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killing a dead class (a bunch of ritorical why's)
necro_the_crafter
✭✭✭✭
Short timers on buffs is really biggest class weakness, u have to do so much buff managment in PVP, it spoiles all of the expirience.
Why necro has shortest timer on class major resolve buff? upgrading it to 30s will go a long way to make this class a bit convinient to play
Spitit mender and mortal coil also would be much better if they were at least 20s timers.
It really goes like:
1. Aplly major resolve;
2. Apply race against time;
3. Aplly vigor;
4. Apply spirit mender;
5. Pop damage/crit/single-resourse potion;
6. Apply major breach to a target;
7. Set up blastbones;
8. Try to cc your target on class that has no instant or convinient setup block/dodge pierce cc;
9. Fail to cc;
10. Whif the dawnbraker;
11. Try to survive until you get another ultimate/pot cd;
12. Return to step 1;
At this point i guess we have to demand this changes, why are necro left so far behing every other class on timer changes?
Making a longer timers on this buffs would increase necro pressure uptime, which on its own will help this class alot, and adding major brutality/sorcery or major savagery/prophecy, or both is really essential to free up potion slot for all that fancy potions that was addded into the game over the years. Necro is the only class that cant use alchemy which is super weird from fanatsy point, like cmon dark mage has no benefit from alchemy...
And the blastbones rework... highest use rate skill gone... all to make PvE rotation smother...
And they rework BB while necro has half of its kit severly underused due to it being weak, awkward, inconviniet, underpowered.
Why not rework Grave Grasp? that ability that literally useless, NOBODY runs it in ANY content, because its hard to hit even on PvE encounters?simply making circles stick to a target or to a caster will make it so much better
Why Agony Totem has 2s delay before first burst? why does it need 3 more bursts of fear afterwards? enemies thats got feared onse would't get feard again in same cast of totem,cuz of cc immunity, and you rarely get someone to walk into that even in PvE. making it fear on cast and adding other effect on subsequented burst will help it a ton.
Why Skeletal Minion was treated like a dot during a dot changes, but games doesnt recognise it as dot? This one is actualy so bat that morphing it into sceletal arcanist actually reduce its damage in pvp due to becoming aoe damage, that gaet reduced by major/minor evasion. making it deal dot damage will help it scale with class passives at least, and increasing summoned pets amount up to 3 will play into rising dead fantasy of necro.
Why Hexproof has no secondary effects? warden has it purges tied to a skill that not even primarly for purging, and templars had stron ally synergy on his with aoe dot/heal that also procs his class passives. making it add flat armor/weapon or spell damage/ mitigation / healing/ anything per negative effect removed will make it a great ability, espesialy in this dot heavy meta
Why Sythe has so much cost for its damage, inconvinient cone-shaped aoe (more of a PVP issue), no real utility? adding ramping damage on it with sucssesive casts, or execute scaling, will make it an actual class skill worth slotting
Why both skulls morphs are basicly the same rn, diferentianting only in a damage type,while also slowest projectile speed in the game... Well ... Do you wanna miss a green skull, or do you wanna miss a blue skull?Why not making it projectile faster, and remaking secondary effects to really differntiate a choises?here is suggestion off the top of my head -
Fire skull - secondary aoe exploisive near primary target every second cast
Poison skull - applies poison dot, each cast stacks up on dots damage, up to 4 casts.
I dunno, I feel like devs shun necros, just like the rest of Tamriel does... or maybe the plan to overhaul it... or maybe spell crafting system will bring a new perspective on necro... I just wish that they would at least acknowledge necro issues, just write down one line of text on any patchnote, like: "we know that necro bad, we will fix it soon"...
Why necro has shortest timer on class major resolve buff? upgrading it to 30s will go a long way to make this class a bit convinient to play
Spitit mender and mortal coil also would be much better if they were at least 20s timers.
