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PVP Templar Tank/Sustain build critique

Linkanton
Linkanton
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Im currently testing out a pvp templar build follwing a philosophy of outlasting my opponent using good regen and good sustained damage with an ability to burst an enemy to finish them off. This will probably be a hybrid build, wearing 5 heavy and 2 medium. When I get better gear as I reach vr14, i might try undaunted armor sets with 5 heavy 1m 1l and use the undaunted passives.

This is a breton templar btw, no changing this. I know imperial could be better but breton is also pretty good cause cause of magicka management and higher spell resistance. This toon is also a werewolf.

The main bar (s/b)
Designed to have sustained damage and be survivable with good ultimate gain.
1.Vampire bane - slotted for ranged dot, ultimate gain from dawn passive
2.Heroic slash - slotted as main damage dealer, ulti gain, and snare to keep them in range of blazing shield and empowering sweep
3.Shielded Assault - gap closer, damage shield
4.Repentance - passive regen, active health and stamina gain
5.Blazing Shield - this is slotted for survivability as well as for burst damage. With the high health and some weapon crit, this can hit very hard.
*Ulti: Empowering sweep - this is slotted for damage reduction and for bursting the opponent down in conjunction with blazing shield. With how this bar is set up, this ulti can be casted multiple times on every encounter, and it is easy to hit this skill because of both a gap closer stun and the snare of heroic slash.

second bar (bow)
Designed for utility and single target dps when needed
1.Venom arrow - slotted for more ranged dot. (flex spot, can possibly be Breath of Life if health pots can't sustain or possibly even radiant glory for execute.)
2.Lethal arrow - slotted for ranged damage when needed. Useful when defending keeps and ganking.
3.Blazing Spear - slotted for aedric spear passive as well as ranged aoe damage and stun.
4.Channeled focus - very good armor and spell resistance buff, as well as excellent magicka return. almost always up.
5.Purifying Ritual - slotted for cleanse as well as HoT.
ulti: ice comet or solar disturbance.

Health is aimed to be around 32k, for stamina and magicka, im still not sure. Stamina will be higher than magicka for sure since stamina is used a lot more. Magicka is reserved purely for blazing shield. What do you suggest? Regen, im not sure what values to aim for, but I am for high stamina and magicka regens, and good health regen. Channeled focus should be kept in mind cause of its high magicka return

Mundus stone - probably magicka regen or if I reach a good amount without this, I'll go for weapon power.

Armor sets are: 5 pc willow's path for more regen and larger magicka pool, 4 pc hunding rage for damage. for jewelry, I will aim for stamina cost reduction.
General playstyle: Be in the opponents face all the time, applying DOTs and constantly attacking with weaved heroic slashes. Blazing shield is kept up for mitigation and burst damage. When an opportunity to kill arises, bursting with blazing shield and empowering sweep is really potent. Constant weapon swapping to refresh buffs and applying lethal arrow debuff to opponent is also done. With high regen, s/b, templar buffs, and constant steady damage, i've been able to outlast and, when it is time, burst down an opponents while playing in the non-vet campaign. I'd like to know how viable this could be in the big leagues.


So now for my questions:
1.Do you think heroic slash (weaved with light attacks and shield bashes) can deal good enough damage in pvp to make it matter or is biting jabs a necessity for more sustain damage? I like heroic slash for its synergy with blazing shield and empowering sweep though.

2.As a whole, do you think this build is viable? Im yet to reach a point where I can extensively test this since im only vr1 at the moment. (played this a lot in non vet and it seems to work well)

3.Do you think the armor sets I chose is optimal or should I go for more defensive sets like whiterakes?

4.What target Health, Magicka, Stamina, and regens should I aim for?

thanks a lot! any further comments and suggestion will greatly be appreciated :)
  • Linkanton
    Linkanton
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    anyone?
  • Animal_Mother
    Animal_Mother
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    Hybrids aren't in a good place, right now. Hopefully this will change.

    To maximize Blazing Shield, you have to stack Health; to keep it up, Magicka. To maximize weapon damage, Stamina.

    Up through this past weekend, I was a hybrid 2h (sometimes DW)/Bow Temp (20/22/20 stats); I used Stamina for attacks and Magicka for defense.

