Maintenance for the week of September 22:
· [COMPLETE] NA megaservers for maintenance – September 22, 4:00AM EDT (8:00 UTC) - 10:00AM EDT (14:00 UTC)
· [COMPLETE] EU megaservers for maintenance – September 22, 8:00 UTC (4:00AM EDT) - 14:00 UTC (10:00AM EDT)
· [COMPLETE] NA megaservers for maintenance – September 22, 4:00AM EDT (8:00 UTC) - 10:00AM EDT (14:00 UTC)
· [COMPLETE] EU megaservers for maintenance – September 22, 8:00 UTC (4:00AM EDT) - 14:00 UTC (10:00AM EDT)
The maintenance is complete, and the PTS is now back online and patch 11.2.1 is available.
Vigor 5.1.4: why?
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Durham✭✭✭✭✭
✭Yea with dot damage getting a big buff, vigor was over nerfed imo. I would rather them go after the major mending of a DK then go after vigor.
Tool tips will min max procs with major and minor brutality, plus major mending, plus outside a keep, and the 12% Dk passive healing healing. Tool tips were comming from these guys.
Other Stam class excluding the DK and Stamden are really hurt by this.Edited by Durham on 6 August 2019 14:52PVP DEADWAIT
PVP The Unguildables3 -
evoniee✭✭✭✭so resolving vigor not even get any advantage than live version, it straight remove its area heal and 1 tick6 -
Kova✭✭✭✭✭Get enough magicka players to *** on the forums and this is the result you get. Meanwhile they still have higher tooltips with mutagen, a buff to all shields, and most single target DoTs are MAGICKA. Good luck trying to get an actual intelligent answer.
edit: I stand corrected with emphasis on "most". It's fairly balanced with single target DoTs
Username checks out.
EP Sorc: Aydinn
AD Stamplar: Verdant`Knight
DC Stamblade: Apple`Punch
EP Stam Sorc: Kós
AD DragonKnight: Transmigrant
EP NIghtblade: Aydinn3 -
Delparis✭✭✭✭✭7% more per tick, costs 17% less and lost the AOE heal. 100% less fun. I really enjoyed being able to heal other people in PvP on my stamblade when needed.
I don't like stam build running around healing others, that's the Heal job not some trash fighter in plate armor with great sword. Fighting a full stamina group stacking heals with vigor make them impossible to kill.
Vigor was always overperforming, that's why heals are not needed anymore in dungeon and even in trials.
And Guess what? all this *** is because one single content (Maelstrom Arena). If there was no single player hard mode content there was no reason to give stamina build a heal. an we would see more clearely in all this mess.
Donno where i saw that Matt Firor said that ESO wasn't an mmorpg. now i understand what he means.1 -
SodanTok✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭7% more per tick, costs 17% less and lost the AOE heal. 100% less fun. I really enjoyed being able to heal other people in PvP on my stamblade when needed.
I don't like stam build running around healing others, that's the Heal job not some trash fighter in plate armor with great sword. Fighting a full stamina group stacking heals with vigor make them impossible to kill.
Vigor was always overperforming, that's why heals are not needed anymore in dungeon and even in trials.
And Guess what? all this *** is because one single content (Maelstrom Arena). If there was no single player hard mode content there was no reason to give stamina build a heal. an we would see more clearely in all this mess.
Donno where i saw that Matt Firor said that ESO wasn't an mmorpg. now i understand what he means.
So much wrong in this, like usually
8 -
Kadoin✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Yea with dot damage getting a big buff, vigor was over nerfed imo. I would rather them go after the major mending of a DK then go after vigor.
Tool tips will min max procs with major and minor brutality, plus major mending, plus outside a keep, and the 12% Dk passive healing healing. Tool tips were comming from these guys.
Other Stam class excluding the DK and Stamden are really hurt by this.
ZOS has a strange perception of balance where, instead of nerfing the passives and/or skill of a single class, they make everyone suffer . The healing changes across the board are even better for any class without a %HP heal (the thing ZOS should have also went after, but did not address with the healing changes.) Glad to see they keep nerfing heals that actually require an investment though!1 -
Sun7dance✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭7% more per tick, costs 17% less and lost the AOE heal. 100% less fun. I really enjoyed being able to heal other people in PvP on my stamblade when needed.
I don't like stam build running around healing others, that's the Heal job not some trash fighter in plate armor with great sword. Fighting a full stamina group stacking heals with vigor make them impossible to kill.
Vigor was always overperforming, that's why heals are not needed anymore in dungeon and even in trials.
