Performance drop within player-created homes

Vaoh · October 2017

First off, I am a PS4 Pro player. This probably has quite a bit to do with the performance issues.

I created a very nice forest home out of The Gorinir Estate awhile back, but the place is laggy for non-PS4 Pro players. Even on PS4 Pro, looking in certain directions causes lag. When attacking a target skeleton, it can sometimes feel like I'm fighting a trial boss due to performance drops.

My home has 600/600 furnishings and the maximum amounts of pets and special furnishings like trophies.

Does anyone know what in particular is causing this? Is it having 600/600 items? Would the same happen if I placed 600 small items (like forks) in my home? Is it the house itself being more susceptible to performance drops than others, which I'm pretty sure is true with Earthtear Cavern?

I plan to build another Large Home one day but don't see the point if people lag when they enter it. I want to avoid lag however possible. Ty

reiverx · October 2017

I'm also on PS4 Pro with 600 items in Strident Springs Demesne. I do get a few seconds where the items load upon entry but I don't get lag. I also don't get visitors so I can't be sure how other people experience my home.

Are you on the NA server? I'd love to check your place out.

Aliyavana · October 2017

The thing with console is that they are weaker than pcs and item limits are probably there to help with limitations of hardware

Aurie · October 2017

But surely the individual player, whether a PC or a console player, is responsible for making his or her own choice as to how many items are placed in his/her house.

If performance is affected, then the answer is very simple ; the player can opt for self-limiting the number of items he places and retain what he considers to be acceptable loading times/lag....or he can place more items and accept a reduced level of performance.

The players in this game are all (officially) 18+. They can think for themselves and make their own decisions. They do not need to be nannied and spoonfed. That is one of the reasons the 18+ rating is there. And if there is (undoubtedly) a proportion of younger players.....well, they should not be playing ESO in the first place, and @ZO$ is not responsible for bad decisions on their part re: housing performance issues.

Vaoh · October 2017

reiverx wrote: »

I'm also on PS4 Pro with 600 items in Strident Springs Demesne. I do get a few seconds where the items load upon entry but I don't get lag. I also don't get visitors so I can't be sure how other people experience my home.

Are you on the NA server? I'd love to check your place out.

Yep, I'm on PS4 NA @reiverx I'll pm you my psn.

Message me and sometime we'll group up and I'll let you travel inside the home. Would like to know if you get any performance drops as well (after loading ofc).

Vaoh · October 2017

Aurelle1 wrote: »

But surely the individual player, whether a PC or a console player, is responsible for making his or her own choice as to how many items are placed in his/her house.

If performance is affected, then the answer is very simple ; the player can opt for self-limiting the number of items he places and retain what he considers to be acceptable loading times/lag....or he can place more items and accept a reduced level of performance.

The players in this game are all (officially) 18+. They can think for themselves and make their own decisions. They do not need to be nannied and spoonfed. That is one of the reasons the 18+ rating is there. And if there is (undoubtedly) a proportion of younger players.....well, they should not be playing ESO in the first place, and @ZO$ is not responsible for bad decisions on their part re: housing performance issues.

Sure, and to solve any problem performance-wise in ESO, we can choose to opt out. To "self-limit" as you put it. If we avoid PvP and Trials, then ESO doesn't seem too laggy anymore and we should totally ignore the issue, right? I don't like that reasoning at all.

The issue here is that a choice like this shouldn't really have to be made. Unfortunately there isn't any choice here which is why I created this thread where I'm asking questions on how to minimize FPS issues besides simply not putting items in my home.

If I can figure out whether it is the specific home or specific furnishing type/size that tends to strain performance, I can make better investments into which homes/items to get in the future. If you read my post you would notice multiple questions I laid out aimed at creating a better comprehension of the source of the performance issues, rather than just removing furnishings immediately.

I've already accepted the forest home will have lag. It's the next home I'm more concerned out.

Aurie · October 2017

Sorry to disappoint you, but I did read your post. The questions you are asking can only be answered by @ZO$ , if they care to do that.

But, referring to your last post, we are talking about housing issues here. Not Pvp/trials. Or anything else.

My reply to your OP is entirely based on logic. You don't want poor performance? You limit the number of furnishing items you place. You may not like it, but it's very simple. What do you want @ZO$ to do? Limit the item cap for everyone, no matter what platform, so that you guys playing on consoles don't have to make any choices?

You may not like my reasoning, but I like yours even less.

Vaoh · October 2017

Aurelle1 wrote: »

Sorry to disappoint you, but I did read your post. The questions you are asking can only be answered by @ZO$ , if they care to do that.

But, referring to your last post, we are talking about housing issues here. Not Pvp/trials. Or anything else.

