Can we have Undaunted 9 handed to us as well?

Islyn · February 2016

Why don't we just give everyone all max skills unlocked and an Urn with all Monster Sets at v16, 501 CP and AR Rank 50 when we click the thing to skip the opening whatever with Cadwell.

Robotmafia wrote: »

guys guys calm down.. theres no point... this is how ZOS sees things

PVE > PVP
Casual > HC players
mainstream > dedicated players
money > all (in the end they are a business so u cant blame them for how our world works)

Rubbish or else the Nerfs and vendor wouldn't be there. Just stop with this misinformation.

People aren't happy how things are zos (and damn me for even the appearance of defending them) is just trying to find a middle ground. So maybe rather than the middle finger, we all could look for middle ground instead.

Tyrion87 · February 2016

Levelling Undaunted is not that slow and time-consuming as progression within Alliance War.
When the patch is applied, the time needed to level up both of these skill lines will be comparable.
Enough said.

Islyn · February 2016

Ballzy321 wrote: »

Undaunted is handed to us. Knock normal dailys out everyday 10 min a day less than a month To get it. I don't get how you can compare the two. I think undaunted should be as big as a grind as assault.

Dailies are not 10 min a day. For in and out and turn in for 10 points for silver and 20 points for gold, both are circa 30 min total if you're with a group that doesn't take over 7 minutes to kill the engine Guardian...lol but yeah.

Count 15 min per pledge.

Also, do the timed, no deaths etc on easy modes and also all hard modes you haven't and complete Deadlands Savvy and you'll be close

IcyDeadPeople · February 2016

Ballzy321 wrote: »

Undaunted is handed to us. Knock normal dailys out everyday 10 min a day less than a month To get it. I don't get how you can compare the two. I think undaunted should be as big as a grind as assault.

If you enjoy doing dailies, it can be fun. If you hate PVE dungeons, it's not fun.

Artjuh90 wrote: »

why do you want skills that are necesary for certain builds behind walls? dont see any other MMO do this. and it really doesn't make sense

I'm in favor of people being able to be competitive in the game doing the aspects they enjoy. Some players hate PVP and others hate PVE. (A lot of people do enjoy both, however.)

Why should any of us spend any time at all doing something we hate? This is how you get burned out on the game. It's supposed to be entertainment, right? A recreational activity we can hop on and have fun for a couple hours, rather than a job of drudgery where you feel "Oh god, I have to grind X for another 30 hours," etc.

DRXHarbinger · February 2016

dlepi24 wrote: »

You've essentially taken something that takes months to get (alliance rank 10) and now allowing players to get it within a day or two. I don't agree with that at all, but if you're going through with it can you do the same thing on the other side of the spectrum? I don't want to do PvE just as these others don't want to PvP. If you're making it easier for them to get all their skills/passives in 1/10th of the XP, canwe get the same for Undaunted? I'm not sure of the current XP requirements for Undaunted 9 but I'd like to be able to get it in 1/10th of the XP, as well.

Seriously lol, who doesn't have this on their mains yet? Everyone cries oh I've done ICP 100,000,000 times and no helm has ever dropped for me I hate RNG but then doesn't have Undaunted 9? How come no one has it? seems like it's making threads for the sake of it, it's easy to get and 99% of regular players do, it's like 30 pledges and less time than alliance ever will be.

Jaeysa · February 2016

IcyDeadPeople wrote: »

Ballzy321 wrote: »

Undaunted is handed to us. Knock normal dailys out everyday 10 min a day less than a month To get it. I don't get how you can compare the two. I think undaunted should be as big as a grind as assault.

If you enjoy doing dailies, it can be fun. If you hate PVE dungeons, it's not fun.

Artjuh90 wrote: »

why do you want skills that are necesary for certain builds behind walls? dont see any other MMO do this. and it really doesn't make sense

I'm in favor of people being able to be competitive in the game doing the aspects they enjoy. Some players hate PVP and others hate PVE. (A lot of people do enjoy both, however.)

Why should any of us spend any time at all doing something we hate? This is how you get burned out on the game. It's supposed to be entertainment, right? A recreational activity we can hop on and have fun for a couple hours, rather than a job of drudgery where you feel "Oh god, I have to grind X for another 30 hours," etc.

