a lost letter, becoming entangled in political intrigues involving the Totem of Tiber Septim and the Numidium. The game introduces readable books, marking a leap in lore depth.
Lore Books and Interests: Books found in bookstores, libraries, or containers reveal the Agent’s curiosities:
Political Intrigue: Texts like A History of Daggerfall and The War of Betony show a fascination with the Iliac Bay’s rivalries (e.g., Daggerfall vs. Sentinel), reflecting a need to navigate High Rock and Hammerfell’s complex politics.
Magical and Daedric Lore: On Oblivion and Mysticism suggest an interest in arcane forces, particularly relevant to the Totem and Numidium’s supernatural power.
Heroic Legends: King Edward and The Real Barenziah indicate a curiosity about legendary figures, possibly for inspiration in their own heroic journey.
Cultural Diversity: Books like The First Scroll of Baan Dar highlight an interest in the Bretons and Redguards, essential for working with diverse factions.
Philosophical Questions: The Light and the Dark and The Firmament point to a budding curiosity about Tamriel’s cosmology and divine forces.
Profile: The Daggerfall Agent is a cunning, politically savvy operative with a growing intellectual streak. Their engagement with regional history and magical lore reflects a strategic mind, adept at maneuvering through factional conflicts. Their interest in heroic tales and cosmology suggests they see themselves as part of a larger narrative, blending pragmatism with a curiosity about Tamriel’s deeper truths. They are a bridge between Arena’s simplicity and the scholarly heroes of later games.
3. The Nerevarine (Morrowind)
Role and Context: In The Elder Scrolls III: Morrowind (2002), the Nerevarine is an outlander prisoner in Vvardenfell, potentially the reincarnation of Indoril Nerevar, destined to confront the Tribunal and Dagoth Ur. The game’s rich book system immerses the character in Dunmer culture.
Lore Books and Interests: Books found on shelves, in temples, and in ruins reveal a complex character:
Prophecy and Destiny: The 36 Lessons of Vivec and Nerevarine Prophecy show an obsession with their fated role, questioning whether they are truly Nerevar reborn.
Dunmer Culture and Politics: The War of the First Council and Great House records (The Brown Book of 3E 426) indicate a deep interest in Vvardenfell’s Great Houses, Tribunal Temple, and Ashlander traditions, crucial for navigating local tensions.
Mysticism and Philosophy: Sithis and Vivec and Mephala reflect a fascination with metaphysical truths, exploring the nature of divinity and reality in a world of living gods.
Practical Skills: Skill books like The Wraith’s Wedding Dowry (Speechcraft) suggest a pragmatic need to master abilities for survival and influence.
Profile: The Nerevarine is a reflective, scholarly outsider, blending philosophical depth with practical survival instincts. Their focus on prophecy and Dunmer lore reveals a character wrestling with identity and destiny in an alien land. They are a thinker-hero, seeking to unravel Vvardenfell’s mysteries while mastering the skills to thrive in its dangers, making them the most introspective of the series’ protagonists.
4. The Champion of Cyrodiil (Oblivion)
Role and Context: In The Elder Scrolls IV: Oblivion (2006), the Champion is a prisoner who escapes during Uriel Septim VII’s assassination, tasked with stopping the Oblivion Crisis and aiding Martin Septim against Mehrunes Dagon. Cyrodiil’s cosmopolitan setting shapes their interests.
Lore Books and Interests: Books found in homes, guilds, and Oblivion gates highlight their priorities:
Daedric Threats: On Oblivion and The Mythic Dawn Commentaries show a strategic interest in understanding Mehrunes Dagon and the Oblivion Crisis to combat the Daedric invasion.
Imperial History: A Brief History of the Empire and The Amulet of Kings reflect a curiosity about Cyrodiil’s political legacy, aligning with their role in preserving the Septim dynasty.
Religion and Cosmology: The Monomyth and Varieties of Faith in the Empire indicate an interest in divine forces, likely spurred by their encounter with Akatosh’s avatar and Uriel’s prophecy.
Adventure and Folklore: The Real Barenziah and The Lusty Argonian Maid suggest a lighter curiosity about Tamriel’s heroes and cultural quirks.
