at what level should i start pvp

cf398ub17_ESO

i am level 37 right now

liquid_wolf

I started at about 13.

Quested and pvp'd off and on til about 28ish.

Stopped till I hit 40... have gone and now am 43.

I'm sitting at 8th on the emperor leaderboards, behind a bunch of VR 2-10 guys.

Cydone

As long as you know your class, it's strengths and shortcomings, and can play to both relatively well, you will have no problems pvping at your current level. Unless you go up against someone who is VR6 or above, then you will(and SHOULD) have some problems killing them.

Look at what profession they are, what level they are and plan accordingly. Going blindly into a fight is never a good strategy to have.

Magischzwei

Go veteran level or go home.
Cydone is a liar scared of loosing his own benefit.

Cydone

Magischzwei wrote: »

Go veteran level or go home.
Cydone is a liar scared of loosing his own benefit.

Magischzwei is scared because others have invested and are investing time to earn their rewards. He wants them for free.

I pvp'd throughout my entire leveling experience. I never felt at a great dis-advantage when facing higher level players.....unless they were close to the very top level. I took on a few, got killed. So, what did I do? I didn't cry on the forums about someone who was or close to top level beating me. I wasn't dumb enough to keep trying to take on those powerful ppl(who EARNED that power) in 1 v 1 battles. When I saw a group of VR6 or above players, I didn't try to take them on with an equal group of lvl 30 players or something like that. Because I'm not stupid. Unlike some ppl that think as a lvl 30, you should be able to take out a group of ppl that are 20+ levels above your own, even if you have an equal number of ppl in your group, that are also lvl 30.

I used tactics and strategy to take them out. One of my group would lure a couple away from their group and we would kill them. Where we had the advantage over their levels. Taking on a powerful enemy out in the open, that has the advantage in a straight up fight, isn't a smart strategy. Then coming to the forums to whine and complain about it is even less of one.

cf398ub17_ESO

thanks guys

lao

Cydone wrote: »

Magischzwei wrote: »

Go veteran level or go home.
Cydone is a liar scared of loosing his own benefit.

Magischzwei is scared because others have invested and are investing time to earn their rewards. He wants them for free.

I pvp'd throughout my entire leveling experience. I never felt at a great dis-advantage when facing higher level players.....unless they were close to the very top level. I took on a few, got killed. So, what did I do? I didn't cry on the forums about someone who was or close to top level beating me. I wasn't dumb enough to keep trying to take on those powerful ppl(who EARNED that power) in 1 v 1 battles. When I saw a group of VR6 or above players, I didn't try to take them on with an equal group of lvl 30 players or something like that. Because I'm not stupid. Unlike some ppl that think as a lvl 30, you should be able to take out a group of ppl that are 20+ levels above your own, even if you have an equal number of ppl in your group, that are also lvl 30.

I used tactics and strategy to take them out. One of my group would lure a couple away from their group and we would kill them. Where we had the advantage over their levels. Taking on a powerful enemy out in the open, that has the advantage in a straight up fight, isn't a smart strategy. Then coming to the forums to whine and complain about it is even less of one.

to be fair. zerging them isnt beating them. its more or less valid since u cant 1v1 or 3v3 or 5v5 or 50v50 them. u did get alliance points but u didnt beat them.

nicholaspingasb16_ESO

VR 10

Cydone

lao wrote: »

Cydone wrote: »

Magischzwei wrote: »

Go veteran level or go home.
Cydone is a liar scared of loosing his own benefit.

Magischzwei is scared because others have invested and are investing time to earn their rewards. He wants them for free.

I pvp'd throughout my entire leveling experience. I never felt at a great dis-advantage when facing higher level players.....unless they were close to the very top level. I took on a few, got killed. So, what did I do? I didn't cry on the forums about someone who was or close to top level beating me. I wasn't dumb enough to keep trying to take on those powerful ppl(who EARNED that power) in 1 v 1 battles. When I saw a group of VR6 or above players, I didn't try to take them on with an equal group of lvl 30 players or something like that. Because I'm not stupid. Unlike some ppl that think as a lvl 30, you should be able to take out a group of ppl that are 20+ levels above your own, even if you have an equal number of ppl in your group, that are also lvl 30.

I used tactics and strategy to take them out. One of my group would lure a couple away from their group and we would kill them. Where we had the advantage over their levels. Taking on a powerful enemy out in the open, that has the advantage in a straight up fight, isn't a smart strategy. Then coming to the forums to whine and complain about it is even less of one.

to be fair. zerging them isnt beating them. its more or less valid since u cant 1v1 or 3v3 or 5v5 or 50v50 them. u did get alliance points but u didnt beat them.

If the 50v50 is 50 VR5's against 50 lvl 30 players, then yes, the 50 VR5 ppl should win because they have the advantage. THAT is what you get when you are closing in or ARE the very top level in a game. You want scaling, or seems you do, which would balance the fight out for the lower level ppl that have invested barely any time into their characters.

But HOW is this balanced for the people that ARE spending hours getting their characters to the plateau? It isn't balanced at all. The people that want equal footing, without putting in the leg work, are trying to make it so that the people that play the game the most(who should then reap the greatest rewards), their effort should be for nothing. Simply because they haven't reached/earned the same as the other person. How is it fair to even discuss rewarding ppl for not putting in the same time as others??

lao

Cydone wrote: »

lao wrote: »

Cydone wrote: »

Magischzwei wrote: »

Go veteran level or go home.
Cydone is a liar scared of loosing his own benefit.

Magischzwei is scared because others have invested and are investing time to earn their rewards. He wants them for free.

I pvp'd throughout my entire leveling experience. I never felt at a great dis-advantage when facing higher level players.....unless they were close to the very top level. I took on a few, got killed. So, what did I do? I didn't cry on the forums about someone who was or close to top level beating me. I wasn't dumb enough to keep trying to take on those powerful ppl(who EARNED that power) in 1 v 1 battles. When I saw a group of VR6 or above players, I didn't try to take them on with an equal group of lvl 30 players or something like that. Because I'm not stupid. Unlike some ppl that think as a lvl 30, you should be able to take out a group of ppl that are 20+ levels above your own, even if you have an equal number of ppl in your group, that are also lvl 30.

I used tactics and strategy to take them out. One of my group would lure a couple away from their group and we would kill them. Where we had the advantage over their levels. Taking on a powerful enemy out in the open, that has the advantage in a straight up fight, isn't a smart strategy. Then coming to the forums to whine and complain about it is even less of one.

to be fair. zerging them isnt beating them. its more or less valid since u cant 1v1 or 3v3 or 5v5 or 50v50 them. u did get alliance points but u didnt beat them.

If the 50v50 is 50 VR5's against 50 lvl 30 players, then yes, the 50 VR5 ppl should win because they have the advantage. THAT is what you get when you are closing in or ARE the very top level in a game. You want scaling, or seems you do, which would balance the fight out for the lower level ppl that have invested barely any time into their characters.

But HOW is this balanced for the people that ARE spending hours getting their characters to the plateau? It isn't balanced at all. The people that want equal footing, without putting in the leg work, are trying to make it so that the people that play the game the most(who should then reap the greatest rewards), their effort should be for nothing. Simply because they haven't reached/earned the same as the other person. How is it fair to even discuss rewarding ppl for not putting in the same time as others??

im not saying that anything needs to be done. the system is working as intended. most effort put in results in best reward. thats exactly how its intended.

all im saying is u shouldnt claim you beat them with "superior tactics" aka outnumbering them cos a win doesnt count for *** unless its even numbers.

that beeing said it also goes the other way around if 10 vr10 players kill 30 l30s theres also nothing to brag about.

its just how open world pvp mmos play out. sometimes small high lvl groups get zerged by lower levels and sometimes the high level group will beat vastly superior numbers of low level players. both scenarios dont mean jack tho as its not an even fight.

only fights that count is equal number/equal level fights imo as thats the only case where u can somewhat reliably measure skill between both sides.

