Do you think some people just don't know how to properly play their class?

METALPUNKS

First off I get there are some broken mechanics in the game, broken skills or skills that need some changes. That said do you ever feel that people just don't know how to play their class, especially after seeing threads they make in his their class is broken and they keep dying.

I do fine with my NB build and I see many streamers in very high content do fine in all classes. I can easily take on mobs at least 2 or 3 levels ahead of me. I also never stick with the same set of skills all the time, I always change it up.

How do you feel about this. Do think the game is incredibly hard? Or do you feel it's almost too easy like me? I can't remember the last time something actually killed me.

For me this really shows in pvp. I really feel like many players are just slamming buttons instead using their tools to their advantage.

Andy22

METALPUNKS wrote: »

That said do you ever feel that people just don't know how to play their class....

Thats exactly the problem, since there is no "static" class path they push u on and give u many free choices its easy to create something "new", but also as easy to miss or pick some "crappy/buggy" skill-line.

So the question is rather:
"Why do so many players struggle to build something that fits the stereotypical role others expect/need in groups/dungeons aka dps/heal/tank."

Here are some of the problems i noticed to get a "good" build per role:

DPS:
1) Huge gap between players using the "buggy" animation canceling or "skill weaving" thinggy, compared to others. Its so counterintuitive to use that u can't figure this out yourself normally.

2) If u are simply unlucky and picked a "under-performing" skill-line u will struggle deal "high" DPS. U need time/skill investment to test different combos, since there are huge differences.

3) U can simply miss the current "best" dps skill's. So if u never tested "Impulse spam" or "deadly bash" u don't know that this is "good", compared to other alternatives.

4) U don't know that there are "super" potions that are way better than drop potions and allow u to build a good mixed sta/magicka based build.

Heal:
1) U don't know that heals scale with your weapon DPS.
2) U don't know that only the resto staff regen and templar heals can actually crit atm and build for crit.
3) U don't know that damage shields receive none mitigated damage, means most of them are bad if compared to a normal heal. Basically multiply any damage shield value with 0.6 or 0.7 and compare it to a heal.
4) U don't know that a heavy resto staff attack will restore 10% magicka at the end.

Tank:
1) U are a vampire and believe that fire resist somehow "negates" the 50% extra fire damage. U will always take 50% more fire damage than a similar none vampire tank, no matter what items u use.
2) U are confused about what soft/hardcap actually means.
3) U picked NB/Templar as tank and struggle on trash-groups. (Talons FTW)
4) U "missmanage" stamina for blocking/taunting.

A) High respec cost at later levels also makes "experimenting" painfully. I did reset 3 times, just to test 4 different "morphs", since the tooltip was bad/misleading. If i could just respect single points, i would have found my current build much faster, easier.

There are so many "strange" and unbalanced factors at work to build/understand your role, that screwing up partly has a high chance to occur.
So either u are lucky in your class/role pick (DK tank) or need quite some investment to understand how things work and check forums, watch videos or install addons and experiment yourself.

Sharee

Do you think some people just don't know how to properly play their class?

Absolutely.

Even as a MMO vet, it took me much trial and error until i found a spec that was working well. I can imagine someone without much experience and/or patience would try one spec, find out it sucks, and write off the whole class as useless.

TESO gives you amost infinite ways of speccing your character. But that also means it gives you infinite ways of screwing up

Syntse

Yes I think there are people who do not "know" how to play their class.

With the 3 chars so far (DK,NB,Sorc) that I have created I have not noticed issues being underpowered. Also there is possibility that some people just choose to play in certain way/build based on some role play decision they have made.

NinjaC00M

I wonder if the OP is still questing 3-4 levels higher in VR areas? =/ As for the high respec cost, meh! I had to pay 16,700gp last respec and that was my 7th on that toon. Yes it's expensive but the only other thing I buy is mount feed and bag/bank slots.

The reply to the OP the idea of the game is to play the way you want to play! I know I know it sucks when you get old jack of all in your group off tanking and off healing and tickling the boss BUT! If you don't like that join a guild that has organised groups. Personally I like the crazy groups where there is no set healer or tank as it makes things a little spicy when your heavy damage light armoured DPS is getting all the aggro =P I'm sure he doesn't enjoy it as much as me but still

If you want to be mister "You cannot DPS for me unless you have these skills" That's your prerogative. Personally I say let folks crack on and just explain what you know and NOT what you think you know !o_O! Misinformation is just as bad as no information, in some cases worse. If you personally have not tested something in the most recent patch don't say it as fact! Things change and people make mistakes, always add the clause "But I'd test it out yourself first!"

And to close.....
Anyone doing PUGs for trials will certainly feel the repair bills =P Don't like it join a guild =D lol

Betaguy

I'll keep my answer short and sweet. HELL YES~!