It really goes like:
1. Aplly major resolve;
2. Apply race against time;
3. Aplly vigor;
4. Apply spirit mender;
5. Pop damage/crit/single-resourse potion;
6. Apply major breach to a target;
7. Set up blastbones;
8. Try to cc your target on class that has no instant or convinient setup block/dodge pierce cc;
9. Fail to cc;
10. Whif the dawnbraker;
11. Try to survive until you get another ultimate/pot cd;
12. Return to step 1;
At this point i guess we have to demand this changes, why are necro left so far behing every other class on timer changes?
Making a longer timers on this buffs would increase necro pressure uptime, which on its own will help this class alot, and adding major brutality/sorcery or major savagery/prophecy, or both is really essential to free up potion slot for all that fancy potions that was addded into the game over the years. Necro is the only class that cant use alchemy which is super weird from fanatsy point, like cmon dark mage has no benefit from alchemy...
And the blastbones rework... highest use rate skill gone... all to make PvE rotation smother...
And they rework BB while necro has half of its kit severly underused due to it being weak, awkward, inconviniet, underpowered.
Why not rework Grave Grasp? that ability that literally useless, NOBODY runs it in ANY content, because its hard to hit even on PvE encounters?simply making circles stick to a target or to a caster will make it so much better
Why Agony Totem has 2s delay before first burst? why does it need 3 more bursts of fear afterwards? enemies thats got feared onse would't get feard again in same cast of totem,cuz of cc immunity, and you rarely get someone to walk into that even in PvE. making it fear on cast and adding other effect on subsequented burst will help it a ton.
Why Skeletal Minion was treated like a dot during a dot changes, but games doesnt recognise it as dot? This one is actualy so bat that morphing it into sceletal arcanist actually reduce its damage in pvp due to becoming aoe damage, that gaet reduced by major/minor evasion. making it deal dot damage will help it scale with class passives at least, and increasing summoned pets amount up to 3 will play into rising dead fantasy of necro.
Why Hexproof has no secondary effects? warden has it purges tied to a skill that not even primarly for purging, and templars had stron ally synergy on his with aoe dot/heal that also procs his class passives. making it add flat armor/weapon or spell damage/ mitigation / healing/ anything per negative effect removed will make it a great ability, espesialy in this dot heavy meta
Why Sythe has so much cost for its damage, inconvinient cone-shaped aoe (more of a PVP issue), no real utility? adding ramping damage on it with sucssesive casts, or execute scaling, will make it an actual class skill worth slotting
Why both skulls morphs are basicly the same rn, diferentianting only in a damage type,while also slowest projectile speed in the game... Well ... Do you wanna miss a green skull, or do you wanna miss a blue skull?Why not making it projectile faster, and remaking secondary effects to really differntiate a choises?here is suggestion off the top of my head -
Fire skull - secondary aoe exploisive near primary target every second cast
Poison skull - applies poison dot, each cast stacks up on dots damage, up to 4 casts.
I dunno, I feel like devs shun necros, just like the rest of Tamriel does... or maybe the plan to overhaul it... or maybe spell crafting system will bring a new perspective on necro... I just wish that they would at least acknowledge necro issues, just write down one line of text on any patchnote, like: "we know that necro bad, we will fix it soon"...
20
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StarOfElyon✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭I just want you to know that your feedback has been received and we fully intend to ignore it.32 -
Shadowbinder7✭✭✭necro_the_crafter wrote: »Short timers on buffs is really biggest class weakness, u have to do so much buff managment in PVP, it spoiles all of the expirience.
Why necro has shortest timer on class major resolve buff? upgrading it to 30s will go a long way to make this class a bit convinient to play
Spitit mender and mortal coil also would be much better if they were at least 20s timers.
It really goes like:
1. Aplly major resolve;
2. Apply race against time;
3. Aplly vigor;
4. Apply spirit mender;
5. Pop damage/crit/single-resourse potion;
6. Apply major breach to a target;
7. Set up blastbones;
8. Try to cc your target on class that has no instant or convinient setup block/dodge pierce cc;
9. Fail to cc;
10. Whif the dawnbraker;
11. Try to survive until you get another ultimate/pot cd;
12. Return to step 1;
At this point i guess we have to demand this changes, why are necro left so far behing every other class on timer changes?
