Inner light breaks clouding swarm's invisibility.

RoamingRiverElk · February 2016

I can totally see how this clouding swarm change is consistent with making meteors nonreflectable. Not...

Erondil · February 2016

Bashev wrote: »

ZOS_KNowak wrote: »

Thanks for all the feedback on the new reveal ability interactions. We’ve been closely monitoring feedback in this thread (as well as the Nightblade Class thread) and have a number of changes planned for how revealing enemy players will work. These changes will not be in the next PTS patch, but will be changed before the Thieves Guild update goes live.
Enemy players using Magelight and Revealing Flare will reveal you and prevent you from returning to stealth and invisibility for 3 seconds, down from 5 seconds.

We like the counterplay that Magelight and Revealing Flare have against stealth and invisibility, but agree the current lockout period is too punishing. Also note that the reveal lockout duration cannot be refreshed. The lockout should only occur if you are pulled out of stealth or invisibility – if you cast Magelight or Revealing Flare on a non-invisible target, it should have no effect.
Piercing Mark will no longer prevent you from entering stealth or invisibility. It will match its behavior currently on the Live megaservers, and will only give the caster of the Piercing Mark unerring vision of you.

Unlike Magelight and Revealing Flare, you can constantly refresh Piercing Mark on an enemy. Being able to indefinitely prevent you from entering stealth or invisibility was too strong, especially since Piercing Mark has an extremely long range and duration.

We’d also like to clarify to say that the current interaction of Clouding Swarm and reveal abilities is intended. The global change to revealing noted above will make this less punishing for players who pick this morph, but we will be keeping a close eye on how it performs when compared to the Devouring Swarm morph.

And again ZoS heart the crying NBs while Templars.... they are templars. Revealing Flare will be pointless again. Thank you ZoS.
I can see a 4 men NB bomb squad jumping killing and disappearing. The whine for nerf magicka NB will be so loud next patch.

Clouding swarm is not only a nightblade skill though, and that's what this thread is about... Concerning other changes listed here, I think it's a good move. Since 1.7, ZOS started to nerf every escape abilities and mechanics because of complaints on forums about sorc streaking, stam builds fleeing and nightblades cloaking. While those mechanics were maybe annoying in few others situations, their heavy nerf extremly favored the zerg to kill fewer numbers trying to run away, and destroyed alot of "true" smallscale players/groups. Changes to invisibility counters goes in the opposite direction, and it's imo a good thing. Would be nice to see bow speed and streak change reverted aswell so more than 1 class can solo tho..

whiteshadow711jppreub18_ESO · February 2016

ZOS_KNowak wrote: »

Thanks for all the feedback on the new reveal ability interactions. We’ve been closely monitoring feedback in this thread (as well as the Nightblade Class thread) and have a number of changes planned for how revealing enemy players will work. These changes will not be in the next PTS patch, but will be changed before the Thieves Guild update goes live.
Enemy players using Magelight and Revealing Flare will reveal you and prevent you from returning to stealth and invisibility for 3 seconds, down from 5 seconds.

We like the counterplay that Magelight and Revealing Flare have against stealth and invisibility, but agree the current lockout period is too punishing. Also note that the reveal lockout duration cannot be refreshed. The lockout should only occur if you are pulled out of stealth or invisibility – if you cast Magelight or Revealing Flare on a non-invisible target, it should have no effect.
Piercing Mark will no longer prevent you from entering stealth or invisibility. It will match its behavior currently on the Live megaservers, and will only give the caster of the Piercing Mark unerring vision of you.

Unlike Magelight and Revealing Flare, you can constantly refresh Piercing Mark on an enemy. Being able to indefinitely prevent you from entering stealth or invisibility was too strong, especially since Piercing Mark has an extremely long range and duration.

We’d also like to clarify to say that the current interaction of Clouding Swarm and reveal abilities is intended. The global change to revealing noted above will make this less punishing for players who pick this morph, but we will be keeping a close eye on how it performs when compared to the Devouring Swarm morph.

Awesome, thank you.. now this feels a little more balanced. When it comes to Clouding Swarm, since it is a Ultimate, you should be re-granted Invisibility..

silky_soft · February 2016

ZOS_KNowak wrote: »

Thanks for all the feedback on the new reveal ability interactions. We’ve been closely monitoring feedback in this thread (as well as the Nightblade Class thread) and have a number of changes planned for how revealing enemy players will work. These changes will not be in the next PTS patch, but will be changed before the Thieves Guild update goes live.
Enemy players using Magelight and Revealing Flare will reveal you and prevent you from returning to stealth and invisibility for 3 seconds, down from 5 seconds.

