Set ideas for hybrid Warden.

LittlePinkDot · January 2023

So I'm leveling up a redguard Warden I'm going to make a hybrid.
Her spammable will be Brawler from the 2hand skill line. 1h/shield for back bar. I'm going to be heavy armour and use the Mythic Torc of Tonal constancy.
I will be using deep fissure for the major and minor breach. Blue betty instead of the stamina version.

Any ideas for a good set combo?
I was wondering about Diamond's Victory but I can't seem to find info online about which Wardens skills trigger melee or ranged supremacy.
I'm also wondering if I'll need a sustain set like wretched vitality if I'm using the Torc Mythic.
FYI I don't use dungeon sets since I hate farming dungeons and only pug.
I also don't want anything that increases costs like NMA.

OBJnoob · January 2023

I think diamonds victory would be a fine set for warden-- they have plenty of class ranged attacks (fetcherflies, beetles, bird,) to proc the one half and your Brawler attack will proc the other half. When you're actively on offense it should take only a little practice to have both buffs up basically always.

You could pair it with most things and it'd be alright... But if you want something actually good and easy to get you really should just use rallying cry.

I'm not sure about your choice of mythic... But honestly you tell me. Let me know how it goes. Wardens have good passives for bi-stat recovery so I do think it could be useful and I do think you'll have success running stam and magicka abilities. I honestly just wonder how often you can/want to let either stat get low enough to proc the effect. Stam, in my opinion, is more important than magicka in pvp because that's what core combat abilities cost. If you run out of stam you're dead. If you run out of magicka you may also be dead but you can break free, run, block, and roll while you get a little mag back. If I were you I think I'd run the green Betty instead of the blue, and let your magicka be the resource that gets low to proc torq.

Also-- not sure if you'll like brawler as a spammable. Wardens wearing rallying cry do pretty good at survival, what they really need is more offense. You might end up dumping brawler for dizzy or executioner if I were to guess.

LittlePinkDot · January 2023

OBJnoob wrote: »

I think diamonds victory would be a fine set for warden-- they have plenty of class ranged attacks (fetcherflies, beetles, bird,) to proc the one half and your Brawler attack will proc the other half. When you're actively on offense it should take only a little practice to have both buffs up basically always.

You could pair it with most things and it'd be alright... But if you want something actually good and easy to get you really should just use rallying cry.

I'm not sure about your choice of mythic... But honestly you tell me. Let me know how it goes. Wardens have good passives for bi-stat recovery so I do think it could be useful and I do think you'll have success running stam and magicka abilities. I honestly just wonder how often you can/want to let either stat get low enough to proc the effect. Stam, in my opinion, is more important than magicka in pvp because that's what core combat abilities cost. If you run out of stam you're dead. If you run out of magicka you may also be dead but you can break free, run, block, and roll while you get a little mag back. If I were you I think I'd run the green Betty instead of the blue, and let your magicka be the resource that gets low to proc torq.

Also-- not sure if you'll like brawler as a spammable. Wardens wearing rallying cry do pretty good at survival, what they really need is more offense. You might end up dumping brawler for dizzy or executioner if I were to guess.

I don't see what's so great about Rallying cry. I don't group with people. I don't know if you have to for the set to work. I'm solo most of the time. I don't talk to or coordinate with other people. I also use most of my PvP characters for overland PVE and soloing public dungeons.

The build is something I saw online except they use DW with rending slashes as the spammable, but uses some master weapons that increase the damage of rending slashes. But I don't do trials because I'm solo, so I changed it to brawler. I was thinking about executioner but the stated sheet damage is lower than brawler and I have no idea if I can use an execute as a spammable.

The build I saw online was using blue betty, that's the only reason I was going to use blue betty.
https://dottzgaming.com/build/natures-wrath-stamina-warden-pvp-build/

But there's definitely a few things I'm doing different. They're an imperial, I'm using a redguard. And so far as a redguard using 2h and only level 30, I'm not having any trouble sustaining stam. It's magicka I'm running out of. Then I just have to spam brawler until my mag comes back.
This is just leveling in PVE though. Nowhere near ready for PvP.
I noticed they're using essence thief with wretched vitality, I might use wretched vitality, but I would want to pair it with a damage set like diamonds victory.