Cydone

lao wrote: »

Cydone wrote: »

lao wrote: »

Cydone wrote: »

Magischzwei wrote: »

Go veteran level or go home.
Cydone is a liar scared of loosing his own benefit.

Magischzwei is scared because others have invested and are investing time to earn their rewards. He wants them for free.

I pvp'd throughout my entire leveling experience. I never felt at a great dis-advantage when facing higher level players.....unless they were close to the very top level. I took on a few, got killed. So, what did I do? I didn't cry on the forums about someone who was or close to top level beating me. I wasn't dumb enough to keep trying to take on those powerful ppl(who EARNED that power) in 1 v 1 battles. When I saw a group of VR6 or above players, I didn't try to take them on with an equal group of lvl 30 players or something like that. Because I'm not stupid. Unlike some ppl that think as a lvl 30, you should be able to take out a group of ppl that are 20+ levels above your own, even if you have an equal number of ppl in your group, that are also lvl 30.

I used tactics and strategy to take them out. One of my group would lure a couple away from their group and we would kill them. Where we had the advantage over their levels. Taking on a powerful enemy out in the open, that has the advantage in a straight up fight, isn't a smart strategy. Then coming to the forums to whine and complain about it is even less of one.

to be fair. zerging them isnt beating them. its more or less valid since u cant 1v1 or 3v3 or 5v5 or 50v50 them. u did get alliance points but u didnt beat them.

If the 50v50 is 50 VR5's against 50 lvl 30 players, then yes, the 50 VR5 ppl should win because they have the advantage. THAT is what you get when you are closing in or ARE the very top level in a game. You want scaling, or seems you do, which would balance the fight out for the lower level ppl that have invested barely any time into their characters.

But HOW is this balanced for the people that ARE spending hours getting their characters to the plateau? It isn't balanced at all. The people that want equal footing, without putting in the leg work, are trying to make it so that the people that play the game the most(who should then reap the greatest rewards), their effort should be for nothing. Simply because they haven't reached/earned the same as the other person. How is it fair to even discuss rewarding ppl for not putting in the same time as others??

im not saying that anything needs to be done. the system is working as intended. most effort put in results in best reward. thats exactly how its intended.

all im saying is u shouldnt claim you beat them with "superior tactics" aka outnumbering them cos a win doesnt count for *** unless its even numbers.

that beeing said it also goes the other way around if 10 vr10 players kill 30 l30s theres also nothing to brag about.

its just how open world pvp mmos play out. sometimes small high lvl groups get zerged by lower levels and sometimes the high level group will beat vastly superior numbers of low level players. both scenarios dont mean jack tho as its not an even fight.

only fights that count is equal number/equal level fights imo as thats the only case where u can somewhat reliably measure skill between both sides.

If you really think that "superior tactics" means outnumbering someone, you really know nothing about tactics in pvp lol. Not saying I'm the best tactician there is, but even I know that. And try telling any country IRL, that not having even numbers in a victory doesn't mean anything, in a war. Same principle applies here. Ask the Vietcong about using superior tactics against a stronger enemy. If 4 lvl 35 players can effectively pick of members of a group, 2 by 2 or 3 by 3, and those players are 20+ levels above you....then yes it does mean something.

SirAndy

cf398ub17_ESO wrote: »

at what level should i start pvp, i am level 37 right now

10

lao

Cydone wrote: »

lao wrote: »

Cydone wrote: »

lao wrote: »

Cydone wrote: »

Magischzwei wrote: »

Go veteran level or go home.
Cydone is a liar scared of loosing his own benefit.

Magischzwei is scared because others have invested and are investing time to earn their rewards. He wants them for free.

I pvp'd throughout my entire leveling experience. I never felt at a great dis-advantage when facing higher level players.....unless they were close to the very top level. I took on a few, got killed. So, what did I do? I didn't cry on the forums about someone who was or close to top level beating me. I wasn't dumb enough to keep trying to take on those powerful ppl(who EARNED that power) in 1 v 1 battles. When I saw a group of VR6 or above players, I didn't try to take them on with an equal group of lvl 30 players or something like that. Because I'm not stupid. Unlike some ppl that think as a lvl 30, you should be able to take out a group of ppl that are 20+ levels above your own, even if you have an equal number of ppl in your group, that are also lvl 30.

I used tactics and strategy to take them out. One of my group would lure a couple away from their group and we would kill them. Where we had the advantage over their levels. Taking on a powerful enemy out in the open, that has the advantage in a straight up fight, isn't a smart strategy. Then coming to the forums to whine and complain about it is even less of one.

to be fair. zerging them isnt beating them. its more or less valid since u cant 1v1 or 3v3 or 5v5 or 50v50 them. u did get alliance points but u didnt beat them.

If the 50v50 is 50 VR5's against 50 lvl 30 players, then yes, the 50 VR5 ppl should win because they have the advantage. THAT is what you get when you are closing in or ARE the very top level in a game. You want scaling, or seems you do, which would balance the fight out for the lower level ppl that have invested barely any time into their characters.

But HOW is this balanced for the people that ARE spending hours getting their characters to the plateau? It isn't balanced at all. The people that want equal footing, without putting in the leg work, are trying to make it so that the people that play the game the most(who should then reap the greatest rewards), their effort should be for nothing. Simply because they haven't reached/earned the same as the other person. How is it fair to even discuss rewarding ppl for not putting in the same time as others??

im not saying that anything needs to be done. the system is working as intended. most effort put in results in best reward. thats exactly how its intended.

all im saying is u shouldnt claim you beat them with "superior tactics" aka outnumbering them cos a win doesnt count for *** unless its even numbers.

that beeing said it also goes the other way around if 10 vr10 players kill 30 l30s theres also nothing to brag about.

its just how open world pvp mmos play out. sometimes small high lvl groups get zerged by lower levels and sometimes the high level group will beat vastly superior numbers of low level players. both scenarios dont mean jack tho as its not an even fight.

only fights that count is equal number/equal level fights imo as thats the only case where u can somewhat reliably measure skill between both sides.

If you really think that "superior tactics" means outnumbering someone, you really know nothing about tactics in pvp lol. Not saying I'm the best tactician there is, but even I know that. And try telling any country IRL, that not having even numbers in a victory doesn't mean anything, in a war. Same principle applies here. Ask the Vietcong about using superior tactics against a stronger enemy. If 4 lvl 35 players can effectively pick of members of a group, 2 by 2 or 3 by 3, and those players are 20+ levels above you....then yes it does mean something.

i quote u from an earlier post

""""When I saw a group of VR6 or above players, I didn't try to take them on with an equal group of lvl 30 players or something like that. Because I'm not stupid. Unlike some ppl that think as a lvl 30, you should be able to take out a group of ppl that are 20+ levels above your own, even if you have an equal number of ppl in your group, that are also lvl 30.""""

thats ur "superior tactics" again im not saying what u did is wrong but dont go around and claim u beat anyone. ive played competitive mmos for over 15 years so ill assure u ive forgotten more about pvp tactics that most in here will ever know

ur entire rl analogy already proves that u dont know anything about competitive pvp. anyone who ever was part of a top tier group in any mmo, even the modern casual ones, would never make such a comparison as games have MUCH more in common with a sport than with a war. only the roleplayers would ever call it a war.

as a competitive player i couldnt care less about the theme of the game.

its about measuring ur skills with the skills of other likeminded ppl in fair fights. fair in this case means same numbers, same level of char progression, same level of gear. obviously this is done at max level with best possible gear as its the only way to make sure that fights are held on an even footing. thats why competitive players rush through the content. we dont care about the story, we dont care about immersion, we dont care about anything but competition as thats the only fun part in mmos for the vast majority of us. we have no interest in running in a 200ppl zerg of l10-40 ppl cos theres no challenge and no challenge equals boring.

ultimatively, when the game grew abit and more ppl reach that level, the goal is to set up fights with other competitive guilds/groups somewhere in the wilderness far away from everyone. how does that carry any strategical value in ur "war" ?