We like the counterplay that Magelight and Revealing Flare have against stealth and invisibility, but agree the current lockout period is too punishing. Also note that the reveal lockout duration cannot be refreshed. The lockout should only occur if you are pulled out of stealth or invisibility – if you cast Magelight or Revealing Flare on a non-invisible target, it should have no effect.
Piercing Mark will no longer prevent you from entering stealth or invisibility. It will match its behavior currently on the Live megaservers, and will only give the caster of the Piercing Mark unerring vision of you.

Unlike Magelight and Revealing Flare, you can constantly refresh Piercing Mark on an enemy. Being able to indefinitely prevent you from entering stealth or invisibility was too strong, especially since Piercing Mark has an extremely long range and duration.

We’d also like to clarify to say that the current interaction of Clouding Swarm and reveal abilities is intended. The global change to revealing noted above will make this less punishing for players who pick this morph, but we will be keeping a close eye on how it performs when compared to the Devouring Swarm morph.

Thanks, now remove the allies part of radiant magelight and we are done.

Master_Kas · February 2016

ZOS_KNowak wrote: »

Thanks for all the feedback on the new reveal ability interactions. We’ve been closely monitoring feedback in this thread (as well as the Nightblade Class thread) and have a number of changes planned for how revealing enemy players will work. These changes will not be in the next PTS patch, but will be changed before the Thieves Guild update goes live.
Enemy players using Magelight and Revealing Flare will reveal you and prevent you from returning to stealth and invisibility for 3 seconds, down from 5 seconds.

We like the counterplay that Magelight and Revealing Flare have against stealth and invisibility, but agree the current lockout period is too punishing. Also note that the reveal lockout duration cannot be refreshed. The lockout should only occur if you are pulled out of stealth or invisibility – if you cast Magelight or Revealing Flare on a non-invisible target, it should have no effect.
Piercing Mark will no longer prevent you from entering stealth or invisibility. It will match its behavior currently on the Live megaservers, and will only give the caster of the Piercing Mark unerring vision of you.

Unlike Magelight and Revealing Flare, you can constantly refresh Piercing Mark on an enemy. Being able to indefinitely prevent you from entering stealth or invisibility was too strong, especially since Piercing Mark has an extremely long range and duration.

We’d also like to clarify to say that the current interaction of Clouding Swarm and reveal abilities is intended. The global change to revealing noted above will make this less punishing for players who pick this morph, but we will be keeping a close eye on how it performs when compared to the Devouring Swarm morph.

Awsome. That's good enough for me and probably most of the Nightblades out there.

Thanks!

Tryxus · February 2016

Master_Kas wrote: »

ZOS_KNowak wrote: »

Thanks for all the feedback on the new reveal ability interactions. We’ve been closely monitoring feedback in this thread (as well as the Nightblade Class thread) and have a number of changes planned for how revealing enemy players will work. These changes will not be in the next PTS patch, but will be changed before the Thieves Guild update goes live.
Enemy players using Magelight and Revealing Flare will reveal you and prevent you from returning to stealth and invisibility for 3 seconds, down from 5 seconds.

We like the counterplay that Magelight and Revealing Flare have against stealth and invisibility, but agree the current lockout period is too punishing. Also note that the reveal lockout duration cannot be refreshed. The lockout should only occur if you are pulled out of stealth or invisibility – if you cast Magelight or Revealing Flare on a non-invisible target, it should have no effect.
Piercing Mark will no longer prevent you from entering stealth or invisibility. It will match its behavior currently on the Live megaservers, and will only give the caster of the Piercing Mark unerring vision of you.

Unlike Magelight and Revealing Flare, you can constantly refresh Piercing Mark on an enemy. Being able to indefinitely prevent you from entering stealth or invisibility was too strong, especially since Piercing Mark has an extremely long range and duration.

We’d also like to clarify to say that the current interaction of Clouding Swarm and reveal abilities is intended. The global change to revealing noted above will make this less punishing for players who pick this morph, but we will be keeping a close eye on how it performs when compared to the Devouring Swarm morph.

Awsome. That's good enough for me and probably most of the Nightblades out there. Thanks!

Yeah, that's rlly good. A bit of hope in the shadows

looking forward even more for TG update now.

RAGUNAnoOne · February 2016

ZOS_KNowak wrote: »

Thanks for all the feedback on the new reveal ability interactions. We’ve been closely monitoring feedback in this thread (as well as the Nightblade Class thread) and have a number of changes planned for how revealing enemy players will work. These changes will not be in the next PTS patch, but will be changed before the Thieves Guild update goes live.
Enemy players using Magelight and Revealing Flare will reveal you and prevent you from returning to stealth and invisibility for 3 seconds, down from 5 seconds.