It would be nice if it was that simple, but Undaunted Mettle is I believe fully unlocked at undaunted 9 - and that's a big help to any magicka build. I don't blame people for not wanting to grind day in day out in content that drives them up the walls.

IcyDeadPeople · February 2016

Jaeysa wrote: »

IcyDeadPeople wrote: »

Ballzy321 wrote: »

Undaunted is handed to us. Knock normal dailys out everyday 10 min a day less than a month To get it. I don't get how you can compare the two. I think undaunted should be as big as a grind as assault.

If you enjoy doing dailies, it can be fun. If you hate PVE dungeons, it's not fun.

Artjuh90 wrote: »

why do you want skills that are necesary for certain builds behind walls? dont see any other MMO do this. and it really doesn't make sense

I'm in favor of people being able to be competitive in the game doing the aspects they enjoy. Some players hate PVP and others hate PVE. (A lot of people do enjoy both, however.)

Why should any of us spend any time at all doing something we hate? This is how you get burned out on the game. It's supposed to be entertainment, right? A recreational activity we can hop on and have fun for a couple hours, rather than a job of drudgery where you feel "Oh god, I have to grind X for another 30 hours," etc.

It would be nice if it was that simple, but Undaunted Mettle is I believe fully unlocked at undaunted 9 - and that's a big help to any magicka build. I don't blame people for not wanting to grind day in day out in content that drives them up the walls.

Undaunted 9 requires 1300 rep points, equivalent of running 65 gold pledges, 130 silver pledges or 260 bronze pledges. In my case, in the couple years I've been playing, I've only done about 3 or 4 pledges in total and never completed any trials. If I have a limited time to play, I choose to spend it in Cyrodiil rather than running dungeons over and over, even if it means giving up on ever earning trial gear, maelstrom weapons, monster helm sets or undaunted passive, etc.

I'd say this is more of a difference in perspective. If you enjoy PVP, getting to Veteran (326k AP) or First Sergeant (1.6m AP) is not a grind, it's fun. For some players Cyrodiil is what the game is all about.

For others, it's all about running pledges and trials. If you enjoy PVE dungeons, then running 60 gold pledges can be fun as well.
.

Islyn · February 2016

IcyDeadPeople wrote: »

Jaeysa wrote: »

IcyDeadPeople wrote: »

Ballzy321 wrote: »

Undaunted is handed to us. Knock normal dailys out everyday 10 min a day less than a month To get it. I don't get how you can compare the two. I think undaunted should be as big as a grind as assault.

If you enjoy doing dailies, it can be fun. If you hate PVE dungeons, it's not fun.

Artjuh90 wrote: »

why do you want skills that are necesary for certain builds behind walls? dont see any other MMO do this. and it really doesn't make sense

I'm in favor of people being able to be competitive in the game doing the aspects they enjoy. Some players hate PVP and others hate PVE. (A lot of people do enjoy both, however.)

Why should any of us spend any time at all doing something we hate? This is how you get burned out on the game. It's supposed to be entertainment, right? A recreational activity we can hop on and have fun for a couple hours, rather than a job of drudgery where you feel "Oh god, I have to grind X for another 30 hours," etc.

It would be nice if it was that simple, but Undaunted Mettle is I believe fully unlocked at undaunted 9 - and that's a big help to any magicka build. I don't blame people for not wanting to grind day in day out in content that drives them up the walls.

Undaunted 9 requires 1300 rep points, equivalent of running 65 gold pledges, 130 silver pledges or 260 bronze pledges. In my case, in the couple years I've been playing, I've only done about 3 or 4 pledges in total and never completed any trials. If I have a limited time to play, I'd rather spend it in Cyrodiil than running dungeons over and over, even if it means giving up on monster helm sets or the undaunted passive, etc.

It's nothing more than a difference in perspective. If you enjoy PVP, getting to Veteran (326k AP) or First Sergeant (1.6m AP) is not a grind, it's fun. For some players Cyrodiil is what the game is all about.

