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The maintenance is complete, and the PTS is now back online and patch 11.2.1 is available.
Sad there's no Sorc buffs in 8.2.0
WuffyCerulei
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Pretty sad to see there's pretty much no buffs to the Sorcerer class itself in the patch notes. We were promised buffs in the last Lost Depths PTS week and only got a Daedric Prey buff. Here we got nothing. Not even a crumb. I'm disappointed.
Sorcerer's pretty much been the same for years. Nerf Rush of Agony and Saints&Seducer's
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acastanza_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Not true
They're doubling down on forcing Sorcs to be zookeepers, again, and mocking us about it to boot.
I don't understand how they can be this ignorant of the state of the game.
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xDeusEJRx✭✭✭✭✭
✭The real sorcerer buffs were the pets we found along the waySolo PvP'er PS5 NA player
90% of my body is made of Magblade10 -
WuffyCerulei✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭acastanza_ESO wrote: »Not true
They're doubling down on forcing Sorcs to be zookeepers, again, and mocking us about it to boot.
I don't understand how they can be this ignorant of the state of the game.
I meant to the class itself, rather than sets, but yeah. I don't mind pets, but it certainly isn't everyone's preferred play style.Sorcerer's pretty much been the same for years. Nerf Rush of Agony and Saints&Seducer's3 -
Asdara✭✭✭✭✭
✭that's the saddest patch i've seen in 8 years, so little content and barely any change“The Second Era? Oh, you mean the BEAM Era. Because apparently every problem could be solved with a giant glowing light shooting at everything.”8 -
MajorSnakeFox✭✭✭The Sorc is one of the strongest classes in DPS. There is no separation between PVE and PVP in ESO. That he is not as good in PVP as in PVE is just the way it is. It was the same for other classes over the years. Get along with it.1 -
acastanza_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭MajorSnakeFox wrote: »The Sorc is one of the strongest classes in DPS. There is no separation between PVE and PVP in ESO. That he is not as good in PVP as in PVE is just the way it is. It was the same for other classes over the years. Get along with it.
Compelte nonsense.
There are plenty of ways sorc could be reworked that would address major issues with the class that not affect PVE DPS at all. We've made innumerable threads on the subject of the defensive tools and buff access that Sorc lacks.12 -
WuffyCerulei✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭MajorSnakeFox wrote: »The Sorc is one of the strongest classes in DPS. There is no separation between PVE and PVP in ESO. That he is not as good in PVP as in PVE is just the way it is. It was the same for other classes over the years. Get along with it.
The issue isn't that sorcs are just strong in DPS, it's that only one particular build is the absolute best for damage. Which would be pets. The class has so many skills that could be used by dps, but they aren't as pets are the top damage. The rotations have been stagnant for years. And if you don't use pets, you're absolutely and totally *** on damaged.Sorcerer's pretty much been the same for years. Nerf Rush of Agony and Saints&Seducer's7 -
MashmalloMan✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭that's the saddest patch i've seen in 8 years, so little content and barely any change
This is what we asked for right!? Bug fixes.
Hilarious. The one time they need massive changes after what they did with Update 35, they choose to "listen" to us and do next to nothing.
Well, unfortunately, looks like I'm avoiding the game for another 4 months because the next gap is usually the longest.
Might be more if they're Chapter preview shows another mini-game mechanic for the 4th year in a row.6 -
Minalan✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭It would be nice if they could put crystal weapon’s unique penetration buff into the base skill so that frags can benefit as well.
Come on, fixing the magicka spec starts with one small step.Edited by Minalan on 19 September 2022 22:240 -
MashmalloMan✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭It would be nice if they could put crystal weapon’s unique penetration buff into the base skill so that frags can benefit as well.
Come on, fixing the magicka spec starts with one small step.
I would happily give that and the -10% cost reduction up for something new. The 1k penetration was always laughable from the get-go. The entire purpose behind it seemed to be a way to offer stam sorcs something unique to bring to the table, but no raid is ever going to change their entire comp for 1k less penetration easily achieved via sets for only 1 target at a time.
I would personally want Sundered on Crystal Weapon and Concussed on Crystal Frag (with a shock element change).
They both provide a better boost to damage output but they're named and give a small damage tick. They're also in theme with what should be Sorc's strongest aspects, Physical and Shock damage.
Could take it one step further, make the status effect reliant on the second proc of Crystal Weapon and the instant proc of Crystal Frag, makes them more fun to work around if having it on the base ability is too much.Edited by MashmalloMan on 19 September 2022 22:452 -
YandereGirlfriend✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Perhaps it's for the best that Sorcerers weren't touched. Witness what happened to Wardens.4 -
MetallicMonk✭✭✭✭✭Another thread where players are clueless about how bad the class is in PvP at top end and base their performance of it in PvE off of dummy parses, class has virtually no cleave which is largely prevalent in most end game encounters.7
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WuffyCerulei✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭MetallicMonk wrote: »Another thread where players are clueless about how bad the class is in PvP at top end and base their performance of it in PvE off of dummy parses, class has virtually no cleave which is largely prevalent in most end game encounters.
