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One of the many problems with Vamps and Werewolves
Elyna
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Vampires can fit into ANY type of character build, regardless of what you build. it offers a heal, fast sneak, an ability that decreases damage and a huge heal with the ult. I cant think of anyone who wouldnt want that. On top of that, you dont need a lot of mana if you get to stage 4
Werewolves not so much. The gimmick with the WW is that the more stamina you have, the more damage you do THIS IS A PROBLEM. If your a magicka focused character that doesnt use stamina and want to be a WW, have fun gimping the ever loving hell out of yourself.
Theres just little to no reason to not be a WW over a Vamp except for roleplay reasons.
Suggestions for WW
-Make damage scale with transformation level not Stamina
-Decrease the transformation cost to 500 (at least) or at least a passive that makes it cost significantly less.
-Better WW abilities. I know you dont have a lot to work with, but can you at least try or make the current abilities better?
Just got an idea for an ability to replace that useless pounce
Thrill of the Hunt. You heighten your sense, revealing any and all living things nearby within a certain radius for a time. I know its not amazing, but at least it wont lock you up in animation like the pounce would.
Edited by Elyna on 10 May 2014 09:37 Werewolves not so much. The gimmick with the WW is that the more stamina you have, the more damage you do THIS IS A PROBLEM. If your a magicka focused character that doesnt use stamina and want to be a WW, have fun gimping the ever loving hell out of yourself.
Theres just little to no reason to not be a WW over a Vamp except for roleplay reasons.
Suggestions for WW
-Make damage scale with transformation level not Stamina
-Decrease the transformation cost to 500 (at least) or at least a passive that makes it cost significantly less.
-Better WW abilities. I know you dont have a lot to work with, but can you at least try or make the current abilities better?
Just got an idea for an ability to replace that useless pounce
Thrill of the Hunt. You heighten your sense, revealing any and all living things nearby within a certain radius for a time. I know its not amazing, but at least it wont lock you up in animation like the pounce would.
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Brittany_Joy✭✭✭✭The pounce is not useless because it is a great gapcloser and provides CC. You can also pounce while jumping which helps. The current abilities are actually fine and perform well in PvP and PvE. The problems are the high ultimate cost, being more susceptible to CC, lack of AoE damage, lack of lifeline or execution abilities.
Also you do not need to be a stamina focused build in order to get the most out of being a werewolf because the werewolf passives can increase your stamina to 20% and you can increase it more by killing 5 more people to gain another 25% stamina boost. So transforming into a werewolf can increase your stamina up to 45%, which will get you over the soft cap even if you don't have a stamina-focused-build. Also at vet rank 10 it is more easy to soft cap magicka and stamina.
Being a werewolf does have more drawbacks than advantages. But you mainly listed misconceptions instead of the real problem.Edited by Brittany_Joy on 10 May 2014 09:540 -
Elyna✭✭✭✭
Heres the thing. Do you want a Pounce or an ability that makes you take 70% less damage move faster, immune to most CC and make you untargetable by enemy players?Brittany_Joy wrote: »The pounce is not useless because it is a great gapcloser and CC move. You can also pounce while jumping which helps. The current abilities are actually fine and perform well in PvP and PvE. The problems are the high ultimate cost, being more susceptible to CC, lack of AoE damage, lack of lifeline abilities or execution moves.
Do you want want an AOE Fear or an AOE heal with virtually no cooldown and it heals based on how many enemies it hits.
Do you want an ult that requires you to grind for 10 minutes or an ability that heals you and stuns the enemy for around 5 seconds?
All of the Werewolf abilities are absolute jokes when compared to Vamps.
EDIT: The time it took to turn into a WW to actually chase someone, you couldve done that with the Vamps mist form., which is a basic ability.Edited by Elyna on 10 May 2014 09:560 -
Brittany_Joy✭✭✭✭
Heres the thing. Do you want a Pounce or an ability that makes you take 70% less damage move faster, immune to most CC and make you untargetable by enemy players?Brittany_Joy wrote: »The pounce is not useless because it is a great gapcloser and CC move. You can also pounce while jumping which helps. The current abilities are actually fine and perform well in PvP and PvE. The problems are the high ultimate cost, being more susceptible to CC, lack of AoE damage, lack of lifeline abilities or execution moves.
Do you want want an AOE Fear or an AOE heal with virtually no cooldown and it heals based on how many enemies it hits.
Do you want an ult that requires you to grind for 10 minutes or an ability that heals you and stuns the enemy for around 5 seconds?
All of the Werewolf abilities are absolute jokes when compared to Vamps.
EDIT: The time it took to turn into a WW to actually chase someone, you couldve done that with the Vamps mist form., which is a basic ability.
Oh I understand what you mean now. I do agree that the werewolf's abilities is not as strong as a vampire's abilities. But the current werewolf abilities do work well and synergies well with each other. However, adding a few more useful abilities would definitely make werewolves more viable in PvP and PvE.0 -
Elyna✭✭✭✭Brittany_Joy wrote: »
Heres the thing. Do you want a Pounce or an ability that makes you take 70% less damage move faster, immune to most CC and make you untargetable by enemy players?Brittany_Joy wrote: »The pounce is not useless because it is a great gapcloser and CC move. You can also pounce while jumping which helps. The current abilities are actually fine and perform well in PvP and PvE. The problems are the high ultimate cost, being more susceptible to CC, lack of AoE damage, lack of lifeline abilities or execution moves.
Do you want want an AOE Fear or an AOE heal with virtually no cooldown and it heals based on how many enemies it hits.
Do you want an ult that requires you to grind for 10 minutes or an ability that heals you and stuns the enemy for around 5 seconds?
All of the Werewolf abilities are absolute jokes when compared to Vamps.
