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Bad or bugged ranked system: +0 points on win -150 points on loss

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NeKryXe
NeKryXe
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This has been reported since release. This season ends in 5 days! It needs to be fixed for the next one.

If the system knows how to steal -150 points from our score after a loss it should knows how to give positive points on victories.

THINGS THAT NEED TO BE FIXED IN RANKED MODE:

Time penalty on conceding:
Casual > it's ok.
Ranked > it's wrong!

Losing a match that didn't start:
Casual > it's ok.
Ranked > it's wrong!

Being matched constantly with the same player:
Casual > it's ok.
Ranked > it's wrong!

Zero points after a match victory:
Casual > it's ok.
Ranked > it's wrong!
  • NeKryXe
    NeKryXe
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    A new season has started and nothing has changed or fixed. We continue getting 0 points on win and -150 on losses. But now I noticed a new problem... I'm already on Rubedite and there are only 97 positions occupied on the rank at this moment, which means that we can see all players. I've been watching carefully and checking the opponent names after the matches and I found out that the game is now matching players already ranked with players that didn't even reach Rubedite, This is very wrong!
  • sekou_trayvond
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    But you're probably fine with 150 pts for a win, right?

    Leaving my snark aside, there needs to be some "skin" in the game for this ranked system to work. 150 pts for SOME losses works for that. We do need a minimum point reward for a W but that's about all really. The ranked system works pretty well on the whole.
  • Personofsecrets
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    sekou_trayvond wrote: »
    But you're probably fine with 150 pts for a win, right?

    Leaving my snark aside, there needs to be some "skin" in the game for this ranked system to work. 150 pts for SOME losses works for that. We do need a minimum point reward for a W but that's about all really. The ranked system works pretty well on the whole.

    If a player is so out of my league that I lose 150 points for losing to them, then I shouldn't be playing them to begin with.
    Don't tank

    "In future content we will probably adjust this model somewhat (The BOP model). It's definitely nice to be able to find a cool item that you don't need and trade it to someone who can't wait to get their hands on it." - Wrobel
  • Personofsecrets
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    For crying out loud. The person I just played was doing well. They were making decent choices. They built a strong deck. It was a giant (expletive) struggle which I just so happened to win. Zero points. I have other things to do today after that excellent rank increase. It's the start of the season. FOR CRYING OUT LOUD. Zero points. IT'S THE START OF THE SEASON. I've played not that many games. How is one player doing so well and another player so poorly AT THE START OF THE SEASON that ZERO POINTS is already a potential result? And they don't care. That's right folks, they don't care.
    Don't tank

    "In future content we will probably adjust this model somewhat (The BOP model). It's definitely nice to be able to find a cool item that you don't need and trade it to someone who can't wait to get their hands on it." - Wrobel
  • spartaxoxo
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    Personofsecrets wrote: »
    For crying out loud. The person I just played was doing well. They were making decent choices. They built a strong deck. It was a giant (expletive) struggle which I just so happened to win. Zero points. I have other things to do today after that excellent rank increase. It's the start of the season. FOR CRYING OUT LOUD. Zero points. IT'S THE START OF THE SEASON. I've played not that many games. How is one player doing so well and another player so poorly AT THE START OF THE SEASON that ZERO POINTS is already a potential result? And they don't care. That's right folks, they don't care.

    I personally suspect there is an MMR system at play here. It would make sense if there was a skill system that causes these point discrepancies. I don't how the points work yet though. They haven't given us the full breakdown on how points work.
    Edited by spartaxoxo on 4 March 2023 16:37
  • NeKryXe
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    sekou_trayvond wrote: »
    But you're probably fine with 150 pts for a win, right?

    Leaving my snark aside, there needs to be some "skin" in the game for this ranked system to work. 150 pts for SOME losses works for that. We do need a minimum point reward for a W but that's about all really. The ranked system works pretty well on the whole.

    No I'm not. I already mentioned it before, in other discussions, many times, that the difference should be smaller. Winning 150 points is too much and 0 points is absolutely offensive.
  • NeKryXe
    NeKryXe
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    spartaxoxo wrote: »
    Personofsecrets wrote: »
    For crying out loud. The person I just played was doing well. They were making decent choices. They built a strong deck. It was a giant (expletive) struggle which I just so happened to win. Zero points. I have other things to do today after that excellent rank increase. It's the start of the season. FOR CRYING OUT LOUD. Zero points. IT'S THE START OF THE SEASON. I've played not that many games. How is one player doing so well and another player so poorly AT THE START OF THE SEASON that ZERO POINTS is already a potential result? And they don't care. That's right folks, they don't care.

    I personally suspect there is an MMR system at play here. It would make sense if there was a skill system that causes these point discrepancies. I don't how the points work yet though. They haven't given us the full breakdown on how points work.

    Maybe there's a time penalty too, to prevent players to play too much. In the middle of the last season, at some point, I started to get 0 points consecutively in every win, even when play against players higher ranked than me. So I decided to stop playing. After 2 or 3 days I returned, I won a match against a lower ranked player, and got about 100 points. In the last week, I played only 1 match per day, and that's how I managed to reach top 2%.

