Honest Question for Bowblade Mains

SandandStars · August 2023

Do you feel the combat style you’ve chosen is a little bit sneaky and cowardly?

Not trying to be a jerk. I’ve just never been able to enjoy sneaky/ganky.

How do you view your class/playing style choice?

LittlePinkDot · August 2023

I think your question is about stealth/invisibility. Not bows in particular. You can brawl with a bow. I bet the Vateshran point blank snipe bow would be fun to build around.

Tigeracer · August 2023

It's literally the only way to get some kills as a stamina nightblade right now. Even then, you can only kill other nightblade, some sorcs and the occasional templar.

I'm currently working on a brawler nightblade, but it's a rough and expensive process. In saying that, I haven't gotten my hands on rallying cry yet. I'm also not a vampire, so that might be part of it too.

Oblivion_Protocol · August 2023

I’ve played bowblade for months now, and I can’t say I care much about the idea of being seen as cowardly. Ganking with a bow, especially when you’re targeting someone who’s in the middle of a fight, can be highly effective.

The downside is that you really have to choose your target carefully. On my magblade ganker, I can pretty confidently kill just about anyone under 30K health without much in the way of a fight. They don’t even have to be half dead from fighting someone else (though it helps, lol). But with the bow, I can’t always just execute people at will. I can survive a lot more easily, though, so that’s an upside.

geonsocal · August 2023

sometimes what we see is just a reflection of ourselves...

i've killed and died within eso pvp sooooooooo many times - i don't really keep score of fights too often anymore...just try to mostly focus on putting in work for my alliance...

so - my answer to your cowardly - deceitful perhaps(?) - behavior of a bow blade would be: performance execution of your build and playstyle...

if sneaky/distrustful/cowardly/fearful gameplay is how you view it - i'd say the reverse perspective would be taking pleasure in the execution of the build...

i die a lot of different ways - someone snipe spamming is just one of them...

WreckfulAbandon · August 2023

What you are describing are lesser weasels and they aren't really a threat to anyone even Xv1. It's the greater weasels running DW and actually having some knowledge of the game who are by far the bigger scourge on PvP.

It's something everyone has to deal with from time to time even if they don't acknowledge it. A couple of days ago I was watching a well known streamer playing a tanky arcanist in Cyrodiil and he got ganked twice in the 30 or so min I watched by the same weasel. 100-0'd and not in an Xv1. It's a looked down upon playstyle for a reason.

The term weasel isn't necessarily an insult by the way, some people actually keep them as pets. I just found it an apt description. I trust the mods will accept that I am just being descriptive and not insulting.

ShadowProc · August 2023

WreckfulAbandon wrote: »

What you are describing are lesser weasels and they aren't really a threat to anyone even Xv1. It's the greater weasels running DW and actually having some knowledge of the game who are by far the bigger scourge on PvP.

It's something everyone has to deal with from time to time even if they don't acknowledge it. A couple of days ago I was watching a well known streamer playing a tanky arcanist in Cyrodiil and he got ganked twice in the 30 or so min I watched by the same weasel. 100-0'd and not in an Xv1. It's a looked down upon playstyle for a reason.

The term weasel isn't necessarily an insult by the way, some people actually keep them as pets. I just found it an apt description. I trust the mods will accept that I am just being descriptive and not insulting.

Well some of them have it coming. When we hear certain streamers are complaining on stream about being stream sniped when they are literally outside the front door of our own keep, they have it coming. It's like they don't think viewers will tell us they trash talking. It's their go to move when they die making accusations.

In thier minds all gankers are stream snipers. Lmao.

Marcus684 · August 2023

My take on stealth blades (not just bow blades) is that they often seem to be the ones that really, really hate dying the most, based on the number of hate tells I've received from them over the years when they do get caught out of stealth and killed.

If you mean the snipers that hang out at max range plinking you when you're fighting someone else and run/stealth away when even slightly threatened, yeah it does seem cowardly, but it could just be laziness. I've occasionally been guilty of throwing together a half-assed bow build on a PvE toon and casually zerg surfing, which means I'll sometimes contribute to an Xv1 kill, but I also take my lumps and accept my inevitable death if one of these sweaties targets me.

Edit: typo

Dojohoda · August 2023

You can't ever think you are safe in a PVP zone. Don't think of the sneaky players as cowardly, think of them as patient.

DrNukenstein · August 2023

Worst spec to play with, most annoying spec to play against.