We like the counterplay that Magelight and Revealing Flare have against stealth and invisibility, but agree the current lockout period is too punishing. Also note that the reveal lockout duration cannot be refreshed. The lockout should only occur if you are pulled out of stealth or invisibility – if you cast Magelight or Revealing Flare on a non-invisible target, it should have no effect.
Piercing Mark will no longer prevent you from entering stealth or invisibility. It will match its behavior currently on the Live megaservers, and will only give the caster of the Piercing Mark unerring vision of you.

Unlike Magelight and Revealing Flare, you can constantly refresh Piercing Mark on an enemy. Being able to indefinitely prevent you from entering stealth or invisibility was too strong, especially since Piercing Mark has an extremely long range and duration.

We’d also like to clarify to say that the current interaction of Clouding Swarm and reveal abilities is intended. The global change to revealing noted above will make this less punishing for players who pick this morph, but we will be keeping a close eye on how it performs when compared to the Devouring Swarm morph.

I think revealing flare should have the long lockout period as it is useless for anything besides just that magelight gives their benefits. also please tell wrobel to publicly admit his double standard on ultimates not having counters he obviously only cares about the ones he likes.

mr_wazzabi · February 2016

ZOS_KNowak wrote: »

Thanks for all the feedback on the new reveal ability interactions. We’ve been closely monitoring feedback in this thread (as well as the Nightblade Class thread) and have a number of changes planned for how revealing enemy players will work. These changes will not be in the next PTS patch, but will be changed before the Thieves Guild update goes live.
Enemy players using Magelight and Revealing Flare will reveal you and prevent you from returning to stealth and invisibility for 3 seconds, down from 5 seconds.

We like the counterplay that Magelight and Revealing Flare have against stealth and invisibility, but agree the current lockout period is too punishing. Also note that the reveal lockout duration cannot be refreshed. The lockout should only occur if you are pulled out of stealth or invisibility – if you cast Magelight or Revealing Flare on a non-invisible target, it should have no effect.
Piercing Mark will no longer prevent you from entering stealth or invisibility. It will match its behavior currently on the Live megaservers, and will only give the caster of the Piercing Mark unerring vision of you.

Unlike Magelight and Revealing Flare, you can constantly refresh Piercing Mark on an enemy. Being able to indefinitely prevent you from entering stealth or invisibility was too strong, especially since Piercing Mark has an extremely long range and duration.

We’d also like to clarify to say that the current interaction of Clouding Swarm and reveal abilities is intended. The global change to revealing noted above will make this less punishing for players who pick this morph, but we will be keeping a close eye on how it performs when compared to the Devouring Swarm morph.

Thank you zos for listening to feedback. This actually seems fair and balanced

Essiaga · February 2016

ZOS_KNowak wrote: »

Thanks for all the feedback on the new reveal ability interactions. We’ve been closely monitoring feedback in this thread (as well as the Nightblade Class thread) and have a number of changes planned for how revealing enemy players will work. These changes will not be in the next PTS patch, but will be changed before the Thieves Guild update goes live.
Enemy players using Magelight and Revealing Flare will reveal you and prevent you from returning to stealth and invisibility for 3 seconds, down from 5 seconds.

We like the counterplay that Magelight and Revealing Flare have against stealth and invisibility, but agree the current lockout period is too punishing. Also note that the reveal lockout duration cannot be refreshed. The lockout should only occur if you are pulled out of stealth or invisibility – if you cast Magelight or Revealing Flare on a non-invisible target, it should have no effect.
Piercing Mark will no longer prevent you from entering stealth or invisibility. It will match its behavior currently on the Live megaservers, and will only give the caster of the Piercing Mark unerring vision of you.

Unlike Magelight and Revealing Flare, you can constantly refresh Piercing Mark on an enemy. Being able to indefinitely prevent you from entering stealth or invisibility was too strong, especially since Piercing Mark has an extremely long range and duration.

We’d also like to clarify to say that the current interaction of Clouding Swarm and reveal abilities is intended. The global change to revealing noted above will make this less punishing for players who pick this morph, but we will be keeping a close eye on how it performs when compared to the Devouring Swarm morph.

BS on Swarm. It's an ultimate ... But we can't reflect meteor?

