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Slayer of ESO's Economy - We need you ZOS!
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xenowarrior92eb17_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭LoL man i had the same reaction 1 year ago when this addon appeared...HOWEVER i got chilled when i installed it to realize that nobody uses it...literally.0 -
Vahrokh✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭
On the other hand, this addon you’re talking about just makes it so people don’t have to clutter zone chat with “WTS” messages. It just takes that process and gives it a convenient UI.
I don’t see what’s so wrong about that.
It exploits weak points of the game to destroy guild traders.
Not really. People who sell in chat can accomplish the same thing. Most do it using mail and the CoD functionality.
It seems to me like this addon works using a built in game system and layering a new UI on top of it. It’s not like it stores the items for players. They still have to carry the items until they’re sold.
So, when I write in zone chat in Craglorn WTS <x> somebody from Stonefalls can see it?
That does make the addon more appealing, now that you mention it.
TTC does the same thing, too.
What else does this thing do?
It shows where do you need to travel to get that item, it's not given to you wherever you are.
Fast travel. It’s a pretty quick process.
But then you can sell this item to guild store in better place for bigger price, and global auction house decreases prices in all zones at the same time breaking this important aspect of trading.
Same thing with TTC and MM. You can purchase items low and resell them high. You can also see what price others are selling at, and undercut them.
It’s called “playing the auction house”. It’s something that happens in every multiplayer game with an economy. It’s actually a pretty popular activity. Kind of like playing the stock market...which actually sounds really boring.
Either way, I’m not seeing the difference, here.
One makes global changes that remove much of this aspect, and the second one only regional that enchance it.
But TTC and MM are not regional. They are very global. Fast travel is also global.
MM is local, TTC is global
MM became global as soon as TTC got popular. People price things based on TTC, MM records those sales, and the two sync up.
They go hand in hand. The economy in ESO is a global economy thanks to these addons.
This new addon will fall right in line with TTC and MM.
It isn't global economy, every zone has other prices. MM only shows your guilds.
No they don’t. Different prices exist because of the prevailing price at the time an item was posted or a lack of using TTC. The prices are not based on zone, though.
Different zones in ESO do not have different levels of supply and demand because market conditions are the same throughout all the zones. Due largely to the fact that players can just fast travel everywhere.
You seem to be one of the few with a clue about how markets work.
Anyone who moves 100-200k+ a week worth of items knows power-traders are heavily arbitraging the guild traders across the whole game.
A simple, recent example: Camoran Dubious Throne recipe: when the event ended, me and a thousand other guys went to "relist" hundreds of those recipes on every guild trader in game to 89,999 / 90k. This happened in about 3 hours.
This means, markets information is being "leaked" on common prices facilities (like a global auction house would do) and this creates arbitrage. Arbitrage leads to prices correlation (across regions), realigment and optimization: other typical effects of global markets.Vaerah, Dark Elf Magicka Sorceress
Trials addict, soloer extraordinaire!
Here are my Elder Scrolls Online videos
Here is the Sorcerer Helper addon I have updated to work on current ESO2 -
Aesthier✭✭✭✭✭Nice Advertisement!
Well Played Radinyn!
10/10 because no one noticed but all swallowed.0 -
FakeFox✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭What is ZOS supposed to do? Sure, they can ban the addon, but they can't do anything about the website. So they could just make it browserbased.Edited by FakeFox on 5 April 2018 07:54EU/PC (GER) - Healermain since 2014 - 50305 Achievement Points - Youtube (PvE Healing Guides, Builds & Gameplay)1 -
wolfie1.0.✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Overall I am not necessarily opposed to this. COD fees DO scale in relation to the cost of items, and after a certain price range it can really add up. What really concerns me though is the so called Protection Clauses. Is it not considered a violation of the Code of Conduct to ban players from using your add-on?
Also wasn't there a similar add-on a year or 2 ago that was banned because it tried to do this same thing?
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Turelus✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭
I won't be using it. There is a difference between trusting a 3rd party add-on and trusting a 3rd party add-on which requires additional .exe files to run.
Yes I know the add-on is safe and there are no security issues, but I've seen enough good people turn bad in online gaming when the chance for money is given.
@Turelus - EU PC Megaserver
"Don't count on others for help. In the end each of us is in this alone. The survivors are those who know how to look out for themselves."0 -
wolfie1.0.✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭What is ZOS supposed to do? Sure, they can ban the addon, but they can't do anything about the website. So they could just make it browserbased.