Making a longer timers on this buffs would increase necro pressure uptime, which on its own will help this class alot, and adding major brutality/sorcery or major savagery/prophecy, or both is really essential to free up potion slot for all that fancy potions that was addded into the game over the years. Necro is the only class that cant use alchemy which is super weird from fanatsy point, like cmon dark mage has no benefit from alchemy...
And the blastbones rework... highest use rate skill gone... all to make PvE rotation smother...
And they rework BB while necro has half of its kit severly underused due to it being weak, awkward, inconviniet, underpowered.
Why not rework Grave Grasp? that ability that literally useless, NOBODY runs it in ANY content, because its hard to hit even on PvE encounters?simply making circles stick to a target or to a caster will make it so much better
Why Agony Totem has 2s delay before first burst? why does it need 3 more bursts of fear afterwards? enemies thats got feared onse would't get feard again in same cast of totem,cuz of cc immunity, and you rarely get someone to walk into that even in PvE. making it fear on cast and adding other effect on subsequented burst will help it a ton.
Why Skeletal Minion was treated like a dot during a dot changes, but games doesnt recognise it as dot? This one is actualy so bat that morphing it into sceletal arcanist actually reduce its damage in pvp due to becoming aoe damage, that gaet reduced by major/minor evasion. making it deal dot damage will help it scale with class passives at least, and increasing summoned pets amount up to 3 will play into rising dead fantasy of necro.
Why Hexproof has no secondary effects? warden has it purges tied to a skill that not even primarly for purging, and templars had stron ally synergy on his with aoe dot/heal that also procs his class passives. making it add flat armor/weapon or spell damage/ mitigation / healing/ anything per negative effect removed will make it a great ability, espesialy in this dot heavy meta
Why Sythe has so much cost for its damage, inconvinient cone-shaped aoe (more of a PVP issue), no real utility? adding ramping damage on it with sucssesive casts, or execute scaling, will make it an actual class skill worth slotting
Why both skulls morphs are basicly the same rn, diferentianting only in a damage type,while also slowest projectile speed in the game... Well ... Do you wanna miss a green skull, or do you wanna miss a blue skull?Why not making it projectile faster, and remaking secondary effects to really differntiate a choises?here is suggestion off the top of my head -
Fire skull - secondary aoe exploisive near primary target every second cast
Poison skull - applies poison dot, each cast stacks up on dots damage, up to 4 casts.
I dunno, I feel like devs shun necros, just like the rest of Tamriel does... or maybe the plan to overhaul it... or maybe spell crafting system will bring a new perspective on necro... I just wish that they would at least acknowledge necro issues, just write down one line of text on any patchnote, like: "we know that necro bad, we will fix it soon"...
I came to this thread literally to say, fully completely agree with OP and feel their pain.
And STRONGLY suggest the developers start listening to feedback exactly like this, particularly for necromancer class. Instead of making their own arguably misguided changes such as grave lords sacrifice. I am not sure why this ability was even made when for its primary role (damage dealer) it does not even outpace the pvp morph (blighted blastbones) on an endgame pve build!
Meanwhile it seems in update 42 they are addressing the tethers and making them stronger… ok excellent… while ignoring ALL the other issues the OP has listed above with the class abilities.
Forgive the use of capitals ZOS devs… but WHY ARE YOU FIXING ABILITIES ONE BY ONE EACH PATCH AND NOT ADDRESSING THE WHOLE LOT OF OTHER UNDERPERFORMING ABILITIES IN THE NECROMANCER CLASS????
Skeletal Arcanist, the entire bone tyrant tree except for necrotic potency (which should have more healing), expunge and morphs, animate blast bones, spirit mender and morphs with much too weak HoT
The developers must know very well how gutted the magicka necromancer is in PVE (except as support) and PVP completely!
I have played every single class magicka and stamina. So I can feel the pros and cons of each style and set up. And this is just neglecting aspects of the game (the necromancer is just one example) because… what? There is too much focus on something else?
