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Kristofereso just spoke for this community. 100% agree with him. Has my support!
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Ragnaroek93✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭What killed the game for me was the combat direction. Cast time on ultimates destroyed combo based builds because you can't hit your ult reliably (outside of lag against good players) after a stun anymore. Defile was removed from everything except stamcro. All vanilla classes got crippled heavily while the two op classes (stamcro and stamden) are dominating all other classes for over a year now. Dots are in the bin and we have overtuned proc sets instead (just look at how pitiful poison injection is now for example). Cyro performance is just as bad as always.
I'm just tired tbh. Giving feedback in this game is like talking to a wall. They come up with a stupid idea like cast times on ultimates and regardless of how the community reacts to it (90% dislike it according to polls) they still have pushed that change to the live server.I used to think that PvP was a tragedy, but now I realize, it's a comedy.10 -
Firstmep✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭TheBonesXXX wrote: »TheBonesXXX wrote: »I'm here till alpha two of AoC starts, Steven Shariff is about to cast a massive beacon of light on the players and a massive shadow on devs who don't tell business executives to sit down and keep their mouth shut.
Are there devs who have successfully done this?
Yes, him. Because he 100% owns his studio. There are no investors and board of foolishness to answer too, just a man and a team of passionate people who can do whatever they want.
and he will never sell.
ESO has had six years and the writing on the wall was there since the day they scrapped the sub model in favour of a crownstore. They're broken most of their promises to the community in favour of turning profit, it's not an insult, just a fact of things.
As long as an MMO (or any company) has investors to answer too, it will always be profit over quality. The only thing I disagree with is Microsofts acquisition of Bethesda, because Microsoft will get a return on their investment or shut the entire thing down and kill off TES franchise all together.
ESO was never ready for release and it's the investors who set the release date. Cyrodiil has been a laggy mess since two months into release.
I dont blame him for losing optimism, I float in and out of ESO because all of the MMOs have their chains yanked by investors.
Yeah eso also wasnt crowd funded, like AoC, yes I know Shariff put his own money up as well, that's why they were selling cosmetic items for cash in the battle royal mode, that was supposed to be a combat test nothing else.
Money makes the world go around, let's not be stupid about this.2 -
techyeshic✭✭✭✭✭Performance he mentions; has not been as bad thus patch compared to earlier in the year. I popped on last night for the 3rd time in 3 weeks and found it ok. What was striking, and one if the reasons I dislike where we are at; was I saw zergs with nearly all if them procing Crimson. Many are truly awful but there are so many of them. It's just stupid.
And he is wrong on saying Microsoft got screwed. I don't think Microsoft cares about the quality the way people think they do. They want the IPs and Elder Scrolls, Doom, and Fallout are huge. I mean; look at how EA milks Star Wars and the NFL or FIFA.Edited by techyeshic on 14 December 2020 14:090 -
Doczy✭✭✭zos is dumb as blizzard. lost hundreds loyal players for few casuals.
and they lost profit. cuz casual dont buy eso+ and crowns.
blizzard tried it too few years ago . they removed skills for make the game for console. but now they bring them back.
cuz this kind of games not for casuals. you need to work and grind for items money skills. and a lot of practice for endgame PVE/PVP
casuals just playing few hours for nothing1 -
fred4✭✭✭✭✭
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This is often cited. I think it's true for some classes, such as magblade, where the delay of both Soul Harvest and Assassin's Will makes Fear ineffective. However what is IMO often overlooked is that ultimate -> Executioner is now a single GCD operation, due to the ult delay. This probably favors DK above all else, since the ult is targeted as well as being the CC. Dawnbreaker is where you maybe get problems already, because with speed (Wild Hunt) prevalent it becomes harder ensuring the target is still where you saw them when DB finally hits.Ragnaroek93 wrote: »Cast time on ultimates destroyed combo based builds because you can't hit your ult reliably (outside of lag against good players) after a stun anymore.
The justification for the ult delays was IMO pure nonsense all along. Players, especially new players, don't react better because of a 0.4s delay. They might escape (Dawnbreaker), because they're on the move anyway. I think a good player has a sense of their opponents rotation and they preemptively counter it, because they know from experience what's coming.
I would actually except (stam) DK from that. It's two DOTs are IMO working pretty well, when they're not purged. Not asking for buffs nor nerfs here. I merely think (stam) DK is in a decent spot these days, despite not being as tanky as it once was.Dots are in the bin
I would say it's worse than it's ever been. It used to be that, when Grey Host was three bars or lower, performance was OK. These days lag can hit you even when the campaign is half empty.Cyro performance is just as bad as always.Edited by fred4 on 14 December 2020 14:391 -
TheBonesXXX✭✭✭✭✭
✭This game does things right, but then what it goofs it goofs bad. Cyrodiiil has gotten a few additions but it's mostly set it and forget it.
Everyone thought that PvErs made the bulk of the playerbase and now you can see that's not accurate. PvPers are the bulk of MMOs and any MMO that doesn't take care of it's PvPers hurt significantly.
There's still time to fix the mess, the first time Cyrodiiil becomes playable people will trickle back in.
But there's a lot of broken trust. Who knows what will happen.1 -
fred4✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭
I actually do believe that.TheBonesXXX wrote: »Everyone thought that PvErs made the bulk of the playerbase...
Where do you get your information from?...and now you can see that's not accurate. PvPers are the bulk of MMOs and any MMO that doesn't take care of it's PvPers hurt significantly.0 -
HiImRex✭✭✭✭✭Literally everybody on Steam is playing Cyberpunk 2077 right now and prob will be for another week.
A large majority of MMO players are back on WoW for its latest expansion that just dropped.
It's literally the kind of week that only comes every 3-4 years in the gaming industry.