What ZOS can do is lock down the portions of the API that interface with this Add-on. Granted that wont stop a website form popping up and sending trades and such, but I be the major appeal here is the in game UI features. if ZOS blocks that the ultility is pretty much gone.0 -
Xeven✭✭✭✭✭
✭http://www.esoui.com/downloads/info1768-NirnAuctionHouse.html
https://nirnah.com/
This addon, just adds global auction house, and it's very bad for the guild traders. People just have to pay for the C.O.D and it isn't even comparable amount! ZOS you need to disallow this addon before it will break the economy completly. I know I will face a lot of hate from whole "Global Auction House" group, however if you, ZOS, don't implement that system, why should it be allowed?
This guy. Sites like this exist for every single MMO and its actually *** great for the economy.2 -
Voxicity✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Just downloaded it. Way too clunky and buggy and so much effort
Uninstalled right away, not for me0 -
srfrogg23✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭
On the other hand, this addon you’re talking about just makes it so people don’t have to clutter zone chat with “WTS” messages. It just takes that process and gives it a convenient UI.
I don’t see what’s so wrong about that.
It exploits weak points of the game to destroy guild traders.
Not really. People who sell in chat can accomplish the same thing. Most do it using mail and the CoD functionality.
It seems to me like this addon works using a built in game system and layering a new UI on top of it. It’s not like it stores the items for players. They still have to carry the items until they’re sold.
So, when I write in zone chat in Craglorn WTS <x> somebody from Stonefalls can see it?
That does make the addon more appealing, now that you mention it.
TTC does the same thing, too.
What else does this thing do?
It shows where do you need to travel to get that item, it's not given to you wherever you are.
Fast travel. It’s a pretty quick process.
But then you can sell this item to guild store in better place for bigger price, and global auction house decreases prices in all zones at the same time breaking this important aspect of trading.
Same thing with TTC and MM. You can purchase items low and resell them high. You can also see what price others are selling at, and undercut them.
It’s called “playing the auction house”. It’s something that happens in every multiplayer game with an economy. It’s actually a pretty popular activity. Kind of like playing the stock market...which actually sounds really boring.
Either way, I’m not seeing the difference, here.
The (very obvious) difference is that one person cannot manipulate prices server-wide without putting in a huge amount of effort due to the distributed nature of the guild trader system. This keeps prices low. Consolidate everything on a global auction house and one whale can easily manipulate the market with a few clicks, but with guild traders, that person would have to go to every or nearly every trader.
It’s never just one person in other games, either. Just like in ESO, the people that are playing the auction house are constantly competing with each other and anyone else who puts new items up for sale. That’s why prices end up going lower and lower.
The strawman argument that “just one person can manipulate...” gets even more ludicrous when you try to say that they’re manipulating the market just to keep prices low.
Do you realize that people would have buy high and sell low to do that? That they would be intentionally losing money just to lower the prices? That doesn’t even make sense.
The only difference between a global AH and the guild traders is the level of transparency, ease of access, and self reliance. At this point, that’s it.Edited by srfrogg23 on 5 April 2018 11:063 -
srfrogg23✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭now just curious how many people will use it with hope it will be many to show ZOS their guild traders system isnt to good...atleast until they wil maybe add npc in game to search items from every guild trader where to go instead of wasting time running on every zone just to get info there is no any item which you want to buy or to get this items after many zones...
Still based on the other topic ~~60+ % of game's population is against global auction house.
from where you get 60% of this gam population is against global auction? dont say its from forum pools where less than 1k different players even writing something on forum xD
and I dont see any chance as more than 50%+ players will be against global auction as this game is more casual friendly and global AH would be more casual friendy where you need to have active sales to not be kicked from guild and of there are zones with the best prices for selling where you to get and be in those guilds you really need to have good sales and we have other worse zones where you need to wait or many many more time longer to sold this one item which could be sold in same day in good zone or need to drastically lower price to have sure you will sell this item before price will drop more with this time
while in global AH you dont need any special guild to even list your items for sale and everyone have flat chance to sell same item for similiar price without being additional disadvantaged because of bad location of your guild trader
In game literally everyone I meet is against auction house except some of the min/max players. Guild Trader's are more realstic to the medival/fantasy way of trading than global auction house.
Then TTC and MM should probably be banned, along with all other trade addons.
You can’t get the true medieval trader experience by looking up the prices on a website or addon. The internet didn’t exist back then.
Why in the XXI century do we still say "prices are posted"? Because since the old ages, commodity merchants did not go to every single producer to ask prices. Common prices were... posted, especially for common goods like ale and foods.
In the ancient Rome we had tablets illustrating the fixed prices to apply to some activities (including gladiators owners wages).
