Pet Sorcs and Dueling

grim_tactics · May 2017

I'll be the first to agree that dueling is for nothing more than passing the time and maybe testing out rotations. This game is not balanced for 1v1.

With that said - I can't be the only one who refuses to duel a Pet Sorc.

The only thing in this game, outside VMA, that just really gets to me is having a max level player challenge me to a duel only to summon pets right as the fight starts.

People do this because they are realizing no one wants to duel them if they are showing their hand.

As soon as I see pets summoned I just leave combat area - no thanks.

To top it off are the players talking crap that are pet Sorcs. I mean - yeah - good job on your 3v1 victory. Round of applause, now put my little pony up and actually fight 1on1.

Pets serve a purpose, not saying they aren't good in PvE, but I really wish they would go back to being only for solo early level content. Pets have no business being viable as an end game build.

Waffennacht · May 2017

That last line needs to be removed. It's not cool to want any archetype to be destroyed like that.

That being said, yes they can be super annoying, only a few builds can really bring a well built one down. But that's how it goes, I'm going to guess you're not a dot heavy build are ya?

dpencil1 · May 2017

I'm a pet sorc dueler, but I never talk crap. It's not that I'm trying to cheese people. I play pet sorc everywhere...dungeons, vMA, even Cyrodill. It's what I'm used to using, and what I'm geared for. It's dissapointing when people refuse to duel me just because of that. I still get schooled by good PvPers who learn how to counter the build. And like it or not, you will be seeing pet sorcs in BGs, so it's good practice, just like dueling any other spec.

Honestly, I think the whole complaining thing in duels is stupid. You don't get to control what your opponent runs anywhere else. So...

grim_tactics · May 2017

Waffennacht wrote: »

That last line needs to be removed. It's not cool to want any archetype to be destroyed like that.

That being said, yes they can be super annoying, only a few builds can really bring a well built one down. But that's how it goes, I'm going to guess you're not a dot heavy build are ya?

I just think pets are stupid is why I said that.

I don't want them nerfed - not saying that at all - and I'm fine with people enjoying it. I'm just stating it just seems ridiculous and stupid is all. I know it's hard to put that into context as to how I'm saying it. I would feel like a 5 yr old using them - THATS JUST ME - lol - I would never tell anyone how to enjoy the game and I hope they play the way they want.

dpencil1 wrote: »

I'm a pet sorc dueler, but I never talk crap. It's not that I'm trying to cheese people. I play pet sorc everywhere...dungeons, vMA, even Cyrodill. It's what I'm used to using, and what I'm geared for. It's dissapointing when people refuse to duel me just because of that. I still get schooled by good PvPers who learn how to counter the build. And like it or not, you will be seeing pet sorcs in BGs, so it's good practice, just like dueling any other spec.

Honestly, I think the whole complaining thing in duels is stupid. You don't get to control what your opponent runs anywhere else. So...

I'm not complaining as much as I was just venting I guess. Again - this game isn't meant for 1v1 balance and I understand that.

My competitive side is probably my worst attribute honestly so it just strikes a nerve when I'm like "Ok - dude wants to duel - let's go," and boom 2 pets and a storm atronach. If I was running AoEs and such it wouldn't be hard at all to take out the pets but I run mostly single target PvP bars.

I've beaten my fair share too by just running them down and not allowing them to get distance. To me - a Pet Sorc that wants to duel needs to admit it's essentially a 2v1 scenario.

I'm not worried about them in BG because they're easy to pick apart in group play and burn down - it's the 1v1 scenario without cover to kite that's difficult.

Juhasow · May 2017

Fasala+shieldbreaker+rearming trap(against volatile familiar)+s&b ulti = totally countered pet sorc.

Aedaryl · May 2017

Refuse to duel pet sorc is the most L2P issue from this game.

There is one particular build, making everything into damage, a DUEL build, OP, it will be destroy next patch, since sustain is not that easy.

Then, openworld pet sorc build, like your openworld build, can be easely countered.

- If you are templar, use purge : you delete the sorc curse (6s curse, so you can easaly purge it), reduce pets damage by 55%.
Also, templar can easely kill pets with their main spamable, and 1 pet dead = win for you, you can interrupt the cast of the pet easely.

- If you are a sorc, you can just easely shield, mines, or use the prison rune on overload bar to make the pet useless for a very long time.

- A NB can fear the pets, making them useless for 4s + the time that scamp come back to you, agony make them useless for long time too shadow image is a good counter too. Stamblade can easely kill pets too.

- Dk can tank the pets well and use the petrify for stun a pet for a long time.

- Rearming trap, cyrodil purge, are good counter to pets too.

Also, since most pet build are very damage oriented, we will take a good nerf, because we can't lower or magicka (no damage from pets, hardened ward not enough strong) we will need to lost 3 spell damage glyph for sustain, and sustain will still be extremely hard.