My reply to your OP is entirely based on logic. You don't want poor performance? You limit the number of furnishing items you place. You may not like it, but it's very simple. What do you want @ZO$ to do? Limit the item cap for everyone, no matter what platform, so that you guys playing on consoles don't have to make any choices?

You may not like my reasoning, but I like yours even less.

The questions I asked can be answered by anyone, not just ZOS. It requires testing.
Yes, more furnishings = more load on the game. This is obvious lol. There is much more to it though which would be the point of creating a Forum discussion about it....

Are you okay? Like this thread was quite literally made just to ask a few questions regarding how performance drops are created from furnishings, and if the type of furnishing or home itself played a part at all, or if it was strictly based on furniture count.

You've come in here lecturing about needing to be 18+ to play ESO (lol) and just acting weird with this enormous attitude of yours. Not gonna argue with you. If you aren't here to discuss the topic or help then please go elsewhere and ty

GaldorP · October 2017

It seems to me that the dynamic decorations in houses are more performance-intensive for the GPU than items that appear to have the same 3d models but are part of a static environment in a regular zone. I've experienced fps drops on PC as well in homes where I placed a lot of high polygon-count decorations (like several hundred trees and plants, for example). I would assume that items with a more complex 3d model and more/larger textures also have a bigger impact on performance.

But to be honest, I would rather be able to place a ton of furnishing items in my home, even if they have a strong impact on client performance, instead of having the incredibly low limit on the number of items I can place in my homes right now. It should be my choice if I want lush decorations or perfect client performance in my own home.

Aurie · October 2017

GaldorP wrote: »

But to be honest, I would rather be able to place a ton of furnishing items in my home, even if they have a strong impact on client performance, instead of having the incredibly low limit on the number of items I can place in my homes right now. It should be my choice if I want lush decorations or perfect client performance in my own home.

Just what I've been saying in this and other threads.

I get that OP is trying to work out what causes poor performance and why. And I hope he finds what he is looking for, and can adjust what he places in his houses accordingly.

But inevitably the subject of item limit arises (as it always does in housing threads, and as it did in the post before mine....to which my post was directed).

A lot of us feel very strongly about the low item limits, and are aware that they are quite possibly being capped due to differences in platform capabilities. Given that players on consoles or older PCs can in fact make their own minds up about what level of performance they are OK with in their own houses, it seems unnecessary and frustrating to the rest of us to have what might be a blanket cap due to that reason.

Vaoh · October 2017

GaldorP wrote: »

It seems to me that the dynamic decorations in houses are more performance-intensive for the GPU than items that appear to have the same 3d models but are part of a static environment in a regular zone. I've experienced fps drops on PC as well in homes where I placed a lot of high polygon-count decorations (like several hundred trees and plants, for example). I would assume that items with a more complex 3d model and more/larger textures also have a bigger impact on performance.

But to be honest, I would rather be able to place a ton of furnishing items in my home, even if they have a strong impact on client performance, instead of having the incredibly low limit on the number of items I can place in my homes right now. It should be my choice if I want lush decorations or perfect client performance in my own home.

@GaldorP Ty!

Not sure if this is the correct way to ask, but are you on a "lower-end" PC? Or can you run ESO at 60FPS using a PC much stronger than my PS4?

Either way that was what worried me. Furnishings that are larger will be a bigger buren to performance than a pebble

in that case no wonder my home lags! It's my only home that is even remotely filled up so had no way of testing that wouldn't cause hours of furnture fixing afterward.

GaldorP · October 2017

Vaoh wrote: »

GaldorP wrote: »

It seems to me that the dynamic decorations in houses are more performance-intensive for the GPU than items that appear to have the same 3d models but are part of a static environment in a regular zone. I've experienced fps drops on PC as well in homes where I placed a lot of high polygon-count decorations (like several hundred trees and plants, for example). I would assume that items with a more complex 3d model and more/larger textures also have a bigger impact on performance.

But to be honest, I would rather be able to place a ton of furnishing items in my home, even if they have a strong impact on client performance, instead of having the incredibly low limit on the number of items I can place in my homes right now. It should be my choice if I want lush decorations or perfect client performance in my own home.

@GaldorP Ty!

Not sure if this is the correct way to ask, but are you on a "lower-end" PC? Or can you run ESO at 60FPS using a PC much stronger than my PS4?

Either way that was what worried me. Furnishings that are larger will be a bigger buren to performance than a pebble in that case no wonder my home lags! It's my only home that is even remotely filled up so had no way of testing that wouldn't cause hours of furnture fixing afterward.

I played ESO on an older PC from 2010 or 2011 that would probably be considered very low end now. I could normally run the game on medium settings with a good stable framerate but the fps dropped a bit in some trials and veteran dungeons. I don't have the exact framerate values unfortunately since I haven't played the game in a few months now.

