I will most likely being going to Stamina NB 1h/Board after 1.6. I feel like magic Melee is going to be gimped.

Stamina builds would become extremly strong I think. And they already are superior in my opinion, at least on PTS.

But we also must stay realistic. It's not realistic, to use stamina to shot lightning or fire. I think, it should stay a bit realistic at least.

Got to agree with this, had to abandon Ambush and Killer's blade and my new build will use Lotus fan...which I really don't like honestly lol.

There are just certain skills that NEED to have a stam option. For example...sorc pets. It does not make sense that they only scale w magicka. Should go both ways. There are other skills too, but I am just too tired to put much effort into it at this time.

danno816_ESO wrote: »

Cody wrote: »

now stamina builds will be OP.

there will be people talking about stamina builds being OP, then ZOS will switch it to magicka builds being OP, then back again, then again, and again, and again, and again, and again.....

Sounds about perfect.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e31OSVZF77w

Is my comprehension on cyclical balance clear?

Heavy Armour should provide significantly more defense/sustain against physical attacks (Medium Armour) than it does against Spells (Light Armour) so that Heavy builds are countered by Light builds which are countered by Medium builds which are countered by Heavy builds?

and if that comprehension is correct, questions:
How to go about ensuring that Medium hits hard against Light while Heavy does not hit hard against Light in a system where each category inherently has access to either source of damage output?

Should ZOS also be making spells less dramatically reduced by Block than physical attacks are?

The simplest fix is to give each class it's own weapon powers.
Ie if you are a sorc.... no more Stam based weapon skills.

Instead hack the sorc toggle a 2h lightning blade as an example since zos loves toggles.
When toggled on the sorc Imbues his weapon with lighting that does whatever the surge line does,
As example.

Then u have weapon based skills different for every class that either use Stam or mag. In this way you don't have every single class running around with the exact same skills.

Thy way it is now. Most people use 6 to 8 skills NOT EVEN IN THEIR CLASS LINE, AS EITHER WEAPON SKILLS OR GUILD SKILLS ARE SUPERIOR.

ItsMeToo wrote: »

ZOS should give every class the option with every skill, to pick where the skill uses power from. Be it magica or stamina. Let the player choose. Let the skill be the same either way, but the cost of using that skill uses the same amount of magica or stamina.

Better yet combine magicka and stamina into one resource stat. We could call it Booooriiing!

c0rp wrote: »

There are just certain skills that NEED to have a stam option. For example...sorc pets. It does not make sense that they only scale w magicka. Should go both ways. There are other skills too, but I am just too tired to put much effort into it at this time.

That is just ridiculous if they let you cast what is obviously a magical ability for stamina what is the point of having magicka, why not just get rid of the blue mana and just make everything use green mana? This game is different in that physical and magical DPS abilities draw on different resource bars, that all classes have access to both resource bars, and that defensive abilities such as block, dodge and sprint use the same physical DPS mana bar.

Sorry but physical abilities should continue to cost stamina and ANYTHING that is magical should cost magicka. If this dynamic changes they should just merge them and be done with it.

But I can tell you this much everyone is gonna roll stamina 2 hander pretty much and magicka is only gonna be for casting damage shields.

Kingdinguhling wrote: »

But I can tell you this much everyone is gonna roll stamina 2 hander pretty much and magicka is only gonna be for casting damage shields.

It does look like they are buffing stamina too much but we will see how it all washes out after a few weeks of update 6 going live, lets just say my new magicka DPS Templar is a little concerned that his 2H spells hield using brethren are going to make his damage output look like dust on the wind.

Samadhi wrote: »

danno816_ESO wrote: »

Cody wrote: »

now stamina builds will be OP.

there will be people talking about stamina builds being OP, then ZOS will switch it to magicka builds being OP, then back again, then again, and again, and again, and again, and again.....

Sounds about perfect.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e31OSVZF77w

Is my comprehension on cyclical balance clear?

Heavy Armour should provide significantly more defense/sustain against physical attacks (Medium Armour) than it does against Spells (Light Armour) so that Heavy builds are countered by Light builds which are countered by Medium builds which are countered by Heavy builds?

and if that comprehension is correct, questions:
How to go about ensuring that Medium hits hard against Light while Heavy does not hit hard against Light in a system where each category inherently has access to either source of damage output?

Should ZOS also be making spells less dramatically reduced by Block than physical attacks are?

I have actually been thinking about this recently in trying to come up with builds. First off, no game is going to be balanced around 1v1 and we haven't been able to play enough to really tell where the balance is in major group content.

