techprince wrote: »

Biro123 wrote: »

You're not expected to catch them. Sorc is the most mobile class, and its good that different classes have their thing. (That said, it has shorter range than real gap-closers, and ramping cost).
Sorc escaping also involves lightning form for major exped, dodging and sprinting. And that takes two slots an a reasonable stam investment. Its not just streak.

So with your logic, you arent suppose to kill DKs and Wardens as they are the most tankiest class. #faceplam

If you take the tankiest class, and also invest in tankiness, then no, not really, not to a single player. Otherwise, what's the point?

The limits on all these things are generally sustain.While they can sustain it, their strengths should actually be strengths. Its kind of a cornerstone of RPGs.

Metemsycosis wrote: »

streak is class defining and shouldn't be nerfed more than it has.

annoying skill for sure
but so is shade, mortal coil, arctic blast, elusive mist, breath of life, etc etc

Eta I also have found that a well timed immovable potion is a good counter to the sorc that streaks when you go in for a burst/killing combo

There have been plenty of class defining skills that got their functionality outright removed or changed drastically simply because they were outperforming. Why streak should be an exception?

techprince wrote: »

Biro123 wrote: »

techprince wrote: »

Biro123 wrote: »

You're not expected to catch them. Sorc is the most mobile class, and its good that different classes have their thing. (That said, it has shorter range than real gap-closers, and ramping cost).
Sorc escaping also involves lightning form for major exped, dodging and sprinting. And that takes two slots an a reasonable stam investment. Its not just streak.

So with your logic, you arent suppose to kill DKs and Wardens as they are the most tankiest class. #faceplam

If you take the tankiest class, and also invest in tankiness, then no, not really, not to a single player. Otherwise, what's the point?

The limits on all these things are generally sustain.While they can sustain it, their strengths should actually be strengths. Its kind of a cornerstone of RPGs.

"If" they invest in tankiness. Otherwise they die quickly. This isnt the case with sorcerers. You don't have to invest for streak specifically. 2 streaks and you are out of range of every gap closer out there. Is target blocking? Streak. Is target roll dodging? Streak. Is target chasing? Streak. Want to go out of range? Streak. Such an overloaded skill should not exist. This applies to cloak as well but cloak counters are getting buffed in next patch.

Except 2 streaks doesn't get you out of range of anyone with gap closers who uses them. It takes a combination of streaks plus dodge plus major exped plus recovery of both stats to sustain that until clear, plus survivability to live through the ranged damage you take while doing so (because you ain't shielding while spamming streak and lightning form), and cc-prevention pots/poisons.

That's a big build investment just to escape. And yes, I have ran Sorc builds without that investment.. Max mag pet builds with no Stam recovery, barely enough mag recovery to sustain without resto heavies, no lightning form due to bar space issues with pets, and that build very rarely escaped once in melee, even with streak. It hit really hard and had huge shields, but lost the usual Sorc mobility - even with streak slotted!

techprince wrote: »

MadeInVN wrote: »

https://youtu.be/eucU43CsXvk

This only happens when you specifically build for movement speed. He had Minor+Major expedition+ Medium Armor and mostly an orc for its movement speed passive. What does sorc has to build for? Even if someone uses gap closers, YOUR STREAK STUNS. This further proves how bs and overloaded streak is.

Doesn't prove anything, it is just your opinion on streak. I've been killed so many times while streaking away with range attacks, DOTs or gap closers.

Joy_Division wrote: »

techprince wrote: »

This only happens when you specifically build for movement speed. He had Minor+Major expedition+ Medium Armor and mostly an orc for its movement speed passive. What does sorc has to build for? Even if someone uses gap closers, YOUR STREAK STUNS. This further proves how bs and overloaded streak is.

Then stop asking ZOS to solve every build dilemma you have and build for speed if Sorcerers streaking away bothers you so much. With multiple ways to do so (unlike in the past), the only reason to be a slow plodder is because the player intentionally chooses that aspect of their build. Playing the slowest class in the game (Magpar), use Steed + Swift (and you can even throw on medium armor next patch) = dont care how many times they streak or stun me, just like in the video, a streaking / fleeing sorcerer will be caught if I choose to do so.