Cydone

lao wrote: »

Cydone wrote: »

lao wrote: »

Cydone wrote: »

lao wrote: »

Cydone wrote: »

Magischzwei wrote: »

Go veteran level or go home.
Cydone is a liar scared of loosing his own benefit.

Magischzwei is scared because others have invested and are investing time to earn their rewards. He wants them for free.

I pvp'd throughout my entire leveling experience. I never felt at a great dis-advantage when facing higher level players.....unless they were close to the very top level. I took on a few, got killed. So, what did I do? I didn't cry on the forums about someone who was or close to top level beating me. I wasn't dumb enough to keep trying to take on those powerful ppl(who EARNED that power) in 1 v 1 battles. When I saw a group of VR6 or above players, I didn't try to take them on with an equal group of lvl 30 players or something like that. Because I'm not stupid. Unlike some ppl that think as a lvl 30, you should be able to take out a group of ppl that are 20+ levels above your own, even if you have an equal number of ppl in your group, that are also lvl 30.

I used tactics and strategy to take them out. One of my group would lure a couple away from their group and we would kill them. Where we had the advantage over their levels. Taking on a powerful enemy out in the open, that has the advantage in a straight up fight, isn't a smart strategy. Then coming to the forums to whine and complain about it is even less of one.

to be fair. zerging them isnt beating them. its more or less valid since u cant 1v1 or 3v3 or 5v5 or 50v50 them. u did get alliance points but u didnt beat them.

If the 50v50 is 50 VR5's against 50 lvl 30 players, then yes, the 50 VR5 ppl should win because they have the advantage. THAT is what you get when you are closing in or ARE the very top level in a game. You want scaling, or seems you do, which would balance the fight out for the lower level ppl that have invested barely any time into their characters.

But HOW is this balanced for the people that ARE spending hours getting their characters to the plateau? It isn't balanced at all. The people that want equal footing, without putting in the leg work, are trying to make it so that the people that play the game the most(who should then reap the greatest rewards), their effort should be for nothing. Simply because they haven't reached/earned the same as the other person. How is it fair to even discuss rewarding ppl for not putting in the same time as others??

im not saying that anything needs to be done. the system is working as intended. most effort put in results in best reward. thats exactly how its intended.

all im saying is u shouldnt claim you beat them with "superior tactics" aka outnumbering them cos a win doesnt count for *** unless its even numbers.

that beeing said it also goes the other way around if 10 vr10 players kill 30 l30s theres also nothing to brag about.

its just how open world pvp mmos play out. sometimes small high lvl groups get zerged by lower levels and sometimes the high level group will beat vastly superior numbers of low level players. both scenarios dont mean jack tho as its not an even fight.

only fights that count is equal number/equal level fights imo as thats the only case where u can somewhat reliably measure skill between both sides.

If you really think that "superior tactics" means outnumbering someone, you really know nothing about tactics in pvp lol. Not saying I'm the best tactician there is, but even I know that. And try telling any country IRL, that not having even numbers in a victory doesn't mean anything, in a war. Same principle applies here. Ask the Vietcong about using superior tactics against a stronger enemy. If 4 lvl 35 players can effectively pick of members of a group, 2 by 2 or 3 by 3, and those players are 20+ levels above you....then yes it does mean something.

i quote u from an earlier post

""""When I saw a group of VR6 or above players, I didn't try to take them on with an equal group of lvl 30 players or something like that. Because I'm not stupid. Unlike some ppl that think as a lvl 30, you should be able to take out a group of ppl that are 20+ levels above your own, even if you have an equal number of ppl in your group, that are also lvl 30.""""

thats ur "superior tactics" again im not saying what u did is wrong but dont go around and claim u beat anyone. ive played competitive mmos for over 15 years so ill assure u ive forgotten more about pvp tactics that most in here will ever know

ur entire rl analogy already proves that u dont know anything about competitive pvp. anyone who ever was part of a top tier group in any mmo, even the modern casual ones, would never make such a comparison as games have MUCH more in common with a sport than with a war. only the roleplayers would ever call it a war.

as a competitive player i couldnt care less about the theme of the game.

its about measuring ur skills with the skills of other likeminded ppl in fair fights. fair in this case means same numbers, same level of char progression, same level of gear. obviously this is done at max level with best possible gear as its the only way to make sure that fights are held on an even footing. thats why competitive players rush through the content. we dont care about the story, we dont care about immersion, we dont care about anything but competition as thats the only fun part in mmos for the vast majority of us. we have no interest in running in a 200ppl zerg of l10-40 ppl cos theres no challenge and no challenge equals boring.

ultimatively, when the game grew abit and more ppl reach that level, the goal is to set up fights with other competitive guilds/groups somewhere in the wilderness far away from everyone. how does that carry any strategical value in ur "war" ?

To be fair to what you quoted me on, I never said that level of players me and my group used those tactics on. We were 30-40 and 4 of us. They were VR1-3 with like 2 VR6's in there, for a total of like 7 players. AND I also said that we would lure a few of them away from their group and kill them. Drawing small parts of a stronger force away to ambush them with slightly greater numbers is a tactic that works in pvp and also works IRL. Look at the American Revolution and the militia forces that were running the British mad with their tactics. And I've been in MMO's/pvp just about as long as you have(since 2003).

Also, I wasn't calling what we do war. I was calling it PvP while referencing the fact that the tactics we employed, to take out those larger and higher level groups, have been and are yet today used in IRL wars. You want a bolster and warzones/battlegrounds that pit an even number of equally leveled players against each other?? SW:TOR is free to play and offers this. Same as WoW I believe. Please, feel free to play those as much as you like.

lao

Cydone wrote: »

lao wrote: »

Cydone wrote: »

lao wrote: »

Cydone wrote: »

lao wrote: »

Cydone wrote: »

Magischzwei wrote: »

Go veteran level or go home.
Cydone is a liar scared of loosing his own benefit.

Magischzwei is scared because others have invested and are investing time to earn their rewards. He wants them for free.

I pvp'd throughout my entire leveling experience. I never felt at a great dis-advantage when facing higher level players.....unless they were close to the very top level. I took on a few, got killed. So, what did I do? I didn't cry on the forums about someone who was or close to top level beating me. I wasn't dumb enough to keep trying to take on those powerful ppl(who EARNED that power) in 1 v 1 battles. When I saw a group of VR6 or above players, I didn't try to take them on with an equal group of lvl 30 players or something like that. Because I'm not stupid. Unlike some ppl that think as a lvl 30, you should be able to take out a group of ppl that are 20+ levels above your own, even if you have an equal number of ppl in your group, that are also lvl 30.

I used tactics and strategy to take them out. One of my group would lure a couple away from their group and we would kill them. Where we had the advantage over their levels. Taking on a powerful enemy out in the open, that has the advantage in a straight up fight, isn't a smart strategy. Then coming to the forums to whine and complain about it is even less of one.

to be fair. zerging them isnt beating them. its more or less valid since u cant 1v1 or 3v3 or 5v5 or 50v50 them. u did get alliance points but u didnt beat them.

If the 50v50 is 50 VR5's against 50 lvl 30 players, then yes, the 50 VR5 ppl should win because they have the advantage. THAT is what you get when you are closing in or ARE the very top level in a game. You want scaling, or seems you do, which would balance the fight out for the lower level ppl that have invested barely any time into their characters.

