StamDK and Bleed Damage viability?

ArchMikem · February 2023

I just found out Flurry and Twin Slashes both do bleed damage now, so does the DW Ulti, and that got me thinking.

A Stamina DK, Dual Wield, wearing Blooddrinker and Deadly Strike? With appropriate CP. Would that apply sufficient pressure in a 1v1 to overwhelm self heals? Granted the other player doesn't just cast a purge.

buzzclops · February 2023

Ive done this exact build on necro. (They have a dot passive so its even stronger). The damage was insane but really hard to survive. Thing is, its 2 medium set that you want double barred and you have to use masters dual wield if you go bleeds. Makes less room for monster set or mythic or any heavy piece for resistance. Sustain was rough so you need lava soup or serpent or both (no cp). Basically you end up with like 28k hp (all attributes) and like 21k stam. Sustain was awful. I have to say if you have a pocket healer it was absolutely insane in bgs tho lol.

Edit: i now remember i also tried it on stam sorc which was actually the best of the 3 class i tried it on sorc>necro>dk

The hit and run toolkit of sorcerer made this a lot better and dark deal can carry your sustain. BUT, hit and run and dot is kinda counter productive cause you dont always get your KO and you cant stay in the fight long to keep pressure. But in random solo bgs (no heal no premade) it was ridiculously op.

geonsocal · February 2023

bleed over time damage seems less powerful than poison over time damage...bleed dots don't seem as bad as poison dots...i don't know if that's true though...it would seem like a good set up for when it's zergy in cyrodiil and you're not being focused a lot...

maybe either blooddrinker or deadly strike and another sustain or damage mitigation set, or some other damage set in heavy...sustain with pots and heavy attacks...

bleed is like the antithesis of burst...maybe mix something in that either defiles or drains resources...

i don't know, bloodthirsty jewels and spin to win, blooddrinker/deadly strike might work...just got to stay alive long enough yourself...roll baby roll...

right now for my primarily light or medium toons i've been using oakensoul and blinding flare together to help stay alive, well-fitted helps too...

ArchMikem · February 2023

geonsocal wrote: »

bleed over time damage seems less powerful than poison over time damage...bleed dots don't seem as bad as poison dots...i don't know if that's true though...it would seem like a good set up for when it's zergy in cyrodiil and you're not being focused a lot...maybe either blooddrinker or deadly strike and another sustain or damage mitigation set, or some other damage set in heavy...sustain with pots and heavy attacks...bleed is like the antithesis of burst...maybe mix something in that either defiles or drains resources...i don't know, bloodthirsty jewels and spin to win, blooddrinker/deadly strike might work...just got to stay alive long enough yourself...roll baby roll...

right now for my primarily light or medium toons i've been using oakensoul and blinding flare together to help stay alive, well-fitted helps too...

How are you setting up your Oakensoul builds? I just farmed a ring the other day but not sure who to use it on or how. Like do I even bother slotting an offhand weapon if it's set bonus can't even be used? How do I restructure the build if I can no longer go 5/5/2?

What about combining Oakensoul with a Master Weapon?

geonsocal · February 2023

yes, go through the whole double bar setup - depending on the scenario - large scale versus small scale, or just however you're feeling at the moment, go with that weapon and bar (to switch bars you have to unequip oakensoul)...

while oakensoul is most definitely not OP and it is not for the best builds - it is soooooooooo much easier to play...

oh my goodness, a single bar build is extremely relaxing to play - no more continually buffing...

well, except for when lag is bad and nothing works anyway and you're stuck healing over and over again - just in case...

i'm still using 2 five piece sets, the oakensoul and 1 monster piece...i've extended that setup to all 17 pvp toons (2 servers) i have...

life in cyrodiil is good...

you just need to make sure you're not duplicating all the buffs from oakensoul...

for my toons in mostly light or medium armor - i'm also slotting blinding flare, with both minor and major protection (15% damage mitigation off the top), fairly durable...

i'll tell ya @ArchMikem - i've stepped in an arena like twice...hated it...not doing it again...so, i don't have any good master weapons...

i'm not doing it myself - but, i'm reading a lot here about folks splitting up their sets and not going with 2 five piece sets anymore...

a lot of the folks with more finely tuned toons usually do this...

i'm a casual though, with a bunch of toons i rotate playing a lot - so, my stuff is mostly set up for convenience...and for forcing other alliance players to have to go rez somewhere else

axi · February 2023

Just use master dual wield. That weapon alone allows for significant pressure especially when combined with way of fire set and vateshran destro.

Urzigurumash · February 2023

axi wrote: »

Just use master dual wield. That weapon alone allows for significant pressure especially when combined with way of fire set and vateshran destro.

You like Ele Sus on DK instead of Noxious Breath, or additionally?

ArchMikem · February 2023

Welp, update time.