Profile: The Champion is a pragmatic, duty-driven hero with a cosmopolitan outlook, balancing strategic needs with intellectual curiosity. Their focus on Daedric lore and imperial history reflects a commitment to saving Cyrodiil, while their engagement with religion and folklore shows a broader quest for meaning in a divine crisis. They are less esoteric than the Nerevarine but more politically engaged, embodying Cyrodiil’s imperial ethos.
5. The Dragonborn (Skyrim)
Role and Context: In The Elder Scrolls V: Skyrim (2011), the Dragonborn is a prisoner who discovers they can absorb dragon souls and use the Thu’um, destined to defeat Alduin, the World-Eater, amid Skyrim’s civil war. The game’s Nordic setting shapes their heroic identity.
Lore Books and Interests: Books in longhouses, colleges, and ruins reveal their focus:
Dragon Lore: The Book of the Dragonborn and The Dragon War show a deep interest in their unique powers and the ancient dragon conflict, essential for facing Alduin.
Nordic Culture: The Songs of the Return and Children of the Sky reflect a fascination with Nord heroism, history, and spirituality, aligning with their role in Skyrim’s war-torn landscape.
Mystical Forces: The Lunar Lorkhan and The Arcanum indicate curiosity about Tamriel’s cosmology, particularly the gods tied to their destiny (e.g., Kyne, Lorkhan).
Combat Skills: Skill books like The Black Arrow (Archery) highlight a practical focus on mastering abilities to survive Skyrim’s dangers.
Profile: The Dragonborn is a bold, mythic warrior rooted in Skyrim’s rugged culture. Their obsession with dragon lore and Nord traditions reflects their role as a legendary savior, while their interest in cosmology and combat skills balances heroic destiny with practical survival. They are less scholarly than the Nerevarine but more action-oriented, embodying Skyrim’s warrior ethos.
6. The Vestige (The Elder Scrolls Online)
Role and Context: In The Elder Scrolls Online (2014–present), the Vestige is a soul-shriven hero who escapes Coldharbour to oppose Molag Bal’s Planemeld and navigate the Alliance War in Tamriel’s Second Era. The game’s continent-wide scope shapes their diverse interests.
Lore Books and Interests: The expansive library across Tamriel’s zones reveals a versatile character:
Daedric Lore: The Slave Pits of Coldharbour and On Oblivion show a pressing need to understand Molag Bal and Daedric mechanics, tied to their soul-shriven nature.
Cultural Diversity: The Code of Malacath, The Green Pact, and Varieties of Faith in Tamriel reflect a broad curiosity about Tamriel’s races and societies, essential for working with the Covenant, Dominion, and Pact.
Prophecy and Religion: The Monomyth and The Nerevarine Prophecy suggest an interest in divine forces and their anomalous existence as a hero without a soul.
Adventure and Skills: Wulfmare’s Guide to Better Thieving and The Argonian Account indicate a practical and adventurous spirit, mastering skills and enjoying Tamriel’s tales.
Profile: The Vestige is a resilient, adaptable wanderer with a global perspective, shaped by their unique condition and Tamriel’s diversity. Their focus on Daedric lore reflects a personal stake in resisting Molag Bal, while their cultural curiosity enables them to bridge warring factions. Philosophical yet practical, they embody exploration and survival in a chaotic era, making them the most versatile of the series’ heroes.
Synthesis and Evolution
Across the Elder Scrolls series, the player characters share common threads but evolve with the games’ increasing lore depth:
Destiny and Prophecy: All are drawn to texts about fate (e.g., Nerevarine Prophecy, The Book of the Dragonborn), reflecting their roles as chosen heroes grappling with divine mandates.
Practical Knowledge: From Daggerfall’s The Wraith’s Wedding Dowry to Skyrim’s The Black Arrow, each seeks skills to survive Tamriel’s dangers, showing pragmatism.
Cultural Engagement: Whether it’s Arena’s provinces, Daggerfall’s Iliac Bay, or ESO’s Tamriel, all are curious about the societies they navigate, adapting to local politics and traditions.
Mysticism and Philosophy: Texts like The Firmament (Daggerfall) and Sithis (Morrowind) reveal a recurring interest in Tamriel’s cosmology, growing more pronounced in later games.
Evolution:
Arena’s Agent is a simple, duty-driven hero, limited by the game’s sparse lore but curious about the Empire and artifacts.
Daggerfall’s Agent introduces scholarly depth, blending political savvy with magical and mythic interests.
The Nerevarine (Morrowind) is a philosophical outsider, obsessed with prophecy and Dunmer lore.