But HOW is this balanced for the people that ARE spending hours getting their characters to the plateau? It isn't balanced at all. The people that want equal footing, without putting in the leg work, are trying to make it so that the people that play the game the most(who should then reap the greatest rewards), their effort should be for nothing. Simply because they haven't reached/earned the same as the other person. How is it fair to even discuss rewarding ppl for not putting in the same time as others??

im not saying that anything needs to be done. the system is working as intended. most effort put in results in best reward. thats exactly how its intended.

all im saying is u shouldnt claim you beat them with "superior tactics" aka outnumbering them cos a win doesnt count for *** unless its even numbers.

that beeing said it also goes the other way around if 10 vr10 players kill 30 l30s theres also nothing to brag about.

its just how open world pvp mmos play out. sometimes small high lvl groups get zerged by lower levels and sometimes the high level group will beat vastly superior numbers of low level players. both scenarios dont mean jack tho as its not an even fight.

only fights that count is equal number/equal level fights imo as thats the only case where u can somewhat reliably measure skill between both sides.

If you really think that "superior tactics" means outnumbering someone, you really know nothing about tactics in pvp lol. Not saying I'm the best tactician there is, but even I know that. And try telling any country IRL, that not having even numbers in a victory doesn't mean anything, in a war. Same principle applies here. Ask the Vietcong about using superior tactics against a stronger enemy. If 4 lvl 35 players can effectively pick of members of a group, 2 by 2 or 3 by 3, and those players are 20+ levels above you....then yes it does mean something.

i quote u from an earlier post

""""When I saw a group of VR6 or above players, I didn't try to take them on with an equal group of lvl 30 players or something like that. Because I'm not stupid. Unlike some ppl that think as a lvl 30, you should be able to take out a group of ppl that are 20+ levels above your own, even if you have an equal number of ppl in your group, that are also lvl 30.""""

thats ur "superior tactics" again im not saying what u did is wrong but dont go around and claim u beat anyone. ive played competitive mmos for over 15 years so ill assure u ive forgotten more about pvp tactics that most in here will ever know

ur entire rl analogy already proves that u dont know anything about competitive pvp. anyone who ever was part of a top tier group in any mmo, even the modern casual ones, would never make such a comparison as games have MUCH more in common with a sport than with a war. only the roleplayers would ever call it a war.

as a competitive player i couldnt care less about the theme of the game.

its about measuring ur skills with the skills of other likeminded ppl in fair fights. fair in this case means same numbers, same level of char progression, same level of gear. obviously this is done at max level with best possible gear as its the only way to make sure that fights are held on an even footing. thats why competitive players rush through the content. we dont care about the story, we dont care about immersion, we dont care about anything but competition as thats the only fun part in mmos for the vast majority of us. we have no interest in running in a 200ppl zerg of l10-40 ppl cos theres no challenge and no challenge equals boring.

ultimatively, when the game grew abit and more ppl reach that level, the goal is to set up fights with other competitive guilds/groups somewhere in the wilderness far away from everyone. how does that carry any strategical value in ur "war" ?

To be fair to what you quoted me on, I never said that level of players me and my group used those tactics on. We were 30-40 and 4 of us. They were VR1-3 with like 2 VR6's in there, for a total of like 7 players. AND I also said that we would lure a few of them away from their group and kill them. Drawing small parts of a stronger force away to ambush them with slightly greater numbers is a tactic that works in pvp and also works IRL. Look at the American Revolution and the militia forces that were running the British mad with their tactics. And I've been in MMO's/pvp just about as long as you have(since 2003).

Also, I wasn't calling what we do war. I was calling it PvP while referencing the fact that the tactics we employed, to take out those larger and higher level groups, have been and are yet today used in IRL wars. You want a bolster and warzones/battlegrounds that pit an even number of equally leveled players against each other?? SW:TOR is free to play and offers this. Same as WoW I believe. Please, feel free to play those as much as you like.

again im not saying ur tactic is bad. its the obvious thing to do in the situation u described. all im saying is it doesnt rly count in a competitive way as to many factors arent on a equal setting. sure if u kill 3 vr6+ ppl with 4 lvl 30ishs u did a damn good job. (or they did really bad, depends how u look at it) however look at football f.e. when a 1st league club plays a 3rd league club the 3rd league club wont bring 15 players to compensate for their lack of skill. the nature of open world pvp mmos allows u to do that tho which is fine ofc as it doesnt violate any rules but its not really a fair win.

mentioning wow and swtor just proves ur lack of experience even more. if u knew what ur talking about u would have mentioned DAoC and Darkfall instead ^^

driosketch

SirAndy wrote: »

cf398ub17_ESO wrote: »

at what level should i start pvp, i am level 37 right now

10

As long as you don't mind being easy pickings outside of a group, and you don't plan on sending all your time there, go in at 10. You'll have a bit of a head start on the current campaign in terms of AP and eventual rewards the sooner you get in because lots of others will wait till level 50. And do the tutorial quest, that's nearly 2,000 AP, plus you're going to get free skill points, access to a ton of sky shards, and leveled rewards at each mile stone. If your campaign is in balanced, do your daily quests and earn AP. If it's imbalanced in your favor, hunt sky shards. Imbalanced against you or you want to do the opposite that your campaign allows you to do, guest to another campaign.

Cydone

lao wrote: »

Cydone wrote: »

lao wrote: »

Cydone wrote: »

lao wrote: »

Cydone wrote: »

lao wrote: »

Cydone wrote: »

Magischzwei wrote: »

Go veteran level or go home.
Cydone is a liar scared of loosing his own benefit.

Magischzwei is scared because others have invested and are investing time to earn their rewards. He wants them for free.

I pvp'd throughout my entire leveling experience. I never felt at a great dis-advantage when facing higher level players.....unless they were close to the very top level. I took on a few, got killed. So, what did I do? I didn't cry on the forums about someone who was or close to top level beating me. I wasn't dumb enough to keep trying to take on those powerful ppl(who EARNED that power) in 1 v 1 battles. When I saw a group of VR6 or above players, I didn't try to take them on with an equal group of lvl 30 players or something like that. Because I'm not stupid. Unlike some ppl that think as a lvl 30, you should be able to take out a group of ppl that are 20+ levels above your own, even if you have an equal number of ppl in your group, that are also lvl 30.

I used tactics and strategy to take them out. One of my group would lure a couple away from their group and we would kill them. Where we had the advantage over their levels. Taking on a powerful enemy out in the open, that has the advantage in a straight up fight, isn't a smart strategy. Then coming to the forums to whine and complain about it is even less of one.

to be fair. zerging them isnt beating them. its more or less valid since u cant 1v1 or 3v3 or 5v5 or 50v50 them. u did get alliance points but u didnt beat them.

If the 50v50 is 50 VR5's against 50 lvl 30 players, then yes, the 50 VR5 ppl should win because they have the advantage. THAT is what you get when you are closing in or ARE the very top level in a game. You want scaling, or seems you do, which would balance the fight out for the lower level ppl that have invested barely any time into their characters.

But HOW is this balanced for the people that ARE spending hours getting their characters to the plateau? It isn't balanced at all. The people that want equal footing, without putting in the leg work, are trying to make it so that the people that play the game the most(who should then reap the greatest rewards), their effort should be for nothing. Simply because they haven't reached/earned the same as the other person. How is it fair to even discuss rewarding ppl for not putting in the same time as others??

im not saying that anything needs to be done. the system is working as intended. most effort put in results in best reward. thats exactly how its intended.

all im saying is u shouldnt claim you beat them with "superior tactics" aka outnumbering them cos a win doesnt count for *** unless its even numbers.

that beeing said it also goes the other way around if 10 vr10 players kill 30 l30s theres also nothing to brag about.

its just how open world pvp mmos play out. sometimes small high lvl groups get zerged by lower levels and sometimes the high level group will beat vastly superior numbers of low level players. both scenarios dont mean jack tho as its not an even fight.

only fights that count is equal number/equal level fights imo as thats the only case where u can somewhat reliably measure skill between both sides.