Could someone from ZOS acknowledge the Templar ...
http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/245184/official-feedback-thread-for-templars/p1

Xsorus · February 2016

ZOS_KNowak wrote: »

Thanks for all the feedback on the new reveal ability interactions. We’ve been closely monitoring feedback in this thread (as well as the Nightblade Class thread) and have a number of changes planned for how revealing enemy players will work. These changes will not be in the next PTS patch, but will be changed before the Thieves Guild update goes live.
Enemy players using Magelight and Revealing Flare will reveal you and prevent you from returning to stealth and invisibility for 3 seconds, down from 5 seconds.

We like the counterplay that Magelight and Revealing Flare have against stealth and invisibility, but agree the current lockout period is too punishing. Also note that the reveal lockout duration cannot be refreshed. The lockout should only occur if you are pulled out of stealth or invisibility – if you cast Magelight or Revealing Flare on a non-invisible target, it should have no effect.
Piercing Mark will no longer prevent you from entering stealth or invisibility. It will match its behavior currently on the Live megaservers, and will only give the caster of the Piercing Mark unerring vision of you.

Unlike Magelight and Revealing Flare, you can constantly refresh Piercing Mark on an enemy. Being able to indefinitely prevent you from entering stealth or invisibility was too strong, especially since Piercing Mark has an extremely long range and duration.

We’d also like to clarify to say that the current interaction of Clouding Swarm and reveal abilities is intended. The global change to revealing noted above will make this less punishing for players who pick this morph, but we will be keeping a close eye on how it performs when compared to the Devouring Swarm morph.

How does scorching flare work in relation to this? Did you just decrease the damage of it? Cause it the dot duration is 5 seconds and the reveal only lasts 3 seconds you're basically cutting two seconds off the dot duration.

Master_Kas · February 2016

Tryxus wrote: »

Master_Kas wrote: »

ZOS_KNowak wrote: »

Thanks for all the feedback on the new reveal ability interactions. We’ve been closely monitoring feedback in this thread (as well as the Nightblade Class thread) and have a number of changes planned for how revealing enemy players will work. These changes will not be in the next PTS patch, but will be changed before the Thieves Guild update goes live.
Enemy players using Magelight and Revealing Flare will reveal you and prevent you from returning to stealth and invisibility for 3 seconds, down from 5 seconds.

We like the counterplay that Magelight and Revealing Flare have against stealth and invisibility, but agree the current lockout period is too punishing. Also note that the reveal lockout duration cannot be refreshed. The lockout should only occur if you are pulled out of stealth or invisibility – if you cast Magelight or Revealing Flare on a non-invisible target, it should have no effect.
Piercing Mark will no longer prevent you from entering stealth or invisibility. It will match its behavior currently on the Live megaservers, and will only give the caster of the Piercing Mark unerring vision of you.

Unlike Magelight and Revealing Flare, you can constantly refresh Piercing Mark on an enemy. Being able to indefinitely prevent you from entering stealth or invisibility was too strong, especially since Piercing Mark has an extremely long range and duration.

We’d also like to clarify to say that the current interaction of Clouding Swarm and reveal abilities is intended. The global change to revealing noted above will make this less punishing for players who pick this morph, but we will be keeping a close eye on how it performs when compared to the Devouring Swarm morph.

Awsome. That's good enough for me and probably most of the Nightblades out there. Thanks!

Yeah, that's rlly good. A bit of hope in the shadows looking forward even more for TG update now.

Indeed. Was Vicious death purchaseable for AP btw?

5 julianos, 5 vicious death, 2x torugs pact. My mana NB is waiting !

Edit: Get rekt piercing mark spamming snipers

Lava_Croft · February 2016

Clouding Swarm is effectively made useless in the next update while still no sign of it actually being fixed when it comes to Piercing Mark.

laksikus · February 2016

ZOS_KNowak wrote: »

Thanks for all the feedback on the new reveal ability interactions. We’ve been closely monitoring feedback in this thread (as well as the Nightblade Class thread) and have a number of changes planned for how revealing enemy players will work. These changes will not be in the next PTS patch, but will be changed before the Thieves Guild update goes live.
Enemy players using Magelight and Revealing Flare will reveal you and prevent you from returning to stealth and invisibility for 3 seconds, down from 5 seconds.

We like the counterplay that Magelight and Revealing Flare have against stealth and invisibility, but agree the current lockout period is too punishing. Also note that the reveal lockout duration cannot be refreshed. The lockout should only occur if you are pulled out of stealth or invisibility – if you cast Magelight or Revealing Flare on a non-invisible target, it should have no effect.
Piercing Mark will no longer prevent you from entering stealth or invisibility. It will match its behavior currently on the Live megaservers, and will only give the caster of the Piercing Mark unerring vision of you.