For others, it's all about running pledges and trials. If you enjoy PVE dungeons, then running 60 gold pledges can be fun as well.
.

You look at veteran dungeons in achievement tab and you see there are many 50 point ones you only need to do a few dungeons to get.

All no deaths, all speed, all hard modes that adds up to a lot and also all group dungeons (not delves) and their quests are even more and when you finish all from each alliance, you get a free 50 points from each of those 3 simple achievements. Scale them down to lvl 20 and just nuke the place. Rinse and repeat.

Robotmafia · February 2016

Islyn wrote: »

Why don't we just give everyone all max skills unlocked and an Urn with all Monster Sets at v16, 501 CP and AR Rank 50 when we click the thing to skip the opening whatever with Cadwell.

Robotmafia wrote: »

guys guys calm down.. theres no point... this is how ZOS sees things

PVE > PVP
Casual > HC players
mainstream > dedicated players
money > all (in the end they are a business so u cant blame them for how our world works)

Rubbish or else the Nerfs and vendor wouldn't be there. Just stop with this misinformation.

People aren't happy how things are zos (and damn me for even the appearance of defending them) is just trying to find a middle ground. So maybe rather than the middle finger, we all could look for middle ground instead.

lol misinformation? its my opinion... and that of many others... this game clearly has a stronger focus to pve... im not saying the put 0 focus into pvp but its is definetly not balanced... which doesnt have to be a bad thing but that is the way it is IMO

Aquanova · February 2016

Artjuh90 wrote: »

Llyw wrote: »

Artjuh90 wrote: »

dlepi24 wrote: »

You've essentially taken something that takes months to get (alliance rank 10) and now allowing players to get it within a day or two. I don't agree with that at all, but if you're going through with it can you do the same thing on the other side of the spectrum? I don't want to do PvE just as these others don't want to PvP. If you're making it easier for them to get all their skills/passives in 1/10th of the XP, canwe get the same for Undaunted? I'm not sure of the current XP requirements for Undaunted 9 but I'd like to be able to get it in 1/10th of the XP, as well.

getting easy gear with the trait you want isn't enough. plz

Here we go again, another trying to equate skill line with item pieces. You folks just wont quit, well a lot of folks I believe aren't buying your smoke and mirrors.

Also EVERYONE can buy PvP and Undaunted sets with GOLD and AP. So he is actual everyone, Yep that's right, even YOU.

The OP has a good point, if PvP skill line is 1/10th of what it is now, why is it that Undaunted skill line not be 1/10th of what it is now. Does that actually some how hurt PvE player and if so how?

the passives are a minor boost to you character though while many builds use skills from the alliance skill tree's. THAT'S a large difference

^THIS

laksikus · February 2016

LBxFinalDeath wrote: »

I don't even understand why you'd even ask this?

If you're any decent at PvP you should have no issue breezing through the vet dungeons and getting undaunted 9. (No reason for 10)

Asking for undaunted to be handed to you pretty much is admitting your build is garbage, I guess.

same as every PVEer not being able to farm AP, admitting they are garbage and cant undrstand game mechanics

NBrookus · February 2016

Islyn wrote: »

I want to know what alliance level you get max skills now?

Like I am AR 13. What do I need to be to get Proxi Det now?

It was 15 before IIRC....

My sorc is AR8 or 9; I just checked and prox det was unlocked. So pretty early.

I'm all for unlocking the skills much sooner, especially vigor, but I think they maybe swung too far in that direction.

Islyn · February 2016

NBrookus wrote: »

Islyn wrote: »

I want to know what alliance level you get max skills now?

Like I am AR 13. What do I need to be to get Proxi Det now?

It was 15 before IIRC....

My sorc is AR8 or 9; I just checked and prox det was unlocked. So pretty early.

I'm all for unlocking the skills much sooner, especially vigor, but I think they maybe swung too far in that direction.

Huh. I really hate to admit this but I think you guys (others have said it's too far too) may be right.

Thank you for the details...:-)

Edited to add: wait, are we sure they're not all unlocked for everyone for testing?

Just double checking...

myrrrorb14_ESO · February 2016

Lol

Yeah, it's so similar. You want Undaunted? You can have it. Takes like a week if you actually do it. Pledges alone get you there fast. Get a guild and grind them out over a weekend and done.