BALANCE please. It’s really so little to ask for, doesn’t take much effort
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Shadowbinder7✭✭✭To add. Similar messes have been left with vampire and psijic skill lines.
Such wonderful fun ideas, such ruined neglected forgotten underused skill lines6 -
JanTanhide✭✭✭✭✭
✭IncultaWolf wrote: »Necro is BIS for being a crafter/pack mule character
So true. All three of my Necros are Mules.1 -
ItsNotLiving✭✭✭✭The whole game is cooked. Balance is beyond gone and classes are left in states that are simply unfun to play everything is so homogenized that soon everyone will run the same skills same sets and the only difference is the icon next to their name on the friends list. Necro and Templar are both terrible unplayable and boring, canceled my sub and swapped games it’s never going to be fixed. Also shoutout to everyone who said hybridization would ruin this game they ended up right. At least you have green blastbones haha right……6 -
danko355✭✭✭Necro visuals and style are the best for my taste, so I log in with my necro, do some activities (mainly pvp) until full frustration realizing how much I’m limiting myself by not playing literally any other class that outperforms Necromancer in all aspects and just log off until next urge. And it’s getting worse and worse over the years.1 -
CameraBeardThePirate✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭I'll say it again:
Extended timers on Necro abilities is not the buff you think it would be.
Corpse creation is tied to ability duration. The more you extend the timers of corpse creators, the lower your corpse generation is.
Extending timers out to 30 seconds would mean only 1 corpse every 15 second (that's 50% slower corpse generation from Bone Armor).
The reason Intensive Mender is so good is precisely because of the short timer, not despite the short timer. It is basically an on demand corpse.4 -
chessalavakia_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭CameraBeardThePirate wrote: »I'll say it again:
Extended timers on Necro abilities is not the buff you think it would be.
Corpse creation is tied to ability duration. The more you extend the timers of corpse creators, the lower your corpse generation is.
Extending timers out to 30 seconds would mean only 1 corpse every 15 second (that's 50% slower corpse generation from Bone Armor).
The reason Intensive Mender is so good is precisely because of the short timer, not despite the short timer. It is basically an on demand corpse.
Does that really matter that much when you can make a corpse up to every three seconds using Vault?0 -
CameraBeardThePirate✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭chessalavakia_ESO wrote: »CameraBeardThePirate wrote: »I'll say it again:
Extended timers on Necro abilities is not the buff you think it would be.
Corpse creation is tied to ability duration. The more you extend the timers of corpse creators, the lower your corpse generation is.
Extending timers out to 30 seconds would mean only 1 corpse every 15 second (that's 50% slower corpse generation from Bone Armor).
The reason Intensive Mender is so good is precisely because of the short timer, not despite the short timer. It is basically an on demand corpse.
Does that really matter that much when you can make a corpse up to every three seconds using Vault?
Well yes, especially considering the Class Mastery script encourages high corpse generation, and can also only create a corpse if there are no other corpses around.0 -
Urvoth✭✭✭✭✭
✭I honestly don't mind the short buff timers and think it adds a lot to the necro skill curve. The #1 issue with necro imo is the glaring lack of a damage kit. Blastbones is the only solid skill in the kit and now Stalking is completely gone and replaced by the clunkiest and worst-designed buff in the entire game. There's not even a ton of generic dot options to be buffed by GLS and the ones that are available are mostly low damage. It also doesn't make thematic sense to make an entire class's damage kit revolve around non-class abilities.
Skulls is a bit more viable now despite still having speed AND animation issues, but the rest of the damage kit is beyond lacking, and at this point if you want to build into damage through proc sets, necro ends up also feeling a lot squishier than other classes. There's still a lack of important buffs, debuffs, and viable utility skills, but the core issue is just not having damage skills. Necro has no actual damage combo or class pressure options and even before the recent Stalking deletion, Blastbones mostly just existed within a vacuum. Deleting our primary damage skill for yet another non-damaging ability was beyond counterproductive, especially with that skill being the class-defining ability.