They just steal kills and +1 on fair fights from like 30 meters away with on demand disengage. Melee gankers get a bad rep because we pop out of nowhere to instagib, but at least we have to take risks and can flex into brawling.

And somehow, if they aren't being baby sat while they are nowhere near the fight with their potent disengage that they have multiple seconds to decide to use they will go 1/10 more often than any other spec.

The ones that play around bombard and the knock back though, they're onto something. You could say that is a very potent support spec that has a place in most comps. That place just isn't making kills happen solo.

I'd also recommend the vat bow if anyone wants to be a respectable bow user. You can gank with it into an incap or concealed weapon (like d-swing) and impress your friends.

WreckfulAbandon · August 2023

ShadowProc wrote: »

Well some of them have it coming. When we hear certain streamers are complaining on stream about being stream sniped when they are literally outside the front door of our own keep, they have it coming. It's like they don't think viewers will tell us they trash talking. It's their go to move when they die making accusations.

In thier minds all gankers are stream snipers. Lmao.

That may be the case but I wasn't commenting on whether it was deserved or not. My point is the amount of critical burst damage that a NB is able to pack into a combo is insanely high and this makes the ease of going into/remaining in stealth problematic.

Some will say there are counters such as detect pots but you will never have 100% uptime on that, especially if you are just going about your business doing other things. The advantage definitely lies with the person who is able to remain hidden out of sight and wait for the perfect moment to strike.

Detect Life spells have always been a thing in Elder Scrolls games so it's absurd that the counterplay to stealth is so limited. Especially when the burst damage is enough to take a competent arcanist with 39k health from 100-0 in 1 second. There is no counterplay to being jumped like that. Now imagine a 30k health sorc who is unable to build good resists (if they want to do good damage) and it becomes literally impossible to survive a well timed burst from stealth especially if already engaged. Just feels like NBs are playing an entirely different game.

Wandering_Immigrant · August 2023

I don't consider myself a "bowblade", my front bar is dual wield and it's the bar I prefer to be on. Here's the thing though, I'm running around cyrodiil with 10k phys resist, 11k mag resist, and 23k health. I run Diamond's Victory so my typical strat is to spend 5 seconds on my bow finding a squishy in the crowd, then Ambush in, kill that squishy in under 5 seconds and then gtfo before I melt, and then back to my bow to pick out another target. However, my bow bar is set up more like a second front bar than a back bar, and with only a little less wpn damage than my dual wield bar it's perfectly capable of killing. So if people are going to let themselves be killed by my secondary bar then there's no reason for me to jump in and risk being 1 shotted by an ultimate dump or getting my teammates killed by a bomber. A kill is a kill and if I'm racking them up from a distance I'll stay there until that well runs dry.

So is my playstyle sneaky? You're damn right it is, that's why I enjoy it. But cowardly, idk I think the more cowardly ones are the people running around with 40k health and 30k resistances on a vamp build. I have 3 other characters who are currently geared for and active in PvP with a 4th I'm working on tweaking, so 5 total. Other than my stamblade they're all brawlers fighting in the front lines alongside you, and it feels like straight up easy mode compared to the work I have to do on my stamblade to not just get kills but to avoid being a liability as well.

OBJnoob · August 2023

I think it depends on how you view the game. Most PvP people represented here on these forums just really want to be the best. And pewpewing from 30m away before vanishing is perhaps a cowardly way to try and be the best.

But if your goal is more to just be part of a team and win a campaign then there's nothing wrong with stealth snipers.

Think about real life. Are snipers cowards? Are assassins? Are ninjas? Are spies? Putting yourself in harms way is not, actually, an important part of fighting. The very best fighters do everything they can not to.

Captain: "Fire mortars on that bunker coordinate Sergeant!"

Sergeant: "No sir, we're gonna walk over there and fight them fair."

Enemy: "Fire mortars on these idiots walking over here."

Lol

Udrath · August 2023

Nearly all bow users die with them facing the opposite way trying to run, so yes they’re cowards lol

PhoenixGrey · August 2023

WreckfulAbandon wrote: »

What you are describing are lesser weasels and they aren't really a threat to anyone even Xv1. It's the greater weasels running DW and actually having some knowledge of the game who are by far the bigger scourge on PvP.

It's something everyone has to deal with from time to time even if they don't acknowledge it. A couple of days ago I was watching a well known streamer playing a tanky arcanist in Cyrodiil and he got ganked twice in the 30 or so min I watched by the same weasel. 100-0'd and not in an Xv1. It's a looked down upon playstyle for a reason.

