Force Shock should be undodgeable

Father_X_Zombie · June 2016

The recent changes to the Sorcerer class are definitely for the worst. Our defenses were greatly weakened, as an indirect result our offense is too due to the need to shield more often. This also led to more Sorcerers tied to destro staff because of recovery management issues with duel wielding. Meanwhile our opponents (stam builds) are able to have better DPS, and survivalibility because of shuffle and dodge roll, which happens to be the bane of Sorcs because almost all of our abilities that do decent damage are dodgeable.

In order to compensate this, the ability "Force Shock" and it's morphs (morphed to force pulse and crushing shock) shouldn't be dodgeable, more damage wouldn't hurt too but it's a stretch

. What do you guys think?

Ps: I'm not here to complain about the sorc nerfs so the L2P brigade should move along.

tist · June 2016

I would be happier with a non dodge-able mages wrath.

Sup radiant.

Joy_Division · June 2016

I think it's a bad idea to buff a general offensive ability available to everyone such that it defeats dodge-roll without any counter-balancing drawbacks just because ZoS has messed up sorcerers.

Oakmontowls_ESO · June 2016

To be fair the skill doesn't make sense to be dodge able in the first place

CasNation · June 2016

I disagree for the simple fact that this ability is available to all class, so it would be an across-the-board buff to magicka builds/nerf to stamina builds NOT just a buff to magicka sorcs. Do I think magicka sorcs need some help to make their playstyle not mind-numbingly boring? Yes, but it should be done within the class itself, not outside it.

Father_X_Zombie · June 2016

Joy_Division wrote: »

I think it's a bad idea to buff a general offensive ability available to everyone such that it defeats dodge-roll without any counter-balancing drawbacks just because ZoS has messed up sorcerers.

Really only Sorcs and to a lesser degree mag DKs run force shock. The damage is very low to other instant cast weapon abilities such as hidden blade and poison arrow. On most Sorc bars, the only ability that does good damage against perma dodgers is curse, but it takes forever to explode and can be healed through using only vigor.

Father_X_Zombie · June 2016

tist wrote: »

I would be happier with a non dodge-able mages wrath.

Sup radiant.

This would be good too, atm it's by far the worst execute in the game, and would also help duel wield sorcs with instant DPS.

Father_X_Zombie · June 2016

CasNation wrote: »

I disagree for the simple fact that this ability is available to all class, so it would be an across-the-board buff to magicka builds/nerf to stamina builds NOT just a buff to magicka sorcs. Do I think magicka sorcs need some help to make their playstyle not mind-numbingly boring? Yes, but it should be done within the class itself, not outside it.

I see your point, but really only Sorcs are tied to a staff for instant DPS, mag DKs use it too but aren't depended on it. Plus stam is already very powerful right now (nbs in particular) because they dodge everything and still put out good DPS.

gibous · June 2016

The problem is with evasion. I think it's bad design to have both active and passive dodging in this game, and at the very least the evasion buff should only last for 6 seconds just like shields.

Father_X_Zombie · June 2016

gibous wrote: »

The problem is with evasion. I think it's bad design to have both active and passive dodging in this game, and at the very least the evasion buff should only last for 6 seconds just like shields.

Yes! Make them suffer with the sorcs!

psychotic13 · June 2016

Hmmm, I like this approach.

Robbmrp · June 2016

tist wrote: »

I would be happier with a non dodge-able mages wrath.

Sup radiant.

Zenimax can make Radiant dodgeable as long as they setup the skill like mages wrath. I'd take an instant execute over a time ticking one any day....

Minalan · June 2016

A dodge rolling, blocking, reflecting Stam DK is mostly immune to all Sorc damage right now except for heavy resto attacks. If said Stam DK is a vamp? You're never going to hit him.

We need 'something' to get through. Force pulse is a good start.

Father_X_Zombie · June 2016

Minalan wrote: »

A dodge rolling, blocking, reflecting Stam DK is mostly immune to all Sorc damage right now except for heavy resto attacks. If said Stam DK is a vamp? You're never going to hit him.

We need 'something' to get through. Force pulse is a good start.

We'll said, but don't forget about stamplars, dodge roll plus purge, so literally nothing can touch them

dodgehopper_ESO · June 2016

Father_X_Zombie wrote: »

gibous wrote: »

The problem is with evasion. I think it's bad design to have both active and passive dodging in this game, and at the very least the evasion buff should only last for 6 seconds just like shields.

Yes! Make them suffer with the sorcs!