Alliance ranks take millions of AP. Which is easy enough for those that grind out 1 million per week. But is still a grind for most.

Not sure how much they nerfed the ranks, but it needed a bit of an adjustment.

Btw, I'm serious. You can have the Undaunted for just stepping in a dungeon as far as I'm concerned. All its saving you is 10-20 hours of play. Shoot, put it in the Crown store.

SneaK · February 2016

I just want them to sell off other player's character's in the crown store. Oh, that EP V16 sorc just wrecked me, so I bought his character right out from under him, got heeeeemmm.

munkt0r · February 2016

Can someone please explain what it is being discussed here regarding Assault/Support skill lines "handed" to people?

Xendyn · February 2016

myrrrorb14_ESO wrote: »

Lol

Yeah, it's so similar. You want Undaunted? You can have it. Takes like a week if you actually do it. Pledges alone get you there fast. Get a guild and grind them out over a weekend and done.

Alliance ranks take millions of AP. Which is easy enough for those that grind out 1 million per week. But is still a grind for most.

Not sure how much they nerfed the ranks, but it needed a bit of an adjustment.

Btw, I'm serious. You can have the Undaunted for just stepping in a dungeon as far as I'm concerned. All its saving you is 10-20 hours of play. Shoot, put it in the Crown store.

They slashed it by 90%
That's more than a bit.
no joking.

olsborg · February 2016

Undaunted mettle needs to be achievable for pvpers too, it has a pretty big impact in pvp and currently you can only get it if you group up for some pve, EQUALITY FOR ALL PLS!

WalkingLegacy · February 2016

What a joke - after every player has rank ten, what progression is left for PvP?

Are they giving up on fixing Cyrodil/PvP so they just want everyone to get their Alliance war skillsets faster?

yodased · February 2016

So many threads.

The question remains: does it matter?

The concept that a diminished reward should only be available for one set of variables in a video game that tries to incorporate chaos of humans into it is, well, dumb.

Again: Does it matter, anyway?

If the best gear and access to abilities was the separator of this or any other video game, there would not be video games.

The separation is the knowledge and intelligence of the player, their ability to use their surroundings and abilities in ways that confuse and disorientate their enemies, especially here in this game.

Give the same exact character to a person who worked their way through 100m AP to level 50 and someone who worked through 10m and you know exactly what will happen, come on.

If you are letting someone else's journey to the same destination affect your personal well being, that is a bigger issue than a video game.

This some how cheapens your experience? It makes what you did less "worthy" some how?

Does it matter? not. at. all.

rfennell_ESO · February 2016

I'd love to get undaunted line for free.

Because I grinded it out once and them I did it again... and I'm not doing it ever again.

Emma_Overload · February 2016

Llyw wrote: »

Artjuh90 wrote: »

dlepi24 wrote: »

You've essentially taken something that takes months to get (alliance rank 10) and now allowing players to get it within a day or two. I don't agree with that at all, but if you're going through with it can you do the same thing on the other side of the spectrum? I don't want to do PvE just as these others don't want to PvP. If you're making it easier for them to get all their skills/passives in 1/10th of the XP, canwe get the same for Undaunted? I'm not sure of the current XP requirements for Undaunted 9 but I'd like to be able to get it in 1/10th of the XP, as well.

getting easy gear with the trait you want isn't enough. plz

Here we go again, another trying to equate skill line with item pieces. You folks just wont quit, well a lot of folks I believe aren't buying your smoke and mirrors.

Also EVERYONE can buy PvP and Undaunted sets with GOLD and AP. So he is actual everyone, Yep that's right, even YOU.

The OP has a good point, if PvP skill line is 1/10th of what it is now, why is it that Undaunted skill line not be 1/10th of what it is now. Does that actually some how hurt PvE player and if so how?

Why do you assume that PvE players care if you get Undaunted ranks? We don't. They can nerf Undaunted ranks the same as Alliance for all I care.