Unlike Magelight and Revealing Flare, you can constantly refresh Piercing Mark on an enemy. Being able to indefinitely prevent you from entering stealth or invisibility was too strong, especially since Piercing Mark has an extremely long range and duration.

We’d also like to clarify to say that the current interaction of Clouding Swarm and reveal abilities is intended. The global change to revealing noted above will make this less punishing for players who pick this morph, but we will be keeping a close eye on how it performs when compared to the Devouring Swarm morph.

Great news, but what about the Bug where Single target npc attacks pull you out of cloak on pts?

olsborg · February 2016

Erondil wrote: »

Bashev wrote: »

ZOS_KNowak wrote: »

Thanks for all the feedback on the new reveal ability interactions. We’ve been closely monitoring feedback in this thread (as well as the Nightblade Class thread) and have a number of changes planned for how revealing enemy players will work. These changes will not be in the next PTS patch, but will be changed before the Thieves Guild update goes live.
Enemy players using Magelight and Revealing Flare will reveal you and prevent you from returning to stealth and invisibility for 3 seconds, down from 5 seconds.

We like the counterplay that Magelight and Revealing Flare have against stealth and invisibility, but agree the current lockout period is too punishing. Also note that the reveal lockout duration cannot be refreshed. The lockout should only occur if you are pulled out of stealth or invisibility – if you cast Magelight or Revealing Flare on a non-invisible target, it should have no effect.
Piercing Mark will no longer prevent you from entering stealth or invisibility. It will match its behavior currently on the Live megaservers, and will only give the caster of the Piercing Mark unerring vision of you.

Unlike Magelight and Revealing Flare, you can constantly refresh Piercing Mark on an enemy. Being able to indefinitely prevent you from entering stealth or invisibility was too strong, especially since Piercing Mark has an extremely long range and duration.

We’d also like to clarify to say that the current interaction of Clouding Swarm and reveal abilities is intended. The global change to revealing noted above will make this less punishing for players who pick this morph, but we will be keeping a close eye on how it performs when compared to the Devouring Swarm morph.

And again ZoS heart the crying NBs while Templars.... they are templars. Revealing Flare will be pointless again. Thank you ZoS.
I can see a 4 men NB bomb squad jumping killing and disappearing. The whine for nerf magicka NB will be so loud next patch.

Clouding swarm is not only a nightblade skill though, and that's what this thread is about... Concerning other changes listed here, I think it's a good move. Since 1.7, ZOS started to nerf every escape abilities and mechanics because of complaints on forums about sorc streaking, stam builds fleeing and nightblades cloaking. While those mechanics were maybe annoying in few others situations, their heavy nerf extremly favored the zerg to kill fewer numbers trying to run away, and destroyed alot of "true" smallscale players/groups. Changes to invisibility counters goes in the opposite direction, and it's imo a good thing. Would be nice to see bow speed and streak change reverted aswell so more than 1 class can solo tho..

Couldnt agree more, ZOS has made the game less and less about L2P and more into L2Z (Zerg)

Jeezye · February 2016

What exactly does happen to clouding swarm now? Do you get pulled out of the swarm when hit my magelight/ flare ?
I thought they wanted to give ultimates back their unique effects, noone wants to go clouding swarm when 3/4 of all players will be using magelight.

Chrlynsch · February 2016

Another confirmed nerf for vampires! And therefore...

Step One: nerf vampire and abilities into the ground
Step two: allow players to buy the skill line with cash
Step three: nerf vampire some more so everyone drops vampire
Step four: create new skills and buff Vampire again
Step five: profit!

Not bad zos... not bad...

TX12001rwb17_ESO · February 2016

Here is the thing Clouding swarm grants PERFECT Invisibility..not that imperfect invisibility that NBS use, with clouding swarm your allies cant even see you when you use it so piercing mark and magelight should not effect it at all.

Last I checked judging by the visuals don't you turn into those bats that are flying around? the visuals sure point to it being that seeing as unlike devouring swarm the bats come out of the player then cluster together as the player reforms, it would explain why allies cant see you when you use it and if that's the case then it isn't invisibility then is it and thus magelight and piercing mark shouldn't have an effect on it at all.

TX12001rwb17_ESO · February 2016

Oh yeah BTW Clouding swarm has no effect on NPCS, they can still see you when you use it.

duncan_cougarpreeb18_ESO · February 2016

You call 3 seconds lock out balanced? ...