Masters Sword and Mace with Oakensoul, 5 Deadly Strike, 3 Hulking Draugr and a Kragh piece for extra pen. Kept switching out Rend and Leap cause even though Rend is a great DoT, I immediately had trouble chasing after Nightblades on foot.

Yes sustain sucked, yes even with 21k resists I felt squishy, and we're playing in a time where most PvPers are vets using tanky yet high dmg builds, so the only ones that my DoTs actually worked against were pure DDs, and low levels. Trying to PvP with a DK my own way is a terrible experience and after a while I just relogged onto my StamBlade. Though thus build sounds real nice for PvE.

geonsocal · February 2023

DK's are hot right now in cyrodiil...maybe work something else out for how to use your stam dk...

ArchMikem · February 2023

geonsocal wrote: »

DK's are hot right now in cyrodiil...maybe work something else out for how to use your stam dk...

I know what those DKs are doing for the most part but I have neither the inclination or energy to fully understand their build. Just sucks that there's the one meta that makes you a nigh invincible powerhouse and every other setup is simply worse.

buzzclops · February 2023

ArchMikem wrote: »

geonsocal wrote: »

DK's are hot right now in cyrodiil...maybe work something else out for how to use your stam dk...

I know what those DKs are doing for the most part but I have neither the inclination or energy to fully understand their build. Just sucks that there's the one meta that makes you a nigh invincible powerhouse and every other setup is simply worse.

Mara’s balm and sea serpents coil is what they use. Its super cheesy let the game play for you but you can definitely build dks differently. What they do is essentially this: Apply breath > spam flames of oblivion 3 times then whip. Rinse repeat. Stand in your eruption (you have coil anyway) and spam dragon blood for heals. Its probably the easiest playstyle out there with heavy attacks lightning builds. You basically never have to pre hot or prepare to line up bursts or heals together. Just spam buttons and react to dmg taken. Which is why its so powerful because you wont panic or tunnel vision.

We will see when maras balm gets nerfed but this plays style has been super popular since oakensoul got out. And they keep releasing sets that helps it.

The big counter to them was defile and now mara covers it.

But we are getting away from the topic

ArchMikem · February 2023

buzzclops wrote: »

ArchMikem wrote: »

geonsocal wrote: »

DK's are hot right now in cyrodiil...maybe work something else out for how to use your stam dk...

I know what those DKs are doing for the most part but I have neither the inclination or energy to fully understand their build. Just sucks that there's the one meta that makes you a nigh invincible powerhouse and every other setup is simply worse.

Mara’s balm and sea serpents coil is what they use. Its super cheesy let the game play for you but you can definitely build dks differently. What they do is essentially this: Apply breath > spam flames of oblivion 3 times then whip. Rinse repeat. Stand in your eruption (you have coil anyway) and spam dragon blood for heals. Its probably the easiest playstyle out there with heavy attacks lightning builds. You basically never have to pre hot or prepare to line up bursts or heals together. Just spam buttons and react to dmg taken. Which is why its so powerful because you wont panic or tunnel vision.

We will see when maras balm gets nerfed but this plays style has been super popular since oakensoul got out. And they keep releasing sets that helps it.

The big counter to them was defile and now mara covers it.

But we are getting away from the topic

I actually appreciate the explanation. Most of them want to be vague or keep the build to themselves so it doesn't proliferate. Even still I only PvP as a time waster, I like to make general purpose builds that I can take into all or most content without major gear swaps, which is why I'm always at a disadvantage when stepping into Cyro.

geonsocal · February 2023

my mag dk is still rocking silks of the sun and heavy julianos...it's like the only build i haven't really tinkered with much at all - i really like the visuals associated with the build, doing decent flame damage is always in style too...

my stam dk uses swamp raider and pariah, need to switch out pariah though for mara's balm...

when i get tired of having to work too hard on one of my other toons, i switch to the stam dk to relax and have fun...actually did just that last night...

Edit: this post has got me thinking, maybe it is time for a change with my mag dk...think i'll swap out the heavy julianos with elf-bane perhaps...

taugrim · February 2023

ArchMikem wrote: »

I just found out Flurry and Twin Slashes both do bleed damage now, so does the DW Ulti, and that got me thinking.

A Stamina DK, Dual Wield, wearing Blooddrinker and Deadly Strike? With appropriate CP. Would that apply sufficient pressure in a 1v1 to overwhelm self heals? Granted the other player doesn't just cast a purge.

Stacking DoTs works.

I would recommend rather than focusing on bleeds specifically, slotting abilities that have DoT effects. DK has multiple of those in its class kit.

Then pairing that with Stinging Slashes set.

One setup I liked:

Stinging Slashes
1-pc Magma Incarnate for sustain
Markyn
Order's Wrath
backbarred Wretched Vitality for sustain

You have high resource recovery, good sustained DoT damage, and good CC.