Redguard has that adrenaline rush, so I was thinking stam might not be a problem.

WrathOfInnos · January 2023

Last I checked, Shalks procs both melee and ranged for Diamonds Victory, but does not give full uptime now that both morphs of Shalks last longer than DV's 5s. Deep Fissure in particular is very long. This is also from at least a year ago, so it may have been fixed at some point to only be melee or ranged.

DV is not a great set anyway, I'd go with something more bursty like Stuhn or Acuity.

OBJnoob · January 2023

@LittlePinkDot You do not need to be grouped for rallying cry to work. In fact it works better if you are alone. For every additional person effected, the proc is less and less. That's what all that confusing mumbo jumbo at the end of the description is saying. What makes it so good? Quite simply, it's offense and defense at the same time, and a decent amount of both. It does NOT work in PvE, so there is that, but I encourage you to try it anyway if you want to PvP.

What you said about mag/stam makes sense to me so do your thing.

What you said about brawler makes sense too. Honestly your build is going to work fine. People may say diamonds victory isn't as good as some other things... And they're probably right... But that doesn't mean it isn't fine. It's fine.

If you find out you need more offense then you know what to do. No, executioner doesn't work as a spammable. For the record I run my warden without an executioner and it's also fine. But I use a frost staff, so I have an extra 12% damage. I have seen better wardens than me using melee weapons, and the passives for those weapons help make up the loss of a frost staff, but it's really the ability to have an execute that makes NOT using a frost staff viable. In my opinion.

I wouldn't run wretched vitality with the mythic you're talking about. It's just a little overkill and hybrid wardens really don't struggle for sustain that badly to begin with. It is counter-productive to have a mythic that grants recovery when things run low paired with a set that keeps both stats high. If your mythic item isn't in effect more than 50% of the time then you should probably be using a different mythic.

LittlePinkDot · January 2023

WrathOfInnos wrote: »

Last I checked, Shalks procs both melee and ranged for Diamonds Victory, but does not give full uptime now that both morphs of Shalks last longer than DV's 5s. Deep Fissure in particular is very long. This is also from at least a year ago, so it may have been fixed at some point to only be melee or ranged.

DV is not a great set anyway, I'd go with something more bursty like Stuhn or Acuity.

Stuhn sucks for me because you have to heavy attack to off balance an enemy.
I NEVER HEAVY ATTACK.
I absolutely hate heavy attacking.

Come to think of it I don't really like anything that requires a heavy or light attack to proc. I prefer things that proc off my skills.

OBJnoob · January 2023

Your understanding of off-balance isn't quite right. Heavy attacking people does NOT put them off balance. I think (think,) the concussed status effect causes people to be off balance. More certainly, skills that put people off balance put people off balance. I don't say that to be rude or anything-- the skills literally say they do. As it pertains to you-- Dizzying Swing puts targets off balance, and so does the magicka morph of the warden skill cliff racer.

Once somebody is already off balance heavy attacking that person stuns them. That is the only relationship heavy attacks have with the off balance mechanic.

LittlePinkDot · January 2023

OBJnoob wrote: »

Your understanding of off-balance isn't quite right. Heavy attacking people does NOT put them off balance. I think (think,) the concussed status effect causes people to be off balance. More certainly, skills that put people off balance put people off balance. I don't say that to be rude or anything-- the skills literally say they do. As it pertains to you-- Dizzying Swing puts targets off balance, and so does the magicka morph of the warden skill cliff racer.

Once somebody is already off balance heavy attacking that person stuns them. That is the only relationship heavy attacks have with the off balance mechanic.

I misread what I had googled. It said Blocking a heavy attack, not heavy attacking.
But I don't know what skills I have on a Warden that cause off balance.
And I'm not planning on using cliff racer.

Would Dawn Breaker of smiting or Arctic blast cause off balance? I'm wary of using a set I don't know how to trigger when I need it. I do love the pen on that set though. Maybe paired with Rallying cry.

I had never bothered ever reading up on what "off Balance" is exactly, although I see it pop up sometimes when I'm playing a few of my other characters. It never mattered enough to care about. Stuff is either dying or it isn't.

