No Proc Sets is Awesome!!!

Parasaurolophus · February 2021

This test also exposed the problems of class balance, where if you are not a stamina warden / necromancer / dk, playing pvp is basically pointless.

Oreyn_Bearclaw · February 2021

Lag was great until about 6:30 Est. Then it was back with a vengeance. By 7 est, the lag was as bad as any point I have seen in the last year (PC/NA GrayHost). Also about the same time I started seeing specific ball groups. Prior to the ball groups showing up, there were some pretty massive battles with some pretty darn good performance. EP zerg was bigger than I have seen in months, and it worked just fine.

Hard to know how much we can take from this test. I certainly enjoy the playstyle better without they heavy armor proc meta, but I do miss the utility of some things like Ring of the Hunt for example. If they decide to remove damage proc sets from PVP, I am all for it, but the list of usable sets right now is going to need expanded pretty significantly.

I will also say it over and over, ZOS needs a basic science class. Why reintroduce cross healing for this test. I am not commenting on the merits of the change, simply on how they are controlling variables while testing. They need to strip combat down to its bare essentials, get a baseline, and slowly add things back one by one. That is how you test and control variables. To be candid, I think this test is pretty meaningless. Was the lag bad because cross healing was back or because proc sets have little effect on performance. We will never know.

mauerzahnb16_ESO · February 2021

tonight at prime time lag seemed even worse,... not fun at all...

Galarthor · February 2021

I agree. Non-Proc set pvp is so much more fun. But it would be nice if some of those sets we lost, especially the sustain / utility sets (not damage and healing) would get a rework or we reintroduced as new sets. For example: make Lich add a certain amount of Mag Regen as a flat stat. Great idea for future content

But don't bring back any proc sets. That would just open the flood gates.

Oreyn_Bearclaw wrote: »

I will also say it over and over, ZOS needs a basic science class. Why reintroduce cross healing for this test. I am not commenting on the merits of the change, simply on how they are controlling variables while testing. They need to strip combat down to its bare essentials, get a baseline, and slowly add things back one by one. That is how you test and control variables. To be candid, I think this test is pretty meaningless. Was the lag bad because cross healing was back or because proc sets have little effect on performance. We will never know.

Not if they do a ceteris paribus analysis where they keep everything the same and only change 1 variable at a time and then compare which change had the greatest impact.

I think what we need to see next is: No proc sets & no AoE spamming . B/c we all have the same experience. Performance without proc sets is actually rather good right up to the moment where the ball groups show up in Cyrodiil.

Oreyn_Bearclaw · February 2021

Galarthor wrote: »

I agree. Non-Proc set pvp is so much more fun. But it would be nice if some of those sets we lost, especially the sustain / utility sets (not damage and healing) would get a rework or we reintroduced as new sets. For example: make Lich add a certain amount of Mag Regen as a flat stat. Great idea for future content

But don't bring back any proc sets. That would just open the flood gates.

Oreyn_Bearclaw wrote: »

I will also say it over and over, ZOS needs a basic science class. Why reintroduce cross healing for this test. I am not commenting on the merits of the change, simply on how they are controlling variables while testing. They need to strip combat down to its bare essentials, get a baseline, and slowly add things back one by one. That is how you test and control variables. To be candid, I think this test is pretty meaningless. Was the lag bad because cross healing was back or because proc sets have little effect on performance. We will never know.

Not if they do a ceteris paribus analysis where they keep everything the same and only change 1 variable at a time and then compare which change had the greatest impact.

I think what we need to see next is: No proc sets & no AoE spamming . B/c we all have the same experience. Performance without proc sets is actually rather good right up to the moment where the ball groups show up in Cyrodiil.

The test I really want to see is delete purge. Probably the best way to remove ballgroups or at least curb them signficantly.

I would also be up for a test with no groups enabled, no cross healing, and no proc sets. Not because that is how I necessarily want to play, I just want to see what the performance is like. That is about as streamlined as you can get. I would say no CP as well, but since we have both campaigns, no reason to make it mandatory as part of the test. If this doesnt result in good performance, its probably safe to assume the game is unfixable, which would admittedly be nice to know.

Goregrinder · February 2021

exeeter702 wrote: »

Meh, cyrodil is still wack just on principle

You never played Dark Age of Camelot or Planetside 2 by chance have you?

Dr_Ganknstein · February 2021

It is nice to not have to fight against certain sets but it's also kinda boring. Part of the fun for me was build diversity. I'd like to see more sets added to the list like bone pirate, bright throat, NMA etc.

UntouchableHunter · February 2021

This is not true the game is even worst so lag and bugged

DirkRavenclaw · February 2021

I find Perfprmance has Improved slightly, dont know if the Test is the Factor here, Time will tell. Its the first Week of the Test but it feels soo much more like back in 2017/2018, only the Guards are stronger nowadays

Please offer a no-proc Campaign permanently

soniku4ikblis · February 2021

Nothing's changed. During peak hours the ping is the same. You can still play beautifully during late night, early morning, and mid day. lol

Vogtard · February 2021

Did you notice that PROC SETS is an anagram of PET SORCS?

Mojmir · February 2021

The lag and skills not firing is still an issue, ball groups are still a culprit

Ranger209 · February 2021

Vogtard wrote: »

Did you notice that PROC SETS is an anagram of PET SORCS?

Now that's funny!!

Galarthor · February 2021

Mojmir wrote: »

The lag and skills not firing is still an issue, ball groups are still a culprit

Yes they are. I'd even argue the main culprit.

However, proc sets seem to have their fair share of the blame. Plus they make PvP really dull and imbalanced.
You can definitely tell the difference b/c tanky builds are just that now and don't go around killing droves of people at the same time. That alone makes it worth removing proc sets from PvP.

exeeter702 · February 2021

Goregrinder wrote: »

exeeter702 wrote: »

Meh, cyrodil is still wack just on principle

You never played Dark Age of Camelot or Planetside 2 by chance have you?

Both actually. Religiously in fact. My opinion hasnt changed. I enjoyed that style of spectacle when I was younger. But nowdays, when it comes to pvp I appreciate more focused pvp endeavors. Not large scale nonsense where you feel like you are involved in something exciting amd epic but are extremely rarely afforded scenarios where individual performance carries actual weight.

Goregrinder · February 2021

exeeter702 wrote: »

Goregrinder wrote: »

exeeter702 wrote: »

Meh, cyrodil is still wack just on principle

You never played Dark Age of Camelot or Planetside 2 by chance have you?

Both actually. Religiously in fact. My opinion hasnt changed. I enjoyed that style of spectacle when I was younger. But nowdays, when it comes to pvp I appreciate more focused pvp endeavors. Not large scale nonsense where you feel like you are involved in something exciting amd epic but are extremely rarely afforded scenarios where individual performance carries actual weight.

Nice same here man, roaming in 8-mans on DAoC was so fun, even roaming overt in SWG always brought some kind of unforgettable player generated content. Planetside 2 blew my mind on what large scale combat could be, so naturally when ESO was teased with clips showing Cyrodiil combat, I blew my lid open and preordered the moment they let us preorder.

I still enjoy enjoy large scale combat, and will still log on Planetside 2 during prime time so I still find enjoyment out of Cyrodiil. But the good news is, ESO added a PVP mode more structured than Cyrodiil in the form of Battlegrounds...at least their version of it. So for people not a fan of large scale wars (ie: Troy, 300, Two Towers, insert large scale war movie here, etc), you have battlegrounds. Not quite WoW arena, but something closer to it than Cyrodiil.