Yes, they would, for the local area. Rome wasn’t comparing their prices to Egypt’s, though. In the real world, fast travel didn’t exist. The internet did not exist. And, different regions had a different production of goods due to access to materials, agricultural conditions, and geography.
Heck, they had a hard time comparing prices to a town 10 miles away because that was a full day of travel on horse-back - if you were lucky enough to own a healthy horse.
Trust me. No one wants the true “medieval trading experience”. It sucked.2 -
Stewart1874✭✭✭✭✭Guild traders make for a uniquely awful, awful experience. There is zero continuity in pricing which leads to folk on either end of the spectrum being brutally ripped off. You can make easy money taking advantage of people who don't know the 'correct' value of items either by buying items that are woefully under priced, e.g. a couple days back I bought a Plague Doctor impenetrable girdle for 1k and sold it for 11k and conversely I can't afford to purchase an ancient orc shields motif page because folk seem to think its worth 200k+.
An auction house system would eliminate this daylight robbery system and create continuity across the board for how much folk pay and would eliminate the extremes - of being lucky enough to find an imperial motif for 1k, or unlucky enough to find the motif you desperately need being priced gouged *** out of!
IMO its just being different for differents sake. Its not a better system than an auction house and there is a reason top MMO's use auction houses rather than guild traders.PS4 - Europe - Aldmeri Dominion5 -
Peekachu99✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭I’m failing to see a problem with a market dictated by the consumers’ wants/ needs.
Current system is horrid. Good riddance.2 -
Radinyn✭✭✭✭✭Peekachu99 wrote: »I’m failing to see a problem with a market dictated by the consumers’ wants/ needs.
Current system is horrid. Good riddance.
These two cannot co-exist because addon destroys the base game one. That's why I'd like to see this addon banned.0 -
Peekachu99✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Peekachu99 wrote: »I’m failing to see a problem with a market dictated by the consumers’ wants/ needs.
Current system is horrid. Good riddance.
These two cannot co-exist because addon destroys the base game one. That's why I'd like to see this addon banned.
No one using an antiquated and broken system in favour of a much better system is called “progress”. ZOS will catch up, eventually. There is absolutely no breaking of the TOS with an addon that allows players to mail what they want; to whom they want, at whatever price has been decided.
The addon is using the exact mechanics and limitations set in place, and just enhancing the social aspect and connectivity. Too bad, so sad for those who actually think the Guild Trader system is in any way efficient and fun.3 -
ZiRM✭✭✭✭✭
✭Tried it and I believe this game needs to make selling easier and faster for people. Not just in Guilds!
I won't be using this, too many red flags and it doesn't look like I will sell things with it, is anyone actually using it?
ZOS needs to take a hard look at changing the way people can sell goods in ESO.Want to become Vampire? 5k @ZiRM in game.ESO Server Status. ( ^_^)o自自o(^_^ ) SkåL!!!!!4 -
zaria✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭
Its two effects, the first and most obvious is that cheap items will drop in price fast and hard, you have 25-50 slots to sell things in and need to sell them fast enough to make room for more items to sell.
On the other hand, this addon you’re talking about just makes it so people don’t have to clutter zone chat with “WTS” messages. It just takes that process and gives it a convenient UI.
I don’t see what’s so wrong about that.
It exploits weak points of the game to destroy guild traders.
Not really. People who sell in chat can accomplish the same thing. Most do it using mail and the CoD functionality.
It seems to me like this addon works using a built in game system and layering a new UI on top of it. It’s not like it stores the items for players. They still have to carry the items until they’re sold.
So, when I write in zone chat in Craglorn WTS <x> somebody from Stonefalls can see it?
That does make the addon more appealing, now that you mention it.
TTC does the same thing, too.
What else does this thing do?
It shows where do you need to travel to get that item, it's not given to you wherever you are.
Fast travel. It’s a pretty quick process.
But then you can sell this item to guild store in better place for bigger price, and global auction house decreases prices in all zones at the same time breaking this important aspect of trading.
Same thing with TTC and MM. You can purchase items low and resell them high. You can also see what price others are selling at, and undercut them.
It’s called “playing the auction house”. It’s something that happens in every multiplayer game with an economy. It’s actually a pretty popular activity. Kind of like playing the stock market...which actually sounds really boring.
Either way, I’m not seeing the difference, here.
The (very obvious) difference is that one person cannot manipulate prices server-wide without putting in a huge amount of effort due to the distributed nature of the guild trader system. This keeps prices low. Consolidate everything on a global auction house and one whale can easily manipulate the market with a few clicks, but with guild traders, that person would have to go to every or nearly every trader.
It’s never just one person in other games, either. Just like in ESO, the people that are playing the auction house are constantly competing with each other and anyone else who puts new items up for sale. That’s why prices end up going lower and lower.