The Champion (Oblivion) is a cosmopolitan savior, focused on imperial stability and Daedric threats.
The Dragonborn (Skyrim) is a mythic warrior, rooted in Nord heroism and dragon lore.
The Vestige (ESO) is a versatile wanderer, embracing Tamriel’s diversity and Daedric challenges.
This progression reflects the series’ shift from action-driven RPG to immersive, lore-rich worlds, with each protagonist becoming more complex and reflective of their setting’s cultural and narrative depth.
Edit:
This is not a request to figure out how to play my character. This is meant to be a light hearted exploration of what the lore of the game might say about our character, if we were to choose to apply said insights to our character. I have zero intentions of ever applying this to any situation outside of this conversation.
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Syldras✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭That's the same text you posted a few days ago and then asked the thread to be deleted, right? (Seems so, as it still describes the Vestige as embracing diversity and Daedric treats - the latter a strange thing to "embrace".) Then I won't have to skim it another time.
Putting aside the AI topic, I still don't understand how the existence of books in the game alone would necessarily define our player character. ESO has over 7,150 books right now (although it does include things like private notes and letters, but they count as "books" item-wise) and in no way does the sole existence of something mean that it defines our character's interests or character.
Real world example: If I go into a big bookstore today, there will be books about all kinds of topics, including, let's say, crocheting and child-rearing, and in terms of fiction, there will be everything from the average serial killer psycho thriller to kitchy paperback romance novels. But just because these things are there, it doesn't mean I'm interested in crocheting, child-rearing, serial killer stories or romance novels.
Of course in real life I wouldn't pick those books up to take a closer look, but in ESO we often can't even choose whether to open a book or not, because at a bookshelf we got a random one displayed without seeing the title beforehand.
Edited by Syldras on 4 June 2025 14:17@Syldras | PC | EU
The forceful expression of will gives true honor to the Ancestors.
Sarayn Andrethi, Telvanni mage (Main)
Darvasa Andrethi, his "I'm NOT a Necromancer!" sister
Malacar Sunavarlas, Altmer Ayleid vampire
Soris Rethandus, a Sleeper not yet awake10 -
Tornaad✭✭✭✭✭
✭That's the same text you posted a few days ago and then asked the thread to be deleted, right? (Seems so, as it still describes the Vestige as embracing diversity and Daedric treats - the latter a strange thing to "embrace".) Then I won't have to skim it another time.
Putting aside the AI topic, I still don't understand how the existence of books in the game alone would necessarily define our player character. ESO has over 7,150 books right now (although it does include things like private notes and letters, but they count as "books" item-wise) and in no way does the sole existence of something mean that it defines our character's interests or character.
Real world example: If I go into a big bookstore today, there will be books about all kinds of topics, including, let's say, crocheting and child-rearing, and in terms of fiction, there will be everything from the average serial killer psycho thriller to kitchy paperback romance novels. But just because these things are there, it doesn't mean I'm interested in crocheting, child-rearing, serial killer stories or romance novels.
Of course in real life I wouldn't pick those books up to take a closer look, but in ESO we often can't even choose whether to open a book or not, because at a bookshelf we got a random one displayed without seeing the title beforehand.
Applying your situation to my hypothetical question, if I walk into a bookstore with thousands of books, I am only going to go to those sections that I am interested in and will only pick up those books which catch my attention, and each of those choices can tell someone watching.
Does this actually apply to the game, technically the answer to that is only if you want it to. In this case, the goal of the this discussion is to explore the question of what if it does.0 -
mocap✭✭✭✭✭
✭
Just lore basics. Read "Chaotic Creatia: The Azure Plasm" book.If we assume that the books we pick up from the shelves and such represent our character's interests, what do they say about our character?
If you mean books regarding your Orc Sorc with Two-handed Sword, Resto staff and the ability to summon bear and skeletons... then there are no such books in the game and are unlikely to be.0 -
Danikat✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭In real life if I'm looking at someone else's bookshelf and I pick one book to read by far the most likely reason is the title seemed weird to me and I wanted to know what it was about. The second most likely is I'm wondering what a book like that might say about the person who owns it.
I suppose if yuo watched me do it enough times you might get some idea about the type of words/phrases I'm surprised to see in book titles, but I don't think you'd learn much about my personality as a whole. I doubt it's any more meaningful for a fictional character.