FrauPerchta

Yes. It's a major problem in ESO

METALPUNKS

I dont mind playing with people that dont understand their class, in fact i help them if i can. Just yesterday i ran into someone and we grouped up and they kepy dying over and over so i took 20 minutes to explain how to play a NB. They had way to DOT skills on their bar and not enough hard hitting skills or self heals.

I do not blame the player for this at all. I just dont think the game explains how things work. Stuff like why does it matter how much stamina you have for how hard your staff hits. Or what counts as a weapon crit or a spell crit. The only reason i know is from add ons like combat log and reccount. I am really worried about console, it is gonna suck without any fall off numbers to show you whats going on. Or at least test dummies to help you create a good build.

Again the game just doesnt explain itself well. Jus yesterday i sold a motif and we agreed on 500 gold and i told him id send the motif with a cod. He opened the mail and payed the COD but then sent me 500. I explained how it worked and sent him back his 500 gold. Maybe that one was his fault because if i remember correctly it does prompt you that your paying a postage. Maybe he just wasnt looking.

Shaun98ca2

I going to agree a lot of people don't know how to preform well in their preferred roles. Just yesterday I was grouped with a DPS Sorcerer and he had no CC in a dungeon. I recommended that he get some CC.

I wouldn't consider anybody in this game a month in a "bad" player, they just need more time a learn.

A bad player refuses to learn and adapt.

poodlemasterb16_ESO

I know I'm just learning and I practice. Spent about 15 minutes getting bash and hack to work right with sword&board and I was definitely better on the next lot of mobs.

I just try to get the timing right, it's not all that intuitive, and you have to be very controlled to not descend into power attacks and lose your stamina.

My Red Witch has taught me a lot about magic attacks and my DK is teaching me melee.

Uh huh. There is skill involved, I am pleased.

Singular

Yes! Me!

I suck at this game.

ZoM_Head

The amount of times i saw healers rush in ahead of the whole group in dungeons.

The amount of times i saw tanks rush into mobs of 8+ groups and go down in literally 2-3 seconds, then blame the healer.

The amount of times i saw DPS (both melee/stamina based medium armor users and magic/magicka based light armor users) rush in thinking that they can take on everyone before the tank does.

Sometimes, even the top talented players in the game just take a step back and actually observe the situation before they take action....whatever their role is.

Zerl

There will always be people in MMOs who have little idea on how to play a class. However, with the game as it is now, there are also alot of people who DO know but are unable to do much due to the bugged mechanics/ inbalances of the game.

They are usually pretty easy to differentiate though, as the former will simply scream for nerfs/ buffs to said class or skill. Whereas the latter will provide a more in-depth explanation into what they "feel" is wrong along with suggestion(s) as to how it can be rectified.

Draaconis

The first time I saw a guy in full heavy, wielding a bow, and being followed by two sorc. pets, I stopped paying attention. I have seen a few forum posts of Night Blades wondering why their magicka skill chain uses magicka. That was kinda funny.

Thechemicals

How can they....Zeni sold the "you can be anything" feature. Tank /heal/dps is still the core here but you have all these people who look like cross dressers.

RazzPitazz

Qiute frankly I am new to MMO's. Spent some time on a MOBA but not RPG. So I have an understanding of roles, but when I have almost 50 skill trees thrown at me, all of which I can use and all of which have aspects of every role in them, it is absolutely mind dumbing trying to think of a spec that works best for anything. My current attempt is a Khajiit DK. Absolutely not a tank or DPS per se. Im trying out a crit build with lots of regen. Hopefully Im not wasting time.

Theron75

Not sure the L2P your class issue is valid in ESO. There are far too many options, which could be part of the problem. Build or role issues are a more valid argument.

You can't really get a feel for how your build performs until at least L15 when you can weapon swap. And you can't really learn your role and how to counter mechanics until you've done some dungeons. Solo play in ESO is easy for any play style, so that's a moot point.

Weapon swap @ 15 is an interesting, but poor design in my opinion. That's a core mechanic, and you don't get it until you're 1/3 of your way to level 50? Huh? Weapon swap needs to be added @ level 5, not 15.

Dovhakiin

Wrong...I think a lot people just dont know how to use their classes,no matter what build they choose, but specially Tank people, they sometimes dont even have taunt skills... so yeah, I dont really think its because of glitches ,yes ,there are glitches, but when you are a specialized Role such as Tank or Heal, they just dont know how to use be one...

FrauPerchta

Speaking of weapon swap I think we should be able to slot the same weapon for both since on two of my characters I really don't want to swap my weapon but I do want the second set of abilities. Granted all I have to do is slot a similar weapon but that can get expensive.