Streak has pretty much worked the same way since launch. On my slow magplar, which has most often been mid tier and lacked many of the movement options ZOS has since put in the game (one the very few changes they have made that have actually improved combat/the game), according to my kill counter which has only tracked some of my playtime, I have killed at least 22,042 sorcerers; the vast majority of these kills came when the class was either at or near top tier (when frags stunned, shields lasted 20 seconds, were immune to crits, etc.).

The video that is posted above is representative of what every player and class is easily capable of if they choose to do so.

Like everyone is an orc, runs medium armor and has Major+Minor expedition right? Oh lets run medium on mag classes as well. Stupid [snip]. That valides this point further that unless you build for it, you are not going to counter this overloaded one skill for all bs.

Again a Sorcerer doesn't have to build for streak. 90% of the time you will successfully burst and get away. And here you are comparing the remaining 10% and sayings sorcerer needs to specifically build for it and that's bs, everyone knows it. Sorc mains defend it the core.

[edited for profanity bypass]

techprince wrote: »

Viewsfrom6ix wrote: »

techprince wrote: »

MadeInVN wrote: »

https://youtu.be/eucU43CsXvk

This only happens when you specifically build for movement speed. He had Minor+Major expedition+ Medium Armor and mostly an orc for its movement speed passive. What does sorc has to build for? Even if someone uses gap closers, YOUR STREAK STUNS. This further proves how bs and overloaded streak is.

Doesn't prove anything, it is just your opinion on streak. I've been killed so many times while streaking away with range attacks, DOTs or gap closers.

Similarly, streak isnt overloaded is just your opinion because you are the one using it. Bias is everywhere.

I didn't claim anything to be factual. You're the one saying "this proves" and conjuring percentages outta nowhere, 90% this and 10% that.

Try playing a sorc and see how many times you die.

Marcus_Aurelius wrote: »

Viewsfrom6ix wrote: »

Is the skill OP because you can't catch a streaking sorc?

It is OP because it allows you to reset a fight you were going to lose.
In any other class you die, in a sorc you just streak away.

Ok, I hardly even play sorc but, from a small scale or 1v1 perspective:

Saying that the skill is OP because a sorc would lose the fight if they didn't use it is the same as saying
"<insert any other class here> would have lost the fight if they didn't use <insert strong generic/class defensive skill here>".
Which I find somewhat absurd. You always have to consider what defensive options your opponent has available.

Its like me complaining about an opponent blocking and burst healing after I hit them down to 5% health by saying its OP that they could heal because without blocking and healing they were going to lose.

In reality even with that situation I got them to 5% health doesn't mean simply they were "going to lose", because they have burst heal, which when used in the correct way can enable them to survive. Likewise getting a sorc close to death or into what looks to be a bad situation doesn't mean they are "going to lose" because they can streak and if they use it well and it doesn't get countered they can survive. Same thing.

I find the "they were going to lose" argument to be based on players feeling like they have won a fight before they actually have, and then getting frustrated when the opponent manages to survive and/or escape.
Which can be easily based on a misperception that the opponent is close to death when in actuality they might not really be.
Maybe it only looked like you were close to winning because the sorc has built their defence around using streak (ie: sustain and speed) instead of mitigation and healing, so its easy for their health to drop low but even when that happens are still quite capable at surviving, whereas another class that invests in HoTs and mitigation instead might be harder to get low, but easier to finish off once you do.
In my eyes, you are only entitled to feel like you have won the fight once the opponent is actually dead.

And on any other class you don't necessarily just die - you use the other defensive options you have available to survive. They may not work as well as streak in terms of surviving a particular situation, but there will always be some other situation where those other skills can work potentially in a different but more advantageous way.

Sure, streak is strong.
So are other classes defensive skills and/or passives.
Does streak enabled you do achieve something on sorc that you can't on other classes? Yes, but so do other classes have defensive skills that allow them to achieve things that sorc can't. Classes have different strengths and weaknesses. As they should.

Viewsfrom6ix wrote: »

techprince wrote: »

Viewsfrom6ix wrote: »

techprince wrote: »

Viewsfrom6ix wrote: »

techprince wrote: »

MadeInVN wrote: »

https://youtu.be/eucU43CsXvk

This only happens when you specifically build for movement speed. He had Minor+Major expedition+ Medium Armor and mostly an orc for its movement speed passive. What does sorc has to build for? Even if someone uses gap closers, YOUR STREAK STUNS. This further proves how bs and overloaded streak is.