If you really think that "superior tactics" means outnumbering someone, you really know nothing about tactics in pvp lol. Not saying I'm the best tactician there is, but even I know that. And try telling any country IRL, that not having even numbers in a victory doesn't mean anything, in a war. Same principle applies here. Ask the Vietcong about using superior tactics against a stronger enemy. If 4 lvl 35 players can effectively pick of members of a group, 2 by 2 or 3 by 3, and those players are 20+ levels above you....then yes it does mean something.

i quote u from an earlier post

""""When I saw a group of VR6 or above players, I didn't try to take them on with an equal group of lvl 30 players or something like that. Because I'm not stupid. Unlike some ppl that think as a lvl 30, you should be able to take out a group of ppl that are 20+ levels above your own, even if you have an equal number of ppl in your group, that are also lvl 30.""""

thats ur "superior tactics" again im not saying what u did is wrong but dont go around and claim u beat anyone. ive played competitive mmos for over 15 years so ill assure u ive forgotten more about pvp tactics that most in here will ever know

ur entire rl analogy already proves that u dont know anything about competitive pvp. anyone who ever was part of a top tier group in any mmo, even the modern casual ones, would never make such a comparison as games have MUCH more in common with a sport than with a war. only the roleplayers would ever call it a war.

as a competitive player i couldnt care less about the theme of the game.

its about measuring ur skills with the skills of other likeminded ppl in fair fights. fair in this case means same numbers, same level of char progression, same level of gear. obviously this is done at max level with best possible gear as its the only way to make sure that fights are held on an even footing. thats why competitive players rush through the content. we dont care about the story, we dont care about immersion, we dont care about anything but competition as thats the only fun part in mmos for the vast majority of us. we have no interest in running in a 200ppl zerg of l10-40 ppl cos theres no challenge and no challenge equals boring.

ultimatively, when the game grew abit and more ppl reach that level, the goal is to set up fights with other competitive guilds/groups somewhere in the wilderness far away from everyone. how does that carry any strategical value in ur "war" ?

To be fair to what you quoted me on, I never said that level of players me and my group used those tactics on. We were 30-40 and 4 of us. They were VR1-3 with like 2 VR6's in there, for a total of like 7 players. AND I also said that we would lure a few of them away from their group and kill them. Drawing small parts of a stronger force away to ambush them with slightly greater numbers is a tactic that works in pvp and also works IRL. Look at the American Revolution and the militia forces that were running the British mad with their tactics. And I've been in MMO's/pvp just about as long as you have(since 2003).

Also, I wasn't calling what we do war. I was calling it PvP while referencing the fact that the tactics we employed, to take out those larger and higher level groups, have been and are yet today used in IRL wars. You want a bolster and warzones/battlegrounds that pit an even number of equally leveled players against each other?? SW:TOR is free to play and offers this. Same as WoW I believe. Please, feel free to play those as much as you like.

again im not saying ur tactic is bad. its the obvious thing to do in the situation u described. all im saying is it doesnt rly count in a competitive way as to many factors arent on a equal setting. sure if u kill 3 vr6+ ppl with 4 lvl 30ishs u did a damn good job. (or they did really bad, depends how u look at it) however look at football f.e. when a 1st league club plays a 3rd league club the 3rd league club wont bring 15 players to compensate for their lack of skill. the nature of open world pvp mmos allows u to do that tho which is fine ofc as it doesnt violate any rules but its not really a fair win.

mentioning wow and swtor just proves ur lack of experience even more. if u knew what ur talking about u would have mentioned DAoC and Darkfall instead ^^

So, mentioning the most recent(SW:TOR) and most succesful(WoW) mmo's that do this means I know nothing?? lol You're starting to look more and more like an entitlement person, wanting something for nothing.

lao

Cydone wrote: »

lao wrote: »

Cydone wrote: »

lao wrote: »

Cydone wrote: »

lao wrote: »

Cydone wrote: »

lao wrote: »

Cydone wrote: »

Magischzwei wrote: »

Go veteran level or go home.
Cydone is a liar scared of loosing his own benefit.

Magischzwei is scared because others have invested and are investing time to earn their rewards. He wants them for free.

I pvp'd throughout my entire leveling experience. I never felt at a great dis-advantage when facing higher level players.....unless they were close to the very top level. I took on a few, got killed. So, what did I do? I didn't cry on the forums about someone who was or close to top level beating me. I wasn't dumb enough to keep trying to take on those powerful ppl(who EARNED that power) in 1 v 1 battles. When I saw a group of VR6 or above players, I didn't try to take them on with an equal group of lvl 30 players or something like that. Because I'm not stupid. Unlike some ppl that think as a lvl 30, you should be able to take out a group of ppl that are 20+ levels above your own, even if you have an equal number of ppl in your group, that are also lvl 30.

I used tactics and strategy to take them out. One of my group would lure a couple away from their group and we would kill them. Where we had the advantage over their levels. Taking on a powerful enemy out in the open, that has the advantage in a straight up fight, isn't a smart strategy. Then coming to the forums to whine and complain about it is even less of one.

to be fair. zerging them isnt beating them. its more or less valid since u cant 1v1 or 3v3 or 5v5 or 50v50 them. u did get alliance points but u didnt beat them.

If the 50v50 is 50 VR5's against 50 lvl 30 players, then yes, the 50 VR5 ppl should win because they have the advantage. THAT is what you get when you are closing in or ARE the very top level in a game. You want scaling, or seems you do, which would balance the fight out for the lower level ppl that have invested barely any time into their characters.

But HOW is this balanced for the people that ARE spending hours getting their characters to the plateau? It isn't balanced at all. The people that want equal footing, without putting in the leg work, are trying to make it so that the people that play the game the most(who should then reap the greatest rewards), their effort should be for nothing. Simply because they haven't reached/earned the same as the other person. How is it fair to even discuss rewarding ppl for not putting in the same time as others??

im not saying that anything needs to be done. the system is working as intended. most effort put in results in best reward. thats exactly how its intended.

all im saying is u shouldnt claim you beat them with "superior tactics" aka outnumbering them cos a win doesnt count for *** unless its even numbers.

that beeing said it also goes the other way around if 10 vr10 players kill 30 l30s theres also nothing to brag about.

its just how open world pvp mmos play out. sometimes small high lvl groups get zerged by lower levels and sometimes the high level group will beat vastly superior numbers of low level players. both scenarios dont mean jack tho as its not an even fight.

only fights that count is equal number/equal level fights imo as thats the only case where u can somewhat reliably measure skill between both sides.

If you really think that "superior tactics" means outnumbering someone, you really know nothing about tactics in pvp lol. Not saying I'm the best tactician there is, but even I know that. And try telling any country IRL, that not having even numbers in a victory doesn't mean anything, in a war. Same principle applies here. Ask the Vietcong about using superior tactics against a stronger enemy. If 4 lvl 35 players can effectively pick of members of a group, 2 by 2 or 3 by 3, and those players are 20+ levels above you....then yes it does mean something.

i quote u from an earlier post

""""When I saw a group of VR6 or above players, I didn't try to take them on with an equal group of lvl 30 players or something like that. Because I'm not stupid. Unlike some ppl that think as a lvl 30, you should be able to take out a group of ppl that are 20+ levels above your own, even if you have an equal number of ppl in your group, that are also lvl 30.""""

thats ur "superior tactics" again im not saying what u did is wrong but dont go around and claim u beat anyone. ive played competitive mmos for over 15 years so ill assure u ive forgotten more about pvp tactics that most in here will ever know

ur entire rl analogy already proves that u dont know anything about competitive pvp. anyone who ever was part of a top tier group in any mmo, even the modern casual ones, would never make such a comparison as games have MUCH more in common with a sport than with a war. only the roleplayers would ever call it a war.

as a competitive player i couldnt care less about the theme of the game.

its about measuring ur skills with the skills of other likeminded ppl in fair fights. fair in this case means same numbers, same level of char progression, same level of gear. obviously this is done at max level with best possible gear as its the only way to make sure that fights are held on an even footing. thats why competitive players rush through the content. we dont care about the story, we dont care about immersion, we dont care about anything but competition as thats the only fun part in mmos for the vast majority of us. we have no interest in running in a 200ppl zerg of l10-40 ppl cos theres no challenge and no challenge equals boring.

ultimatively, when the game grew abit and more ppl reach that level, the goal is to set up fights with other competitive guilds/groups somewhere in the wilderness far away from everyone. how does that carry any strategical value in ur "war" ?