The strawman argument that “just one person can manipulate...” gets even more ludicrous when you try to say that they’re manipulating the market just to keep prices low.
Do you realize that people would have buy high and sell low to do that? That they would be intentionally losing money just to lower the prices? That doesn’t even make sense.
The only difference between a global AH and the guild traders is the level of transparency, ease of access, and self reliance. At this point, that’s it.
You price them below the other items in auction, now unlike WOW who has hundreds of servers ESO has 6 so 500K players will use the auction.
All the servers in WOW limit supply the same way the guild traders to. Now you will not bother to search around for an 500 gold item, you buy it even if MM say its 25% overpriced. In an auction house you will buy the cheapest item.
For rare items you can afford to hold on to them and you price them high, probably use the action with no realistic buyout.
Here the effect works the opposite way, prices go up as its plenty of players with lots of gold.
We had that effect with sharpened weapons, imagine with an auction house
Last you have price manipulation who get way easier with an single source, it happen in ESO to but is far less effective.
Grinding just make you go in circles.
Asking ZoS for nerfs is as stupid as asking for close air support from the death star.0 -
Radinyn✭✭✭✭✭Peekachu99 wrote: »Peekachu99 wrote: »I’m failing to see a problem with a market dictated by the consumers’ wants/ needs.
Current system is horrid. Good riddance.
These two cannot co-exist because addon destroys the base game one. That's why I'd like to see this addon banned.
No one using an antiquated and broken system in favour of a much better system is called “progress”. ZOS will catch up, eventually. There is absolutely no breaking of the TOS with an addon that allows players to mail what they want; to whom they want, at whatever price has been decided.
The addon is using the exact mechanics and limitations set in place, and just enhancing the social aspect and connectivity. Too bad, so sad for those who actually think the Guild Trader system is in any way efficient and fun.
This addon allows it's owner to ban some people that is against TOS and I'm sure more things are.
I've played many MMO's with auction houses and guild traders are just soo much better idea for me! Just like auction house is better for you.0 -
Peekachu99✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Peekachu99 wrote: »Peekachu99 wrote: »I’m failing to see a problem with a market dictated by the consumers’ wants/ needs.
Current system is horrid. Good riddance.
These two cannot co-exist because addon destroys the base game one. That's why I'd like to see this addon banned.
No one using an antiquated and broken system in favour of a much better system is called “progress”. ZOS will catch up, eventually. There is absolutely no breaking of the TOS with an addon that allows players to mail what they want; to whom they want, at whatever price has been decided.
The addon is using the exact mechanics and limitations set in place, and just enhancing the social aspect and connectivity. Too bad, so sad for those who actually think the Guild Trader system is in any way efficient and fun.
This addon allows it's owner to ban some people that is against TOS and I'm sure more things are.
I've played many MMO's with auction houses and guild traders are just soo much better idea for me! Just like auction house is better for you.
ESO is literally the only current MMORPG with this kind of system, and likely the only one that will have this system in the next decade. If it’s so great and innovative why hasn’t anyone copied it yet?
Answer: Because it’s bad. It’s fine to like bad things—I have a soft spot for B-movies. It just bothers me how righteously some people defend the current system when it’s clearly unpopular and riddled with issues.6 -
Universe✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭ZOS will probably won't do anything about it.
The only result from this thread will be more players using this addon.
This thread serves as unintentional(or intentional ?) advertising of this addon.Some videos I recorded for fun: Main character:
PC EU main: Universe - AD magicka Sorcerer, Former Emperor, Grand Overlord, The Merciless, Trial Bosses Solo Champion
Top alts: Genius(stamina/sagicka Dragonknight) The Force(stamina Nightblade) and other chars.
PC NA main: The Magic - AD magicka Sorcerer
Started playing ESO in beta & early access
User_ID: Daedric_Prince2 -
Radinyn✭✭✭✭✭Peekachu99 wrote: »Peekachu99 wrote: »Peekachu99 wrote: »I’m failing to see a problem with a market dictated by the consumers’ wants/ needs.
Current system is horrid. Good riddance.
These two cannot co-exist because addon destroys the base game one. That's why I'd like to see this addon banned.
No one using an antiquated and broken system in favour of a much better system is called “progress”. ZOS will catch up, eventually. There is absolutely no breaking of the TOS with an addon that allows players to mail what they want; to whom they want, at whatever price has been decided.
The addon is using the exact mechanics and limitations set in place, and just enhancing the social aspect and connectivity. Too bad, so sad for those who actually think the Guild Trader system is in any way efficient and fun.