Butcherboy

I have no idea how to play my class the way I want to. My attempt to build my style of assassin has failed miserably, and I can't afford a full respec so now I have to start a new character. I am fully aware that it is my fault for not doing more research before picking skills (some are bugged, some just suck in play) but every failure just makes the game more unpleasant to play. I don't play with other people though, so it's not like I am dragging anyone else down. I'm just sitting here behind a keyboard, being quietly bitter that my character sucks so bad.

FrauPerchta

We need a Build board where folks can post builds that work well for them and others can post builds that they are having a rough time with so that players that under the game dynamics better can suggest how to save builds since respec is so expensive.

Personally I think at lvl10 we should be given a chance to respec, then again at lvl 25 and 50. Just for those times when that skill you expected fire and brimstone from actually gives you a lit match and a hand full warm pebbles

SeñorCinco

Dovhakiin wrote: »

Tank people, they sometimes dont even have taunt skills...

How many of those skills are there?

AlMcFly

Forget class...lots of people just don't know how to play the game...period. I had a tough time in several parts of the game. No matter what though I found a way to beat everything. V4+ is downright unforgiving to a solo player. But when I hear players under level 40 or 50 just livid and absolutely ready to leave the game because it is too difficult, it makes me facepalm.

When somebody in a forum says "L2P", 99% of the time I think they are trolls and completely moronic for saying it. However honestly, some people really really do just need to...L2P...

bullerwjb16_ESO

I wonder if there is a difference between those who "graduated" from the Elder Scrolls line of SP games and those who came to ESO from WOW etc? I stayed more or less with what I have successfully used since Bloodmoon; Dark Elf \ Knight; shoot them with an arrow; burn them; pull them in & bash en with a pointed stick! :-0

NordJitsu

I'd say roughly 85% of players do not know how to play the game period at this point.

But the game has only been out for a month, so I don't blame them.

Most people right now are just bad. Plain and simple.

But they'll get better. And then the constant "nerf this, nerf that" threads will hopefully go away or become less frequent.

SeñorCinco

NordJitsu wrote: »

I'd say roughly 85% of players do not know how to play the game period at this point.

Then that leaves 15% of the players to think if someone doesn't follow their min-max mentality and cookie-cutter constructs they don't know what their doing.

NordJitsu

@SeñorCinco

Wrong. You don't need cookie cutter builds in this game. There are hundreds of viable ways to play. There are also several hundred very bad builds you can play.

But the most important thing in this game is player skill. Which is awesome. The action combat is working as intended.

People will improve with time and it will only make the game more fun.

Btw, I'd say I'm currently better than a large majority of players, but I don't think that's something to be proud of right now. I got the privilege to play on the closed beta PTS. I simply have more experience and more hours played than most people.

I will be very happy when I stop being able to 6v1 people in PvP. More challenge means more entertainment and more learning opportunities for me.

Locke_ESO

The biggest problem is how you level a lot of the time. Ever since WoW introduced what I call "the quest pathway" most MMOs basically have a pattern of letting solo players just quest all the way to maximum level with a bit of theme park group content thrown in. This gives them a very narrow view of what works and what doesn't. Many people just never get the chance to experience their character in a group situation before being thrown in the deep end.

Locke_ESO

SeñorCinco wrote: »

Dovhakiin wrote: »

Tank people, they sometimes dont even have taunt skills...

How many of those skills are there?

Two that I know of as a Healer. Puncture in 1h and shield & the undaunted one.

Soloeus

Think? I know.

Sorcerers mostly, because of nerfs and changes. Players got used to playing in a specific way and now their build doesn't work anymore.

deathly809_ESO

METALPUNKS wrote: »

First off I get there are some broken mechanics in the game, broken skills or skills that need some changes. That said do you ever feel that people just don't know how to play their class, especially after seeing threads they make in his their class is broken and they keep dying.

I do fine with my NB build and I see many streamers in very high content do fine in all classes. I can easily take on mobs at least 2 or 3 levels ahead of me. I also never stick with the same set of skills all the time, I always change it up.

How do you feel about this. Do think the game is incredibly hard? Or do you feel it's almost too easy like me? I can't remember the last time something actually killed me.

For me this really shows in pvp. I really feel like many players are just slamming buttons instead using their tools to their advantage.

I could kill some mobs that were 6 levels above me. The PVE is super easy for most things. The only problem I have seen on the forums for people is the dungeons and PVP. Either they get smushed into the ground in dungeons because they herp derp it or something, or they cry because the guy who plays PVP for 5 hours every day is smashing them in the face forever.

Of course some people just don't know how to pick the right skills for the right situation. Also some skills were over-powered and really did annoy the *** out of people.