Racial Bonusses should be removed

Skyunamu · August 2014

For some reason, i can use hours and hours, calculating the perfect match on how i can become the best possible character, cc, dps, ect... i bet alot of people take a Catman only for the sneak and crit chance.

i bet alot of people take dunmer only for fire, not because they actually like the race.

as an example i love bretons. that race is perfect. just my style. but if i want to be a real sneak master, i have to be something else. even though. a breton or an imperial is ideal in my head as an assassin.
Lucien lachance... ect

My proposal would be that there should be traits instead for Characters. That you yourself over time could choose your own 3 (racial bonuses) Whatever race you are.

AlexDougherty · August 2014

I chose my characters for the race, I chose a Khajiit Templar, which isn't the best match, not the worst but not the best either.

Admittedly I chose a Dunmer Dragonknight, but I wanted a Dunmer character and the Dragonknight looked like the best class for that (not the other way around). Same with my Altmer and Sorceror.

I like the racial abilities, they add a feel for those characters. They should leave them as they are. What they need to do is balance the game so that Stamina builds work too, then everyone would be happy.

Nox_Aeterna · August 2014

We did have threads like this before , i support the notion that racials should not be bound in a MMO , but it is a normal feature of the TES games.

In a single player game im willing to pick my race for fun , in a MMO im not.

I made a breton because of the racials , i dont regret it really , after playing for long and learning more about the breton lore i quite like the race today , but if i had went with which race i prefer back when i made my char i would have a bosmer today.

guybrushtb16_ESO · August 2014

Don't like them too personally. I chose my races for racials as well, and I'm a bit annoyed that it is a decision that is usually made long before you can really grasp their pro and cons.

Khajit for example, pretty much appeared to be the go-to race for anything stamina related, because everything was so easily softcapped. Now though, it turns out anybody serious about pvp is immune to crits pretty much, and their lack of stat boosts mean imperials practically get +22% health over them after capping stamina, so they are almost redundant for that purpose.

Artemiisia · August 2014

didnt read the post, title was enough for me to say

NO

Skyunamu · August 2014

Artemissia, please read the post instead of that. and AlexDoughertyi can see your point. most parts i agree, but isnt it a sad somehow that if you choose to become a real sneak assassin that 10% extra damage will be there if you choose a catman or a wood elf. which also means you would have to be in the aldmeri dominion. would be nice to be a great sneaker breton, without knowing while playing that maybe you would not have died if you were a catman.

Kaynlor · August 2014

No. Racials are a very real part of Elder Scrolls series. Other MMOs have racials as well, such as Elves being more intelligent, Orcs having more strength, etc.

Skyunamu wrote: »

My proposal would be that there should be traits instead for Characters. That you yourself over time could choose your own 3 (racial bonuses) Whatever race you are.

Just, no. Everyone would want the same traits to make the most awesomest l33t build. No.

Slaunyeh · August 2014

One of my main draws to this game is that race is a meaningful choice. I really like the current setup and think that removing this element of the game would diminish it significantly.

Morvul · August 2014

as someone playing a pure magicka casting ORC sorcerer:
not at all OP, racials definetly should stay for flavour and diversity!

jesterstear · August 2014

I somewhat agree with OP here. Implementing a racial passives system is a bit like running around with a flag on your head showing your political affiliations. A few people who agree with your interpretation of the lore will like it, but far more people will have differing opinions and will hate it.

When the softcaps were easy to reach, it mattered less. If you chose an Altmer and rolled a stamina class, you could still hit the cap in stamina anyway, you'd just work harder on developing your stamina attribute but could get away with neglecting magicka more. And vice versa, if you're a Redguard sorcerer etc.

If they are doing away with such caps altogether I worry it could become more divisive. One of the reasons I stopped playing Lord of the Rings online was because I hated the racial system. Elf characters were invariably rolled as archers or spell casters, tanks were invariably Dwarves or Men, with significant racial bonuses that applied after the hard cap. (all other races capping at 15% incoming healing modifier, men getting a bonus 5% on top of that, the hard cap for heavy armour physical mitigation being 80%, Dwarves getting an extra 1% on top of that, and bonuses to Block etc).