Islyn · February 2016

Emma_Eunjung wrote: »

Llyw wrote: »

Artjuh90 wrote: »

dlepi24 wrote: »

You've essentially taken something that takes months to get (alliance rank 10) and now allowing players to get it within a day or two. I don't agree with that at all, but if you're going through with it can you do the same thing on the other side of the spectrum? I don't want to do PvE just as these others don't want to PvP. If you're making it easier for them to get all their skills/passives in 1/10th of the XP, canwe get the same for Undaunted? I'm not sure of the current XP requirements for Undaunted 9 but I'd like to be able to get it in 1/10th of the XP, as well.

getting easy gear with the trait you want isn't enough. plz

Here we go again, another trying to equate skill line with item pieces. You folks just wont quit, well a lot of folks I believe aren't buying your smoke and mirrors.

Also EVERYONE can buy PvP and Undaunted sets with GOLD and AP. So he is actual everyone, Yep that's right, even YOU.

The OP has a good point, if PvP skill line is 1/10th of what it is now, why is it that Undaunted skill line not be 1/10th of what it is now. Does that actually some how hurt PvE player and if so how?

Why do you assume that PvE players care if you get Undaunted ranks? We don't. They can nerf Undaunted ranks the same as Alliance for all I care.

Yeah and not a one of us that I've ever seen has said contrary to the above.

Our issue was that we have horrid RNG and now because of pvp wah anyone can buy the same stuff that I know personally took one guy over 60 dc runs to get because I was there for the 57-63rd when he got it. (Their normal healer was away so I ran the grind for the afternoon with them).

I cared a lot and bitched and moaned about the masks heads hats whatever.... but then I was like whatever. I'd help that same guy farm gold or lend it to him to buy it so....have at it.

tplink3r1 · February 2016

Llyw wrote: »

Artjuh90 wrote: »

dlepi24 wrote: »

You've essentially taken something that takes months to get (alliance rank 10) and now allowing players to get it within a day or two. I don't agree with that at all, but if you're going through with it can you do the same thing on the other side of the spectrum? I don't want to do PvE just as these others don't want to PvP. If you're making it easier for them to get all their skills/passives in 1/10th of the XP, canwe get the same for Undaunted? I'm not sure of the current XP requirements for Undaunted 9 but I'd like to be able to get it in 1/10th of the XP, as well.

getting easy gear with the trait you want isn't enough. plz

Here we go again, another trying to equate skill line with item pieces. You folks just wont quit, well a lot of folks I believe aren't buying your smoke and mirrors.

Also EVERYONE can buy PvP and Undaunted sets with GOLD and AP. So he is actual everyone, Yep that's right, even YOU.

The OP has a good point, if PvP skill line is 1/10th of what it is now, why is it that Undaunted skill line not be 1/10th of what it is now. Does that actually some how hurt PvE player and if so how?

Alliance War skill line...

IcyDeadPeople · February 2016

Islyn wrote: »

Artjuh90 wrote: »

dlepi24 wrote: »

You've essentially taken something that takes months to get (alliance rank 10) and now allowing players to get it within a day or two. I don't agree with that at all, but if you're going through with it can you do the same thing on the other side of the spectrum? I don't want to do PvE just as these others don't want to PvP. If you're making it easier for them to get all their skills/passives in 1/10th of the XP, canwe get the same for Undaunted? I'm not sure of the current XP requirements for Undaunted 9 but I'd like to be able to get it in 1/10th of the XP, as well.

getting easy gear with the trait you want isn't enough. plz

I want to know what alliance level you get max skills now?

Like I am AR 13. What do I need to be to get Proxi Det now?

It was 15 before IIRC....

Right now on PTS, you only need 90k AP for Vigor, 150k AP for Caltrops/Barrier and 210k AP for Magicka Detonation.

It doesn't quite match up with the alliance rank anymore. Basically on PTS you get Vigor by the time you are Tyro grade 2, then Caltrops, Barrier and Magicka Detonation while you are still Legionary.

ThePonzzz · February 2016

Man, make caltrops easier to get and then remove the siphoning attacks proc.