    It's all very shady with this ranked system. There's no guide, no rules, nothing. Sometimes it just feels random. But it's possible a mix of MMR and time penalty. One thing I'm now aware: once we reach top 10% the chance of getting 0 points on most matches is very high.
  • WitchyKiki
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    spartaxoxo wrote: »
    Personofsecrets wrote: »
    For crying out loud. The person I just played was doing well. They were making decent choices. They built a strong deck. It was a giant (expletive) struggle which I just so happened to win. Zero points. I have other things to do today after that excellent rank increase. It's the start of the season. FOR CRYING OUT LOUD. Zero points. IT'S THE START OF THE SEASON. I've played not that many games. How is one player doing so well and another player so poorly AT THE START OF THE SEASON that ZERO POINTS is already a potential result? And they don't care. That's right folks, they don't care.

    I personally suspect there is an MMR system at play here. It would make sense if there was a skill system that causes these point discrepancies. I don't how the points work yet though. They haven't given us the full breakdown on how points work.

    ^ This. I often find myself playing the same people over and over, some MMR is in place.
    Context is for kings -Captain Gabriel Lorca
  • sekou_trayvond
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    Fairly certain they're working off of a player's historical rating in determining how many points are at play in any given match. But they do need a minimum points gain. Playing a competitive match for upwards of 20 minutes for 0 points is suboptimal.
    Personofsecrets wrote: »
    For crying out loud. The person I just played was doing well. They were making decent choices. They built a strong deck. It was a giant (expletive) struggle which I just so happened to win. Zero points. I have other things to do today after that excellent rank increase. It's the start of the season. FOR CRYING OUT LOUD. Zero points. IT'S THE START OF THE SEASON. I've played not that many games. How is one player doing so well and another player so poorly AT THE START OF THE SEASON that ZERO POINTS is already a potential result? And they don't care. That's right folks, they don't care.

  • SilverBride
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    I wonder why there has been no explanation about what system is being used and how it works. I have seen the speculations but it would be nice to have an official response.
    PCNA
  • Personofsecrets
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    I just lost 150 points to the rank 13 players because TOT is awesome.
    Don't tank

    "In future content we will probably adjust this model somewhat (The BOP model). It's definitely nice to be able to find a cool item that you don't need and trade it to someone who can't wait to get their hands on it." - Wrobel
  • AnduinTryggva
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    Personofsecrets wrote: »
    sekou_trayvond wrote: »
    But you're probably fine with 150 pts for a win, right?

    Leaving my snark aside, there needs to be some "skin" in the game for this ranked system to work. 150 pts for SOME losses works for that. We do need a minimum point reward for a W but that's about all really. The ranked system works pretty well on the whole.

    If a player is so out of my league that I lose 150 points for losing to them, then I shouldn't be playing them to begin with.

    The thing is you:
    - get a random player so s/he could be a pro or a beginner. So you cannot chose not to play against high or low rank players.
    - even if you could chose you still don't know if the player you are pitched against is right now a better ranked player or not.

    While I understand the idea behind that dynamic ranking I think it is crap as the current rank is in no way an indicator how good and experienced a player is. Particularly at the beginning of a new month. At least if there is not a hidden eternal ranking that would be the basis for calculation win/loss points.
  • Personofsecrets
    Personofsecrets
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    AnduinTryggva wrote: »
    Personofsecrets wrote: »
    sekou_trayvond wrote: »
    But you're probably fine with 150 pts for a win, right?

    Leaving my snark aside, there needs to be some "skin" in the game for this ranked system to work. 150 pts for SOME losses works for that. We do need a minimum point reward for a W but that's about all really. The ranked system works pretty well on the whole.

    If a player is so out of my league that I lose 150 points for losing to them, then I shouldn't be playing them to begin with.

    The thing is you:
    - get a random player so s/he could be a pro or a beginner. So you cannot chose not to play against high or low rank players.
    - even if you could chose you still don't know if the player you are pitched against is right now a better ranked player or not.

    While I understand the idea behind that dynamic ranking I think it is crap as the current rank is in no way an indicator how good and experienced a player is. Particularly at the beginning of a new month. At least if there is not a hidden eternal ranking that would be the basis for calculation win/loss points.

    I should be able to do just that. Playing against a player who is apparently "so bad" is a giant waste of time. Not just from a score perspective, but from a gameplay perspective. There is no challenge and only a minimal reward. On the other side, there is a risk that is disproportionally large. Along with that is my time and aggravation. This is why ranking systems exist to begin with.

    This particular player is consistently high ranked. Them beating me isn't unheard of and they do things that skilled players do which unskilled players don't do. I have played them often and there is absolutely no way that they are so bad that they are worth -150 points for losing to. This is also aggravating, that I'm a better judge of player skill than the ranking system
    Don't tank

    "In future content we will probably adjust this model somewhat (The BOP model). It's definitely nice to be able to find a cool item that you don't need and trade it to someone who can't wait to get their hands on it." - Wrobel
  • NeKryXe
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    Today I lost 2 matches and, obviously, got -300 points stolen from my score (this never fails).
    Then I won a match and received +2 points. HHAHAHAHAHAHAAHA!!!

    This is so damn stupid that the best thing is just to laugh! :smiley:

    It's really hard to understand if this ranking system is all bugged or if it is just super dumb. It's all insanely ridiculous!
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