    In PvE grinding, I was fine. In PvP my shields weren't lasting or damaging enough and my attacks weren't hard-hitting, enough. If I surprised someone in stealth (wearing 4x Air), I still had a decent chance of losing the encounter. I ended up specializing in Stamina when I realized Rally and Blood Craze were out healing Purifying Ritual for me.
  • jopeymonster
    jopeymonster
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    Sorry OP. The main problem with this thread is you are trying to critique a class that has absolutely zero reason to be in this game. There is no good build for Templars other then Healbot.

    Want to tank - play a DK.

    #truthhurts
    #nerfkeyboards
  • Linkanton
    Linkanton
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    Hmmmm, maybe I wasn't quite clear enough. This isn't exactly a hybrid build going for damage from stamina and magicka. Mainly, this is a stamina tank build which uses a bit of magicka for utility and survivability and stamina for sustained damage etc. If you look at the set ups posted, the only investment to magicka is the mundus stone and the race, breton. Most of my ivestments (2/3) would be for health, and aroung 1/3 will be alotted for stamina. The goal of the build is to not burst down people but be survivable enough to not get bursted down, and be able to outlast opponents with sustained damaged and great regen.

    So, do you guys thins a build like this is viable for pvp as a whole or should I just screw it and go for cookie cutter burst pvp builds?
    Edited by Linkanton on 15 April 2015 20:20
  • Linkanton
    Linkanton
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    Sorry OP. The main problem with this thread is you are trying to critique a class that has absolutely zero reason to be in this game. There is no good build for Templars other then Healbot.

    Want to tank - play a DK.

    #truthhurts

    well obviously that's not the case ;)
  • jopeymonster
    jopeymonster
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    Linkanton wrote: »
    Sorry OP. The main problem with this thread is you are trying to critique a class that has absolutely zero reason to be in this game. There is no good build for Templars other then Healbot.

    Want to tank - play a DK.

    #truthhurts

    well obviously that's not the case ;)

    Just didn't want you to get your hopes up like the rest of us Templars. Carry on with your bad self as you see fit.

    BUT OK - here's some constructive info: You'll need to build based on either PvE or PvP. You won't be able to have a high DR and decent sustain damage that works for both. You can build one or the other for, one or the other. You current example would work well in PvE for exactly what you want. If you take this to PvP though, you'll get Stamina drained super quick, locked down, and executed like a cockroach under a boot. Once a templar gets CC locked, that templar is as good as dead.

    Due to the current SHIELDSSHIELDSSHIELDS meta in PvP, being able to stack your shields and output magicka based DoTs while rocking the sword and board is completely viable. But it ain't easy. As a templar in PvP, regardless of your build, you will ALWAYS get pwned by 50-75% of the classes out there. They just have more and better options in PvP that allow those classes to be stronger regardless of their build. You'll always be the guy that needs to travel in a pack and have back up... but when you have backup and are running in a pack, your entire group will love you. Until your enemies focus fire your butt into mush and everyone else gets crushed shortly after. Having a templar in your PvP group makes every other class better. Being a templar in PvP makes every other class better. Yes... I typed that correctly, and its true.

    I'm not really going to get into specifics, but check out anything by Asteldian on the Dungeon Crawler Network. Or Rendolphe, but I don't know how much he plays anymore as I haven't seen new builds from him in a while.

    Happy Hunting!
    #nerfkeyboards
  • Linkanton
    Linkanton
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    Linkanton wrote: »
    Sorry OP. The main problem with this thread is you are trying to critique a class that has absolutely zero reason to be in this game. There is no good build for Templars other then Healbot.

    Want to tank - play a DK.

    #truthhurts

    well obviously that's not the case ;)

    Just didn't want you to get your hopes up like the rest of us Templars. Carry on with your bad self as you see fit.

    BUT OK - here's some constructive info: You'll need to build based on either PvE or PvP. You won't be able to have a high DR and decent sustain damage that works for both. You can build one or the other for, one or the other. You current example would work well in PvE for exactly what you want. If you take this to PvP though, you'll get Stamina drained super quick, locked down, and executed like a cockroach under a boot. Once a templar gets CC locked, that templar is as good as dead.