I know there were balance issues, but I like caps on stats, it forces people to innovate and not just pump their prime requisite. Like most motor racing sports have limits on maximum engine displacement, max tyre size and minimum weight, you have to pay attention to several areas to get the most effective character possible without busting any limits.

Greatly raising the caps so you can no longer hit them is a poor solution to the Stamina/Magicka build balance issue. They should have addressed the problem at it's source by reducing stamina cost of abilities (esp. defensive ones) across the board, and raised weapon dps.

Azraeel · August 2014

Skyunamu wrote: »

For some reason, i can use hours and hours, calculating the perfect match on how i can become the best possible character, cc, dps, ect... i bet alot of people take a Catman only for the sneak and crit chance.

i bet alot of people take dunmer only for fire, not because they actually like the race.

as an example i love bretons. that race is perfect. just my style. but if i want to be a real sneak master, i have to be something else. even though. a breton or an imperial is ideal in my head as an assassin.
Lucien lachance... ect

My proposal would be that there should be traits instead for Characters. That you yourself over time could choose your own 3 (racial bonuses) Whatever race you are.

Bretons actually got some solid racials no matter what your gameplay is. What would you say if you were into orcs, nords, or argonians? Looking at their racials would make you cry?

No matter what, I chose to be an Orc, why? Because I simply love the race, and I'm not tied down to a specific built. No matter how good redguards have it with stamina, you are entitled to use a melee weapon, same for imperials red diamond, etc... Playing anything else would render the racial useless.
This means that if you pick the perfect race for a specific gameplay, changing your gameplay along the way would make you not only regret choosing a race which you don't like, but also rendering one or more of your racials useless.

So just pick whatever race you like the most.

Anu_Saukko_Tutkija · August 2014

remove those? No, here have a

AlexDougherty · August 2014

Azraeel wrote: »

Skyunamu wrote: »

For some reason, i can use hours and hours, calculating the perfect match on how i can become the best possible character, cc, dps, ect... i bet alot of people take a Catman only for the sneak and crit chance.

i bet alot of people take dunmer only for fire, not because they actually like the race.

as an example i love bretons. that race is perfect. just my style. but if i want to be a real sneak master, i have to be something else. even though. a breton or an imperial is ideal in my head as an assassin.
Lucien lachance... ect

My proposal would be that there should be traits instead for Characters. That you yourself over time could choose your own 3 (racial bonuses) Whatever race you are.

Bretons actually got some solid racials no matter what your gameplay is. What would you say if you were into orcs, nords, or argonians? Looking at their racials would make you cry?

No matter what, I chose to be an Orc, why? Because I simply love the race.

Same reason I made an Argonian.

Still_Mind · October 2014

Skyunamu wrote: »

Artemissia, please read the post instead of that. and AlexDoughertyi can see your point. most parts i agree, but isnt it a sad somehow that if you choose to become a real sneak assassin that 10% extra damage will be there if you choose a catman or a wood elf. which also means you would have to be in the aldmeri dominion. would be nice to be a great sneaker breton, without knowing while playing that maybe you would not have died if you were a catman.

There are other ways to go about racial bonuses. Like using set bonuses\mundus stones to be identical, non-stacking bonuses with racials. Want sneak attack damage, roll catman, or use Shadow stone. Want more health, roll Imperial, or choose the Lord stone, etc, etc, etc.

Kronuxx · October 2014

I disagree with the opening post. There should be racial passives tied with your race, that's how the other previous TES games did it, and it goes with the lore (for the most part, there are some inconsistencies). But I will say this, they need to buff some of the other racial passives. For example, Robust which allows for 30% health regeneration is useless 1) because the amount of health regen per sec is inconsequential to have any real impact, and 2) You can reach soft cap for health regen with just gear so what's the point of the passive in the first place.