When comparing light/medium against heavy a couple things popped out, Heavies main advantage, damage mitigation, is a lot easier to by pass with light armor. Mana users (light armor +destruction staff) have an innate higher magicka penetration then MA has for physical penetration. Outside of NB/DK Medium armor has no ability to apply the major fracture debuff other then through sword and shield (which is obviously not high damaging), while LA has their base penetration, and have energy susceptibility which if not purged / cleansed (don't know if it actually can be but guessing it can) will reduce the players Spell resistence by ~10k total, also they have Nirnhoined for countering armor. Add in that LA also want to keep players at range and HA low sustain, with also Mana users having more skill trees to pull from their skill trees would make them maybe more adapt on taking care of HA players (at least in group settings) then MA. MA (melee range) fighters can deal more damage, but due to lack of good sources of major fracture debuff and other sources of penetration in theory would be dealing less damage to a tankish character then LA, add in that HA can heal up better and melee fighters tend to not forcing HA to use gap closers as much could lead to HA sustain issues not being as apparent.

Against light armor, medium armor has higher damage (melee range) and sustain then Heavy armor, thus are able to break down the damage shields faster and keep up (gap closers) with the Light armor user more so then LA can do against them selves, and HA can also.

Against medium armor HA users might be able to sustain less damage and (in theory) spend less resources on healing up and recovering then MA would. The question I have here as this one I have less time thinking about is, can HA create enough burst / pressure to take down a MA player? This one not sure enough as I wasn't going to test pvp with 3600 cp (with current VR ranks, they have said they are going to remove these, and if the stat increases go with them for leveling up players are going to find they will lose some sustain and base attributes), and just based on duels.

In general... to early to tell if my theory and view has any validity, as we are going to be in the making new builds phase for a while after it launches.

Raxxial wrote: »

c0rp wrote: »

There are just certain skills that NEED to have a stam option. For example...sorc pets. It does not make sense that they only scale w magicka. Should go both ways. There are other skills too, but I am just too tired to put much effort into it at this time.

That is just ridiculous if they let you cast what is obviously a magical ability for stamina what is the point of having magicka, why not just get rid of the blue mana and just make everything use green mana? This game is different in that physical and magical DPS abilities draw on different resource bars, that all classes have access to both resource bars, and that defensive abilities such as block, dodge and sprint use the same physical DPS mana bar.

Sorry but physical abilities should continue to cost stamina and ANYTHING that is magical should cost magicka. If this dynamic changes they should just merge them and be done with it.

Exactly what I was thinking of.

Nihil wrote: »

Samadhi wrote: »

danno816_ESO wrote: »

Cody wrote: »

now stamina builds will be OP.

there will be people talking about stamina builds being OP, then ZOS will switch it to magicka builds being OP, then back again, then again, and again, and again, and again, and again.....

Sounds about perfect.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e31OSVZF77w

Is my comprehension on cyclical balance clear?

Heavy Armour should provide significantly more defense/sustain against physical attacks (Medium Armour) than it does against Spells (Light Armour) so that Heavy builds are countered by Light builds which are countered by Medium builds which are countered by Heavy builds?

and if that comprehension is correct, questions:
How to go about ensuring that Medium hits hard against Light while Heavy does not hit hard against Light in a system where each category inherently has access to either source of damage output?

Should ZOS also be making spells less dramatically reduced by Block than physical attacks are?

I have actually been thinking about this recently in trying to come up with builds. First off, no game is going to be balanced around 1v1 and we haven't been able to play enough to really tell where the balance is in major group content.

When comparing light/medium against heavy a couple things popped out, Heavies main advantage, damage mitigation, is a lot easier to by pass with light armor. Mana users (light armor +destruction staff) have an innate higher magicka penetration then MA has for physical penetration. Outside of NB/DK Medium armor has no ability to apply the major fracture debuff other then through sword and shield (which is obviously not high damaging), while LA has their base penetration, and have energy susceptibility which if not purged / cleansed (don't know if it actually can be but guessing it can) will reduce the players Spell resistence by ~10k total, also they have Nirnhoined for countering armor. Add in that LA also want to keep players at range and HA low sustain, with also Mana users having more skill trees to pull from their skill trees would make them maybe more adapt on taking care of HA players (at least in group settings) then MA. MA (melee range) fighters can deal more damage, but due to lack of good sources of major fracture debuff and other sources of penetration in theory would be dealing less damage to a tankish character then LA, add in that HA can heal up better and melee fighters tend to not forcing HA to use gap closers as much could lead to HA sustain issues not being as apparent.

Against light armor, medium armor has higher damage (melee range) and sustain then Heavy armor, thus are able to break down the damage shields faster and keep up (gap closers) with the Light armor user more so then LA can do against them selves, and HA can also.

Against medium armor HA users might be able to sustain less damage and (in theory) spend less resources on healing up and recovering then MA would. The question I have here as this one I have less time thinking about is, can HA create enough burst / pressure to take down a MA player? This one not sure enough as I wasn't going to test pvp with 3600 cp (with current VR ranks, they have said they are going to remove these, and if the stat increases go with them for leveling up players are going to find they will lose some sustain and base attributes), and just based on duels.

In general... to early to tell if my theory and view has any validity, as we are going to be in the making new builds phase for a while after it launches.

This is some interesting insights, thank you for posting it.

Can agree your final sentiment regarding Heavy burst against Medium is something to examine.