Only if you also put a lock out on bolt escape and dragon wings , plus make biting jabs have a cast time
If those changes (crippling essential skills for each and every class) is what you consider balanced, then sure, cripple NBs too. Otherwise its still about as balanced as a one legged horse.

No they just made cloak being broken official

No stamina regeneration while sneaking, no dot removal on dark cloak and with stealth not being an option for anything any longer, just effectively removed the shadow barrier passive and crippled the Khajits racial passive as well.

<irony> Well done ZOS </irony>

BEZDNA · February 2016

ZOS_KNowak wrote: »

Enemy players using Magelight and Revealing Flare will reveal you and prevent you from returning to stealth and invisibility for 3 seconds, down from 5 seconds.

We like the counterplay that Magelight and Revealing Flare have against stealth and invisibility, but agree the current lockout period is too punishing. Also note that the reveal lockout duration cannot be refreshed. The lockout should only occur if you are pulled out of stealth or invisibility – if you cast Magelight or Revealing Flare on a non-invisible target, it should have no effect.

These change to Revealing Flare feels so wrong. I have nothing against Magelight change and Piercing Mark, but why Reveling Flare? It is a skill which direct objective to counter stealth and invisible enemies.

Correct me if i'm wrong, but if i place Revealing Flare on a ground, enemy nightblade runs into it without being invisible he will be able to cloak straight away as soon as he will leave these area? That is just wrong. It doesn't work these way on live. Once you got debuffed you can't go invisible for 8 seconds and if you got debuffed again - then you can't go invisible for 8 seconds more. If not beeing able to cloak is too punishing, then make it the same way as on live - you can cloak but you will be visible to everyone. Why do we have such a skill if it is so useless then? It is the only reliable counter to cloak we have right now on live ( apart from mark), please don't ruin it. Not beeing able to cloak for 3 sec and can't be replayed - that is just nothing.

Bring it back to be visible for 8 seconds and could be reapplied as it is on live. (not to not beeing able to cloak for 3 sec)

@ZOS_KNowak

Junkogen · February 2016

BEZDNA wrote: »

ZOS_KNowak wrote: »

Enemy players using Magelight and Revealing Flare will reveal you and prevent you from returning to stealth and invisibility for 3 seconds, down from 5 seconds.

We like the counterplay that Magelight and Revealing Flare have against stealth and invisibility, but agree the current lockout period is too punishing. Also note that the reveal lockout duration cannot be refreshed. The lockout should only occur if you are pulled out of stealth or invisibility – if you cast Magelight or Revealing Flare on a non-invisible target, it should have no effect.

These change to Revealing Flare feels so wrong. I have nothing against Magelight change and Piercing Mark, but why Reveling Flare? It is a skill which direct objective to counter stealth and invisible enemies.

Correct me if i'm wrong, but if i place Revealing Flare on a ground, enemy nightblade runs into it without being invisible he will be able to cloak straight away as soon as he will leave these area? That is just wrong. It doesn't work these way on live. Once you got debuffed you can't go invisible for 8 seconds and if you got debuffed again - then you can't go invisible for 8 seconds more. If not beeing able to cloak is too punishing, then make it the same way as on live - you can cloak but you will be visible to everyone. Why do we have such a skill if it is so useless then? It is the only reliable counter to cloak we have right now on live ( apart from mark), please don't ruin it. Not beeing able to cloak for 3 sec and can't be replayed - that is just nothing.

Bring it back to be visible for 8 seconds and could be reapplied as it is on live. (not to not beeing able to cloak for 3 sec)

@ZOS_KNowak

Only reliable counter? I swear people are intentionally obtuse. There are so many counters to cloak. Pick an AOE. It's the easiest option. The overexaggeration with Cloak and stealth is getting way out of hand. It's being nerfed and you're getting yet another more powerful option with magelight.

Stop this madness.

lolo_01b16_ESO · February 2016

Jeezye wrote: »

What exactly does happen to clouding swarm now? Do you get pulled out of the swarm when hit my magelight/ flare ?
I thought they wanted to give ultimates back their unique effects, noone wants to go clouding swarm when 3/4 of all players will be using magelight.

Clouding swarm behaves similar to the unmorphed swarm if any of your enemies uses magelight. Which makes me sad. One the one hand they make meteor unreflectable, so you can't counter an ultimate with a normal skill, and then they allow magelight to counter clouding swarm.

Btw, if you (or someone else) use purge while being locked out of cloak, you can use it again, but it will only consume your magicka, but not make you invisable.