OBJnoob · January 2023

No Dawnbreaker and Arctic don't cause off balance, they simply stun. Abilities will say if they cause off balance. There aren't a whole lot. Dizzy Swing, Screaming Cliff Racer, Surprise Attack (nightblade only.) Uuh, Flying Blade from the dual wield skill line will set people off balance IF they had a skill interrupted. And for that matter interrupting any skill will set people off balance I think. Thing is, most PvPers don't use abilities with cast times, so the only things you're ever really going to interrupt are a sorc trying to Dark Deal or a Templar trying to Beam you.

I don't think blocking heavy attacks puts players off balance. Maybe it works on NPCs I don't know.

Caribou77 · January 2023

I’ve used stuhns in the past and found that proc-ing the set is tedious with every skill except templar’s toppling charge (for PVP). Cliff racers are too slow for PVP, and are, in my opinion, the main problem with Warden’s toolkit: there is no viable spammable for pvp. So people use 2h or other non-class skill lines for spammable and/or execute on warden.

I also run an ice staff on front bar, and do not have an execute slotted. I pretty much trade low kills for high assists in bgs, which I’m okay with,

Also, OBJnoob is very knowledgeable on warden, imo. I’d trust his advice.

OBJnoob · January 2023

Thanks Caribou! Yes my magden isn't THE meta but it is pretty meta, and after playing it for 2 or 3 months straight I have gotten rather good at it. I use Hrothgar's on mine, which most people would probably say isn't very good. But I still do really well, so that's why I feel like you (Pink,) will be fine using Diamonds Victory. What you're comfortable with is what you should use, as long as it isn't utter trash, which it isn't. It is also why I recommend Rallying Cry to go with it though-- because a little meta never hurt anyone.

MEBengalsFan2001 · January 2023

If you want a good all around set to use go with New Moon. It provides you with good damage without much fuss. The only downside is the increase cost of abilities. If you run a Imperial it easily offsets the penalty of new moon.

If you don't want to deal the penalty cost you could try Clever Alchemist or Ancient Dragonguard. I prefer Ancient Dragonguard over Clever Alchemist as it provides offensive when you are above 50% health and defensive when it drops below 50% health. Where as Clever Alchemist is dependent upon using a potion to get the 675 spell/weapon damage bonus.

I played my Warden this weekend and comparing to my Templar just isn't fair in any form or way. Bonus damage, soft CC immunity, cleanse without using resources that also provides major buff, a group heal that is just as strong as BoL and it also provides a HoT and cost a bit less in resources, bonus to crit damage, etc... I found my Warden in its current state to be better than my Templar was when my Templar was its best.

In this day of ESO every class is a hybrid from my experience.

LittlePinkDot · February 2023

OBJnoob wrote: »

Thanks Caribou! Yes my magden isn't THE meta but it is pretty meta, and after playing it for 2 or 3 months straight I have gotten rather good at it. I use Hrothgar's on mine, which most people would probably say isn't very good. But I still do really well, so that's why I feel like you (Pink,) will be fine using Diamonds Victory. What you're comfortable with is what you should use, as long as it isn't utter trash, which it isn't. It is also why I recommend Rallying Cry to go with it though-- because a little meta never hurt anyone.

I've switched things around a bit.
I scrapped the Tonal mythic idea, I have no time for craglorn BS looking for a lead.

I've chosen Heartland conqueror set and armour of the seducer set.
Dizzying swing spammable.

I willl try out ring of the wild hunt if I can actually get all the damn leads.

Still haven't got the last lead I need for Markyn ring for my stamsorc. Extremely frustrating.

OBJnoob · February 2023

@LittlePinkDot not gonna lie I think your other set up was better. But I sympathize with the mythic struggles, I only have 3 or 4 myself. I actually find the whole antiquities process rather fun... But there is 1 lead for every mythic it seems that just makes you want to beat your head into the wall. And "going there" or "doing the thing" is never the hard part, which is why the whole thing is lame.

Anyway... So I wanted to ask you if you have any arena weapons. You know, from Vateshran or maelstrom or dragon star.

The reason I ask is because Heartland is kinda sub-par in an environment where you CAN backbar sets. It has a cool 5-piece bonus that SIMULATES different bonuses on your bars, but isn't as effective as the real deal.