And Guess what? all this *** is because one single content (Maelstrom Arena). If there was no single player hard mode content there was no reason to give stamina build a heal. an we would see more clearely in all this mess.
Donno where i saw that Matt Firor said that ESO wasn't an mmorpg. now i understand what he means.
Wow....I'm trying to write something....but i can't.....because.....just.....wow!
PS5|EU0 -
Emma_Overload✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Stamina players are so SPOILED.
If ZOS had "nerfed" Conjured Ward by knocking one measly second off of the duration and reducing the cost by 500 magicka, Sorcerers would be CELEBRATING this so-called nerf! Instead, they made the shield 9% smaller and added 600 magicka to the cost... now THAT is a nerf.
You guys have been coddled and pandered to by ZOS for so long, you don't even know what a real nerf is.#CAREBEARMASTERRACE7 -
Nerftheforums✭✭✭✭✭
✭Emma_Overload wrote: »Stamina players are so SPOILED.
If ZOS had "nerfed" Conjured Ward by knocking one measly second off of the duration and reducing the cost by 500 magicka, Sorcerers would be CELEBRATING this so-called nerf! Instead, they made the shield 9% smaller and added 600 magicka to the cost... now THAT is a nerf.
You guys have been coddled and pandered to by ZOS for so long, you don't even know what a real nerf is.
Imagine being so ignorant about the game to compare hots to shields, but still having the guts to show this ignorance to a whole pts forum. Grats, you got second place at the pug of the day challenge pepehypeEdited by Nerftheforums on 6 August 2019 17:2818 -
Insco851✭✭✭✭✭
✭Nerftheforums wrote: »Emma_Overload wrote: »Stamina players are so SPOILED.
If ZOS had "nerfed" Conjured Ward by knocking one measly second off of the duration and reducing the cost by 500 magicka, Sorcerers would be CELEBRATING this so-called nerf! Instead, they made the shield 9% smaller and added 600 magicka to the cost... now THAT is a nerf.
You guys have been coddled and pandered to by ZOS for so long, you don't even know what a real nerf is.
Imagine being so ignorant about the game to compare hots to shields, but still having the guts to show this ignorance to a whole pts forum. Grats, you got second place at the pug of the day challenge pepehype
When they arnt stacked (and there’s foreseeable issues with that next patch) they basically are a hot if precast like a stam toon would vigor. Offensive window.
The flexibility is they can ALSO be a pseudo burst heal for classes that lack one... magblade for instance.Edited by Insco851 on 6 August 2019 17:501 -
Sharee✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Emma_Overload wrote: »Stamina players are so SPOILED.
Word.
I was playing a stamina nightblade at release. No vigor at all, no stamina morphs of class skills... fun times 2 -
Hexquisite✭✭✭✭You can blame the same 3 to 4 tool tip warriors that were showing up on every healing thread, be it stam or magic, and hijacked every thread with how healing,--ALL healing needs to be nerfed-praphrased.
PC NA~Ethereal Traders Union~~Spicy Economics~~Tropic Thunder~~Us Ghosts~0 -
thankyourat✭✭✭✭✭
✭Hexquisite wrote: »You can blame the same 3 to 4 tool tip warriors that were showing up on every healing thread, be it stam or magic, and hijacked every thread with how healing,--ALL healing needs to be nerfed-praphrased.
Those were all from min/max builds and nothing that’s uncommon for you to encounter in wayrest or Cyrodiil. They were basically showing you what kind of stats the players running the strongest builds would have. So overall there was nothing wrong with them showing the strengths of some of the buffed skills.2 -
jaysins✭✭✭thankyourat wrote: »Hexquisite wrote: »You can blame the same 3 to 4 tool tip warriors that were showing up on every healing thread, be it stam or magic, and hijacked every thread with how healing,--ALL healing needs to be nerfed-praphrased.
Those were all from min/max builds and nothing that’s uncommon for you to encounter in wayrest or Cyrodiil. They were basically showing you what kind of stats the players running the strongest builds would have. So overall there was nothing wrong with them showing the strengths of some of the buffed skills.
The screenshots showed issues with certain items and major buffs and were not indicative of something being wrong with vigor. Major mending and vitality are ridiculously strong and if you're a DK in heavy you can get mending as it's in your toolkit, major vitality through pots, have 12% increase to healing taken, likely CP that may have been unrealistically optimized towards healing, heavy armor gives 8%, along with undisclosed sets and possibly standing next to a keep for 20% additional healing.