Not all fights in end-game PVE is cleave and only cleave. Single target damage is pretty important too, my guy. Not exactly going to burn a boss if you're mainly built for cleave.Sorcerer's pretty much been the same for years. Nerf Rush of Agony and Saints&Seducer's1 -
MetallicMonk✭✭✭✭✭WuffyCerulei wrote: »Not all fights in end-game PVE is cleave and only cleave. Single target damage is pretty important too, my guy. Not exactly going to burn a boss if you're mainly built for cleave.
You're misunderstanding. Other classes have much more efficient built in cleave to their class, not ones they have to specifically build for. Sorcerer single target is indeed high, but falls behind as soon as there is a relevant amount of cleave damage to be had, which is very often in a ton of encounters.
This is why people who come in and say sorcerer is some top dog in PvE are almost always basing it off some youtuber they watch doing an inflated dummy parse, or occasionally their own.
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MashmalloMan✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭WuffyCerulei wrote: »MetallicMonk wrote: »Another thread where players are clueless about how bad the class is in PvP at top end and base their performance of it in PvE off of dummy parses, class has virtually no cleave which is largely prevalent in most end game encounters.
Not all fights in end-game PVE is cleave and only cleave. Single target damage is pretty important too, my guy. Not exactly going to burn a boss if you're mainly built for cleave.
Their point was the dummy dps only paints 1 picture, single target dps ceiling and people seem to think thats a good metric to judge the entire balance of a class.. as if it's the only thing that matters. Unfortunately ZOS has shown a history of using this same mentality, nerf/buffing based on spreadsheets calculated from target dummy parses.
It does not take into account:- Passive Cleave (you don't need to actively build for) Eg. Warden's Scorch/Winters Revenge, Necro's BB/Graveyard, Templar's Jabs/Shards.
- Ranged vs Melee (whatever gets you the highest score is all that matters instead of the opportunity/cost of how to get there)
- Debuff/Buff access (access to everything you need on a trial dummy)
- Difficulty of rotation (see DK's juggling 10 skills with different timers)
- Sustain (easy to achieve on the trial dummy)
- What skills are providing that DPS, is it mostly 1 skill like oldschool jabs or does it cost 5 skills from 2 pets and Daedric Prey? Try translating that over to PVP.
- How is that DPS is achieved? Is it from pets that aren't useful in anything but a trial or 4 man dungeon where they can't be killed? Is it from a 6s delayed burst skill only useful for the pet buff and not the skill itself, that often times takes so long to explode, it never blows up at all?
"Sorc is amazing, didn't you see that dummy parse?" -_-
The point is, HOW. How is that DPS achieved, an average can be obtained in many different ways. When you have a class like Templar that got most of their end game pve DPS from Jabs, then you pop them over to something like PVP, well look at that.. they now have 9 other slots to fit whatever they want and get the majority of their damage still. If you ever tried swapping from Sorc to Templar in U34 or earlier, you know exactly what I'm talking about. Their skill bars are very dynamic and the build opportunity felt massive where as Sorc is locked into many abilities they can't perform well without.
Not sure about Templar in U35, haven't played, but I gather they nerfed Jabs too far.Edited by MashmalloMan on 20 September 2022 00:057 -
MashmalloMan✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭MetallicMonk wrote: »WuffyCerulei wrote: »Not all fights in end-game PVE is cleave and only cleave. Single target damage is pretty important too, my guy. Not exactly going to burn a boss if you're mainly built for cleave.
This is why people who come in and say sorcerer is some top dog in PvE are almost always basing it off some youtuber they watch doing an inflated dummy parse, or occasionally their own.
Like the numerous of dps parses that start out with Overload for 330 ult until they cast Atro.. Yeah. Hella cheesy. I expect cheese like prebuffing or setting your ult down before the parse begins, but that type of cheese is rarely ever going to happen.
You're not gonna hold on to 500 ultimate before the next phase of a fight where you could cast Atro at 170 ult 2 minutes ago.
Edited by MashmalloMan on 19 September 2022 23:597 -
Turtle_Bot✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭WuffyCerulei wrote: »MetallicMonk wrote: »Another thread where players are clueless about how bad the class is in PvP at top end and base their performance of it in PvE off of dummy parses, class has virtually no cleave which is largely prevalent in most end game encounters.
Not all fights in end-game PVE is cleave and only cleave. Single target damage is pretty important too, my guy. Not exactly going to burn a boss if you're mainly built for cleave.