Phinix1 · February 2016

dlepi24 wrote: »

You've essentially taken something that takes months to get (alliance rank 10) and now allowing players to get it within a day or two. I don't agree with that at all, but if you're going through with it can you do the same thing on the other side of the spectrum? I don't want to do PvE just as these others don't want to PvP. If you're making it easier for them to get all their skills/passives in 1/10th of the XP, canwe get the same for Undaunted? I'm not sure of the current XP requirements for Undaunted 9 but I'd like to be able to get it in 1/10th of the XP, as well.

It always baffles me how people can be so petty as to care how hard it is for others. It is honestly like people can't appreciate what they have unless they are comparing it to others that don't.

Yet you conveniently overlook some important points:

People that "had to grind those ranks" mostly did so because THEY ACTUALLY LIKED PVP. Most hate it. Especially ESO PVP with the lag and macho meta-chasing cheater mindset.
Undaunted passives are FAR less important. An extra couple percent points on stats vs. ACTIVE abilities that change your whole playstyle. Hmmm...
PVP rank 9 took WAY longer than Undaunted passives to grind.

Yet I am sure these points will be completely ignored by people who are only happy when others are forced to be as miserable as they are.

Vezuls · February 2016

dlepi24 wrote: »

Vezuls wrote: »

Funny you say that. They actually made Assault and Support rank 10 as quick to get as Undaunted 9. Took me a week to get Undaunted 9. No big deal at all. Literally do both dailies every day, do all the normal/vet dungeons along with the quests, and do the trials for the achievements, and you will be Undaunted 9 in one week.

Now, to get from 1-10 Assault and Support rank, it will take one week. That is extremely good IMO. They have balanced to two content specific skill lines: Assault + Support (I have in one category because they level simultaneously) as well as Undaunted.

Anyone saying Undaunted is harder to get is too lazy to venture into PvE for a couple hours a day for a few days. And don't you dare come at me saying PvE players are too lazy to go into PvP for a couple of hours, because from my understanding it still takes 700/800k AP to get to Assault Rank 10. A casual player spending 2-3 hours a day will get that in about a week and a half, perhaps a bit longer.

They honestly balanced the time it takes for the two skill lines that are content specific.

Because fighting AI that do the same things every time is difficult. There's a reason PvP skill line should be tougher to acquire.

If it's easy let's see you beat Maw of Lorkaj. Or get respectable speed run scores on other trials. Or get the speed run achievments. Or all the no death achievments.

PvP is no harder than PvE. I go in there with a PvE build with no recovery and absolutely decimate people and take keeps. The bottom line, is it was ridiculous the amount of Ap needed to progress.

This change effects everyone. You want to make an alternate character? You're no longer gimped for months by not having caltrops, proxy, or the assault/support passives.

Islyn · February 2016

IcyDeadPeople wrote: »

Islyn wrote: »

Artjuh90 wrote: »

dlepi24 wrote: »

You've essentially taken something that takes months to get (alliance rank 10) and now allowing players to get it within a day or two. I don't agree with that at all, but if you're going through with it can you do the same thing on the other side of the spectrum? I don't want to do PvE just as these others don't want to PvP. If you're making it easier for them to get all their skills/passives in 1/10th of the XP, canwe get the same for Undaunted? I'm not sure of the current XP requirements for Undaunted 9 but I'd like to be able to get it in 1/10th of the XP, as well.

getting easy gear with the trait you want isn't enough. plz

I want to know what alliance level you get max skills now?

Like I am AR 13. What do I need to be to get Proxi Det now?

It was 15 before IIRC....

Right now on PTS, you only need 90k AP for Vigor, 150k AP for Caltrops/Barrier and 210k AP for Magicka Detonation.

It doesn't quite match up with the alliance rank anymore. Basically on PTS you get Vigor by the time you are Tyro grade 2, then Caltrops, Barrier and Magicka Detonation while you are still Legionary.

Wow and thanks xD

Zerok · February 2016

I agree with OP. I think it takes far too much time to unlock Undaunted to max level.

Let's face it, some players have just more playtime than others. If you don't want to give an unfair advantage to people with a lot of playtime, you have to reduce the grinding in some skill lines.

Now that they've done with with the Alliance skill line, which is good, they could also do this with the Undaunted skill line.