On a stam sorc running a running hulking, seventh legion and bloodspawn I was getting around 24k tooltip on PTS prior to 5.1.4. That's a huge difference. If you want to make the argument that major vitality and/or mending are overperforming, I'm all ears as I think that is a worthwhile conversation. But on my class those numbers are not even close to realistic, even using vitality pots (which I think are pretty cheesy). The modifiers that create these insane tooltips need to be dealt with first as they gimp classes that do not have access to them and then afterwards we can start looking at the skills themselves.Jaisins -AD Stamsorc. Can't outrun an orc sorc
Bearingitall -EP Warden. Lions and tigers and especially Bears oh my1 -
Davadin✭✭✭✭✭
✭Yea with dot damage getting a big buff, vigor was over nerfed imo. I would rather them go after the major mending of a DK then go after vigor.
August Palatine Davadin Bloodstrake - Nord Dragon Knight - PC NA - Gray Host
Greymoor 6.0.7 PvP : Medium 2H/SnB The Destroyer
Dragonhold 5.2.11 PvE : Medium DW/2H The Blood Furnace
March 2021 (too lazy to add CP) PvP: Medium DW/Bow The Stabber0 -
thankyourat✭✭✭✭✭
✭thankyourat wrote: »Hexquisite wrote: »You can blame the same 3 to 4 tool tip warriors that were showing up on every healing thread, be it stam or magic, and hijacked every thread with how healing,--ALL healing needs to be nerfed-praphrased.
Those were all from min/max builds and nothing that’s uncommon for you to encounter in wayrest or Cyrodiil. They were basically showing you what kind of stats the players running the strongest builds would have. So overall there was nothing wrong with them showing the strengths of some of the buffed skills.
The screenshots showed issues with certain items and major buffs and were not indicative of something being wrong with vigor. Major mending and vitality are ridiculously strong and if you're a DK in heavy you can get mending as it's in your toolkit, major vitality through pots, have 12% increase to healing taken, likely CP that may have been unrealistically optimized towards healing, heavy armor gives 8%, along with undisclosed sets and possibly standing next to a keep for 20% additional healing.
On a stam sorc running a running hulking, seventh legion and bloodspawn I was getting around 24k tooltip on PTS prior to 5.1.4. That's a huge difference. If you want to make the argument that major vitality and/or mending are overperforming, I'm all ears as I think that is a worthwhile conversation. But on my class those numbers are not even close to realistic, even using vitality pots (which I think are pretty cheesy). The modifiers that create these insane tooltips need to be dealt with first as they gimp classes that do not have access to them and then afterwards we can start looking at the skills themselves.
There were some stam DKs without vitality pots or alliance support passives that were still getting well over 5k tics. You could get your tooltip much higher as well if you built for more weapon damage. I would much rather see stam sorc receive some sort of survivability buffs from their class than I would like to see stam dk be nerfed. This would allow more build diversity as well. The only thing that would be accomplished by nerfing stam dk healing passives is that it would now be a bad class and stam sorc would still be gimped as well while using a somewhat op ability as a bandage.1 -
Witar✭✭✭✭✭Since all stamina players were super ok with magicka nerfs i'm not sympathetic. Even a bit. Suffer like we suffered.It cannot be seen, cannot be felt,
Cannot be heard, cannot be smelt,
It lies behind stars and under hills,
And empty holes it fills,
It comes first and follows after,
Ends life, kills laughter.6 -
jaysins✭✭✭thankyourat wrote: »thankyourat wrote: »Hexquisite wrote: »You can blame the same 3 to 4 tool tip warriors that were showing up on every healing thread, be it stam or magic, and hijacked every thread with how healing,--ALL healing needs to be nerfed-praphrased.
Those were all from min/max builds and nothing that’s uncommon for you to encounter in wayrest or Cyrodiil. They were basically showing you what kind of stats the players running the strongest builds would have. So overall there was nothing wrong with them showing the strengths of some of the buffed skills.
The screenshots showed issues with certain items and major buffs and were not indicative of something being wrong with vigor. Major mending and vitality are ridiculously strong and if you're a DK in heavy you can get mending as it's in your toolkit, major vitality through pots, have 12% increase to healing taken, likely CP that may have been unrealistically optimized towards healing, heavy armor gives 8%, along with undisclosed sets and possibly standing next to a keep for 20% additional healing.
On a stam sorc running a running hulking, seventh legion and bloodspawn I was getting around 24k tooltip on PTS prior to 5.1.4. That's a huge difference. If you want to make the argument that major vitality and/or mending are overperforming, I'm all ears as I think that is a worthwhile conversation. But on my class those numbers are not even close to realistic, even using vitality pots (which I think are pretty cheesy). The modifiers that create these insane tooltips need to be dealt with first as they gimp classes that do not have access to them and then afterwards we can start looking at the skills themselves.
