Diminishing returns needed on damage increase from magicka/stamina

Domander · February 2015

I'd like to see the damage increase from max magicka and stamina be on diminishing returns.

The more I think about it, the more I like the idea.

I think it would help balance things out. It would also make having balanced stats (hybrid) be more viable, but still not the best damage.

jelliedsoup · February 2015

There will always be an optimal build and i'd imagine it will be a magicka based one.

ToRelax · February 2015

So you basically want most of what softcaps did back in the game but implemented differently.
Well I didn't have anything against softcaps to begin with... I'd be okay with it.

Domander · February 2015

ToRelax wrote: »

So you basically want most of what softcaps did back in the game but implemented differently.
Well I didn't have anything against softcaps to begin with... I'd be okay with it.

Kind of, the more you have the less damage gain per point added, so you can still have as much as you want but we wouldn't see these insane damage numbers from maxed builds. It would make health a little more attractive, as well as other stats.

It would also help with the disparity between racials.

Sharee · February 2015

It's a good idea and something that crossed my mind before as well.

Let people have as much magicka as they want without any softcaps on the resource itself, but implement a soft(or maybe even a hard) cap on the amount of extra damage gained from it. After a certain point, more magicka will enable you to cast more spells, but those spells won't get any more powerful.

RoyJade · February 2015

Actually, increase max magicka/stamina increase your damage, and the formula is linear. Let's make it exponential, it should be good.
A returning softcap or a exponential calculation, that's could be a good answer.

Jar_Ek · February 2015

Yep, this was my conclusion as well. It would make stat decisions meaningful, as you would seek to maximize one stats softcaps and then get enough of the other resources to survive, or would max one stat to be able to spam skills. But not have everything tied to one stat - damage and survival.

Dracane · February 2015

I hate this idea. I can't hear it anymore to be honest. I am so glad, these stupid limitations are finally gone and I can finally build my character, how I want it to be.

I hate plastic limitations. Please, let it be and keep it like it is right now -.-

Jar_Ek · February 2015

@Dracane Unfortunately the current PTS uncapped system also means a lot of other people cannot build the way they want and be in any way competitive. What we, as a community, need is to find a compromise solution that works passably for everyone and deals with the issues which are being highlighted, such as racial passive imbalance and min/max stat builds being too powerful (ie have both great offense and defence rather than having just one).

Dracane · February 2015

@Jar_Ek I think, people are exaggerrating, that's all.
Hybrid builds can be very strong if played right, even stronger than pure Magicka/Stamina builds. Good players like Sypher show us, how OP a magic/melee build can be. Same goes to a Sorcerer 2 handed hybrid build. They are extremely strong, people only don't know how to use this gift.

And OMG racial passives, I can't hear it anymore. People are looking at numbers only. It's up to your skill, not a few % . I agree, Imperials and Dunmer might have a bit too many benefits, but everything else is in line.

Seriously, everyone is whining about their fictional misery. Same goes to DKs, whining they can't kill Sorcs. Even I as a non-DK could tell you an easy tactic, how to kill a Sorc in under 1 minute. (depending on his stamina). I feel like I am sourrounded by uncapable players most of the time.

Everything is fine at the moment, people only have to figure it out. ZoS did a great job.

Jar_Ek · February 2015

@Dracane Well as an Argonian stamina sorcerer, I would say that I seem to have been hit in multiple ways simultaneously... and none of them make life easier.

Domander · February 2015

RoyJade wrote: »

Actually, increase max magicka/stamina increase your damage, and the formula is linear. Let's make it exponential, it should be good.
A returning softcap or a exponential calculation, that's could be a good answer.

I'm not sure what you're saying, but it sounds like you agree.

RoyJade · February 2015

You propose softcap, I propose a exponential formula. It's two different things, but the result is almost the same ^^
So yes, I agree with your idea.

IxSTALKERxI · February 2015

If you did this you would need to buff emperor passives.

ZRage · February 2015

With softcaps and champion system hybrids might aswell go OP, since you got nearly 2x resource you can spend on damage.

Jar_Ek · February 2015

Hybrid builds would only be OP if the exponential curve was set incorrectly... and indeed would still be underpowered if it were set wrongly in the opposite sense. It would have to be a careful balancing act. And we all know how good Sow can be at those...

Maulkin · February 2015

Domander wrote: »

I'd like to see the damage increase from max magicka and stamina be on diminishing returns.

The more I think about it, the more I like the idea.

I think it would help balance things out. It would also make having balanced stats (hybrid) be more viable, but still not the best damage.

I'm not directly opposed to the idea but it's incomplete.

If you have diminishing damage returns, you'll also need diminishing mitigation by armor, like you had before.

Have you fought against a S&B, 7/7 Heavy, Legendary Arena set with Reinforced trait, DK Tank with CP allocated to block cost reduction and damage mitigation and 35k HP? Well I have and he shut me down completely.

No matter how hard i pounded him with my min/max'ed Sorc, I never even got him close to being in trouble. I turned on the now infamous Power Overload and he tanked the damage of 10 balls in a row without even using Scales, just block. He never dropped below 70% HP.

Which is why I keep saying, 1.6 is fairly new and the builds we see in duels are only a small fraction of the ones available and viable in open world PvP and PvE. You are making assumptions and propose changes by seeing a very small sample of 1.6.

Winnower · February 2015

putting in incrementalized bits and pieces with diminishing returns defeats the whole concept of the combat revamp and championship system. might as well have done none of it.

doing this only admits that the mechanics system is poorly designed and implemented, possibly just "broken beyond all redemption". . .if you get my drift.

we have drifted SO FAR from the original concept about pvp and pve play in this game in the past 15 months - it really bugs me.

80% of the problems could be solved trivially if pvp and pve skills and mechanics were separated. le sigh.