Now, you need to know pet sorc weakness :

- A little stamina pool, you can easely make him run OOS

- 1 shield (having harness magicka is a pet sorc that change skill just for make the fight easier against you, because pet sorc can't sustain anymore harness VS a stam build).

- That 1 shield make the pet sorc THE MOST SQUICHY BUILD POSSIBLE : we don't even have healing ward, so we are more easy to kill than magicka NBs. You can easely bust us with a heavy attack (don't have stam to block or dodge) + classical combo.

Snare and imobilisation is good counter to pet sorc too.

The burst of the pet sorc is the biggest burst in the game, but the most telegraphed too. It take 6s to do, and you exactly know when it will come.

-

grim_tactics · May 2017

Aedaryl wrote: »

Refuse to duel pet sorc is the most L2P issue from this game.

There is one particular build, making everything into damage, a DUEL build, OP, it will be destroy next patch, since sustain is not that easy.

Then, openworld pet sorc build, like your openworld build, can be easely countered.

- If you are templar, use purge : you delete the sorc curse (6s curse, so you can easaly purge it), reduce pets damage by 55%.
Also, templar can easely kill pets with their main spamable, and 1 pet dead = win for you, you can interrupt the cast of the pet easely.

- If you are a sorc, you can just easely shield, mines, or use the prison rune on overload bar to make the pet useless for a very long time.

- A NB can fear the pets, making them useless for 4s + the time that scamp come back to you, agony make them useless for long time too shadow image is a good counter too. Stamblade can easely kill pets too.

- Dk can tank the pets well and use the petrify for stun a pet for a long time.

- Rearming trap, cyrodil purge, are good counter to pets too.

Also, since most pet build are very damage oriented, we will take a good nerf, because we can't lower or magicka (no damage from pets, hardened ward not enough strong) we will need to lost 3 spell damage glyph for sustain, and sustain will still be extremely hard.

Now, you need to know pet sorc weakness :

- A little stamina pool, you can easely make him run OOS

- 1 shield (having harness magicka is a pet sorc that change skill just for make the fight easier against you, because pet sorc can't sustain anymore harness VS a stam build).

- That 1 shield make the pet sorc THE MOST SQUICHY BUILD POSSIBLE : we don't even have healing ward, so we are more easy to kill than magicka NBs. You can easely bust us with a heavy attack (don't have stam to block or dodge) + classical combo.

Snare and imobilisation is good counter to pet sorc too.

The burst of the pet sorc is the biggest burst in the game, but the most telegraphed too. It take 6s to do, and you exactly know when it will come.

-

I agree but for a regular MagSorc user it's just a pain. Trust me - I'm the biggest proponent of counterplay. I hate seeing all these nerf threads because people refuse to accept the fact this game isn't balanced for 1v1 or if it's for something else then change your play style. There are certain builds in 1v1 though that other builds can't counter. If I know you are a Pet Sorc I can change my bars up and it wouldn't be an issue in a duel but like I said - so many just wait until the duel starts to summon - so it's done on purpose.

In a way it's L2P most definitely and I won't say I some expert on them. I don't want it nerfed either. However, you have to admit that it's probably one of the cheesiest easiest to play builds in the game that does insane damage and annoys the hell out of people.

I've also seen pet builds run resto with that shield btw.

That's why I avoid Pet Sorc cancer. Don't want to have to be like "Pet Sorc? K - hold up man, let me switch my bar up just to fight you and your minions. Thought this was 1v1 but since you brought friends got to change my whole build."

Hutch679 · May 2017

grim_tactics wrote: »

Waffennacht wrote: »

That last line needs to be removed. It's not cool to want any archetype to be destroyed like that.

That being said, yes they can be super annoying, only a few builds can really bring a well built one down. But that's how it goes, I'm going to guess you're not a dot heavy build are ya?

I just think pets are stupid is why I said that.

I don't want them nerfed - not saying that at all - and I'm fine with people enjoying it. I'm just stating it just seems ridiculous and stupid is all. I know it's hard to put that into context as to how I'm saying it. I would feel like a 5 yr old using them - THATS JUST ME - lol - I would never tell anyone how to enjoy the game and I hope they play the way they want.

dpencil1 wrote: »

I'm a pet sorc dueler, but I never talk crap. It's not that I'm trying to cheese people. I play pet sorc everywhere...dungeons, vMA, even Cyrodill. It's what I'm used to using, and what I'm geared for. It's dissapointing when people refuse to duel me just because of that. I still get schooled by good PvPers who learn how to counter the build. And like it or not, you will be seeing pet sorcs in BGs, so it's good practice, just like dueling any other spec.

Honestly, I think the whole complaining thing in duels is stupid. You don't get to control what your opponent runs anywhere else. So...

I'm not complaining as much as I was just venting I guess. Again - this game isn't meant for 1v1 balance and I understand that.