If you want to know about the Vestiges personality I can recommend two options:
1) Read about the actual game's lore instead of a randomly generated 'summary' of amalgamated bits of TES lore.
2) They're your character - use your own imagination to decide what kind of a person they would be based on your actions in the game and how you want them to be percieved, instead of asking a computer to do it for you.PC EU player | She/her/hers | PAWS (Positively Against Wrip-off Stuff) - Say No to Crown Crates!
"Remember in this game we call life that no one said it's fair"8 -
Tornaad✭✭✭✭✭
✭In real life if I'm looking at someone else's bookshelf and I pick one book to read by far the most likely reason is the title seemed weird to me and I wanted to know what it was about. The second most likely is I'm wondering what a book like that might say about the person who owns it.
I suppose if yuo watched me do it enough times you might get some idea about the type of words/phrases I'm surprised to see in book titles, but I don't think you'd learn much about my personality as a whole. I doubt it's any more meaningful for a fictional character.
If you want to know about the Vestiges personality I can recommend two options:
1) Read about the actual game's lore instead of a randomly generated 'summary' of amalgamated bits of TES lore.
2) They're your character - use your own imagination to decide what kind of a person they would be based on your actions in the game and how you want them to be percieved, instead of asking a computer to do it for you.
Thank you for your advice. I do role play my characters and I have a lot of fun doing so. This has nothing to do with my role playing and everything to do with a simple what if game.1 -
TaSheen✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭It's an interesting exercise, Tornaad. It's not a viable thing for me/my characters in my opinion, because:
Every character I've created has a life, supported by her backstory. Her life is pretty well cut and dried as she starts adventuring, and then she changes depending on what happens to her through quests and adventures. None of my girls are identical, not even the ones of the same race, and every girl does different quests and adventures based on her life prior to game, and her own backstory.
So having their inherent (in-game) "selves" manipulated by books they read isn't really an optimal idea in my view.
I found the AI overview interesting; it was more thorough than I expected, but I'm not really sure it applies to anything I ever thought about any of the games, either when I was actively playing them, or later when thinking back on them.______________________________________________________
"But even in books, the heroes make mistakes, and there isn't always a happy ending." Mercedes Lackey, Into the West
PC NA, PC EU (non steam)- four accounts, many alts....4 -
Tornaad✭✭✭✭✭
✭It's an interesting exercise, Tornaad. It's not a viable thing for me/my characters in my opinion, because:
Every character I've created has a life, supported by her backstory. Her life is pretty well cut and dried as she starts adventuring, and then she changes depending on what happens to her through quests and adventures. None of my girls are identical, not even the ones of the same race, and every girl does different quests and adventures based on her life prior to game, and her own backstory.
So having their inherent (in-game) "selves" manipulated by books they read isn't really an optimal idea in my view.
I found the AI overview interesting; it was more thorough than I expected, but I'm not really sure it applies to anything I ever thought about any of the games, either when I was actively playing them, or later when thinking back on them.
I have no intention of ever applying any of it in game either. I too have already built backgrounds for my character. I just found the question fascinating and enjoyed the AI evaluation, and was hoping to get a conversation going about that what if game.0 -
TaSheen✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭The "what if" for me would be (if it was not optional) just one more reason to no longer play.______________________________________________________
"But even in books, the heroes make mistakes, and there isn't always a happy ending." Mercedes Lackey, Into the West
PC NA, PC EU (non steam)- four accounts, many alts....0 -
Syldras✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Applying your situation to my hypothetical question, if I walk into a bookstore with thousands of books, I am only going to go to those sections that I am interested in and will only pick up those books which catch my attention, and each of those choices can tell someone watching.
Does this actually apply to the game, technically the answer to that is only if you want it to. In this case, the goal of the this discussion is to explore the question of what if it does.
I'm not sure how that AI thing helps you with this question because all that thing does is scanning the contents of all TES lorebooks it can find in its database (which might not even be complete), and then generates an overview about which topics it finds there. Which might say something about the society the game takes place in, but not about the character you're playing.
In case of ESO it's especially complicated because it takes place in many different places all across Tamriel. On Vvardenfell, you'll find books about the Great Houses and about the Dunmer Temple, in Rift you'll find books about the barrows of the ancient Nords or about mead making, while the books in Murkmire will tell you about hunting and mating habits of Argonians. But how do the Dunmer Temple, Nord mead making or Argonian mating habits matter when you play an Altmer from Alinor?