On top of the lack of direct damaging skills, necro doesn't have any indirect damaging skills or passives like other classes have. Volatile Armor, Lightning Form, Arctic Blast, and the Burning Light Passive are just a few examples of the indirect damage options other classes have, which are hugely beneficial for proccing status effects or item set conditions.
There's still plenty of additional issues with the necro kit, but adding actual damage skills would be a good place to start.6 -
BasP✭✭✭✭Most (if not all) of the ideas below have probably been suggested by others multiple times already, but implementing some these would improve the Necromancer in my opinion:
- Make the cost of Blighted Blastbones be determined by your highest maximum resource
- Give Blighted Blastbones the extra damage that Stalking Blastbones used to have
- Make the Skeletal Mage/ Arcanist/ Archer benefit from Rapid Rot (perhaps by turning the skills into single target DOTs that require a target, instead of summons that target the closest enemy)
- Grant Major Brutality and Sorcery while Skeletal Mage/ Arcanist/ Archer is slotted on either bar, similar to Tome-Bearer's Inspiration, or for the during of the skill
- Make Sacrificial Bones and GLS usable out of combat and grant the buff immediately instead of after 2.5 seconds
- Increase the buff from SB and GLS to 20%
- Give Death Scythe and its morphs execute scaling, increasing the damage by 100% against enemies below 50% health
- Increase the base damage from Death Scythe and its morphs slightly, matching the Arcanist's Abyssal Impact
- Give the 3% buffs from Bitter Harvest, Expunge, Shocking Siphon and Restoring Tether the "while slotted on either bar" treatment
- Perhaps turn Remote Totem into Chilling Totem (with a better name) and make it apply Minor Brittle to nearby enemies alongside the current effects
- Increase the missile speed from Flame Skull and both morphs
- Either give Major Prophecy and Savagery for 10 seconds after casting Flame Skull
- Or give Major Prophecy and Savagery by slotting Shocking Siphon
2 -
Alaztor91✭✭✭✭✭
✭CameraBeardThePirate wrote: »
Well yes, especially considering the Class Mastery script encourages high corpse generation, and can also only create a corpse if there are no other corpses around.
How does that script even work?
Is it like you add 1 stack per nearby Corpse every 3s that you cast the skill until you have 10 stacks, each cast refreshing the 10s duration and increasing the stack counter(assuming you have at least 1 nearby Corpse)?
Or is it like you add 1 stack per nearby Corpse every 3s that you cast the skill and stacks get overwritten, so stack counter depends solely on the number of Corpses nearby when the skill was casted?0 -
necro_the_crafter✭✭✭✭CameraBeardThePirate wrote: »I'll say it again:
Extended timers on Necro abilities is not the buff you think it would be.
Corpse creation is tied to ability duration. The more you extend the timers of corpse creators, the lower your corpse generation is.
Extending timers out to 30 seconds would mean only 1 corpse every 15 second (that's 50% slower corpse generation from Bone Armor).
The reason Intensive Mender is so good is precisely because of the short timer, not despite the short timer. It is basically an on demand corpse.
Corpse generation isnt an issue with necros, as they dont have a good corpse consuming ability for pvp scenarios outside of mortal coil.
However, why not decrease a time reqiuered for producing a corpse then? if they lower it to 33% then you will have your corpse every 10 secs from bone armor while builds that dont rely as much on corpses can enjoy adequate buff timers that dont require barswapping every 10 seconds to recast bone armor, mender, vigor and tether, or else you lose all of your active mititgation and drop drasticly on effective hp.
And honestly i never saw intensive mender used in pvp ever. 10% free unnamed mitigation is the last thing that is decent about necros, dropping that for corpse every 4 secs to use with WHAT? skills is crazy. I guess its fine for pve healers to have it every 5 secs for renewing undeath.I honestly don't mind the short buff timers and think it adds a lot to the necro skill curve. The #1 issue with necro imo is the glaring lack of a damage kit. Blastbones is the only solid skill in the kit and now Stalking is completely gone and replaced by the clunkiest and worst-designed buff in the entire game. There's not even a ton of generic dot options to be buffed by GLS and the ones that are available are mostly low damage. It also doesn't make thematic sense to make an entire class's damage kit revolve around non-class abilities.