To be fair to what you quoted me on, I never said that level of players me and my group used those tactics on. We were 30-40 and 4 of us. They were VR1-3 with like 2 VR6's in there, for a total of like 7 players. AND I also said that we would lure a few of them away from their group and kill them. Drawing small parts of a stronger force away to ambush them with slightly greater numbers is a tactic that works in pvp and also works IRL. Look at the American Revolution and the militia forces that were running the British mad with their tactics. And I've been in MMO's/pvp just about as long as you have(since 2003).

Also, I wasn't calling what we do war. I was calling it PvP while referencing the fact that the tactics we employed, to take out those larger and higher level groups, have been and are yet today used in IRL wars. You want a bolster and warzones/battlegrounds that pit an even number of equally leveled players against each other?? SW:TOR is free to play and offers this. Same as WoW I believe. Please, feel free to play those as much as you like.

again im not saying ur tactic is bad. its the obvious thing to do in the situation u described. all im saying is it doesnt rly count in a competitive way as to many factors arent on a equal setting. sure if u kill 3 vr6+ ppl with 4 lvl 30ishs u did a damn good job. (or they did really bad, depends how u look at it) however look at football f.e. when a 1st league club plays a 3rd league club the 3rd league club wont bring 15 players to compensate for their lack of skill. the nature of open world pvp mmos allows u to do that tho which is fine ofc as it doesnt violate any rules but its not really a fair win.

mentioning wow and swtor just proves ur lack of experience even more. if u knew what ur talking about u would have mentioned DAoC and Darkfall instead ^^

So, mentioning the most recent(SW:TOR) and most succesful(WoW) mmo's that do this means I know nothing?? lol You're starting to look more and more like an entitlement person, wanting something for nothing.

most recent doesnt mean *** tho. WoW just as SW:TOR are both *** horrible games. always been always will be. no competitive mmo player has ever even considered them cos the skill ceiling is just way too low. truely competitive mmos are DAoC, Darkfall, to some extend Darkfall Unholy Wars, EvE and good old UO.

Hellbabe2013

PvP with the wervolves buguing is boring. And only on most servers with eben as dominating faction it´s become more and more boring. No chance atm to become as an AD on an EUKampagne (maybe only on Auril not) a chance without the scrolls and the full buffs of Eden to win a fight. On Dämmer AD only had not more than 200ppl playing. And against the bugusing Emporerwehervolve, its the worst PvP i seen in the last years. With so a big area for PvP you should have so many chancesto have a cool PvP but only the keephuntingshit as it is at the moment, it is worthless to play.

Cydone

lao wrote: »

Cydone wrote: »

lao wrote: »

Cydone wrote: »

lao wrote: »

Cydone wrote: »

lao wrote: »

Cydone wrote: »

lao wrote: »

Cydone wrote: »

Magischzwei wrote: »

Go veteran level or go home.
Cydone is a liar scared of loosing his own benefit.

Magischzwei is scared because others have invested and are investing time to earn their rewards. He wants them for free.

I pvp'd throughout my entire leveling experience. I never felt at a great dis-advantage when facing higher level players.....unless they were close to the very top level. I took on a few, got killed. So, what did I do? I didn't cry on the forums about someone who was or close to top level beating me. I wasn't dumb enough to keep trying to take on those powerful ppl(who EARNED that power) in 1 v 1 battles. When I saw a group of VR6 or above players, I didn't try to take them on with an equal group of lvl 30 players or something like that. Because I'm not stupid. Unlike some ppl that think as a lvl 30, you should be able to take out a group of ppl that are 20+ levels above your own, even if you have an equal number of ppl in your group, that are also lvl 30.

I used tactics and strategy to take them out. One of my group would lure a couple away from their group and we would kill them. Where we had the advantage over their levels. Taking on a powerful enemy out in the open, that has the advantage in a straight up fight, isn't a smart strategy. Then coming to the forums to whine and complain about it is even less of one.

to be fair. zerging them isnt beating them. its more or less valid since u cant 1v1 or 3v3 or 5v5 or 50v50 them. u did get alliance points but u didnt beat them.

If the 50v50 is 50 VR5's against 50 lvl 30 players, then yes, the 50 VR5 ppl should win because they have the advantage. THAT is what you get when you are closing in or ARE the very top level in a game. You want scaling, or seems you do, which would balance the fight out for the lower level ppl that have invested barely any time into their characters.

But HOW is this balanced for the people that ARE spending hours getting their characters to the plateau? It isn't balanced at all. The people that want equal footing, without putting in the leg work, are trying to make it so that the people that play the game the most(who should then reap the greatest rewards), their effort should be for nothing. Simply because they haven't reached/earned the same as the other person. How is it fair to even discuss rewarding ppl for not putting in the same time as others??

im not saying that anything needs to be done. the system is working as intended. most effort put in results in best reward. thats exactly how its intended.

all im saying is u shouldnt claim you beat them with "superior tactics" aka outnumbering them cos a win doesnt count for *** unless its even numbers.

that beeing said it also goes the other way around if 10 vr10 players kill 30 l30s theres also nothing to brag about.

its just how open world pvp mmos play out. sometimes small high lvl groups get zerged by lower levels and sometimes the high level group will beat vastly superior numbers of low level players. both scenarios dont mean jack tho as its not an even fight.

only fights that count is equal number/equal level fights imo as thats the only case where u can somewhat reliably measure skill between both sides.

If you really think that "superior tactics" means outnumbering someone, you really know nothing about tactics in pvp lol. Not saying I'm the best tactician there is, but even I know that. And try telling any country IRL, that not having even numbers in a victory doesn't mean anything, in a war. Same principle applies here. Ask the Vietcong about using superior tactics against a stronger enemy. If 4 lvl 35 players can effectively pick of members of a group, 2 by 2 or 3 by 3, and those players are 20+ levels above you....then yes it does mean something.

i quote u from an earlier post

""""When I saw a group of VR6 or above players, I didn't try to take them on with an equal group of lvl 30 players or something like that. Because I'm not stupid. Unlike some ppl that think as a lvl 30, you should be able to take out a group of ppl that are 20+ levels above your own, even if you have an equal number of ppl in your group, that are also lvl 30.""""

thats ur "superior tactics" again im not saying what u did is wrong but dont go around and claim u beat anyone. ive played competitive mmos for over 15 years so ill assure u ive forgotten more about pvp tactics that most in here will ever know

ur entire rl analogy already proves that u dont know anything about competitive pvp. anyone who ever was part of a top tier group in any mmo, even the modern casual ones, would never make such a comparison as games have MUCH more in common with a sport than with a war. only the roleplayers would ever call it a war.

as a competitive player i couldnt care less about the theme of the game.

its about measuring ur skills with the skills of other likeminded ppl in fair fights. fair in this case means same numbers, same level of char progression, same level of gear. obviously this is done at max level with best possible gear as its the only way to make sure that fights are held on an even footing. thats why competitive players rush through the content. we dont care about the story, we dont care about immersion, we dont care about anything but competition as thats the only fun part in mmos for the vast majority of us. we have no interest in running in a 200ppl zerg of l10-40 ppl cos theres no challenge and no challenge equals boring.

ultimatively, when the game grew abit and more ppl reach that level, the goal is to set up fights with other competitive guilds/groups somewhere in the wilderness far away from everyone. how does that carry any strategical value in ur "war" ?