I like the idea of racial passives because it makes the race I choose feel unique and not just another "brick in the wall" with only cosmetics being the difference. On the other hand, the racial passives for Orc, Khajit, Nord, Bosmer, Argonians seriously need some big reworkings and lovin' to make them in line with the Imperial, Breton, Dark Elf, Altmer, Redguard (they have amazing stamina passives and stamina is getting buffed patch by patch). Not to say all the racial passives are bad for the former races that were mentioned, but definitely some are useless/too situational.

On that note, I chose my race based on who I've enjoyed playing now and in previous TES games (Orc by the way) and not based on racial passives, albeit it does make me dissapointed because their racial passives are lackluster. Robust again useless as I just mentioned above. Brawny may seem nice but 6% health/stamina...that doesn't sound very "brawny" to me. I mean, Imperials get 12%/10% respectively. Aren't Orcs described for their physical prowess and smithing excellence? And if you've ever met a blacksmith, or tried your hand in it, you'll know you need stamina and strength. So how is it an Imperial beats them in this regard? Makes no sense to me. And then don't get me started on Swift. It's so situational having an increased sprint speed and damage on charge (only works on 3 charge skills by the way) that I rarely use this passive. Not to mention, that since charge attacks that are affected by this passive are stamina based, hence stamina improves their damage, therefore I'd rather choose a race that provides more stamina from the get go.

timidobserver · October 2014

I prefer ESO's races with real pro/cons and differences over the gimped mostly cosmetic races in games like gw2.

Nerouyn · November 2014

I broadly agree with the OP. In the context of an online game, races shouldn't have bonuses like this.

What I think has happened is ZO have tried to be sneaky. They've given substantial appearing bonuses to each race and then tried to wipe that out with soft caps. They've tried to have it both ways and I don't think it's worked.

I think there'd be much more freedom and resulting diversity in characters if racials were removed. The ones which grant skill xp rate boost are fine, because they have absolutely no effect once the skill maxe, but I'd be happy to see the others go.

Khivas_Carrick · November 2014

The optimal race for what my intentions on a playstyle I wanted would've been way better met with a Redguard or Breton, not the imperial that I picked, because I always play an imperial.

It's a soft rp thing.

brandon · November 2014

AlexDougherty wrote: »

I chose my characters for the race, I chose a Khajiit Templar, which isn't the best match, not the worst but not the best either.

Admittedly I chose a Dunmer Dragonknight, but I wanted a Dunmer character and the Dragonknight looked like the best class for that (not the other way around). Same with my Altmer and Sorceror.

I like the racial abilities, they add a feel for those characters. They should leave them as they are. What they need to do is balance the game so that Stamina builds work too, then everyone would be happy.

Agreed

Sord · November 2014

Personally I would hate to loose racial traits they add a flare to the game and are suppose to represent and distinguish that race from others. Yes the khajit in history are more sneaky, thief/assassin type characters, the Breton are magica based so why not reflect it each races historical traits? What, to make everyone the same or so that we can pick and choose what bonus our character should get? So you can make a stam and health based Breton which goes against the fact that they as a race have never as a whole been physically inclined. Sure their might be an exception now and then but on a whole not really ever according to history are they very physical but have adapted to become a player in the world because of their magic. Racial traits have always been a part of TES and because this is an MMO you want to simply press the delete button on them. THAT IS JUST SILLY!

Sure some might be off base with historical facts and maybe they should pick the racial traits with one stat bonus, one weapon/armor bonus, one unique bonus and the last one with some class bonus. This will keep things more balanced and still give racial abilities. Why people want to make things equal across the board with classes, abilities, racial's is so monotone and boring. Go play WOW if you want monotone character imo!

Ysne58 · November 2014

I think the racial traits are important. It's probable that some of them should be tweaked, but I don't pvp, which is where it would be the most important. I'll leave that discussion to others.

Morvul · December 2014

as someone deliberately playing an orc, pure caster sorcerer...
no I think having racials in the game is great.
it gives flavour to the races, and it gives the option to either go for great, or (as in my case) obviously strange builds.

that said, some of the racials are obviously much better then others, and that might be worth a do-over.
but the concept of having meaningful racials is a sound one, IMHO