Skulls is a bit more viable now despite still having speed AND animation issues, but the rest of the damage kit is beyond lacking, and at this point if you want to build into damage through proc sets, necro ends up also feeling a lot squishier than other classes. There's still a lack of important buffs, debuffs, and viable utility skills, but the core issue is just not having damage skills. Necro has no actual damage combo or class pressure options and even before the recent Stalking deletion, Blastbones mostly just existed within a vacuum. Deleting our primary damage skill for yet another non-damaging ability was beyond counterproductive, especially with that skill being the class-defining ability.
On top of the lack of direct damaging skills, necro doesn't have any indirect damaging skills or passives like other classes have. Volatile Armor, Lightning Form, Arctic Blast, and the Burning Light Passive are just a few examples of the indirect damage options other classes have, which are hugely beneficial for proccing status effects or item set conditions.
There's still plenty of additional issues with the necro kit, but adding actual damage skills would be a good place to start.
I agree,the amount of good damaging spells is pain on a necro.
Skulls, graveyard, archer and tether all pve exlusive tools. And only pvp option got gutted for the sake of buffing other pve spells. And its painfully bad. I was trying heavy dot proc build, with inferno staff, zaan, vateshran and relequen and the kill threat in pvp still was better with blighted than with GLS. What is this skill....
Combining both tether to one skills with damage \ or heal morphs is a good place to start, that will free up one gravelord slot to add a good damaging ability, maybe corpse exploison to finaly utilise exessive amount of corpses for damage purposes.
I personally would trade bb major defile and guaranteed deseased proc for stalking up to 50% modifier. It was better in all scenarios both pve and pvp, and also used to be an exuse for bb being clunky at a times.
Sythe should be more about damage and less about healing, and deaden pain\ necrotic potency should take its place as max health scaling heal. Would be nice if they replaced sythe healing to necrotic potency, getting bigger chunk of heal on the first corpse and smaller portion heals on any subsequent corpse consumed simmilar to how shythe works now, as well as kepping necrotics hot.
Also single target dodge\block pierce fear. With a major breach. At least at 12 m range. Instead of clunky grave grasp grasp. Please. ZOS. OMG. Please.3 -
CameraBeardThePirate✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭necro_the_crafter wrote: »CameraBeardThePirate wrote: »I'll say it again:
Extended timers on Necro abilities is not the buff you think it would be.
Corpse creation is tied to ability duration. The more you extend the timers of corpse creators, the lower your corpse generation is.
Extending timers out to 30 seconds would mean only 1 corpse every 15 second (that's 50% slower corpse generation from Bone Armor).
The reason Intensive Mender is so good is precisely because of the short timer, not despite the short timer. It is basically an on demand corpse.
Corpse generation isnt an issue with necros, as they dont have a good corpse consuming ability for pvp scenarios outside of mortal coil.
Deaden Pain and Necrotic Potency are both excellent corpse consumers, and both require high corpse gen.Edited by CameraBeardThePirate on 6 May 2024 14:070 -
necro_the_crafter✭✭✭✭Deaden Pain and Necrotic Potency are both excellent corpse consumers, and both require high corpse gen.
yes ofcourse, unique ulti gen and mediocre HoT
decent but not exelent imo. If necros have a nice low cost ulti like leap, incap, cresent that would be exellent. Sad that only half decent ultimate you have is a dawnbraker. That is easy to miss on a class with no instant cc\root to set up for it.
so up timers, reduce time it takes to produce a corpse on recast to satisfy peeople that run neccrotic, and people that want more ofensive uptime on their build.
1 -
Dracane✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Shadowbinder7 wrote: »To add. Similar messes have been left with vampire and psijic skill lines.
Such wonderful fun ideas, such ruined neglected forgotten underused skill lines
Tis as you say. The same feel stroke me when last I scrolled over those skill lines.