BEZDNA · February 2016

Junkogen wrote: »

Only reliable counter? I swear people are intentionally obtuse. There are so many counters to cloak. Pick an AOE. It's the easiest option. The overexaggeration with Cloak and stealth is getting way out of hand. It's being nerfed and you're getting yet another more powerful option with magelight.

Stop this madness.

Yes it is the ONLY reliable counter apart from mark which is only available for nightblades. And by reliable i mean that it works in 100% of stations. You can slot AoE and play a gambling game spamming talons or steel tornado and hoping that you will accidentally hit an escaping nightblades, but that is not relabel: 50% of the time i find myself wasting resources for nothing.

I have 3 nightblades myself and i know what i'm talking about and can feel the how it is for both sides. I'm not asking for a cloak nerf, but i also don't want counters to cloak be nerfed because of

Junkogen wrote: »

obtuse

ppl who will instantly start QQ whenever their favorite skill is being involved.

Junkogen · February 2016

BEZDNA wrote: »

Junkogen wrote: »

Only reliable counter? I swear people are intentionally obtuse. There are so many counters to cloak. Pick an AOE. It's the easiest option. The overexaggeration with Cloak and stealth is getting way out of hand. It's being nerfed and you're getting yet another more powerful option with magelight.

Stop this madness.

Yes it is the ONLY reliable counter apart from mark which is only available for nightblades. And by reliable i mean that it works in 100% of stations. You can slot AoE and play a gambling game spamming talons or steel tornado and hoping that you will accidentally hit an escaping nightblades, but that is not relabel: 50% of the time i find myself wasting resources for nothing.

I have 3 nightblades myself and i know what i'm talking about and can feel the how it is for both sides. I'm not asking for a cloak nerf, but i also don't want counters to cloak be nerfed because of

Junkogen wrote: »

obtuse

ppl who will instantly start QQ whenever their favorite skill is being involved.

You just said 50% of the time it works. Other classes defenses work 100% of the time. That's what people don't get. NBs don't have any other defense. I just don't get it. I don't care how many NBs you have. You still have some warped idea of how powerful cloaking is. It's not that powerful. Really. I'm just sick of the exaggerated claims.

It's interesting how you claim that I'm whining, when you're the one complaining and asking for more indirect nerfs to a skill. I'm sick of the ridiculous exaggerations going on about cloak when I see Sorcs, DKs, and Templars tanking half a raid group while still being able to get kills. NBs run. They're not tanking whole groups while mowing down hordes. They run sometimes as part of their defense. Sorry you can't get every last kill. I just don't agree with you and think you have an unfounded complaint.

BEZDNA · February 2016

It's just ridiculous how you turn conversation into anti nerf cloak direction. Same here, as you sad: "I'm just sick of the exaggerated claims." You're doing exactly same thing you're sick of.

The Issue i talk is that according to previous dev post Revealing Flare got double nerf and these nerfs not seems to be intentional. And what is more frustrating is that we will not be able to test it on pts and provide feedback.

Junkogen wrote: »

You still have some warped idea of how powerful cloaking is.

Where exactly i sad i single word about cloak being too powerful?

Junkogen wrote: »

It's interesting how you claim that I'm whining, when you're the one complaining and asking for more indirect nerfs to a skill.

I don't ask for indirect nerfs to cloak. But i'm against of direct multiple nerfs to Revealing Flare.

BEZDNA · February 2016

double post, plz delete.

Lava_Croft · February 2016

If only Shadow Cloak was as reliable as stacking shields...

Jeezye · February 2016

Jeezye wrote: »
What exactly does happen to clouding swarm now? Do you get pulled out of the swarm when hit my magelight/ flare ?
I thought they wanted to give ultimates back their unique effects, noone wants to go clouding swarm when 3/4 of all players will be using magelight.

Clouding swarm behaves similar to the unmorphed swarm if any of your enemies uses magelight. Which makes me sad. One the one hand they make meteor unreflectable, so you can't counter an ultimate with a normal skill, and then they allow magelight to counter clouding swarm.

Btw, if you (or someone else) use purge while being locked out of cloak, you can use it again, but it will only consume your magicka, but not make you invisable.

well if this is the case theres finally not a single reason to go vamp anymore. this is awesome, vamps are by far in the worst spot and now noone will use it at all. There's literary not a single vamp skill that is effective/ working as intended while all passives make tham weak as hell.

Gratz for finally removing vamps from the game!