To be fair to what you quoted me on, I never said that level of players me and my group used those tactics on. We were 30-40 and 4 of us. They were VR1-3 with like 2 VR6's in there, for a total of like 7 players. AND I also said that we would lure a few of them away from their group and kill them. Drawing small parts of a stronger force away to ambush them with slightly greater numbers is a tactic that works in pvp and also works IRL. Look at the American Revolution and the militia forces that were running the British mad with their tactics. And I've been in MMO's/pvp just about as long as you have(since 2003).

Also, I wasn't calling what we do war. I was calling it PvP while referencing the fact that the tactics we employed, to take out those larger and higher level groups, have been and are yet today used in IRL wars. You want a bolster and warzones/battlegrounds that pit an even number of equally leveled players against each other?? SW:TOR is free to play and offers this. Same as WoW I believe. Please, feel free to play those as much as you like.

again im not saying ur tactic is bad. its the obvious thing to do in the situation u described. all im saying is it doesnt rly count in a competitive way as to many factors arent on a equal setting. sure if u kill 3 vr6+ ppl with 4 lvl 30ishs u did a damn good job. (or they did really bad, depends how u look at it) however look at football f.e. when a 1st league club plays a 3rd league club the 3rd league club wont bring 15 players to compensate for their lack of skill. the nature of open world pvp mmos allows u to do that tho which is fine ofc as it doesnt violate any rules but its not really a fair win.

mentioning wow and swtor just proves ur lack of experience even more. if u knew what ur talking about u would have mentioned DAoC and Darkfall instead ^^

So, mentioning the most recent(SW:TOR) and most succesful(WoW) mmo's that do this means I know nothing?? lol You're starting to look more and more like an entitlement person, wanting something for nothing.

most recent doesnt mean *** tho. WoW just as SW:TOR are both *** horrible games. always been always will be. no competitive mmo player has ever even considered them cos the skill ceiling is just way too low. truely competitive mmos are DAoC, Darkfall, to some extend Darkfall Unholy Wars, EvE and good old UO.

First, I never said that TOR or WoW had good pvp, because they don't. They employ the "fair" pvp you're looking for, so go play them. I was, by no means, trying to state the MMO's that did it best lol. Oh and you forgot to mention SWG. Oh yeah, that's right SWG was an open world pvp mmo that didn't give babies a sucker just because they weren't at the same character level as another person.

Lexander

V10

greylox

Anyone can get involved in the zerg...if you enjoy that sort of thing, but as stated above, veterans will be tuff.

lao

Cydone wrote: »

lao wrote: »

Cydone wrote: »

lao wrote: »

Cydone wrote: »

lao wrote: »

Cydone wrote: »

lao wrote: »

Cydone wrote: »

lao wrote: »

Cydone wrote: »

Magischzwei wrote: »

Go veteran level or go home.
Cydone is a liar scared of loosing his own benefit.

Magischzwei is scared because others have invested and are investing time to earn their rewards. He wants them for free.

I pvp'd throughout my entire leveling experience. I never felt at a great dis-advantage when facing higher level players.....unless they were close to the very top level. I took on a few, got killed. So, what did I do? I didn't cry on the forums about someone who was or close to top level beating me. I wasn't dumb enough to keep trying to take on those powerful ppl(who EARNED that power) in 1 v 1 battles. When I saw a group of VR6 or above players, I didn't try to take them on with an equal group of lvl 30 players or something like that. Because I'm not stupid. Unlike some ppl that think as a lvl 30, you should be able to take out a group of ppl that are 20+ levels above your own, even if you have an equal number of ppl in your group, that are also lvl 30.

I used tactics and strategy to take them out. One of my group would lure a couple away from their group and we would kill them. Where we had the advantage over their levels. Taking on a powerful enemy out in the open, that has the advantage in a straight up fight, isn't a smart strategy. Then coming to the forums to whine and complain about it is even less of one.

to be fair. zerging them isnt beating them. its more or less valid since u cant 1v1 or 3v3 or 5v5 or 50v50 them. u did get alliance points but u didnt beat them.

If the 50v50 is 50 VR5's against 50 lvl 30 players, then yes, the 50 VR5 ppl should win because they have the advantage. THAT is what you get when you are closing in or ARE the very top level in a game. You want scaling, or seems you do, which would balance the fight out for the lower level ppl that have invested barely any time into their characters.

But HOW is this balanced for the people that ARE spending hours getting their characters to the plateau? It isn't balanced at all. The people that want equal footing, without putting in the leg work, are trying to make it so that the people that play the game the most(who should then reap the greatest rewards), their effort should be for nothing. Simply because they haven't reached/earned the same as the other person. How is it fair to even discuss rewarding ppl for not putting in the same time as others??

im not saying that anything needs to be done. the system is working as intended. most effort put in results in best reward. thats exactly how its intended.

all im saying is u shouldnt claim you beat them with "superior tactics" aka outnumbering them cos a win doesnt count for *** unless its even numbers.

that beeing said it also goes the other way around if 10 vr10 players kill 30 l30s theres also nothing to brag about.

its just how open world pvp mmos play out. sometimes small high lvl groups get zerged by lower levels and sometimes the high level group will beat vastly superior numbers of low level players. both scenarios dont mean jack tho as its not an even fight.

only fights that count is equal number/equal level fights imo as thats the only case where u can somewhat reliably measure skill between both sides.

If you really think that "superior tactics" means outnumbering someone, you really know nothing about tactics in pvp lol. Not saying I'm the best tactician there is, but even I know that. And try telling any country IRL, that not having even numbers in a victory doesn't mean anything, in a war. Same principle applies here. Ask the Vietcong about using superior tactics against a stronger enemy. If 4 lvl 35 players can effectively pick of members of a group, 2 by 2 or 3 by 3, and those players are 20+ levels above you....then yes it does mean something.

i quote u from an earlier post

""""When I saw a group of VR6 or above players, I didn't try to take them on with an equal group of lvl 30 players or something like that. Because I'm not stupid. Unlike some ppl that think as a lvl 30, you should be able to take out a group of ppl that are 20+ levels above your own, even if you have an equal number of ppl in your group, that are also lvl 30.""""

thats ur "superior tactics" again im not saying what u did is wrong but dont go around and claim u beat anyone. ive played competitive mmos for over 15 years so ill assure u ive forgotten more about pvp tactics that most in here will ever know

ur entire rl analogy already proves that u dont know anything about competitive pvp. anyone who ever was part of a top tier group in any mmo, even the modern casual ones, would never make such a comparison as games have MUCH more in common with a sport than with a war. only the roleplayers would ever call it a war.

as a competitive player i couldnt care less about the theme of the game.

its about measuring ur skills with the skills of other likeminded ppl in fair fights. fair in this case means same numbers, same level of char progression, same level of gear. obviously this is done at max level with best possible gear as its the only way to make sure that fights are held on an even footing. thats why competitive players rush through the content. we dont care about the story, we dont care about immersion, we dont care about anything but competition as thats the only fun part in mmos for the vast majority of us. we have no interest in running in a 200ppl zerg of l10-40 ppl cos theres no challenge and no challenge equals boring.

ultimatively, when the game grew abit and more ppl reach that level, the goal is to set up fights with other competitive guilds/groups somewhere in the wilderness far away from everyone. how does that carry any strategical value in ur "war" ?

To be fair to what you quoted me on, I never said that level of players me and my group used those tactics on. We were 30-40 and 4 of us. They were VR1-3 with like 2 VR6's in there, for a total of like 7 players. AND I also said that we would lure a few of them away from their group and kill them. Drawing small parts of a stronger force away to ambush them with slightly greater numbers is a tactic that works in pvp and also works IRL. Look at the American Revolution and the militia forces that were running the British mad with their tactics. And I've been in MMO's/pvp just about as long as you have(since 2003).

