Another Issue With Champion Points

Germtrocity · July 2015

I don't have too much to say for this one other than I had just spawned from dying to a zerg and then got instakilled as soon as I left the front porch on bleakers.

I can confirm that whoever this player is has 400+ CP, but will not give exact numbers or a name.

Just wait until people hit 500, 600, 700, and so on for CP.
There already is an infamous DC CP grinder with supposedly 500-600+ CP from what I hear, and after taking some of his jabs on my DK through block for 7k or so, I believe it.

That's all I have to say... discuss.

OH and before I forget, inb4L2P from a gank 2 feet from bleaker's porch not 3 seconds after I mounted

Wreuntzylla · July 2015

I thought this was related to using mage guild 20% boost to next attack?

Francescolg · July 2015

What you did see, was even possible long before the CP-system and the last patch were introduced! The main reason behind that numbers is the incompetence of....[snip snip - anti-censure formulation].... balance in this game..

Who fail to recognize this damage numbers, which have been over the top for such a long time...

Bows deserve a special treatment and should not be handled in the same manner as 'real' melee weapons! (this is what I think)

These are causes (without CP skills) for all that damage:
- better crit from stealth (several ways)
- +10% damage from stealth (class/race abilities, several ways)
- +20% damage from stealth (set bonus)
- +20% damage for one attack (from mages guild passive skill, or others)
- +20% weapon damage skills/buffs
- 8% weapon damage passive buff from Dawnbreaker
- special dmg "proc's" (from stealth) like "camouflaged hunter", item sets as undaunted with 3% chance, ravaging set with 10% chance to raise weapon damage, etc., etc. (too many)
- Nirnh.-bug (cancelled)
- too high armor penetration (more in melee)
- Master-weapons
- etc. etc. the list is so long, I can't write it all up, sorry

Now you get unllimited weapon-dmg and the +20% physical damage from CP, further dmg buffs (10% more dmg vs. off-balance targets), etc. etc. AND a lot of combined buffs: "Lesser XYZ" and "major XYZ". All in all, the damage which attacks from stealth can achieve is still stupidly overpowered...

Instead of analyzing how players are able to achieve such (counterstrike-like) damage-numbers and instead of doing sth. against it, the guys who are responsible for this massacre hope that a flat 50% dmg nurf will solve the problems. But the possibilities to raise damage are still so many, that even the incoming -50% dmg nurf won't change much.

Threads like this one were already published in August 2014, remember! Do you think even one of those [snip snip snip's] did do sth. against the 2k+/20k+ hits from stealth, even with a high armor raiting? Noo

Any class can gank from stealth but one outshines all the others.

kadar · July 2015

Yeah, I can do this on my NB and I have 105 CP (I think). Especially when you consider that you were mounted with (I'm assuming) no buffs/shields/mitigation in place.

Vizier · July 2015

LOL Germ-

You posted something like this months ago before we had CP points. You at it again? This is nothing to do with CP and you know it.

So funny Germ- Ever make a post from 20K crystal frag or prox detonation? .. thought not. lol

Germtrocity · July 2015

Vizier wrote: »

LOL Germ-

You posted something like this months ago before we had CP points. You at it again? This is nothing to do with CP and you know it.

So funny Germ- Ever make a post from 20K crystal frag or prox detonation? .. thought not. lol

I have never been one shot until two days ago.

Baragorath · July 2015

If you require nerf such damage I keep request of reducing shields on sorc as this is same issue.

Put heavy armor on or keep going shielded....

@ZOS should watch your and other sorc videos and do balance sorc in line to other classes as we have too many sorcs soloing 1vsX after update 6.

Akinos · July 2015

Baragorath wrote: »

If you require nerf such damage I keep request of reducing shields on sorc as this is same issue.

Put heavy armor on or keep going shielded....

Heavy armor doesn't stop that kind of damage either. This happened to me on July 5th while I had about 20k armor resist.

Just another thing that needs fixing / balancing...

