[Heretic] Sorcerer PvP Build for Patch 2.1 / 1.7

Mythk · September 2015

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MhJ7mddykN4&feature=youtu.be

Attributes

64 Magicka - 0 Health - 0 Stam

Gear

5 pc Kagrenac's Hope
Shirt, legs, gloves, hands, belt
Infused on big, divines on small

2 pc Torug's Pact
Hat, destro/resto staff
Infused on hat, nirnhoned on staff

1 pc Molag Kena
Shoulder
Divines on shoulder

3 pc Willpower Jewelry
Necklace, ring, ring
Arcane on all pieces you can get it on

Destruction Staff Bar

Crystal Fragments
Force Shock (Morph based on preference)
Endless Fury
Power Surge
Velocious Curse

ULTIMATE : Meteor, Dawnbreaker, or Soul Assault

Restoration Staff

Harness Magicka
Healing Ward
Hardened Ward
Streak (OR Ball of Lightning)
Daedric Mines, Restraining Prison, or Rune Cage (dependent on your ultimate)

ULTIMATE : Soul Assault, Greater Storm Atronach, or Absorption Field

Maulkin · September 2015

This is a pretty standard build for Sorcs.No offense meant, cause I run something very very similar.

Two things surprised me:

That you went Kagrenac over Seducer given your low CPs. I'm on 400 and waiting to hit around 520 before I make the switch.
That you used regen jewelry enchants over cost reduction. I still feel the latter is more efficient for sorcs with the way streak costs stack

Other than that our only differences are that I keep mines on the Overload bar and have Boundless Storm for mobility and as an AoE detect against gankblades. You should try it, it's amazing for simply running away from a zerg and resetting your Streak cooldown.

Oh I nearly forgot! Your big burst is Curse, Frags, Mines, Dawnbreaker. So you really really really should start pumping points into Thaumaturge (you have 0!) because that's what they scale with, not Elemental Expert. And I still massively prefer Crushing Shock over Force Pulse. That 5% extra damage is not really consequential for me since I'm max'ing primarily my Magic and only secondarily my Elemental damage. But Crushy interrupt is godsend against rezers, snipers and crazy people that hard-cast frags.

Acts · September 2015

Seems like a fine build, my current setup is nearly on par and some stats being a bit higher then urs with deferent sets.

leepalmer95 · September 2015

This is the exact same as a 1.6 sorc build.

Also i'm sure blessing of restoration or combat prayer are better in 1.7 because if shield breaker, also healing ward got double nerfed

Merlin13KAGL · September 2015

Same, gear choice surprises me w/ the five piece, unless your friend have a habit of dying a lot?

I'm with Mike, on CS. Interrupts from 30+m is a beautiful thing, especially after the lowered elemental secondary effects of the last patch kicked in.

Torn on the Fury morph, as it's only a one-time return for magicka, but extra damage is priceless.

I tend to like Encase morph vs Rune Cage, as you get more than one target out of it.

Maulkin · September 2015

leepalmer95 wrote: »

This is the exact same as a 1.6 sorc build.

Also i'm sure blessing of restoration or combat prayer are better in 1.7 because if shield breaker, also healing ward got double nerfed

You mean skill-wise? Well yeah, nothing much has changed on that front. No skill changes and no passive changes. The gear though is completely different. Willpower, Kena, Kagrenac are all new. Only Torug's is the same.

Healing Ward did NOT get double nerfed. I can still get 16k heal crits off it.

Merlin13KAGL wrote: »

Same, gear choice surprises me w/ the five piece, unless your friend have a habit of dying a lot?

I'm with Mike, on CS. Interrupts from 30+m is a beautiful thing, especially after the lowered elemental secondary effects of the last patch kicked in.

Torn on the Fury morph, as it's only a one-time return for magicka, but extra damage is priceless.

I tend to like Encase morph vs Rune Cage, as you get more than one target out of it.

