champion points and PVP

randomguy · October 16

UNPOPULAR OPINION ALERT

No CP PVP should be promoted in Cyrodiil. It is my opinion that the Alliance Locked Campaign should not be Grayhost, but Ravenwatch.

We are seeing some changes to BGs, which have historically been a NoCP zone. I believe NoCP allows for more balanced PVP in general. First, the obvious reason it allows for equal footing amongst all players. Second, CP allows for specialized builds that can do enormous amounts of damage or result in extreme damage mitigation. CP can be used in a balanced way; however, it is can be used to create a very unbalanced playstyle as well. In battlegrounds, we had seen matches where it was almost impossible to kill anyone and they were not dynamic or very fun. Over time the developers committed to a NoCP battlegrounds experience, which I am grateful for.

Making the same commitment to Cyrodiil seems to me like an obvious choice. The developers had explored NoCP and NoProc sets in Cyrodiil to improve server performance. While I do not have the data from those events, I do believe that overall the issue is the concentration of the population of players to one area. Many players enjoy CP pvp, if they have high CP. Players with low CP and new players are less enthusiastic about fighting their 2k+ CP counterparts. Skill has a large factor as well, but this further disenfranchises new players who are interested in PVP. If the "default server" or Alliance locked server was NoCP, it would be more beneficial for new players logging on to have a healthy population of players to fight on equal footing. While the skill gap will still be there, they will not be so easily one shot by seasoned veterans. Furthermore, in the spirit of competition it will be more challenging for veterans and therefore more fun.

As a former member of Mostly Harmless, I remember having meetings with the developers about concerns and I know the developers take feedback seriously. I strongly believe that making Cyrodiil more accessible to new players will encourage the PVP community to grow and the game to grow as a whole. There will still be other servers such as Grayhost for people who want to use their CP in PVP, or Blackreach as well. Hopefully this will encourage these servers to be used more and by spreading out the population across several servers, the community may be better equipped to deal with the lag issues when everyone is concentrated in one area.

I remember the days of huge Zerg vs Zerg fights, running down multiple groups in a Mostly Hamfest 24 man. Yet, even the decision to reduce the group size to 12 man represents a move in a different direction. I believe this suggestion is in line with a lot of the developers decision making in the past, and I hope to see a healthier PVP population in the future. I believe this is a joint effort and I am working on training new players who are interested in PVP, and I hope other leaders can follow my example and train the future of PVP so we can all have glorious battles in the Three Banners War. To victory! Let there always be a foe worthy of my blade

Major_Mangle · October 16

As much as I prefer nocp and agree with you that it creates the best PvP experience....

Faction locks should be removed. It only prevents you from playing with different groups of friends. If you want to prevent people from jumping back and forth too often between factions add a cooldown of a few days at most, but preferably factions locks shouldn´t exist.

And adding it to Ravenwatch is like trying to throw a glass of water at a house that´s already burned to the ground. ZOS ignored all feedback about the campaign and left it as no proc for way too long.

randomguy · October 18

Major_Mangle wrote: »

As much as I prefer nocp and agree with you that it creates the best PvP experience....

Faction locks should be removed. It only prevents you from playing with different groups of friends. If you want to prevent people from jumping back and forth too often between factions add a cooldown of a few days at most, but preferably factions locks shouldn´t exist.

And adding it to Ravenwatch is like trying to throw a glass of water at a house that´s already burned to the ground. ZOS ignored all feedback about the campaign and left it as no proc for way too long.

100% but RP lords will never be satisfied and lets be honest, thats who the developers cater to the most

Iriidius · October 18

Major_Mangle wrote: »

As much as I prefer nocp and agree with you that it creates the best PvP experience....

Faction locks should be removed. It only prevents you from playing with different groups of friends. If you want to prevent people from jumping back and forth too often between factions add a cooldown of a few days at most, but preferably factions locks shouldn´t exist.

And adding it to Ravenwatch is like trying to throw a glass of water at a house that´s already burned to the ground. ZOS ignored all feedback about the campaign and left it as no proc for way too long.

While I play only for EP anyway I also find faction lock useless because most of the time one faction is dominating a campaign for multiple month beeing the winning faction most of the time and you can change to that faction at begin of the campaign month and play for that faction which is the winning faction most of the day/time. You can still spend the rare times that this faction is loosing on another campaign and if this campaign is unlocked even on another faction there or do IC/BGs or something else or even use ither account to play for other faction in this campaign.
The problem is not that ZOS left Ravenwatch noproc for too long, proc users left campaign short after noproc restriction was added and did not return after proc sets were reallowed and reallowing them soonr would probably not have changed that/brought them back either as the campaign was already dead after less than a patch. As soon as Ravenwatch was dead because of proc enjoyers leaving procless players hesitated to join a dead campaign same as proc enjoyers do hesitate now. Adding restriction to a working campaign was a bad idea and destroyed it. It was the only campaign with noproc compared to 2 proc campaigns and still noproc therefore keeping only the procless part of previous nocp population and not attracting many players from cp campaigns.
While I also had a lot of procless builds I did not want to abandon my outnumberwd faction in Blackreach. Introducing noproc in failed blackreach campaign would have been a better idea.

Jabbs_Giggity · October 31

Honestly, this "cater to the casuals" needs to stop. Most people with 1500+ CP were playing since launch and have seen the pendulum swings over the years to the game.

CP AVA PVP is meant to be "End-Game" content, and should be treated as such. If end game content was meant to be max level with no further reward, believe me, the game would not have lasted as long as it has - even with the shortcomings of new directions to the game.

Why work towards leveling CP if I am going to be simply told I can't use it because it's not fair to the new guy...Well, the new guy should not have the same advantage that I have from playing the game for 10 years. Simply put.

Nearly every bad change to the game has stemmed from "make it easier for the casuals".
-Cast times on Ultimates
-Remove animation cancelling
-Homogenize skills so all classes can do all the same things
-Hybridize skills so you don't have to build for a specific role

The list goes on...

xylena_lazarow · October 31

Jabbs_Giggity wrote: »

Honestly, this "cater to the casuals" needs to stop.

If that were true they'd be nuking ball groups and buffing random solos, not the opposite.

Desiato · November 1

xylena_lazarow wrote: »

Jabbs_Giggity wrote: »

Honestly, this "cater to the casuals" needs to stop.

If that were true they'd be nuking ball groups and buffing random solos, not the opposite.

In terms of skill, the vast majority of current ball group players are what would be considered casual in most pvp games.

ZOS has a stated combat design goal of raising the floor and lowering the ceiling, and the highly effective low skill cap ball group metas in Cyrodiil are a result of this.

The current batch of ball groups aren't like the ones we had many years ago. Cyrodiil used to have legit hardcore gaming guilds, but barely has any now. It's casuals farming casuals most of the time.

edward_frigidhands · November 6

Major_Mangle wrote: »

As much as I prefer nocp and agree with you that it creates the best PvP experience....

Faction locks should be removed. It only prevents you from playing with different groups of friends. If you want to prevent people from jumping back and forth too often between factions add a cooldown of a few days at most, but preferably factions locks shouldn´t exist.

And adding it to Ravenwatch is like trying to throw a glass of water at a house that´s already burned to the ground. ZOS ignored all feedback about the campaign and left it as no proc for way too long.

There is already option for people who dislike faction lock.

edward_frigidhands · November 6

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Vaqual · November 6

CPs are part of the build crafting package and no CP stinks. Some CPs are boring, some are weak some are strong, but overall I like no CP much less.