Germtrocity · July 2015

The_Outsider wrote: »

Yeah, I can do this on my NB and I have 105 CP (I think). Especially when you consider that you were mounted with (I'm assuming) no buffs/shields/mitigation in place.

Snipe doesn't always give the audio indicator that lets you know you are being sniped. Lots of the time you are lucky if the second snipe plays some sort of sound to alert you, but it often does not as well.

I have very fast reaction time and just hearing the sound would have given me time to cast a ward and roll dodge. The fact that a skill is one shotting people is one issue, and to add to that fact you can't even hear the audio for the incoming one shot a lot of the time.

Baragorath · July 2015

BTW please all check our @Germtrocity exploiter.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OLkvDDIKDbg

Here is evidance that he is using exploit of Inner Light buff as many Sorcs do nowadays on Cyro by not having it fit on skills bar and its shown as his buff.

Akinos · July 2015

Baragorath wrote: »

BTW please all check our @Germtrocity exploiter.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OLkvDDIKDbg

Here is evidance that he is using exploit of Inner Light buff as many Sorcs do nowadays on Cyro by not having it fit on skills bar and its shown as his buff.

Yeah I know about that Inner Light thing that only sorcs can do, yet something else that needs fixing.

Baragorath · July 2015

Another Sorc exploit is Bound Armor as well.....

Germtrocity · July 2015

Baragorath wrote: »

Another Sorc exploit is Bound Armor as well.....

Don't derail my thread, this is about snipe and damage.

There are countless other threads dealing with inner light and bound armor, this is not one of those threads.
But thank you for the free advertisement posting my video on this thread.
Now, if you are trying to argue that the inner light exploit is miraculously carrying me and without it I would be terrible, then that is a whole 'nother can of worms that you are opening up.

Baragorath · July 2015

Germtrocity wrote: »

Baragorath wrote: »

Another Sorc exploit is Bound Armor as well.....

Don't derail my thread, this is about snipe and damage.

There are countless other threads dealing with inner light and bound armor, this is not one of those threads.
But thank you for the free advertisement posting my video on this thread.
Now, if you are trying to argue that the inner light exploit is miraculously carrying me and without it I would be terrible, then that is a whole 'nother can of worms that you are opening up.

This video is not to show how good you are but how Sorc become OP after update 6 with hope Zenimax will fix all those exploits and put sorcs in line to other classes.

And if they remove possibility to one shot sorcs without nerfing them they keep unbalance for longer period of time.

rfennell_ESO · July 2015

Germtrocity wrote: »

I don't have too much to say for this one other than I had just spawned from dying to a zerg and then got instakilled as soon as I left the front porch on bleakers.

I can confirm that whoever this player is has 400+ CP, but will not give exact numbers or a name.

Just wait until people hit 500, 600, 700, and so on for CP.
There already is an infamous DC CP grinder with supposedly 500-600+ CP from what I hear, and after taking some of his jabs on my DK through block for 7k or so, I believe it.

That's all I have to say... discuss.

OH and before I forget, inb4L2P from a gank 2 feet from bleaker's porch not 3 seconds after I mounted

The issue is mostly regarding there being little to no way to jack up physical resist. There is a cp (mighty) category that will give you +25% physical but not one that gives you close to that. There is a cp that gives 25% magic dmg and one that makes you take 25% less magic damage.

I have no idea how many the "DC CP grinder" has, last I heard someone was claiming he had 1000. Judging by the "silent partner" who follows him around he's probably a botter.

All ZOS really has to do is look at these super high CP accounts that are on 20 hours a day and they will find the exploiters. Seems simple really, but ZOS is always asleep at the wheel.

Ahzek · July 2015

This is not neccessarily a matter of CP as some here have already pointed out.

HOWEVER with more and more CP phisical stealth gank burst gets way more dangerous than other forms of attack.

They get : % phisical damage, % critical damage and armor penetration. along with more stamina ofc.
All this contributes to higher and higher stealth burst with its100% reliable critical strikes (i already ate a 27k snipe btw, but im pretty much naked with 4k armor so i just live with it ).