Also,seducer only helps with the cost of magicka abilities. So it won't be much use on your front bar using dizzying swing as a spammable. Both of these comments are tied together.

So what I'm getting at is... You should be set up like this, if you're going to use those two sets:
FB Weapon: arena 2h
BB weapon: seducer whatever
Head: monster
Shoulders: monster
Chest: heartland
Hands:heartland
Legs: heartland
Waist: heartland
Feet: heartland
Necklace: seducer
Ring: seducer
Ring: seducer

This way you load your backbar with all your expensive magicka buffs-- frost cloak, polar wind, living trellis' blah blah blah... And it benefits from seducer. Use either a defensive or powered trait probably, which heartland will double.

Your front bar won't need seducer so you're better off dropping it for an arena weapon-- which heartland will still double the trait of. Nirnhoned or sharpened probably. And your bar will be something like dizzying swing, executioner, vigor, beetles, blah blah blah.

Heartland really only shines in this way. It needs to be double-barred to be competitive with other sets in any way. But double-barring things in CP environments really isn't optimal... So if you don't have an arena weapon I wouldn't do it.

LittlePinkDot · February 2023

OBJnoob wrote: »

@LittlePinkDot not gonna lie I think your other set up was better. But I sympathize with the mythic struggles, I only have 3 or 4 myself. I actually find the whole antiquities process rather fun... But there is 1 lead for every mythic it seems that just makes you want to beat your head into the wall. And "going there" or "doing the thing" is never the hard part, which is why the whole thing is lame.

Anyway... So I wanted to ask you if you have any arena weapons. You know, from Vateshran or maelstrom or dragon star.

The reason I ask is because Heartland is kinda sub-par in an environment where you CAN backbar sets. It has a cool 5-piece bonus that SIMULATES different bonuses on your bars, but isn't as effective as the real deal.

Also,seducer only helps with the cost of magicka abilities. So it won't be much use on your front bar using dizzying swing as a spammable. Both of these comments are tied together.

So what I'm getting at is... You should be set up like this, if you're going to use those two sets:
FB Weapon: arena 2h
BB weapon: seducer whatever
Head: monster
Shoulders: monster
Chest: heartland
Hands:heartland
Legs: heartland
Waist: heartland
Feet: heartland
Necklace: seducer
Ring: seducer
Ring: seducer

This way you load your backbar with all your expensive magicka buffs-- frost cloak, polar wind, living trellis' blah blah blah... And it benefits from seducer. Use either a defensive or powered trait probably, which heartland will double.

Your front bar won't need seducer so you're better off dropping it for an arena weapon-- which heartland will still double the trait of. Nirnhoned or sharpened probably. And your bar will be something like dizzying swing, executioner, vigor, beetles, blah blah blah.

Heartland really only shines in this way. It needs to be double-barred to be competitive with other sets in any way. But double-barring things in CP environments really isn't optimal... So if you don't have an arena weapon I wouldn't do it.

My front bar absolutely needs seducer for arctic blast, deep fissure and Fletcher infection, bird of prey. Sharpened trait on the 2 hander is like wearing spriggans when wearing heartland conqueror.
And defending on backbar with 1h/shield is a nice defence boost. She's wearing 4 piece heavy armour. Reinforced chest and legs.

Other than dizzying swing and Vigor, all her other skills are Magicka.
As a Redguard that has 8% weapon cost reduction and the adrenaline rush racial passives on top of the 15% cost reduction in the 2hander skill line, she doesn't have any problems sustaining stamina.
But have you seen how expensive magicka costs of warden skills are?

No I don't have any maelstrom or arena weapons. I'm only a Healer or a recently noob tank in dungeons, less waiting when pugging. I do not DPS in PVE. I'm very... Very...casual. Screw annoying rotations.
My stam Necro is technically a DPS I look for antiquities with but on a target dummy highest DPS I ever got is 14k. Lol.
And I'm solo all the time. Other than dungeon pugs I don't do trials because there's no group finder for trials.

I try to avoid veteran DLC dungeons. It's something I procrastinate.
For the time being I'm just using random monster helm and shoulder for the 1 piece bonus on each of them.
Ring of the wild hunt looks easier to achieve. Maybe Velidreth when I can muster the patience to try to get it.