Well Kagrenac gives 226 spell damage too as a 5-piece bonus. I was surprised because it's quite an offensive setup for someone who 1vXs.

Also, my mantra is: Encase for the districts, Mines for sewers

There is nothing more precious than dragging a sweeper boss from the districts into a group and when he does the big AoE cone you Encase and Streak over the group and then just lol and collect AP

The Fury morph imo is the one skill choice where it the morph you take really doesn't matter. Both are very nice. I take Endless Fury morph too, but it could easily be the other morph.

rokrdt05 · September 2015

mike.gaziotisb16_ESO wrote: »

This is a pretty standard build for Sorcs.No offense meant, cause I run something very very similar.

Two things surprised me:
That you went Kagrenac over Seducer given your low CPs. I'm on 400 and waiting to hit around 520 before I make the switch.

That you used regen jewelry enchants over cost reduction. I still feel the latter is more efficient for sorcs with the way streak costs stack

Other than that our only differences are that I keep mines on the Overload bar and have Boundless Storm for mobility and as an AoE detect against gankblades. You should try it, it's amazing for simply running away from a zerg and resetting your Streak cooldown.

Oh I nearly forgot! Your big burst is Curse, Frags, Mines, Dawnbreaker. So you really really really should start pumping points into Thaumaturge (you have 0!) because that's what they scale with, not Elemental Expert. And I still massively prefer Crushing Shock over Force Pulse. That 5% extra damage is not really consequential for me since I'm max'ing primarily my Magic and only secondarily my Elemental damage. But Crushy interrupt is godsend against rezers, snipers and crazy people that hard-cast frags.

If you actually went in and did the testing, regen is much more effective than cost reduction. Cost reduction has really big diminishing returns the more you stack it.

For Example: A Breton with 100 points into Cost Reduction skill line in the CP tree, on top of the Light Armor Cost Reduction, with your Racial Cost Reduction, you are only getting 139 Cost Reduc from a Gold V16 Cost Reduc Glyph. Whereas you get the FULL benefit from any regen source.

Go back and check the math on it, and you'll see you aren't getting the full 203 Cost Reduc when using those glyphs. Regen has out scaled it somehow in this patch.

Also, this is not the standard sorc build anymore. Many sorcs are trying different builds and bar rotations with this patch. I know myself for example no longer uses a destro but a 2-Hander and have not really seen the benefit of the interrupt that my frags and/or streak couldn't do. I also no longer use Harness either but just Hardened Ward. I've made other changes as well that let me do extremely well solo and 1vX'ing.

Maulkin · September 2015

rokrdt05 wrote: »

mike.gaziotisb16_ESO wrote: »

This is a pretty standard build for Sorcs.No offense meant, cause I run something very very similar.

Two things surprised me:
That you went Kagrenac over Seducer given your low CPs. I'm on 400 and waiting to hit around 520 before I make the switch.

That you used regen jewelry enchants over cost reduction. I still feel the latter is more efficient for sorcs with the way streak costs stack

Other than that our only differences are that I keep mines on the Overload bar and have Boundless Storm for mobility and as an AoE detect against gankblades. You should try it, it's amazing for simply running away from a zerg and resetting your Streak cooldown.

Oh I nearly forgot! Your big burst is Curse, Frags, Mines, Dawnbreaker. So you really really really should start pumping points into Thaumaturge (you have 0!) because that's what they scale with, not Elemental Expert. And I still massively prefer Crushing Shock over Force Pulse. That 5% extra damage is not really consequential for me since I'm max'ing primarily my Magic and only secondarily my Elemental damage. But Crushy interrupt is godsend against rezers, snipers and crazy people that hard-cast frags.

If you actually went in and did the testing, regen is much more effective than cost reduction. Cost reduction has really big diminishing returns the more you stack it.