The only CP for defense to invest here are Armor increases, wich do nothing for LA weares and only so much for medium and heavy armor users, As well as the critical damage reduction star, wich i found many people neglecting so far, since it actually doesnt hold as much value as others in the warrior trees.
Thus with more CP the stealth gank playstyle will become more and more powerfull. While the options to defend against it via the CS are so minor that it simply doesnt balance out as it does with other damage types ( 25% magic damage -> 25% magic dmg reduction -> ~95% actual magic damage taken) .

edit: on the topic of togglexploiting: Like every other exploit in this game you wont get punished for it so many peopel dont care that it is an exploit. It usually doenst carry those players, but it can make quite a difference whether or some1 has just that much magicka more or not (remember hardened ward - magicka relation ^^) and is not much different from cheating an additional amout of CP onto your character. I loathe it and dont approve of people using it, but i have encountered more and more people who just dont care since ZOS doesnt seem to care as well (just like with broken nirn, wich is not an exploit, but seen from many as "unsportsmanlike").

TheElementalPlatypus · July 2015

Getting oneshot that quickly? What a pug smh

L2P

It seems like CP and anything related to balance is second on the ZOS priority list (if that even exists). Seems to me as their current goal is to hype up imp city, which not sure why I get the feeling, will be somehow screwed up awfully by them. It would astound me if they were to even tweak CP in the coming 3 months.

Cinnamon_Spider · July 2015

I love that someone that plays a sorcerer can't even make a post these days without someone crying nerf sorc, especially when it is about being one shot. I don't agree with the use of the inner light bug, but it is good to bring up how ridiculously overpowered stamina attacks are these days.

It should not be possible to hit another player for more health than the average person is running around in Cyrodiil with in one shot, CP or no.

Baragorath · July 2015

Because OP is crying to being one shoted with his LA and without shields on.

He request that none kill him but when he use exploits and keep his shields on become killing machine 1vsX after update 6.

Sorc is not with line to other classes atm and till it is not fixed I will defend one shotting people as it is not easy to achieve....

ToRelax · July 2015

Baragorath wrote: »

Because OP is crying to being one shoted with his LA and without shields on.

He request that none kill him but when he use exploits and keep his shields on become killing machine 1vsX after update 6.

Sorc is not with line to other classes atm and till it is not fixed I will defend one shotting people as it is not easy to achieve....

It comes with a lot of tradeoffs, do you mean that? It's certainly not rocket science.

Rylana · July 2015

Cinnamon_Spider wrote: »

I love that someone that plays a sorcerer can't even make a post these days without someone crying nerf sorc, especially when it is about being one shot. I don't agree with the use of the inner light bug, but it is good to bring up how ridiculously overpowered stamina attacks are these days.

It should not be possible to hit another player for more health than the average person is running around in Cyrodiil with in one shot, CP or no.

STOP PUTTING ME IN BLACK BUBBLES >=/

TheBonesXXX · July 2015

Wonder if it was a head shot?

At least Snipe's name is appropriate.

TheElementalPlatypus · July 2015

Cinnamon_Spider wrote: »

I love that someone that plays a sorcerer can't even make a post these days without someone crying nerf sorc, especially when it is about being one shot. I don't agree with the use of the inner light bug, but it is good to bring up how ridiculously overpowered stamina attacks are these days.

It should not be possible to hit another player for more health than the average person is running around in Cyrodiil with in one shot, CP or no.

I think what bothers me more is that 20k health is the average, and putting points into health is something no class does anymore, any race/class that needs to put points into health is already lacking elsewhere simply because of that. You can argue that templars need it for b shield, and tanks just in general but in reality, what IS the benefit of directly having more health. Like you sort of stated even with 24-26k health its not like a 6k light attack wasnt right around the corner.

It is kind of ridiculous also that the nerf sorc is everywhere even after confirmed nerfs, but eh whatever.