There were some stam DKs without vitality pots or alliance support passives that were still getting well over 5k tics. You could get your tooltip much higher as well if you built for more weapon damage. I would much rather see stam sorc receive some sort of survivability buffs from their class than I would like to see stam dk be nerfed. This would allow more build diversity as well. The only thing that would be accomplished by nerfing stam dk healing passives is that it would now be a bad class and stam sorc would still be gimped as well while using a somewhat op ability as a bandage.
A 5k tick, if not a crit in cryodiil, would require a 50k tooltip which is impossible with major mending and vitality. I had 4.6k weapon damage and 41k stam are pretty healthy stats as sacrificing some weapon damage for stam in a 5-1-1 setup with bound armaments yields similar results to having high weapon damage. Being able to stack 25% and 30% additional healing makes it almost impossible to balance properly. I think better changes would be to bring those figures down to 10% to 15%. A DK running vitality pots in heavy has 75% additional healing. Many of the "major" modifiers are too much imo and need to be toned down. Stam sorc will fair better than most stam classes because of how crit surge is now scaling off of weapon crit but it makes it very difficult to run medium with the additional dot changes for the upcoming patch.
I do agree with you in that I hope they find ways to increase build diversity and add additional tools to all the stam classes toolkits to make us not so heavily reliant on skills outside of our class. I just think with the major buffs it makes it very hard to do.Edited by jaysins on 6 August 2019 20:23Jaisins -AD Stamsorc. Can't outrun an orc sorc
Bearingitall -EP Warden. Lions and tigers and especially Bears oh my0 -
pieratsos✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭7% more per tick, costs 17% less and lost the AOE heal. 100% less fun. I really enjoyed being able to heal other people in PvP on my stamblade when needed.
I don't like stam build running around healing others, that's the Heal job not some trash fighter in plate armor with great sword. Fighting a full stamina group stacking heals with vigor make them impossible to kill.
Vigor was always overperforming, that's why heals are not needed anymore in dungeon and even in trials.
And Guess what? all this *** is because one single content (Maelstrom Arena). If there was no single player hard mode content there was no reason to give stamina build a heal. an we would see more clearely in all this mess.
Donno where i saw that Matt Firor said that ESO wasn't an mmorpg. now i understand what he means.
Seriously ive never seen anyone become a meme in the forums as fast as you did. Literally every single post you make is pure comedy11 -
BaiterOfZergs✭✭✭✭✭Emma_Overload wrote: »Stamina players are so SPOILED.
If ZOS had "nerfed" Conjured Ward by knocking one measly second off of the duration and reducing the cost by 500 magicka, Sorcerers would be CELEBRATING this so-called nerf! Instead, they made the shield 9% smaller and added 600 magicka to the cost... now THAT is a nerf.
You guys have been coddled and pandered to by ZOS for so long, you don't even know what a real nerf is.
You’re the first person to defend any type of magic nerf , even when it’s reasonable. I don’t get why you’re so adamant about creating a stam vs magic debate. That’s the the problem now with feedback in this game. Too many people favor a particular spec or class and their feedback reflects that.
Zerg of House Smallscale, First of his name, wielder of Volendrung, battleground hero, Cyrodiil butcher, the swifft footed, OG of the Templars and first pvpers, defender of scrolls and baiter of zergs.7 -
Austinseph1✭✭✭✭✭This is what happens when you try to balance for 2 modes that are incompatible. One side will always be on the losing end. PvP may be the most vocal but PvE is the largest community. If you try to mix the balance one side will lose out.1 -
Insco851✭✭✭✭✭
✭BaiterOfZergs wrote: »Emma_Overload wrote: »Stamina players are so SPOILED.
If ZOS had "nerfed" Conjured Ward by knocking one measly second off of the duration and reducing the cost by 500 magicka, Sorcerers would be CELEBRATING this so-called nerf! Instead, they made the shield 9% smaller and added 600 magicka to the cost... now THAT is a nerf.
You guys have been coddled and pandered to by ZOS for so long, you don't even know what a real nerf is.
You’re the first person to defend any type of magic nerf , even when it’s reasonable. I don’t get why you’re so adamant about creating a stam vs magic debate. That’s the the problem now with feedback in this game. Too many people favor a particular spec or class and their feedback reflects that.
At least she stays on brand.0 -
YoshinJaa✭✭✭Has anyone tested if Vigor (or Echoing) stacks with multiple users using it at once?0 -
PhoenixGrey✭✭✭✭✭
✭
So increased shield size, less overall stamina damage, bleeds respecting resists now so you cant complain about those eating your shields alive. I will gladly duel any of you on pts for those who think "i dont know what I'm talking about".