For Example: A Breton with 100 points into Cost Reduction skill line in the CP tree, on top of the Light Armor Cost Reduction, with your Racial Cost Reduction, you are only getting 139 Cost Reduc from a Gold V16 Cost Reduc Glyph. Whereas you get the FULL benefit from any regen source.

Go back and check the math on it, and you'll see you aren't getting the full 203 Cost Reduc when using those glyphs. Regen has out scaled it somehow in this patch.

I don't see why the attitude, especially when you're not telling anything I don't know here.

If I wear 7/7 light (which I don't) and have maxed Magician (which I haven't) and I'm Breton (which I'm not) then yes your number is correct.

Do the math from the other side. 179 regen per enchant. Percent increases are 10% form Capacitor passive 28% from Recovery passive with 7/7 light and 20% from pots. That is a total of 58% increase. Or 179 * 1.58 = 282 regen at absolute best case scenario.

So it seems almost double, but the kicker is that regen ticks once every two seconds. The only time my magicka is even getting taxed is when I'm in heavy combat and then I cast a skill every second as per GCD. So 139 per enchant saves me 278 every 2" of combat and even in this extreme scenario of maxing out cost reduction, regen enchants just about break even with cost reduction.

But where regen complete fails, is when it has to cover the cost of Bolt Escape, which incidentally is the only skill that can drain my magicka. Because the cost of Bolt is 50% increasing of base, but the % increase applies only after the flat cost reduction from your enchants. The formula is:

(base cost - flat cost reduction) * 1+(% penalty increase - % cost reduction from passives)

Which means my cost reduction enchants save me an extra 50% of their value every time I streak and that 50% stacks and stacks.

rokrdt05 · September 2015

mike.gaziotisb16_ESO wrote: »

rokrdt05 wrote: »

mike.gaziotisb16_ESO wrote: »

This is a pretty standard build for Sorcs.No offense meant, cause I run something very very similar.

Two things surprised me:
That you went Kagrenac over Seducer given your low CPs. I'm on 400 and waiting to hit around 520 before I make the switch.

That you used regen jewelry enchants over cost reduction. I still feel the latter is more efficient for sorcs with the way streak costs stack

Other than that our only differences are that I keep mines on the Overload bar and have Boundless Storm for mobility and as an AoE detect against gankblades. You should try it, it's amazing for simply running away from a zerg and resetting your Streak cooldown.

Oh I nearly forgot! Your big burst is Curse, Frags, Mines, Dawnbreaker. So you really really really should start pumping points into Thaumaturge (you have 0!) because that's what they scale with, not Elemental Expert. And I still massively prefer Crushing Shock over Force Pulse. That 5% extra damage is not really consequential for me since I'm max'ing primarily my Magic and only secondarily my Elemental damage. But Crushy interrupt is godsend against rezers, snipers and crazy people that hard-cast frags.

If you actually went in and did the testing, regen is much more effective than cost reduction. Cost reduction has really big diminishing returns the more you stack it.

For Example: A Breton with 100 points into Cost Reduction skill line in the CP tree, on top of the Light Armor Cost Reduction, with your Racial Cost Reduction, you are only getting 139 Cost Reduc from a Gold V16 Cost Reduc Glyph. Whereas you get the FULL benefit from any regen source.

Go back and check the math on it, and you'll see you aren't getting the full 203 Cost Reduc when using those glyphs. Regen has out scaled it somehow in this patch.

I don't see why the attitude, especially when you're not telling anything I don't know here.

If I wear 7/7 light (which I don't) and have maxed Magician (which I haven't) and I'm Breton (which I'm not) then yes your number is correct.

Do the math from the other side. 179 regen per enchant. Percent increases are 10% form Capacitor passive 28% from Recovery passive with 7/7 light and 20% from pots. That is a total of 58% increase. Or 179 * 1.58 = 282 regen at absolute best case scenario.