EDIT: The time it took to turn into a WW to actually chase someone, you couldve done that with the Vamps mist form., which is a basic ability.
Oh I understand what you mean now. I do agree that the werewolf's abilities is not as strong as a vampire's abilities. But the current werewolf abilities do work well and synergies well with each other. However, adding a few more useful abilities would definitely make werewolves more viable in PvP and PvE.
I just want them to decrease that ridiculous ult cost. My guess is that they tried to make it like Skyrim's where after you transform you would need to "rest" before you can use beats form. However in Skyrim, you can just use the "wait" function and have another Beast Form. I guess its better for immersion, but there are better ways to do this.0 -
Brittany_Joy✭✭✭✭
They are going to reduce the ultimate cost soon, the actual amount they reduce is unknown though.Brittany_Joy wrote: »
Heres the thing. Do you want a Pounce or an ability that makes you take 70% less damage move faster, immune to most CC and make you untargetable by enemy players?Brittany_Joy wrote: »The pounce is not useless because it is a great gapcloser and CC move. You can also pounce while jumping which helps. The current abilities are actually fine and perform well in PvP and PvE. The problems are the high ultimate cost, being more susceptible to CC, lack of AoE damage, lack of lifeline abilities or execution moves.
Do you want want an AOE Fear or an AOE heal with virtually no cooldown and it heals based on how many enemies it hits.
Do you want an ult that requires you to grind for 10 minutes or an ability that heals you and stuns the enemy for around 5 seconds?
All of the Werewolf abilities are absolute jokes when compared to Vamps.
EDIT: The time it took to turn into a WW to actually chase someone, you couldve done that with the Vamps mist form., which is a basic ability.
Oh I understand what you mean now. I do agree that the werewolf's abilities is not as strong as a vampire's abilities. But the current werewolf abilities do work well and synergies well with each other. However, adding a few more useful abilities would definitely make werewolves more viable in PvP and PvE.
I just want them to decrease that ridiculous ult cost. My guess is that they tried to make it like Skyrim's where after you transform you would need to "rest" before you can use beats form. However in Skyrim, you can just use the "wait" function and have another Beast Form. I guess its better for immersion, but there are better ways to do this.
I want a toggled werewolf transformation, were I can transform at will because I embrace Hircine's gift and being a werewolf is just badass and fun! The whole werewolf transformation being an ultimate is just lame because we gain all the drawbacks of being a werewolf even though we rarely get a chance to transform. It would be better if being a werewolf was similar to being a feral druid, were you can transform at will and play as a werewolf indefinitely.
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Ummaguma✭✭✭what I read: "The problem with Werewolves is They arent Vampires..."I may or may not be spending too much time with Sheogorath, but I cant help it... He makes the BEST Nachos!
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Romboldt✭Brittany_Joy wrote: »The pounce is not useless because it is a great gapcloser and provides CC. You can also pounce while jumping which helps. The current abilities are actually fine and perform well in PvP and PvE. The problems are the high ultimate cost, being more susceptible to CC, lack of AoE damage, lack of lifeline or execution abilities.
Also you do not need to be a stamina focused build in order to get the most out of being a werewolf because the werewolf passives can increase your stamina to 20% and you can increase it more by killing 5 more people to gain another 25% stamina boost. So transforming into a werewolf can increase your stamina up to 45%, which will get you over the soft cap even if you don't have a stamina-focused-build. Also at vet rank 10 it is more easy to soft cap magicka and stamina.
Being a werewolf does have more drawbacks than advantages. But you mainly listed misconceptions instead of the real problem.
The leap is absolutely one of the problems. It's awful. o.O0 -
Sakiri✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭The leap is great. Just buggy as hell.
And my great idea would also "fix" vamps.
Lower ult cost to like 600-800 base(before rank up, which reduces it), morph(which should reduce it) and put a harsh DR on ult cost reduction on all ultimates. That last bit woulf "fix" vamps.
If base is 800, its a bit hard to start with, which is valid. Youre learning your trade so to speak.
Get it to 700 or so at rank 4. Morphed rank 4 to 500(morphs are a b to level). Hard cap of say 25% ult reduction drops this to 375 absolute minimum.
Numbers can be tweaked ofc.0 -
gunsofdeschain✭✭✭
Werewolves not so much. The gimmick with the WW is that the more stamina you have, the more damage you do THIS IS A PROBLEM. If your a magicka focused character that doesnt use stamina and want to be a WW, have fun gimping the ever loving hell out of yourself.
That sums up the problem those of us who rolled nightblade to play a rogue style class have.
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Brittany_Joy✭✭✭✭Brittany_Joy wrote: »The pounce is not useless because it is a great gapcloser and provides CC. You can also pounce while jumping which helps. The current abilities are actually fine and perform well in PvP and PvE. The problems are the high ultimate cost, being more susceptible to CC, lack of AoE damage, lack of lifeline or execution abilities.
Also you do not need to be a stamina focused build in order to get the most out of being a werewolf because the werewolf passives can increase your stamina to 20% and you can increase it more by killing 5 more people to gain another 25% stamina boost. So transforming into a werewolf can increase your stamina up to 45%, which will get you over the soft cap even if you don't have a stamina-focused-build. Also at vet rank 10 it is more easy to soft cap magicka and stamina.
Being a werewolf does have more drawbacks than advantages. But you mainly listed misconceptions instead of the real problem.
The leap is absolutely one of the problems. It's awful. o.O
The leap is fine. I can pounce while jumping and it will stun my target if they are off balance. The morph called Feral Pounce will also increase my time in werewolf form by 4 seconds.
I am a fully maxed out werewolf and from experience I know the abilities are fine and work very well in PvP. It is being unable to break out of CC or dodge that is making us weaker. Also the lack of lifelines while in werewolf form is also a drawback.0