That's your problem right there. Dont you realize this is exactly what got vigor and healing ward nerfed in the first place. ?
Tooltips from illogical dueling builds which will never work in open world pvp or no cp bgs
Please evaluate balance based on pvp content where the maximum player base engage in and not duelsEdited by PhoenixGrey on 7 August 2019 00:541 -
Pelican✭✭✭✭✭Emma_Overload wrote: »Stamina players are so SPOILED.
If ZOS had "nerfed" Conjured Ward by knocking one measly second off of the duration and reducing the cost by 500 magicka, Sorcerers would be CELEBRATING this so-called nerf! Instead, they made the shield 9% smaller and added 600 magicka to the cost... now THAT is a nerf.
You guys have been coddled and pandered to by ZOS for so long, you don't even know what a real nerf is.
You realise removing one second from hard ward still means it has the same size but removing 1 second from vigor while keeping the heal per tick the same means 20% less total healing? The more accurate way to say it is "knocking one measly second off the duration AND reducing the size by 16.7% while reducing the cost by 500 magicka." I don't think any sorc will celebrate that.Edited by Pelican on 8 August 2019 07:26PC NA - EP Solo PvP Player
https://www.youtube.com/c/pelicaneso4 -
Jagdkommando✭✭✭✭Nerftheforums wrote: »You took a skill that was performing decently, buffed it to narnia together with too many single target dots and then nerfed it up to a point where it's basically performing just as before if not worse (20% duration nerf is kinda big ngl). Why? Is there a plan or an idea behind this? Asking for a friend since you basically went from aoe to single target to aoe with less duration.
Kinda speechless somehow, despite seeing this stuff going on for years now.
Oh mate...... just *** zos and close the question, its impossible to tell what are they doing to this game, buffing and nerfing, nerfing and buffing, increasing, decreasing, changing everything and after rolling back, refactoring established things, and again messing up....
The worst is not the vigor changes, i read in the 5.1.4 that they changed another Dromatra destroyer achievement not to be the same from MOL....
WHAT?!?!?!?!? WHAAAAAAAAAAAT??????
Are you serious?? They dont even know their own game achievements!!!!!! Holy ***...
I cant understand this, just wake up any eso player and ask what is dromatra destroyer achievement and everybody will tell you at 5:00am half slept...
wtf is that...1 -
Nerftheforums✭✭✭✭✭
✭Jagdkommando wrote: »Nerftheforums wrote: »You took a skill that was performing decently, buffed it to narnia together with too many single target dots and then nerfed it up to a point where it's basically performing just as before if not worse (20% duration nerf is kinda big ngl). Why? Is there a plan or an idea behind this? Asking for a friend since you basically went from aoe to single target to aoe with less duration.
Kinda speechless somehow, despite seeing this stuff going on for years now.
Oh mate...... just *** zos and close the question, its impossible to tell what are they doing to this game, buffing and nerfing, nerfing and buffing, increasing, decreasing, changing everything and after rolling back, refactoring established things, and again messing up....
The worst is not the vigor changes, i read in the 5.1.4 that they changed another Dromatra destroyer achievement not to be the same from MOL....
WHAT?!?!?!?!? WHAAAAAAAAAAAT??????
Are you serious?? They dont even know their own game achievements!!!!!! Holy ***...
I cant understand this, just wake up any eso player and ask what is dromatra destroyer achievement and everybody will tell you at 5:00am half slept...
wtf is that...
Soooo true. Seems like devs from another game are taking decisions for this ones. Instead of being the experts leading the eso experience, they are the noobs that have to be taken by hand and shown the way. Embarrassing.2 -
Nerftheforums✭✭✭✭✭
✭Emma_Overload wrote: »Stamina players are so SPOILED.
If ZOS had "nerfed" Conjured Ward by knocking one measly second off of the duration and reducing the cost by 500 magicka, Sorcerers would be CELEBRATING this so-called nerf! Instead, they made the shield 9% smaller and added 600 magicka to the cost... now THAT is a nerf.
You guys have been coddled and pandered to by ZOS for so long, you don't even know what a real nerf is.
You realise removing one second from hard ward still means it has the same size but removing 1 second from vigor while keeping the heal per tick the same means 20% less total healing? The more accurate way to say it is "knocking one measly second off the duration AND reducing the size by 16.7% while reducing the cost by 500 magicka." I don't think any sorc will celebrate that.
As if that person would even care to understand how flawed her opinion is. She's been preaching stam op, sorc bad no matter what for years now2