Sorcs can evade too. Its in the medium armor skill line, and works fantastically for non Nightblades (or even nightblades who use other magicka dumps). I disagree with dropping the duration of this skill down to shielding durations. If they were to do so the only way people would use it if the cost was SIGNIFICANTLY reduced. I've got no problem with the passive dodge, what I think is unfair is the way you can dodge roll ad infinitum, but blocking completely cuts off all stamina Regeneration AND costs stamina each time you're hit.

Father_X_Zombie · June 2016

dodgehopper_ESO wrote: »

Father_X_Zombie wrote: »

gibous wrote: »

The problem is with evasion. I think it's bad design to have both active and passive dodging in this game, and at the very least the evasion buff should only last for 6 seconds just like shields.

Yes! Make them suffer with the sorcs!

Sorcs can evade too. Its in the medium armor skill line, and works fantastically for non Nightblades (or even nightblades who use other magicka dumps). I disagree with dropping the duration of this skill down to shielding durations. If they were to do so the only way people would use it if the cost was SIGNIFICANTLY reduced. I've got no problem with the passive dodge, what I think is unfair is the way you can dodge roll ad infinitum, but blocking completely cuts off all stamina Regeneration AND costs stamina each time you're hit.

I was just being a smart a** but evasion combined with dodge roll spam is broken af

acw37162 · June 2016

No it should not.

Father_X_Zombie · June 2016

acw37162 wrote: »

No it should not.

Care to elaborate on why not?

Cody · June 2016

If it were up to me dodge rolling would not guarantee the next attack to miss. It would simply be a way to increase movement temporarily to avoid attacks.

Father_X_Zombie · June 2016

Cody wrote: »

If it were up to me dodge rolling would not guarantee the next attack to miss. It would simply be a way to increase movement temporarily to avoid attacks.

This is true, but without it, ranged attacks would be recking stam builds, but in reality my frags miss every time.

Paraflex · June 2016

I think it would be fair to allow force shock and maybe more spells to not miss on roll dodgers.

holosoul · June 2016

There's really very little reason for any class/build to have an infinite damage 2s shield
Just like stamina players don't like shields, guess what?
Dodge rolling is a little OP right now

holosoul · June 2016

Maybe if it could absorb a maximum of 1 or 2 attacks? That might be more balanced.

acw37162 · June 2016

Father_X_Zombie wrote: »

acw37162 wrote: »

No it should not.

Care to elaborate on why not? [/quote

I thought about semi suitable well worded explanation as to why, and while writing it down I realized it would lead to longer more drawn out responses.

After going through several of the possible outcomes in my head I opted for the shorter less articulate response.

It's weak sauce, I know, but I just didn't have the energy today.

Father_X_Zombie · June 2016

acw37162 wrote: »

Father_X_Zombie wrote: »

acw37162 wrote: »

No it should not.

Care to elaborate on why not? [/quote

I thought about semi suitable well worded explanation as to why, and while writing it down I realized it would lead to longer more drawn out responses.

After going through several of the possible outcomes in my head I opted for the shorter less articulate response.

It's weak sauce, I know, but I just didn't have the energy today.

Ok

Father_X_Zombie · June 2016

holosoul wrote: »

Maybe if it could absorb a maximum of 1 or 2 attacks? That might be more balanced.

I would be ok with this.

leepalmer95 · June 2016

Nothing should ignore stamina's main defence, they don't have shields which negate all crit bonuses and passives void.

It's like having force pulse just ignore shields or block.

Just adapt all the the 'decent' sorc have seemed too.

ToRelax · June 2016

No, that would be stupidly op.

holosoul · June 2016

leepalmer95 wrote: »

Nothing should ignore stamina's main defence, they don't have shields which negate all crit bonuses and passives void.

It's like having force pulse just ignore shields or block.

Just adapt all the the 'decent' sorc have seemed too.

I guess you can adapt also when dodge roll is nerfed

Van_0S · June 2016

Never!
Otherwise we will see many Atlmer(100%) race around due to their passive.

leepalmer95 · June 2016

holosoul wrote: »

leepalmer95 wrote: »

Nothing should ignore stamina's main defence, they don't have shields which negate all crit bonuses and passives void.

It's like having force pulse just ignore shields or block.

Just adapt all the the 'decent' sorc have seemed too.

I guess you can adapt also when dodge roll is nerfed

It's already been nerfed, it's not my fault pugs expect someone to just stand there and take damage.

Curses
Channels
Any Aoe, including things such as jabs
Dots
Meteor

It's easy to deal with a dodge roller because of the increased cost.

If i go to light attack someone and they roll i just hold the light attack and when they finish the roll i hit them with a fully charged heavy for like 7k damage.

So many counters. But i guess people just want to spam frags and hit 100% of the time.