Autolycus · February 2016

Wow this thread is just so full of QQ. Using words like "nobody" and "everyone"

ZOS_KNowak wrote: »

Thanks for all the feedback on the new reveal ability interactions. We’ve been closely monitoring feedback in this thread (as well as the Nightblade Class thread) and have a number of changes planned for how revealing enemy players will work. These changes will not be in the next PTS patch, but will be changed before the Thieves Guild update goes live.
Enemy players using Magelight and Revealing Flare will reveal you and prevent you from returning to stealth and invisibility for 3 seconds, down from 5 seconds.

We like the counterplay that Magelight and Revealing Flare have against stealth and invisibility, but agree the current lockout period is too punishing. Also note that the reveal lockout duration cannot be refreshed. The lockout should only occur if you are pulled out of stealth or invisibility – if you cast Magelight or Revealing Flare on a non-invisible target, it should have no effect.
Piercing Mark will no longer prevent you from entering stealth or invisibility. It will match its behavior currently on the Live megaservers, and will only give the caster of the Piercing Mark unerring vision of you.

Unlike Magelight and Revealing Flare, you can constantly refresh Piercing Mark on an enemy. Being able to indefinitely prevent you from entering stealth or invisibility was too strong, especially since Piercing Mark has an extremely long range and duration.

We’d also like to clarify to say that the current interaction of Clouding Swarm and reveal abilities is intended. The global change to revealing noted above will make this less punishing for players who pick this morph, but we will be keeping a close eye on how it performs when compared to the Devouring Swarm morph.

And what of the issue regarding skill-locking NBs? The prevention of returning to stealth was not the issue. Leave it at 5 seconds if you want, but skill-locking a class is broken by design. Would it be okay to put a skill in the Fighter's Guild skill line that prevents templars from casting their BoL, and a skill that prevents sorcs from casting damage shields?

I don't consider this to be a real fix. I personally couldn't care less about 5 seconds vs 3 seconds of preventing stealth. All I care about is being able to actually cast my skills. Keep NBs from going invisible, fine. But don't prevent them from casting skills that are tied to passives.

TheM0rganism · February 2016

Junkogen wrote: »

BEZDNA wrote: »

Junkogen wrote: »

Only reliable counter? I swear people are intentionally obtuse. There are so many counters to cloak. Pick an AOE. It's the easiest option. The overexaggeration with Cloak and stealth is getting way out of hand. It's being nerfed and you're getting yet another more powerful option with magelight.

Stop this madness.

Yes it is the ONLY reliable counter apart from mark which is only available for nightblades. And by reliable i mean that it works in 100% of stations. You can slot AoE and play a gambling game spamming talons or steel tornado and hoping that you will accidentally hit an escaping nightblades, but that is not relabel: 50% of the time i find myself wasting resources for nothing.

I have 3 nightblades myself and i know what i'm talking about and can feel the how it is for both sides. I'm not asking for a cloak nerf, but i also don't want counters to cloak be nerfed because of

Junkogen wrote: »

obtuse

ppl who will instantly start QQ whenever their favorite skill is being involved.

You just said 50% of the time it works. Other classes defenses work 100% of the time. That's what people don't get. NBs don't have any other defense. I just don't get it. I don't care how many NBs you have. You still have some warped idea of how powerful cloaking is. It's not that powerful. Really. I'm just sick of the exaggerated claims.

It's interesting how you claim that I'm whining, when you're the one complaining and asking for more indirect nerfs to a skill. I'm sick of the ridiculous exaggerations going on about cloak when I see Sorcs, DKs, and Templars tanking half a raid group while still being able to get kills. NBs run. They're not tanking whole groups while mowing down hordes. They run sometimes as part of their defense. Sorry you can't get every last kill. I just don't agree with you and think you have an unfounded complaint.

NBs do have other defenses, though. Magblade-Tanks are incredibly deadly and durable, except every single magblade builds around the same two active skills because you're water...you will always flow to the path of least resistance.

Why would you pass up synergizing something like 7 passives off of one active skill MULTIPLE times throughout a fight when not a single other class can, giving Magblades the most potent advantage in all of PvP? I mean, you'd be stupid not to run the same cookie-cutter-cloak like everyone else. Nerfing cloak would just force NB players to actually learn how to fight (like everyone else) and use more weapon skills (like everyone else). Should it be reined in some? I don't know, nor care. It's just a fact that NBs have a disproportionately over-powered skill when compared to all the class abilities of the other three.

But I digress, this thread is about Clouding Swarm. Not having it's invis broken, constantly, by Inner Light undermines the entire point of counterplay. If I'm going to waste a slot to counter a specific skill that's a cost-benefit choice I need to make considering I could have slotted something else there that offers more damage, defense, or healing.

It's like ZOS doesn't want Vampire Hunter builds or something.