My competitive side is probably my worst attribute honestly so it just strikes a nerve when I'm like "Ok - dude wants to duel - let's go," and boom 2 pets and a storm atronach. If I was running AoEs and such it wouldn't be hard at all to take out the pets but I run mostly single target PvP bars.

I've beaten my fair share too by just running them down and not allowing them to get distance. To me - a Pet Sorc that wants to duel needs to admit it's essentially a 2v1 scenario.

I'm not worried about them in BG because they're easy to pick apart in group play and burn down - it's the 1v1 scenario without cover to kite that's difficult.

Lol if you can't beat a pet sorc, then it sounds like a learn to play problem. You just kill their pets lol its really not that hard

Moglijuana · May 2017

I will duel literally any build in the game...but a pet sorc lol. It's a waste of pots tbh. And on console it's even worse because of the stupid sticky targeting the game has which prevents you from even targeting the thing you need to anyways...Volatile Familiar, Twilight, Engine Guardian + Atro...yea waste of time.

Beardimus · May 2017

Just adapt and over come. Plenty of counters.

Saying its 3 v 1 a pet spec could argue how limited they are on skill slots... Pros and cons.

Do you run a Proc monster helm? Proc armour? Arguably that's 3v 1 also..

Sure dualing pets is tricky but so is never die template healing or constant CC from stamina toons it just takes a strategy

grim_tactics · May 2017

Beardimus wrote: »

Just adapt and over come. Plenty of counters.

Saying its 3 v 1 a pet spec could argue how limited they are on skill slots... Pros and cons.

Do you run a Proc monster helm? Proc armour? Arguably that's 3v 1 also..

Sure dualing pets is tricky but so is never die template healing or constant CC from stamina toons it just takes a strategy

No - don't use proc sets really. If I'm on my Cyrodiil build then yes - but most times I'm trying to stay away from cheese builds and trying different stuff.

Again, this was just a rant post - not a fix this/that nerf post.

grim_tactics · May 2017

Hutch679 wrote: »

grim_tactics wrote: »

Waffennacht wrote: »

That last line needs to be removed. It's not cool to want any archetype to be destroyed like that.

That being said, yes they can be super annoying, only a few builds can really bring a well built one down. But that's how it goes, I'm going to guess you're not a dot heavy build are ya?

I just think pets are stupid is why I said that.

I don't want them nerfed - not saying that at all - and I'm fine with people enjoying it. I'm just stating it just seems ridiculous and stupid is all. I know it's hard to put that into context as to how I'm saying it. I would feel like a 5 yr old using them - THATS JUST ME - lol - I would never tell anyone how to enjoy the game and I hope they play the way they want.

dpencil1 wrote: »

I'm a pet sorc dueler, but I never talk crap. It's not that I'm trying to cheese people. I play pet sorc everywhere...dungeons, vMA, even Cyrodill. It's what I'm used to using, and what I'm geared for. It's dissapointing when people refuse to duel me just because of that. I still get schooled by good PvPers who learn how to counter the build. And like it or not, you will be seeing pet sorcs in BGs, so it's good practice, just like dueling any other spec.

Honestly, I think the whole complaining thing in duels is stupid. You don't get to control what your opponent runs anywhere else. So...

I'm not complaining as much as I was just venting I guess. Again - this game isn't meant for 1v1 balance and I understand that.

My competitive side is probably my worst attribute honestly so it just strikes a nerve when I'm like "Ok - dude wants to duel - let's go," and boom 2 pets and a storm atronach. If I was running AoEs and such it wouldn't be hard at all to take out the pets but I run mostly single target PvP bars.

I've beaten my fair share too by just running them down and not allowing them to get distance. To me - a Pet Sorc that wants to duel needs to admit it's essentially a 2v1 scenario.

I'm not worried about them in BG because they're easy to pick apart in group play and burn down - it's the 1v1 scenario without cover to kite that's difficult.

Lol if you can't beat a pet sorc, then it sounds like a learn to play problem. You just kill their pets lol its really not that hard

Read above as you obviously missed some posts (including the end of what you quoted). I didn't say I had issues , only some builds that can be cancerous to go up against depending on your class and what you are running. If they hide that they are a Pet Sorc and you're set for a true 1v1 it is an issue for certain classes/builds. I can easily adapt a build before hand if they want to duel and it's not an issue obviously.

Must've missed that part where I said "I usually chase them down and burn them."

Besides - focusing pets and ignoring the caster works if you have sustain and don't have to worry about resources or health and have AoEs or Roots you can cast on pets. I'm fully aware of counterplay - I just hate Pet Sorcs.

Moglijuana wrote: »

I will duel literally any duel in the game...but a pet sorc lol. It's a waste of pots tbh. And on console it's even worse because of the stupid sticky targeting the game has which prevents you from even targeting the thing you need to anyays...Volatile Familiar, Twilight, Engine Guardian + Atro...yea waste of time.

On console, trying to count on Overload to turn on and off like it should and targeting to actually work and not lock on to something else is terribly inaccurate and can screw you over.