Why Dive sucks

OnGodiDoDis · July 2022

The Warden class spammable is an atrocious skill to use in PvP. The reason being is because it has a delay before it deals any damage. I know this does not affect PvE, as NPCs cannot roll dodge or block. But in PvP, players have more than enough time to react. Additionally, when attempting to finish off an opponent (if you've ever gotten anyone to execute range as a Warden, congrats) with Dive, the delay allows the target to heal, taking them out of execute range. Hearing that this skill sucks isn't something new to the devs, and I've been wondering why they have not addressed this problem yet. Adding Spell Damage on hit isn't going to work on a spammable that rarely hits or does any considerable amount of damage. Reduce the delay and make it instant cast. There's no reason for the bird to travel all the way across the map, yelling "here I come! You better dodge me!" I'm not sure why the animation was changed in the first place. The bird used to spawn on top of the target, now it spawns behind the caster. If you want counterplay, make it spawn on the target again. This skill is not powerful enough to have a delay or travel time. It's not Crystal Frag (RIP).

CameraBeardThePirate · July 2022

Same goes for Skulls while we're at it. Birds and Skulls both have insanely weird travel times and animations, and neither morph of either skill is worth it at all. Please take another look at these spammables Zos, because at the moment you're gimping yourself for using your class spammable as a warden or necro.

aurelius_fx · July 2022

i'd like to add Stone Fist and Swallow Soul to that list, most class specific ranged spammables feel really slow or bad for one reason or another - not to mention roll dodge just lasts super long and can completely negate 2-3 GCDs

the trade off isn't even that great considering how gap closers have the same range as ranged spammables, so unless you're on speed cap or have some disengage tool (cloak, streak) people are just gonna roll up to you and hit you with actually damaging skills

ESO_Nightingale · July 2022

OnGodiDoDis wrote: »

The Warden class spammable is an atrocious skill to use in PvP. The reason being is because it has a delay before it deals any damage. I know this does not affect PvE, as NPCs cannot roll dodge or block. But in PvP, players have more than enough time to react. Additionally, when attempting to finish off an opponent (if you've ever gotten anyone to execute range as a Warden, congrats) with Dive, the delay allows the target to heal, taking them out of execute range. Hearing that this skill sucks isn't something new to the devs, and I've been wondering why they have not addressed this problem yet. Adding Spell Damage on hit isn't going to work on a spammable that rarely hits or does any considerable amount of damage. Reduce the delay and make it instant cast. There's no reason for the bird to travel all the way across the map, yelling "here I come! You better dodge me!" I'm not sure why the animation was changed in the first place. The bird used to spawn on top of the target, now it spawn behind the caster. If you want counterplay, make it spawn on the target again. This skill is not powerful enough to have a delay or travel time. It's not Crystal Frag (RIP).

agreed. it feels awful to use because it's so slow. it's good that they reworked the functionality of cutting dive and removed the stupid range-based bonus from screaming cliff racer. but work still desperately needs to be done.

xDeusEJRx · July 2022

aurelius_fx wrote: »

i'd like to add Stone Fist and Swallow Soul to that list, most class specific ranged spammables feel really slow or bad for one reason or another - not to mention roll dodge just lasts super long and can completely negate 2-3 GCDs

the trade off isn't even that great considering how gap closers have the same range as ranged spammables, so unless you're on speed cap or have some disengage tool (cloak, streak) people are just gonna roll up to you and hit you with actually damaging skills

swallow soul is the best of the bunch honestly. It got a slight buff in last update to make it better and it can hit a decent amount if you have really high damage but the base damage might be a little too low for a decent spammable. I swear on my magblade I have really high damage and the consistency on the damage is all over the place. Sometimes I see consistent 4.5k non crits and then a random 2.5k and I have decent pen plus im using Elemental drain.

Think maybe a small base boost to swallow soul would make good

MEBengalsFan2001 · July 2022

aurelius_fx wrote: »

i'd like to add Stone Fist and Swallow Soul to that list, most class specific ranged spammables feel really slow or bad for one reason or another - not to mention roll dodge just lasts super long and can completely negate 2-3 GCDs

the trade off isn't even that great considering how gap closers have the same range as ranged spammables, so unless you're on speed cap or have some disengage tool (cloak, streak) people are just gonna roll up to you and hit you with actually damaging skills

All attacks players should be able to dodge, period. It would make PVP more about skill of the player than say using skills that causes unfair advantage.

As for the animation of dive, it does need to be revisited and tweaked. Same with Skull for the Necro and Dark Flare for the Templar. IMO skills should be channeling or instant, nothing really should have a cast time now. If something has a cast time and is being moved to instant, simply adjust the skill base damage to make up for the quicker cast of the skill.

Priyasekarssk · July 2022

Zos shouldn’t have nerfed dive. That’s the only range toolkit for warden. They nerfed everything in range except for Nightblades.