This addon allows it's owner to ban some people that is against TOS and I'm sure more things are.
I've played many MMO's with auction houses and guild traders are just soo much better idea for me! Just like auction house is better for you.
ESO is literally the only current MMORPG with this kind of system, and likely the only one that will have this system in the next decade. If it’s so great and innovative why hasn’t anyone copied it yet?
Answer: Because it’s bad. It’s fine to like bad things—I have a soft spot for B-movies. It just bothers me how righteously some people defend the current system when it’s clearly unpopular and riddled with issues.
Answer: Because devs aren't brave enough to do something that wasn't done before, and coping such a unique system would instantly result with hate because of stealing from other games.0 -
Universe✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭
I hope so.
There is no need for such addon in ESO game economy.Some videos I recorded for fun: Main character:
PC EU main: Universe - AD magicka Sorcerer, Former Emperor, Grand Overlord, The Merciless, Trial Bosses Solo Champion
Top alts: Genius(stamina/sagicka Dragonknight) The Force(stamina Nightblade) and other chars.
PC NA main: The Magic - AD magicka Sorcerer
Started playing ESO in beta & early access
User_ID: Daedric_Prince0 -
Edziu✭✭✭✭✭
✭Stewart1874 wrote: »Guild traders make for a uniquely awful, awful experience. There is zero continuity in pricing which leads to folk on either end of the spectrum being brutally ripped off. You can make easy money taking advantage of people who don't know the 'correct' value of items either by buying items that are woefully under priced, e.g. a couple days back I bought a Plague Doctor impenetrable girdle for 1k and sold it for 11k and conversely I can't afford to purchase an ancient orc shields motif page because folk seem to think its worth 200k+.
An auction house system would eliminate this daylight robbery system and create continuity across the board for how much folk pay and would eliminate the extremes - of being lucky enough to find an imperial motif for 1k, or unlucky enough to find the motif you desperately need being priced gouged *** out of!
IMO its just being different for differents sake. Its not a better system than an auction house and there is a reason top MMO's use auction houses rather than guild traders.
and you just remembered me when in old days where robus agility ring was around 400k workth and my friend who just was bored and was running on guild traders got this ring just for 500 gold lol, gold deal and this was great example fo someone with guild trader in perfect place to selling vs guild trader somewehere on forgotten wastelands and with someone more casual who dont have any idea about present prices0 -
NoTimeToWait✭✭✭✭✭Kiralyn2000 wrote: »I'd bet that the people using that system, aren't really participating much in the standard Guild Vendor Economy to start with. (if they were, why would they bother with that mod, after all).
So, I can't see it having much effect on the regular economy. /shrug
Guild Traders might loose more and more players over time, because it is cheaper and global.
I like guild traders system and oppose this auction house idea. So I won't switch to this addon until a really significant amount of ingame cash flows through it.
Despite the fact that any good trader should always try different venues and research new ways of getting cash, I am fed up with auction system, so I would stay away from it for as long as possible
Also I think it is possible that this auction addon will significantly drop the price for many listings, which is also a negative effect for any trader with significant weekly trade net worth (who also provide a high percentage of all items on sale). So even if many traders try this system, they will keep listing most of their items in the usual way. Therefore, it is unlikely that this addon will reach necessary critical mass.Edited by NoTimeToWait on 5 April 2018 13:011 -
Edziu✭✭✭✭✭
✭now just curious how many people will use it with hope it will be many to show ZOS their guild traders system isnt to good...atleast until they wil maybe add npc in game to search items from every guild trader where to go instead of wasting time running on every zone just to get info there is no any item which you want to buy or to get this items after many zones...
Still based on the other topic ~~60+ % of game's population is against global auction house.
from where you get 60% of this gam population is against global auction? dont say its from forum pools where less than 1k different players even writing something on forum xD
and I dont see any chance as more than 50%+ players will be against global auction as this game is more casual friendly and global AH would be more casual friendy where you need to have active sales to not be kicked from guild and of there are zones with the best prices for selling where you to get and be in those guilds you really need to have good sales and we have other worse zones where you need to wait or many many more time longer to sold this one item which could be sold in same day in good zone or need to drastically lower price to have sure you will sell this item before price will drop more with this time
while in global AH you dont need any special guild to even list your items for sale and everyone have flat chance to sell same item for similiar price without being additional disadvantaged because of bad location of your guild trader
In game literally everyone I meet is against auction house except some of the min/max players. Guild Trader's are more realstic to the medival/fantasy way of trading than global auction house.
and so you exhausted of your logical arguments and now you compared it more to reality how it would look in real life?
just no comments
even casual player will have more mind for discussions 0