So it seems almost double, but the kicker is that regen ticks once every two seconds. The only time my magicka is even getting taxed is when I'm in heavy combat and then I cast a skill every second as per GCD. So 139 per enchant saves me 278 every 2" of combat and even in this extreme scenario of maxing out cost reduction, regen enchants just about break even with cost reduction.

But where regen complete fails, is when it has to cover the cost of Bolt Escape, which incidentally is the only skill that can drain my magicka. Because the cost of Bolt is 50% increasing of base, but the % increase applies only after the flat cost reduction from your enchants. The formula is:

(base cost - flat cost reduction) * 1+(% penalty increase - % cost reduction from passives)

Which means my cost reduction enchants save me an extra 50% of their value every time I streak and that 50% stacks and stacks.

LOL. I love when people assume you have an attitude when you are merely pointing something out. There is no "attitude" in words only your interpretation of them. I was just pointing out that the OP was not necessarily wrong in choosing regen over cost reduction. You're one scenario for cost reduction doesn't out weigh anything else imho, I haven't come across a situation yet where I've need to streak more than 2-3 times. Especially with LoS'ing and other ability combinations... streaking isn't what is used to be in prior patches.

Ezareth · September 2015

rokrdt05 wrote: »

mike.gaziotisb16_ESO wrote: »

This is a pretty standard build for Sorcs.No offense meant, cause I run something very very similar.

Two things surprised me:
That you went Kagrenac over Seducer given your low CPs. I'm on 400 and waiting to hit around 520 before I make the switch.

That you used regen jewelry enchants over cost reduction. I still feel the latter is more efficient for sorcs with the way streak costs stack

Other than that our only differences are that I keep mines on the Overload bar and have Boundless Storm for mobility and as an AoE detect against gankblades. You should try it, it's amazing for simply running away from a zerg and resetting your Streak cooldown.

Oh I nearly forgot! Your big burst is Curse, Frags, Mines, Dawnbreaker. So you really really really should start pumping points into Thaumaturge (you have 0!) because that's what they scale with, not Elemental Expert. And I still massively prefer Crushing Shock over Force Pulse. That 5% extra damage is not really consequential for me since I'm max'ing primarily my Magic and only secondarily my Elemental damage. But Crushy interrupt is godsend against rezers, snipers and crazy people that hard-cast frags.

If you actually went in and did the testing, regen is much more effective than cost reduction. Cost reduction has really big diminishing returns the more you stack it.

For Example: A Breton with 100 points into Cost Reduction skill line in the CP tree, on top of the Light Armor Cost Reduction, with your Racial Cost Reduction, you are only getting 139 Cost Reduc from a Gold V16 Cost Reduc Glyph. Whereas you get the FULL benefit from any regen source.

Go back and check the math on it, and you'll see you aren't getting the full 203 Cost Reduc when using those glyphs. Regen has out scaled it somehow in this patch.

Also, this is not the standard sorc build anymore. Many sorcs are trying different builds and bar rotations with this patch. I know myself for example no longer uses a destro but a 2-Hander and have not really seen the benefit of the interrupt that my frags and/or streak couldn't do. I also no longer use Harness either but just Hardened Ward. I've made other changes as well that let me do extremely well solo and 1vX'ing.

Keep in mind that Champion Point reductions do *not* impact the amount reduced by cost reduction glyphs. Only cost reduction passives and sets do that.

A Breton, Sorc wearing 5 Light Armor with 8 Piece seducer would see (3+5+21+8) = 37 * .8625(don't ask) = ~32% Reduction in the effectiveness of their cost reduction glyphs.

A V16 Cost reduction glyph provides 236 Base reduction. This means under this scenario your breton would actually see a cost reduction of 160, not 139. It should also be noted that after the first Bolt Escape in a row you get the *full* benefit of the cost reduction glyph on and subsequent bolts.

160 cost reduction works out to 320 MR *only* when considering casting a spell every second. If you're stacking enough Magicka regen passives it is possible to have the 169 Regen on the enchant work out to ~320, in which case Magicka Regen is *always* better.