Nestor · October 2017

I have a PC, and its a beast. And when I used my Target Skeleton that is in my home, it is a slide show. I mean I get 3 figure DPS scores because of the lag in getting attacks in, on characters that pull 25K or more in dungeons.

I do have a large number of items in the garden, but I don't think I am near the cap.

Odd thing is, other people can come in and the Target Skelly works just fine for them, even while I am there. I can use other skellies, but mine is useless to me.

Vaoh · October 2017

Nestor wrote: »

I have a PC, and its a beast. And when I used my Target Skeleton that is in my home, it is a slide show. I mean I get 3 figure DPS scores because of the lag in getting attacks in, on characters that pull 25K or more in dungeons.

I do have a large number of items in the garden, but I don't think I am near the cap.

Odd thing is, other people can come in and the Target Skelly works just fine for them, even while I am there. I can use other skellies, but mine is useless to me.

That's really strange if others can attack the target skeleton just fine while you yourself face lag

maybe there's some underlying issue in the housing system for this? No way to know for sure. I notice that item resolution goes down on far away trees and such when you walk around in zones, so my theory then would be that having so many items in close proximity to you forces them to all fully load in which causes the performance drops.

If you create a lot of distance between you and an area packed with furnishings, will you still get lag even when attacking the target skeleton? For example, you place a massive amount of trees (ike 600 trees) inside the home at Serenity Falls Estate which causes lots of lag, but then you walk all the way to the entrance of Serenity Falls and place a target skeleton there. Would you still feel lag when attacking the target skeleton or even feel lag at all for that matter?

Nestor · October 2017

Vaoh wrote: »

If you create a lot of distance between you and an area packed with furnishings, will you still get lag even when attacking the target skeleton? For example, you place a massive amount of trees (ike 600 trees) inside the home at Serenity Falls Estate which causes lots of lag, but then you walk all the way to the entrance of Serenity Falls and place a target skeleton there. Would you still feel lag when attacking the target skeleton or even feel lag at all for that matter?

Each home is a cell, so not sure that would work. As I park all my alts there, I can see the stuff I added pop in as the game loads the house. Also, my Skelly is about as far away from most of the stuff as I can get, being Mournoth Manor for my primary.

Vaoh · October 2017

Nestor wrote: »

Vaoh wrote: »

If you create a lot of distance between you and an area packed with furnishings, will you still get lag even when attacking the target skeleton? For example, you place a massive amount of trees (ike 600 trees) inside the home at Serenity Falls Estate which causes lots of lag, but then you walk all the way to the entrance of Serenity Falls and place a target skeleton there. Would you still feel lag when attacking the target skeleton or even feel lag at all for that matter?

Each home is a cell, so not sure that would work. As I park all my alts there, I can see the stuff I added pop in as the game loads the house. Also, my Skelly is about as far away from most of the stuff as I can get, being Mournhold Manor for my primary.

In that case it looks like I really do have to watch how many items and also what types of items I use

Ty for the info!

Nestor · October 2017

I just checked and I have 312 slots used out of 400. I did just try the skelly and the combat seemed OK. So maybe they fixed something. I did put in a bug report on it, maybe it got acted on.

Vaoh · October 2017

Nestor wrote: »

I just checked and I have 312 slots used out of 400. I did just try the skelly and the combat seemed OK. So maybe they fixed something. I did put in a bug report on it, maybe it got acted on.

It makes me wonder how this would all work for one of the massive homes like Pariah's Pinnacle or Hakkvild's High Hall. Placing tons of stuff on one side of the home and running all the way to the end of it. There is such a long distance to cover that the placed items won't even be in view for you, but since it is a player house, it would be interesting to know if those items would still be fully loaded to cause performance issues.

If you have time, please login to the PTS and try this out for me! Should be easy..... go to Redfur Trading Post in Grahtwood and purchase about 500-600 "Trees, Mossy Murkmire Cluster" from the Home Goods furniture vendor there. Afterward, travel to Pariah's Pinnacle or Hakkvild's High Hall and place all of those trees at the spawn location, then run far away and try to fight a target skeleton and generally just test performance. If you start to notice that performance stabilizes when you create lots of distance then I'm buying Pariah's Pinnacle asap when it releases

Wreuntzylla · October 2017

It's because each item is rendered as a separate piece. What ZoS should do is take snapshots and only populate those areas being worked on.

eirinnpryderi · October 2017

FX 8320E @3.4ghz, 12gb RAM, Radeon 280x 3gb RAM, no issues with houses here, I guessed when Gina said they were looking how to up the furnishing limit without performance issues they were referring to consoles