The thing is, other classes have always gotten their cleave damage passively while still maintaining very similar single target damage. As mentioned, examples include jabs, blast bones, FoO/breath, shulks, power extraction, etc. Sorc has to choose to build into one or the other and it really shows, especially with how crowded the bars are already for the class.3 -
Turtle_Bot✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭MetallicMonk wrote: »WuffyCerulei wrote: »Not all fights in end-game PVE is cleave and only cleave. Single target damage is pretty important too, my guy. Not exactly going to burn a boss if you're mainly built for cleave.
You're misunderstanding. Other classes have much more efficient built in cleave to their class, not ones they have to specifically build for. Sorcerer single target is indeed high, but falls behind as soon as there is a relevant amount of cleave damage to be had, which is very often in a ton of encounters.
This is why people who come in and say sorcerer is some top dog in PvE are almost always basing it off some youtuber they watch doing an inflated dummy parse, or occasionally their own.
This, so much this. They also come in and talk about how their sorc went 15-1 in a bg match, but fail to mention that everyone else in that bg was a literal potato or they talk about how they performed well in cyrodiil without mentioning that the players they are fighting are once again, potatoes or that they were in a large group or zerg surfing in a zerg v zerg fight where the enemy zerg largely ignored them. Majority of them also seem to come from PCNA where the lag/performance issues have been largely fixed so the class is far less punished on that server compared to the other servers.4 -
Syndem✭✭✭acastanza_ESO wrote: »Not true
They're doubling down on forcing Sorcs to be zookeepers, again, and mocking us about it to boot.
I don't understand how they can be this ignorant of the state of the game.
I m just a middle game player, playing since 2019, but i always read the Patchs and go to PTS. After this time i reached this conclusion : They just don t care ! What people say, show, ask or think.
After all the feedback on U35 which % of the "problems" addressed by the comunity were listened ? Maybe 3 % or something like that ?
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PhoenixGrey✭✭✭✭✭
✭ZOS can literally fix the whole class with a few tweaks. Instead they buff stamblade1 -
acastanza_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭acastanza_ESO wrote: »Not true
They're doubling down on forcing Sorcs to be zookeepers, again, and mocking us about it to boot.
I don't understand how they can be this ignorant of the state of the game.
I m just a middle game player, playing since 2019, but i always read the Patchs and go to PTS. After this time i reached this conclusion : They just don t care ! What people say, show, ask or think.
After all the feedback on U35 which % of the "problems" addressed by the comunity were listened ? Maybe 3 % or something like that ?
1000% accurate conclusion.
I tried running a classic mag-stack shield sorc build again this last week. It is laughably bad.
Trash damage, as much pen as a wet noodle, and in order to cram in all three shields you need for good defense, and bound ageis, you sacrifice either a critical damage ability, or any kind of group utility (like restraining prison or something). Not to mention that the only healing shield is one that you can't even reliably cast on yourself! And other than that shield you don't bring any group healing at all.
It is stupid beyond all imagining.Edited by acastanza_ESO on 25 September 2022 06:393 -
Minalan✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Please consider a few small changes that will really help this class.
We need access to either more spell penetration, or spell crit damage. Consider adding some kind of debuff to curse. Every other class delayed damage ability has some kind of secondary effect.
Please consider making the unique penetration buff of Crystal weapon part of the base so that it affects frags.
I’m okay with shields scaling on max magicka, but please tweak the health cap just a little so that it’s more in line with the damage in the game now.
Consider giving us minor protection on hardened ward as we can really use access to this buff without slotting a psijic ultimate.
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Minalan✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭acastanza_ESO wrote: »acastanza_ESO wrote: »Not true
They're doubling down on forcing Sorcs to be zookeepers, again, and mocking us about it to boot.
I don't understand how they can be this ignorant of the state of the game.
I m just a middle game player, playing since 2019, but i always read the Patchs and go to PTS. After this time i reached this conclusion : They just don t care ! What people say, show, ask or think.
After all the feedback on U35 which % of the "problems" addressed by the comunity were listened ? Maybe 3 % or something like that ?
1000% accurate conclusion.
I tried running a classic mag-stack shield sorc build again this last week. It is laughably bad.
Trash damage, as much pen as a wet noodle, and in order to cram in all three shields you need for good defense, and bound ageis, you sacrifice either a critical damage ability, or any kind of group utility (like restraining prison or something). Not to mention that the only healing shield is one that you can't even reliably cast on yourself! And other than that shield you don't bring any group healing at all.
It is stupid beyond all imagining.
This meta you need to stack some stam regen, and some stamina skills. Keep vigor running in a fight, you get a reliable HOT and minor resolve for 20 seconds.
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