And yes, of course we could just assume "what if" and say you're playing an Altmer who drinks mead and lays eggs while praying to the Tribunal. Doesn't make much sense to me, though.
Edited by Syldras on 4 June 2025 22:49@Syldras | PC | EU
The forceful expression of will gives true honor to the Ancestors.
Sarayn Andrethi, Telvanni mage (Main)
Darvasa Andrethi, his "I'm NOT a Necromancer!" sister
Malacar Sunavarlas, Altmer Ayleid vampire
Soris Rethandus, a Sleeper not yet awake6 -
Tornaad✭✭✭✭✭
✭Applying your situation to my hypothetical question, if I walk into a bookstore with thousands of books, I am only going to go to those sections that I am interested in and will only pick up those books which catch my attention, and each of those choices can tell someone watching.
Does this actually apply to the game, technically the answer to that is only if you want it to. In this case, the goal of the this discussion is to explore the question of what if it does.
I'm not sure how that AI thing helps you with this question because all that thing does is scanning the contents of all TES lorebooks it can find in its database (which might not even be complete), and then generates an overview about which topics it finds there. Which might say something about the society the game takes place in, but not about the character you're playing.
In case of ESO it's especially complicated because it takes place in many different places all across Tamriel. On Vvardenfell, you'll find books about the Great Houses and about the Dunmer Temple, in Rift you'll find books about the barrows of the ancient Nords or about mead making, while the books in Murkmire will tell you about hunting and mating habits of Argonians. But how do the Dunmer Temple, Nord mead making or Argonian mating habits matter when you play an Altmer from Alinor?
And yes, of course we could just assume "what if" and say you're playing an Altmer who drinks mead and lays eggs while praying to the Tribunal. Doesn't make much sense to me, though.
You can tell a lot about a person by what books they are interested in.
The goal of this thread is to assume that the books that are picked up off of shelves are chosen not at random but because that is the kind of things the character is interested in, and from there, look at what those interests tell us about the character.
Let me give you a real life example, namely from myself. I am an avid reader. I almost never read fiction. In the past, most of my reading has been in religious topics. Recently it has been heavily focused around both business and programming. My current reading list includes the top five most recommended software development books.
Just from that little glimpse, even without dropping any titles, there is a lot you could learn about me and discern about my character. And then when you factor in that someone with that kind of reading list (which includes a book I first read before graduating high school and that I have met people almost twice my current age who are intimidated to read it) interested in a game like Elder Scrolls, could create quite the interesting picture of a character.
It would work even better if everyone involved in the conversation knew the nature of the books in question and not just the subject nature of them, but I hope that serves as a reasonable example.
That is the kind of thing I am hoping to get done here.
Edited by Tornaad on 5 June 2025 02:060 -
Syldras✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭You can tell a lot about a person by what books they are interested in.
Yes. As someone who is very much interested in literature, has studied philology (and part of that was literature history and historical languages) as a secondary subject at university (first one was history), who has his own private library (started at age 16 - it's going for over 20 years now), and who also collects antique books (and reads all of them, even the ones from before 1800 - it's not just for fancy looks), I am aware of reading habits.The goal of this thread is to assume that the books that are picked up off of shelves are chosen not at random but because that is the kind of things the character is interested in, and from there, look at what those interests tell us about the character.
And that's what I've been saying since my first post: The variety is too big. ESO has over 7000 lorebooks right now, it's just not reasonable to assume that these would all describe the interests of one character. I have rather broad interests, but even I would not read everything.@Syldras | PC | EU
The forceful expression of will gives true honor to the Ancestors.
Sarayn Andrethi, Telvanni mage (Main)
Darvasa Andrethi, his "I'm NOT a Necromancer!" sister
Malacar Sunavarlas, Altmer Ayleid vampire
Soris Rethandus, a Sleeper not yet awake2 -
TheMajority✭✭✭✭✭
✭a character can chose to read about something and it doesn't mean that it was an actual interest to them or a part of who they are, just info they gotTime flies like an arrow- but fruit flies like a banana.
Sorry for my English, I do not always have a translation tool available. Thank you for your patience with our conversation and working towards our mutual understanding of the topic.3 -
Danikat✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭The lore books describe all aspects of the world your character lives in, therefore they indicate an interest in all aspects of the world they live in.