The term weasel isn't necessarily an insult by the way, some people actually keep them as pets. I just found it an apt description. I trust the mods will accept that I am just being descriptive and not insulting.

I know exactly the type of nb you are describing

However, I don’t mind insulting them as they do deserve it and I think they know it themselves too.

geonsocal · August 2023

i liked the analogy someone used to compare the perceived sneaky and cowardly playstyle of someone who enjoys engaging from a distance, and sure - better yet if the person you are shooting at is not even aware you are shooting at them for the first couple of shots - comparing that to those folks who build for pvp immortality...

like just turtling up could be seen as a bit - different type of enjoyment...

i think my stam sorc may just be the best build i have for attacking with a bow...i can do a good bit of damage from range - and also dissuade folks from chasing me...heck, and if i really wanted to - slot streak, pop a tri-pot and just streak away from it all

Sleevez340 · February 5

Udrath wrote: »

Nearly all bow users die with them facing the opposite way trying to run, so yes they’re cowards lol

WreckfulAbandon wrote: »

What you are describing are lesser weasels and they aren't really a threat to anyone even Xv1. It's the greater weasels running DW and actually having some knowledge of the game who are by far the bigger scourge on PvP.

It's something everyone has to deal with from time to time even if they don't acknowledge it. A couple of days ago I was watching a well known streamer playing a tanky arcanist in Cyrodiil and he got ganked twice in the 30 or so min I watched by the same weasel. 100-0'd and not in an Xv1. It's a looked down upon playstyle for a reason.

The term weasel isn't necessarily an insult by the way, some people actually keep them as pets. I just found it an apt description. I trust the mods will accept that I am just being descriptive and not insulting.

This cracks me up. After 16 years of service and also loving this playstyle since DAoC. There are people out there that think there's some kind of honor to sitting at a keyboard, and that dieing means you're not a coward?

You know some people have things to do on a day, this playstyle is effective for someone that can't spend all day playing and learning how to perfectly time every hit, dodge roll, potion, block while their telling the world on YouTube that they are running sets xxxx + xxxx and these skills.

Some of us just want to feel good at the game with the least amount of investment.

Vaqual · February 5

I was once semi-afk during a longer phone call, just playing ESO with half a brain and leveling weapons. I was queueing for random normals and between pops I killed the bandits on the beach outside of Wayrest. It just so happened that I was leveling bow, the weapon I use the least out of all, when 2 guys started pulling bigger packs of bandits. It was rather clear that they were farming XP, but since it is a public spot I kept tagging mobs. I did not know at the time that this reduces their XP and I don't think that it would have made much of a difference for me, but all of a sudden they started flaming me in the say chat à la "nightblade with a bow, the lowest of all lifeforms", wanting me to go away (from the public spot). They made up their mind about me just based on the weapon I was holding at the time.
I get that the ganking can be tiresome sometimes, but it is clearly worth it. I will gladly die to a 5 man ambush if it means one of those NB-obsessed players will spend their evening steaming and seething.

Besides that, hunting bow blades is like a fun sidequest in PvP (excluding Mor Khazgur and Eld Angavar, the mag shot cheese is too much, even for me) and offers some variety.

Auldwulfe · February 5

There are other reasons --- Some of us players are older, and unable to stare at our bars banging keys like a drummer in speed metal...... so this is a LOT like playing a HA character for us ... something in our range and speed of ability.

I do understand the frustration, as I have been on the receiving end, as well .... it is a playstyle, and it is supported by both skills, and sets .... and the bow is a viable weapon.

What I find most hilarious, though, is that people complain so much about things like this .... I used a HA sorc, no pets, with only Vigor as my heal... not the best, and so I used Way of Fire, and Knight's Bane for sets ... again, NOT BIS.... and had a person go off about how "cowardly, and pathetic" it is to use oblivion damage........ Mind you, if he had rushed me, I was dead.... I am a squishy, and my reflexes are no where near what they were 30 years ago..... hence, why I used that build.

PVP means you will die.... no matter the build, I usually die more times than I get kills.... it's a part of the game......

Auldwulfe

moo_2021 · February 6

SandandStars wrote: »

Do you feel the combat style you’ve chosen is a little bit sneaky and cowardly?

Not trying to be a jerk. I’ve just never been able to enjoy sneaky/ganky.

How do you view your class/playing style choice?

Extremely frustrating and I gave up after a few weeks. It's pretty awful having to avoid targets and rely on the team for meat shield.