    Due to the current SHIELDSSHIELDSSHIELDS meta in PvP, being able to stack your shields and output magicka based DoTs while rocking the sword and board is completely viable. But it ain't easy. As a templar in PvP, regardless of your build, you will ALWAYS get pwned by 50-75% of the classes out there. They just have more and better options in PvP that allow those classes to be stronger regardless of their build. You'll always be the guy that needs to travel in a pack and have back up... but when you have backup and are running in a pack, your entire group will love you. Until your enemies focus fire your butt into mush and everyone else gets crushed shortly after. Having a templar in your PvP group makes every other class better. Being a templar in PvP makes every other class better. Yes... I typed that correctly, and its true.

    I'm not really going to get into specifics, but check out anything by Asteldian on the Dungeon Crawler Network. Or Rendolphe, but I don't know how much he plays anymore as I haven't seen new builds from him in a while.

    Happy Hunting!

    Thanks for the feedback. Although just one thing, I think you underestimate the solo potential of templars, as well as their viability when not being support. Try watching some of erlexx's pvp magicka tank builds, and also Kristofer's burst pvp stamina templar. Two very different playstyles, but both are really effective in duels and solo pvp.

    if you haven't already, here is Kristofer's most recent build video. It's really good.
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R0wwQ8XWuVo

    and here is erlexx's. also pretty good!
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lRQv0VM5CzA
  • Animal_Mother
    Animal_Mother
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    A lot of the sills used in the videos have been broken with later patches.

    @jopeymonster speaks the truth about our tanking abilities in PvP - like I pointed out you have to balance all three stats to be effective as a Templar tank, which reduces overall health, overall damage and with our shields overall protection. Maximize Health and Blazing Shield will be awesome for the two times you'll be able to activate it, your Purify is just as important, but won't be healing, and you won't do enough damage to the enemy to be dangerous.
  • Alcast
    Alcast
    Class Representative
    Sorry OP. The main problem with this thread is you are trying to critique a class that has absolutely zero reason to be in this game. There is no good build for Templars other then Healbot.

    Want to tank - play a DK.

    #truthhurts

    lol
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  • Soris
    Soris
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    That stamina templar build of Kristopher was 10 times better before 1.6 just so you know. No wonder why did he stop playing with his templar and made a brand new NB for exact same build. They are currently bottom of the food chain for stamina builds after sorcs. Macika builds were always terrible anyways, and still they are.. (minus jesus beam & spear spam in zergs)

    But that doesn't mean they are non factor. You will always win vs noobs even naked.
    PvE DD templars are good tho.
    Edited by Soris on 17 April 2015 17:59
    Welkynd [Templar/AD/EU]
  • Linkanton
    Linkanton
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    Well this makes me sad. :( should I just reroll a DK?
  • JLB
    JLB
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    Sorry OP. The main problem with this thread is you are trying to critique a class that has absolutely zero reason to be in this game. There is no good build for Templars other then Healbot.

    Want to tank - play a DK.

    #truthhurts

    This ^.
  • Curragraigue
    Curragraigue
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    I would swap shielded assault for channeled focus on your bars since your main bar is your tank bar you want channeled focus on that bar and shielded assault is an offence gap closer and not a defence tank skill. I would dump blazing spear for radiant destruction because radiant destruction is the Temp execute so you need that on your burst bar, you have other skills for cc and the other classes have better AoEs. I would also swap purifying ritual for purge as soon as you have that alliance skill unlocked, it is higher magician cost but a better cleanse for DoTs. I would swap Vampires bane for purge on your bars again because I view your set up as a defence and offence weapon swaps.
    Edited by Curragraigue on 19 April 2015 11:08
    PUG Life - the true test of your skill

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  • jopeymonster
    jopeymonster
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    Linkanton wrote: »
    Well this makes me sad. :( should I just reroll a DK?

    Do whatever makes you happy.
    #nerfkeyboards
  • Saft
    Saft
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    As Templar in PvP unless you are rich+skilled+tri pots you cannot be competitive in 1 vs 1 against anything else then really bad players.

    If you like group play in pvp, templars are good tho. But 1 vs 1, meh lvl up a sorc instead.
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