I dont think current sorc meta is even that out of balance, its not like they recieved some sort of super change from 1.5 to 1.6, its that the idiotic changes suited them the best. Like many have stated before 1.6, in 1.6, and even now, the lowering of health pools, the death to resource management, and the cp system all resulted in in more damage, less health to deal with the damage, and more resources to spam that damage. If people had to build for sustain, or maybe sorcs would have to think about magic other than just when they use streak, they wouldnt be able to infinitely apply everything.

When I see a sorc heavy resto-ing, you know they are either inexperienced or, excuse me if this sounds rude but playing a sorc incredibly stupid.

For the most part, every magic build in all classes have some pretty easy resource management, however on NB/Templar/DK I dont notice the infinite amount of magic that I seem to have on my sorcerer (without even speccing for sustain, nor do I use potions). For people that use tripots it makes the resources all the more abundant. However anyone who is legitimately good at managing their resources, can make this possible on any class quite easily.

With the next update, not much it seems will actually change. DK's and Templars still are going to be 3rd and 4th on the list, only farther down it seems. Sure sorcerer has some playstyle changes coming, but because ZOS addressed bolt escape (You wot m8 ZOS? Do you even look at why people complained about sorcerer?) shields are still going to be complained about.

Seri · July 2015

TheElementalPlatypus wrote: »

Cinnamon_Spider wrote: »

I love that someone that plays a sorcerer can't even make a post these days without someone crying nerf sorc, especially when it is about being one shot. I don't agree with the use of the inner light bug, but it is good to bring up how ridiculously overpowered stamina attacks are these days.

It should not be possible to hit another player for more health than the average person is running around in Cyrodiil with in one shot, CP or no.

I think what bothers me more is that 20k health is the average, and putting points into health is something no class does anymore, any race/class that needs to put points into health is already lacking elsewhere simply because of that. You can argue that templars need it for b shield, and tanks just in general but in reality, what IS the benefit of directly having more health. Like you sort of stated even with 24-26k health its not like a 6k light attack wasnt right around the corner.

Possibly being a Templar I have a quick-ish heal (once you factor in Oceanic weapon-swap lag + Breath of Life cast lag) but I find the difference between 21k and 24k noticeable in my survivablity. Getting jumped or other I often see my HP plummet all the way to ~1-2k before the heal kicks in. Your mileage may vary though. What will be interesting for me is how many of the points in health I can shed once the damage reduction in 1.7 comes in

Rylana wrote: »

Cinnamon_Spider wrote: »

I love that someone that plays a sorcerer can't even make a post these days without someone crying nerf sorc, especially when it is about being one shot. I don't agree with the use of the inner light bug, but it is good to bring up how ridiculously overpowered stamina attacks are these days.

It should not be possible to hit another player for more health than the average person is running around in Cyrodiil with in one shot, CP or no.

STOP PUTTING ME IN BLACK BUBBLES >=/

But... bubbles!

King Bozo · July 2015

Another whine thread. People spend "time" grinding champ points. Should you want 400 champ points then go grind problem solved.

TheElementalPlatypus · July 2015

King Bozo wrote: »

Another whine thread. People spend "time" grinding champ points. Should you want 400 champ points then go grind problem solved.

K I'll see you in a few weeks when I've grown a full neckbeard while not leaving the house to gain my advantages in pvp. Not like I should rely on getting better or anything.

Cinnamon_Spider · July 2015

Rylana wrote: »

Cinnamon_Spider wrote: »

I love that someone that plays a sorcerer can't even make a post these days without someone crying nerf sorc, especially when it is about being one shot. I don't agree with the use of the inner light bug, but it is good to bring up how ridiculously overpowered stamina attacks are these days.

It should not be possible to hit another player for more health than the average person is running around in Cyrodiil with in one shot, CP or no.

STOP PUTTING ME IN BLACK BUBBLES >=/

Master_Kas · July 2015

Lol you don't need for 400 cp for that.

I hit 26 919 prox detonation on multiple v14 tragets yesterday.

Use radiant magelight to reduce stealthad dmg by 50% and no stun when hit from sneak.