The numbers are pretty easy to calculate with this information.

Maulkin · September 2015

rokrdt05 wrote: »

mike.gaziotisb16_ESO wrote: »

rokrdt05 wrote: »

mike.gaziotisb16_ESO wrote: »

This is a pretty standard build for Sorcs.No offense meant, cause I run something very very similar.

Two things surprised me:
That you went Kagrenac over Seducer given your low CPs. I'm on 400 and waiting to hit around 520 before I make the switch.

That you used regen jewelry enchants over cost reduction. I still feel the latter is more efficient for sorcs with the way streak costs stack

Other than that our only differences are that I keep mines on the Overload bar and have Boundless Storm for mobility and as an AoE detect against gankblades. You should try it, it's amazing for simply running away from a zerg and resetting your Streak cooldown.

Oh I nearly forgot! Your big burst is Curse, Frags, Mines, Dawnbreaker. So you really really really should start pumping points into Thaumaturge (you have 0!) because that's what they scale with, not Elemental Expert. And I still massively prefer Crushing Shock over Force Pulse. That 5% extra damage is not really consequential for me since I'm max'ing primarily my Magic and only secondarily my Elemental damage. But Crushy interrupt is godsend against rezers, snipers and crazy people that hard-cast frags.

If you actually went in and did the testing, regen is much more effective than cost reduction. Cost reduction has really big diminishing returns the more you stack it.

For Example: A Breton with 100 points into Cost Reduction skill line in the CP tree, on top of the Light Armor Cost Reduction, with your Racial Cost Reduction, you are only getting 139 Cost Reduc from a Gold V16 Cost Reduc Glyph. Whereas you get the FULL benefit from any regen source.

Go back and check the math on it, and you'll see you aren't getting the full 203 Cost Reduc when using those glyphs. Regen has out scaled it somehow in this patch.

I don't see why the attitude, especially when you're not telling anything I don't know here.

If I wear 7/7 light (which I don't) and have maxed Magician (which I haven't) and I'm Breton (which I'm not) then yes your number is correct.

Do the math from the other side. 179 regen per enchant. Percent increases are 10% form Capacitor passive 28% from Recovery passive with 7/7 light and 20% from pots. That is a total of 58% increase. Or 179 * 1.58 = 282 regen at absolute best case scenario.

So it seems almost double, but the kicker is that regen ticks once every two seconds. The only time my magicka is even getting taxed is when I'm in heavy combat and then I cast a skill every second as per GCD. So 139 per enchant saves me 278 every 2" of combat and even in this extreme scenario of maxing out cost reduction, regen enchants just about break even with cost reduction.

But where regen complete fails, is when it has to cover the cost of Bolt Escape, which incidentally is the only skill that can drain my magicka. Because the cost of Bolt is 50% increasing of base, but the % increase applies only after the flat cost reduction from your enchants. The formula is:

(base cost - flat cost reduction) * 1+(% penalty increase - % cost reduction from passives)

Which means my cost reduction enchants save me an extra 50% of their value every time I streak and that 50% stacks and stacks.

LOL. I love when people assume you have an attitude when you are merely pointing something out. There is no "attitude" in words only your interpretation of them. I was just pointing out that the OP was not necessarily wrong in choosing regen over cost reduction. You're one scenario for cost reduction doesn't out weigh anything else imho, I haven't come across a situation yet where I've need to streak more than 2-3 times. Especially with LoS'ing and other ability combinations... streaking isn't what is used to be in prior patches.

You started your response with "If you actually went and did some testing..." which pretty clearly indicates to me that you think I haven't and that I'm talking out of my arse. Unless English is not your first language in which case this is an unnecessary argument.

I provided the math that shows you why cost reduction is superior the only time that matters, when I'm bolting or when I'm casting spells on cooldown. Any other time, (light combat, kiting) my 1.8k regen before pots keeps me above 90% max magicka constantly so not an issue.