I'm not sure what else you're expecting to get from this.Edited by Danikat on 5 June 2025 09:34PC EU player | She/her/hers | PAWS (Positively Against Wrip-off Stuff) - Say No to Crown Crates!
"Remember in this game we call life that no one said it's fair"6 -
Tornaad✭✭✭✭✭
✭You can tell a lot about a person by what books they are interested in.
Yes. As someone who is very much interested in literature, has studied philology (and part of that was literature history and historical languages) as a secondary subject at university (first one was history), who has his own private library (started at age 16 - it's going for over 20 years now), and who also collects antique books (and reads all of them, even the ones from before 1800 - it's not just for fancy looks), I am aware of reading habits.The goal of this thread is to assume that the books that are picked up off of shelves are chosen not at random but because that is the kind of things the character is interested in, and from there, look at what those interests tell us about the character.
And that's what I've been saying since my first post: The variety is too big. ESO has over 7000 lorebooks right now, it's just not reasonable to assume that these would all describe the interests of one character. I have rather broad interests, but even I would not read everything.
So don't worry about all of them. That reason is why I used the AI.0 -
katanagirl1✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Interesting thought experiment, but my character cannot tell what kind of book she is going to pick up. I just click on a bookcase. I would not like randomness determining her personality. Unless the game starts labeling bookshelves like a bookstore, which I don’t think I would like, then it might take my character down a path that I do not like. I try to read all books for the Eidetic Memory.
I’m like @TaSheen mostly in my gameplay. I don’t really have a idea of their backstory when I create them, but as I play along I find myself being drawn to certain clothing for them or a certain mount, for example, and then a picture of their identity starts to emerge and form. I’m fine creating that all on my own.
Khajiit Stamblade main
Dark Elf Magsorc
Redguard Stamina Dragonknight
Orc Stamplar PVP
Breton Magsorc PVP
Dark Elf Magden
Khajiit Stamblade
Khajiit Stamina Arcanist
PS5 NA1 -
MasterSpatula✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭I do hope there's a book or two about the Vestige's exploits in TES6, even if most of the details are lost to time. In fact, I'd love it if it were highly embellished, as the "unreliable narrator" is a vital part of TES lore.
But as for books about us actually appearing in ESO, nah. In game, it hasn't even been a year yet. Have you ever tried to write a book? It takes time.Edited by MasterSpatula on 5 June 2025 22:57"A probable impossibility is preferable to an improbable possibility." - Aristotle1 -
TaSheen✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭randconfig wrote: »no, would ruin immersion
That would depend on one's definition of "immersion".______________________________________________________
"But even in books, the heroes make mistakes, and there isn't always a happy ending." Mercedes Lackey, Into the West
PC NA, PC EU (non steam)- four accounts, many alts....1 -
johnbonne✭✭✭MasterSpatula wrote: »I do hope there's a book or two about the Vestige's exploits in TES6, even if most of the details are lost to time. In fact, I'd love it if it were highly embellished, as the "unreliable narrator" is a vital part of TES lore.
But as for books about us actually appearing in ESO, nah. In game, it hasn't even been a year yet. Have you ever tried to write a book? It takes time.
Agreed. I enjoyed the rumour of the Nerevarine going to Akavir as a way of giving some form of conclusion to satisfy questions players would've had, and it seems plausible in-universe too. I liked one Redditor's idea that the Nerevarine read Mysterious Akavir, thought it was a travel brochure and couldn't resist seeing all the cool monsters there. "Go to exotic locations, meet exciting new people... and kill them!"
I've heard criticism of the Akavir rumour, with people making their own head-canon for what actually happened, with fighting to release Morrowind's slaves or go on to help end the Oblivion Crisis being common examples. But it doesn't mean it actually happened, and any other rumours pale in comparison to the fact that the Nerevarine killed a god with a lockpick because they was off their rocker on skooma.
Hearing about the Vestige's adventures would be fun in TESVI, even if they're just a face in the crowd, or it's some low-brow pulp fiction. None of it has to be true. Truth, canonicity and objectivity in this series is hard to pin down thanks to things like dragon breaks, CHIM, the Godhead, and - most likely to be attributed to misinterpretation and falsehood - dizzyingly excessive amounts of alcohol. Since all of Daggerfall's endings became canon, the Tamrielic lore keeper who doesn't want a headache considers the laws of reality less concrete, more a suggestion, and at most a mild inconvenience that gets in the way of a damn good story.