Doesn't prove anything, it is just your opinion on streak. I've been killed so many times while streaking away with range attacks, DOTs or gap closers.

Similarly, streak isnt overloaded is just your opinion because you are the one using it. Bias is everywhere.

I didn't claim anything to be factual. You're the one saying "this proves" and conjuring percentages outta nowhere, 90% this and 10% that.

Try playing a sorc and see how many times you die.

I play pvp all day long. Know enough to spot overloaded abilities.

Maybe not enough to spot overloaded abilities in other classes. But that could be your bias like you claim we all have.

So balance them all, stop using "since other classes have overloaded abilities" as an excuse. Shows your bias towards the class you main.

PhoenixGrey wrote: »

techprince wrote: »

Viewsfrom6ix wrote: »

techprince wrote: »

Viewsfrom6ix wrote: »

techprince wrote: »

Viewsfrom6ix wrote: »

techprince wrote: »

MadeInVN wrote: »

https://youtu.be/eucU43CsXvk

This only happens when you specifically build for movement speed. He had Minor+Major expedition+ Medium Armor and mostly an orc for its movement speed passive. What does sorc has to build for? Even if someone uses gap closers, YOUR STREAK STUNS. This further proves how bs and overloaded streak is.

Doesn't prove anything, it is just your opinion on streak. I've been killed so many times while streaking away with range attacks, DOTs or gap closers.

Similarly, streak isnt overloaded is just your opinion because you are the one using it. Bias is everywhere.

I didn't claim anything to be factual. You're the one saying "this proves" and conjuring percentages outta nowhere, 90% this and 10% that.

Try playing a sorc and see how many times you die.

I play pvp all day long. Know enough to spot overloaded abilities.

Maybe not enough to spot overloaded abilities in other classes. But that could be your bias like you claim we all have.

So balance them all, stop using "since other classes have overloaded abilities" as an excuse. Shows your bias towards the class you main.

Why are overloaded abilities a bad thing ? And why will anyone play a class if it's not strong ?

Main reason ppl play warden and necro is they are overloaded and better than the rest. You really want their skills nerfed when players have paid $ for it ?

Buffing other classes and overloading their skills seems fair to me in order to compete with the dlc ones

Because thats not how "balance" works. You shouldn't give overloaded abilities to one class because other classes has them. Nobody should have all-in-one abilities.
ZOS has a history of balancing all in one abilities. Ex: Surprise Attack, Dizzying Swing, Soul Strike etc. Not our fault if their "vision" keep changing.

MadeInVN wrote: »

techprince wrote: »

MadeInVN wrote: »

https://youtu.be/eucU43CsXvk

This only happens when you specifically build for movement speed. He had Minor+Major expedition+ Medium Armor and mostly an orc for its movement speed passive. What does sorc has to build for? Even if someone uses gap closers, YOUR STREAK STUNS. This further proves how bs and overloaded streak is.

I was in 5 medium as an imperial. I also had major + minor expedition. I wasn't stunned, so the 10% extra movement speed didn't proc. My maximum speed before CP buffs were around 45% + 40% + 15% = 200%. If I was another class, I'd lose the 15% but can easily get it back with 2 swift.

I gave the magsorc a huge head start on the bridge, and still caught up to him after he used ball of lightning 3 times in a row. If I had a gap closer, he would have zero chance of escaping.

What? you mean a sorc that just slotted streak/bol without building for mobility can get caught and killed? Who knew?

ResidentContrarian wrote: »

I've never understood how streak gets more complaints and a lesser fanclub defending it than cloak.

Cloak is arguably superior in every way.

Cloak without shade is countered with direct AoE hits. You need movement speed or catch is pretty much guaranteed.

You are not stunned when enemy is escaping in shade, unlike streak.

Cloak is better as ganking tool, while streak is superior as escape tool and as combat tool.

Daffen wrote: »

Depends on the situation, like all things does. Streak is op against slow targets with no gap close, but useless against fast enemies with gap closers.

This is not true. Start the streak on opponent that can be stunned and do streak again in his stun GCD, you will be further than gapcloser range. If you also have good movement speed on top, there are literally 0 ways to stop this scenario. Same as there are 0 ways to stop meteor-streak.

It is uninteractive. Most people on the forums don't ask to remove stun, they ask to make it blockable. And it is crazy to think that sorcs will drop streak because it will be blockable. Like yeah lol sure. Players will hold block 100% of the time, right?