There is an entire world outside of ESO and people who either only play ESO or quit ESO.1 -
katorga✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Realistically, over the years I have watched the "forums" complain about every single meta. This is the second time around for the "proc meta".TheBonesXXX wrote: »This game does things right, but then what it goofs it goofs bad. Cyrodiiil has gotten a few additions but it's mostly set it and forget it.
Everyone thought that PvErs made the bulk of the playerbase and now you can see that's not accurate. PvPers are the bulk of MMOs and any MMO that doesn't take care of it's PvPers hurt significantly.
Unless it is a pvp-only game, pvp makes up a small fraction of the player base in most MMOs. It is true for ESO as well.
1. PVP zones are population capped at a fraction of the server population
2. Server resources are biased toward pve and have to re-allocated during pvp events to support higher population
3. And most telling, there are almost zero PVP oriented things for sale in the Crown store.0 -
Joy_Division✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Kristofereso has been one of ZOS's most consistent and enthusiastic content creators. When even he is expressing frustration, that's very revealing.Make Rush of Agony "Monsters only." People should not be consecutively crowd controlled in a PvP setting. Period.5 -
Waffennacht✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭I had left, but on Xbox, literally nothing else is even Fun for PvP.
I can see PC or even playstation players having other options; I dont know of any for xbox players1 -
TheBonesXXX✭✭✭✭✭
✭TheBonesXXX wrote: »TheBonesXXX wrote: »I'm here till alpha two of AoC starts, Steven Shariff is about to cast a massive beacon of light on the players and a massive shadow on devs who don't tell business executives to sit down and keep their mouth shut.
Are there devs who have successfully done this?
Yes, him. Because he 100% owns his studio. There are no investors and board of foolishness to answer too, just a man and a team of passionate people who can do whatever they want.
and he will never sell.
ESO has had six years and the writing on the wall was there since the day they scrapped the sub model in favour of a crownstore. They're broken most of their promises to the community in favour of turning profit, it's not an insult, just a fact of things.
As long as an MMO (or any company) has investors to answer too, it will always be profit over quality. The only thing I disagree with is Microsofts acquisition of Bethesda, because Microsoft will get a return on their investment or shut the entire thing down and kill off TES franchise all together.
ESO was never ready for release and it's the investors who set the release date. Cyrodiil has been a laggy mess since two months into release.
I dont blame him for losing optimism, I float in and out of ESO because all of the MMOs have their chains yanked by investors.
Yeah eso also wasnt crowd funded, like AoC, yes I know Shariff put his own money up as well, that's why they were selling cosmetic items for cash in the battle royal mode, that was supposed to be a combat test nothing else.
Money makes the world go around, let's not be stupid about this.
ESO had Bethesda and Zenimax to back it from the start, it had an established company in place with the resources already on hand for this project and they started it around Oblivion. Shariff's company is brand new and did not have all the resources in place, I've personally already bought my way into alpha 2, which is fine. I don't mind supplementing a games income where all it will require is a monthly subscription.
Those cosmetic items are supposed to be in the actual MMO.
Thats the difference, Shariff sets the pace, the devs here do not.0 -
Adenoma✭✭✭✭✭
✭What’s sad is the progressive loss of long time players to me. I used to have 10-15 friends online with whom I would actively small group. I don’t play a ton of other games and will likely keep playing through all this, but PvP and unpopular changes have constantly pushed through the PTS despite rabidly negative feedback. We all predicted that a proc meta would be unpopular and I’m disgusted that I get to tear through folks with 40k health and 24k stam in no-CP on my stamden. Now I can’t even find regular folks to run dungeons with or I duo/solo almost exclusively open world because all those devoted players have found the combat unrewarding and have pushed on to other games.
That’s the sad part - not even losing friends, just having them move on because of a negative trajectory of combat’s evolution. We all tolerated the bugs, the nerfs/buffs, and kept moving, but now we’re at a point that it doesn’t feel like we have a say in the game (and has for a while) and it doesn’t seem to be for anyone’s benefit - whether that’s the casual gamer or PvE.Adenoma-Badenoma-Sadenoma2 -
TheBonesXXX✭✭✭✭✭
✭Realistically, over the years I have watched the "forums" complain about every single meta. This is the second time around for the "proc meta".TheBonesXXX wrote: »This game does things right, but then what it goofs it goofs bad. Cyrodiiil has gotten a few additions but it's mostly set it and forget it.
Everyone thought that PvErs made the bulk of the playerbase and now you can see that's not accurate. PvPers are the bulk of MMOs and any MMO that doesn't take care of it's PvPers hurt significantly.
Unless it is a pvp-only game, pvp makes up a small fraction of the player base in most MMOs. It is true for ESO as well.
1. PVP zones are population capped at a fraction of the server population
2. Server resources are biased toward pve and have to re-allocated during pvp events to support higher population
3. And most telling, there are almost zero PVP oriented things for sale in the Crown store.
This game's PvP zone is capped for a fraction of the server population because it was too laggy, it was originally was set for thousands of players per campaign and it failed and it's been set it and forget it ever since. That's not really the same as what it was supposed to be, I dont really care that there isn't anything PvP related in the crown store because that'd be pay for an advantage and they already have a silly policy of "PvE" and "PvP" separate even though you have to PvE to get the best gear.
0 -
TheBonesXXX✭✭✭✭✭
✭
I actually do believe that.TheBonesXXX wrote: »Everyone thought that PvErs made the bulk of the playerbase...
Where do you get your information from?...and now you can see that's not accurate. PvPers are the bulk of MMOs and any MMO that doesn't take care of it's PvPers hurt significantly.
I don't, because I think a good chunk of the PvE players in this game particularly where PvPers trying to get their sets.
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