Extending buff durations in general should be a focus. For instance 4 seconds Major Expedition on most sources is also quite restrictive. By the time you pressed a skill, you have 3 seconds to run before you must replenish it. Buffs in other MMOs last quite long for good reason.Auri-El is my lord,
Trinimac is my shield,
Magnus is my mind.
My debut album on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@Gleandra/videos0 -
endorphinsplox✭✭✭✭So I will point out that Nightblade has a much shorter Major Resolve timer. That said, their primary spammable applies it so it balances out... kinda. When you aren't using the spammable hopefully you have another Shadow skill that you're casting in 6 second intervals (assuming you aren't wearing Heavy Armor). And yes I know Shadowy Disguise, but there are still tons of opportunity for dropoff with Major Resolve on NB.
And yeah Necro feels terrible to use overall. So many buffs and barely using a spammable, focusing on Blighted Blastbones casts instead and praying they don't get instakilled in group fights before they can land.2 -
Deimus✭✭✭I'd agree with a longer duration for the Summoner's Armor morph skill a Necromancer should be juggling minions not buffs.
A longer duration to any corpse creating skill won't hurt corpse generation, because recasting any corpse creating skill after it has been active for 10 seconds leaves a corpse regardless of the skill's full duration (test it on your Necros to see for yourself). If you need a corpse at your feet just recast one of them.
0 -
CameraBeardThePirate✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭I'd agree with a longer duration for the Summoner's Armor morph skill a Necromancer should be juggling minions not buffs.
A longer duration to any corpse creating skill won't hurt corpse generation, because recasting any corpse creating skill after it has been active for 10 seconds leaves a corpse regardless of the skill's full duration (test it on your Necros to see for yourself). If you need a corpse at your feet just recast one of them.
Um, no. You create a corpse if half the duration has expired. There aren't currently any corpse creators longer than 20 seconds, so yes, all corpse creators will create a corpse after 10 seconds has passed, but that's not the rule. They create a corpse at half duration - Guardian will create one at 8 seconds, and Intensive Mender will create one at 4 seconds. The Skeletal minion was the same as Ghost before the duration was increased. When the duration of Mage/Archer was increased, the corpse generation went down, as you had to wait an additional 2 globals before it created the corpse.0 -
Deimus✭✭✭CameraBeardThePirate wrote: »I'd agree with a longer duration for the Summoner's Armor morph skill a Necromancer should be juggling minions not buffs.
A longer duration to any corpse creating skill won't hurt corpse generation, because recasting any corpse creating skill after it has been active for 10 seconds leaves a corpse regardless of the skill's full duration (test it on your Necros to see for yourself). If you need a corpse at your feet just recast one of them.
Um, no. You create a corpse if half the duration has expired. There aren't currently any corpse creators longer than 20 seconds, so yes, all corpse creators will create a corpse after 10 seconds has passed, but that's not the rule. They create a corpse at half duration - Guardian will create one at 8 seconds, and Intensive Mender will create one at 4 seconds. The Skeletal minion was the same as Ghost before the duration was increased. When the duration of Mage/Archer was increased, the corpse generation went down, as you had to wait an additional 2 globals before it created the corpse.
You're right, but my point is still valid. Increasing the duration won't hurt your corpse generation since you can just recast an ability if you need a corpse at your feet. This gives more flexibility in playstyle with more time to choose where a corpse drops from recasting, and gives you a larger window to press the offensive without pulling back to recast multiple buffs. In pvp Deaden Pain and Mortal Coil are the main corpse consuming abilities maybe Siphon for recovery or Animate BB if you are in a group, with Blighted BB being your main form of corpse generation.