PS: Got a bit carried away there, my apologies! I just love how insane TES lore can get, and how its authors unashamedly revel in it. ^_^"A question requires an answer, a set of facts has only a result. An answer raises further questions, but a result is indisputable." - Imperial Commander Ryland Kline, Warhammer Siege
PC EUPAWS (Positively Against Wrip-off Stuff) - Say No to Crown Crates!2 -
MasterSpatula✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭MasterSpatula wrote: »I do hope there's a book or two about the Vestige's exploits in TES6, even if most of the details are lost to time. In fact, I'd love it if it were highly embellished, as the "unreliable narrator" is a vital part of TES lore.
But as for books about us actually appearing in ESO, nah. In game, it hasn't even been a year yet. Have you ever tried to write a book? It takes time.
Agreed. I enjoyed the rumour of the Nerevarine going to Akavir as a way of giving some form of conclusion to satisfy questions players would've had, and it seems plausible in-universe too. I liked one Redditor's idea that the Nerevarine read Mysterious Akavir, thought it was a travel brochure and couldn't resist seeing all the cool monsters there. "Go to exotic locations, meet exciting new people... and kill them!"
I've heard criticism of the Akavir rumour, with people making their own head-canon for what actually happened, with fighting to release Morrowind's slaves or go on to help end the Oblivion Crisis being common examples. But it doesn't mean it actually happened, and any other rumours pale in comparison to the fact that the Nerevarine killed a god with a lockpick because they was off their rocker on skooma.
Hearing about the Vestige's adventures would be fun in TESVI, even if they're just a face in the crowd, or it's some low-brow pulp fiction. None of it has to be true. Truth, canonicity and objectivity in this series is hard to pin down thanks to things like dragon breaks, CHIM, the Godhead, and - most likely to be attributed to misinterpretation and falsehood - dizzyingly excessive amounts of alcohol. Since all of Daggerfall's endings became canon, the Tamrielic lore keeper who doesn't want a headache considers the laws of reality less concrete, more a suggestion, and at most a mild inconvenience that gets in the way of a damn good story.
PS: Got a bit carried away there, my apologies! I just love how insane TES lore can get, and how its authors unashamedly revel in it. ^_^
I'm with you 100%, @johnbonne. Add to your list of lore unreliability the Spinners, storytellers who can retcon reality if they just storytell hard enough."A probable impossibility is preferable to an improbable possibility." - Aristotle1 -
Tornaad✭✭✭✭✭
✭MasterSpatula wrote: »I do hope there's a book or two about the Vestige's exploits in TES6, even if most of the details are lost to time. In fact, I'd love it if it were highly embellished, as the "unreliable narrator" is a vital part of TES lore.
But as for books about us actually appearing in ESO, nah. In game, it hasn't even been a year yet. Have you ever tried to write a book? It takes time.
Agreed. I enjoyed the rumour of the Nerevarine going to Akavir as a way of giving some form of conclusion to satisfy questions players would've had, and it seems plausible in-universe too. I liked one Redditor's idea that the Nerevarine read Mysterious Akavir, thought it was a travel brochure and couldn't resist seeing all the cool monsters there. "Go to exotic locations, meet exciting new people... and kill them!"
I've heard criticism of the Akavir rumour, with people making their own head-canon for what actually happened, with fighting to release Morrowind's slaves or go on to help end the Oblivion Crisis being common examples. But it doesn't mean it actually happened, and any other rumours pale in comparison to the fact that the Nerevarine killed a god with a lockpick because they was off their rocker on skooma.
Hearing about the Vestige's adventures would be fun in TESVI, even if they're just a face in the crowd, or it's some low-brow pulp fiction. None of it has to be true. Truth, canonicity and objectivity in this series is hard to pin down thanks to things like dragon breaks, CHIM, the Godhead, and - most likely to be attributed to misinterpretation and falsehood - dizzyingly excessive amounts of alcohol. Since all of Daggerfall's endings became canon, the Tamrielic lore keeper who doesn't want a headache considers the laws of reality less concrete, more a suggestion, and at most a mild inconvenience that gets in the way of a damn good story.
PS: Got a bit carried away there, my apologies! I just love how insane TES lore can get, and how its authors unashamedly revel in it. ^_^
I enjoyed the read. No need to apologize.1