Mage/Archer is not a viable option for pvp and any timer alterations won't change that (if a dev is reading this skill needs a lot of love and the timer is not what needs to be touched). I'd love to use it for flavor but it would be like shooting myself in the foot even more so. Intensive mender shouldn't be changed since it fills its role as Vigor on a stick, Spirit Guardian is ran for the 10% mitigation and to keep Undead Confederate passive active while the heal is a nice bonus so a duration increase could be beneficial. For Summoner's Armor a 30 second timer would 100% be better. Having to cast Vigor, Armor, and Guardian every 15 seconds kills your momentum and pressure on the enemy. Having that 10 second gap allows you to stagger the timers and keep some pressure on the enemy between buff reapplication.1 -
CameraBeardThePirate✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭CameraBeardThePirate wrote: »I'd agree with a longer duration for the Summoner's Armor morph skill a Necromancer should be juggling minions not buffs.
A longer duration to any corpse creating skill won't hurt corpse generation, because recasting any corpse creating skill after it has been active for 10 seconds leaves a corpse regardless of the skill's full duration (test it on your Necros to see for yourself). If you need a corpse at your feet just recast one of them.
Um, no. You create a corpse if half the duration has expired. There aren't currently any corpse creators longer than 20 seconds, so yes, all corpse creators will create a corpse after 10 seconds has passed, but that's not the rule. They create a corpse at half duration - Guardian will create one at 8 seconds, and Intensive Mender will create one at 4 seconds. The Skeletal minion was the same as Ghost before the duration was increased. When the duration of Mage/Archer was increased, the corpse generation went down, as you had to wait an additional 2 globals before it created the corpse.
You're right, but my point is still valid. Increasing the duration won't hurt your corpse generation since you can just recast an ability if you need a corpse at your feet. This gives more flexibility in playstyle with more time to choose where a corpse drops from recasting, and gives you a larger window to press the offensive without pulling back to recast multiple buffs. In pvp Deaden Pain and Mortal Coil are the main corpse consuming abilities maybe Siphon for recovery or Animate BB if you are in a group, with Blighted BB being your main form of corpse generation.
Mage/Archer is not a viable option for pvp and any timer alterations won't change that (if a dev is reading this skill needs a lot of love and the timer is not what needs to be touched). I'd love to use it for flavor but it would be like shooting myself in the foot even more so. Intensive mender shouldn't be changed since it fills its role as Vigor on a stick, Spirit Guardian is ran for the 10% mitigation and to keep Undead Confederate passive active while the heal is a nice bonus so a duration increase could be beneficial. For Summoner's Armor a 30 second timer would 100% be better. Having to cast Vigor, Armor, and Guardian every 15 seconds kills your momentum and pressure on the enemy. Having that 10 second gap allows you to stagger the timers and keep some pressure on the enemy between buff reapplication.
What? I don't think you're getting my point. Increasing the duration of skills DOES hurt your corpse generation because it takes more time before you're able to recast and create a corpse.
As I already stated, the increase in duration to Skeletal Mage/Archer DID hurt corpse generation, as the ability generates a corpse every 10 seconds instead of every 8 seconds now.
Using Spirit Guardian over Intensive Mender DOES hurt your corpse generation, as Intensive creates a corpse every 4 seconds vs every 8 seconds with Guardian.
Longer duration skills hurt your corpse generation, I'm not sure why you're refuting that when it's a simple fact.Edited by CameraBeardThePirate on 7 May 2024 13:260 -
ecru✭✭✭✭✭
✭ItsNotLiving wrote: »The whole game is cooked. Balance is beyond gone and classes are left in states that are simply unfun to play everything is so homogenized that soon everyone will run the same skills same sets and the only difference is the icon next to their name on the friends list. Necro and Templar are both terrible unplayable and boring, canceled my sub and swapped games it’s never going to be fixed. Also shoutout to everyone who said hybridization would ruin this game they ended up right. At least you have green blastbones haha right……
Yeah, the destruction of any real class identity with the way they implemented scaling based on resource has made just about every class play the same, aside from a few class abilities. It's honestly miserable. I was having fun just messing around with my necro, and blastbones was still my favorite ability even with it's "issues", and they had to go and remove it altogether. Yeah, I can use the stam morph, but that just fits me into an even tighter niche where I'm stuck with a weird hybrid like every other class, rather than the old magcro I used to love.Gryphon Heart
Godslayer
Dawnbringer2