Also, I wasn't calling what we do war. I was calling it PvP while referencing the fact that the tactics we employed, to take out those larger and higher level groups, have been and are yet today used in IRL wars. You want a bolster and warzones/battlegrounds that pit an even number of equally leveled players against each other?? SW:TOR is free to play and offers this. Same as WoW I believe. Please, feel free to play those as much as you like.

again im not saying ur tactic is bad. its the obvious thing to do in the situation u described. all im saying is it doesnt rly count in a competitive way as to many factors arent on a equal setting. sure if u kill 3 vr6+ ppl with 4 lvl 30ishs u did a damn good job. (or they did really bad, depends how u look at it) however look at football f.e. when a 1st league club plays a 3rd league club the 3rd league club wont bring 15 players to compensate for their lack of skill. the nature of open world pvp mmos allows u to do that tho which is fine ofc as it doesnt violate any rules but its not really a fair win.

mentioning wow and swtor just proves ur lack of experience even more. if u knew what ur talking about u would have mentioned DAoC and Darkfall instead ^^

So, mentioning the most recent(SW:TOR) and most succesful(WoW) mmo's that do this means I know nothing?? lol You're starting to look more and more like an entitlement person, wanting something for nothing.

most recent doesnt mean *** tho. WoW just as SW:TOR are both *** horrible games. always been always will be. no competitive mmo player has ever even considered them cos the skill ceiling is just way too low. truely competitive mmos are DAoC, Darkfall, to some extend Darkfall Unholy Wars, EvE and good old UO.

First, I never said that TOR or WoW had good pvp, because they don't. They employ the "fair" pvp you're looking for, so go play them. I was, by no means, trying to state the MMO's that did it best lol. Oh and you forgot to mention SWG. Oh yeah, that's right SWG was an open world pvp mmo that didn't give babies a sucker just because they weren't at the same character level as another person.

idd i forgot about SWG. it was only amazing pre CU tho.

lao

also if ur into open world pvp i suggest u try darkfall unholy wars. open world full loot fps combat mmo.

Cydone

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Cydone wrote: »

lao wrote: »

Cydone wrote: »

lao wrote: »

Cydone wrote: »

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Magischzwei wrote: »

Go veteran level or go home.
Cydone is a liar scared of loosing his own benefit.

Magischzwei is scared because others have invested and are investing time to earn their rewards. He wants them for free.

I pvp'd throughout my entire leveling experience. I never felt at a great dis-advantage when facing higher level players.....unless they were close to the very top level. I took on a few, got killed. So, what did I do? I didn't cry on the forums about someone who was or close to top level beating me. I wasn't dumb enough to keep trying to take on those powerful ppl(who EARNED that power) in 1 v 1 battles. When I saw a group of VR6 or above players, I didn't try to take them on with an equal group of lvl 30 players or something like that. Because I'm not stupid. Unlike some ppl that think as a lvl 30, you should be able to take out a group of ppl that are 20+ levels above your own, even if you have an equal number of ppl in your group, that are also lvl 30.

I used tactics and strategy to take them out. One of my group would lure a couple away from their group and we would kill them. Where we had the advantage over their levels. Taking on a powerful enemy out in the open, that has the advantage in a straight up fight, isn't a smart strategy. Then coming to the forums to whine and complain about it is even less of one.

to be fair. zerging them isnt beating them. its more or less valid since u cant 1v1 or 3v3 or 5v5 or 50v50 them. u did get alliance points but u didnt beat them.

If the 50v50 is 50 VR5's against 50 lvl 30 players, then yes, the 50 VR5 ppl should win because they have the advantage. THAT is what you get when you are closing in or ARE the very top level in a game. You want scaling, or seems you do, which would balance the fight out for the lower level ppl that have invested barely any time into their characters.

But HOW is this balanced for the people that ARE spending hours getting their characters to the plateau? It isn't balanced at all. The people that want equal footing, without putting in the leg work, are trying to make it so that the people that play the game the most(who should then reap the greatest rewards), their effort should be for nothing. Simply because they haven't reached/earned the same as the other person. How is it fair to even discuss rewarding ppl for not putting in the same time as others??

im not saying that anything needs to be done. the system is working as intended. most effort put in results in best reward. thats exactly how its intended.

all im saying is u shouldnt claim you beat them with "superior tactics" aka outnumbering them cos a win doesnt count for *** unless its even numbers.

that beeing said it also goes the other way around if 10 vr10 players kill 30 l30s theres also nothing to brag about.

its just how open world pvp mmos play out. sometimes small high lvl groups get zerged by lower levels and sometimes the high level group will beat vastly superior numbers of low level players. both scenarios dont mean jack tho as its not an even fight.

only fights that count is equal number/equal level fights imo as thats the only case where u can somewhat reliably measure skill between both sides.

If you really think that "superior tactics" means outnumbering someone, you really know nothing about tactics in pvp lol. Not saying I'm the best tactician there is, but even I know that. And try telling any country IRL, that not having even numbers in a victory doesn't mean anything, in a war. Same principle applies here. Ask the Vietcong about using superior tactics against a stronger enemy. If 4 lvl 35 players can effectively pick of members of a group, 2 by 2 or 3 by 3, and those players are 20+ levels above you....then yes it does mean something.

i quote u from an earlier post

""""When I saw a group of VR6 or above players, I didn't try to take them on with an equal group of lvl 30 players or something like that. Because I'm not stupid. Unlike some ppl that think as a lvl 30, you should be able to take out a group of ppl that are 20+ levels above your own, even if you have an equal number of ppl in your group, that are also lvl 30.""""

thats ur "superior tactics" again im not saying what u did is wrong but dont go around and claim u beat anyone. ive played competitive mmos for over 15 years so ill assure u ive forgotten more about pvp tactics that most in here will ever know

ur entire rl analogy already proves that u dont know anything about competitive pvp. anyone who ever was part of a top tier group in any mmo, even the modern casual ones, would never make such a comparison as games have MUCH more in common with a sport than with a war. only the roleplayers would ever call it a war.

as a competitive player i couldnt care less about the theme of the game.

its about measuring ur skills with the skills of other likeminded ppl in fair fights. fair in this case means same numbers, same level of char progression, same level of gear. obviously this is done at max level with best possible gear as its the only way to make sure that fights are held on an even footing. thats why competitive players rush through the content. we dont care about the story, we dont care about immersion, we dont care about anything but competition as thats the only fun part in mmos for the vast majority of us. we have no interest in running in a 200ppl zerg of l10-40 ppl cos theres no challenge and no challenge equals boring.

ultimatively, when the game grew abit and more ppl reach that level, the goal is to set up fights with other competitive guilds/groups somewhere in the wilderness far away from everyone. how does that carry any strategical value in ur "war" ?

To be fair to what you quoted me on, I never said that level of players me and my group used those tactics on. We were 30-40 and 4 of us. They were VR1-3 with like 2 VR6's in there, for a total of like 7 players. AND I also said that we would lure a few of them away from their group and kill them. Drawing small parts of a stronger force away to ambush them with slightly greater numbers is a tactic that works in pvp and also works IRL. Look at the American Revolution and the militia forces that were running the British mad with their tactics. And I've been in MMO's/pvp just about as long as you have(since 2003).

Also, I wasn't calling what we do war. I was calling it PvP while referencing the fact that the tactics we employed, to take out those larger and higher level groups, have been and are yet today used in IRL wars. You want a bolster and warzones/battlegrounds that pit an even number of equally leveled players against each other?? SW:TOR is free to play and offers this. Same as WoW I believe. Please, feel free to play those as much as you like.

again im not saying ur tactic is bad. its the obvious thing to do in the situation u described. all im saying is it doesnt rly count in a competitive way as to many factors arent on a equal setting. sure if u kill 3 vr6+ ppl with 4 lvl 30ishs u did a damn good job. (or they did really bad, depends how u look at it) however look at football f.e. when a 1st league club plays a 3rd league club the 3rd league club wont bring 15 players to compensate for their lack of skill. the nature of open world pvp mmos allows u to do that tho which is fine ofc as it doesnt violate any rules but its not really a fair win.

mentioning wow and swtor just proves ur lack of experience even more. if u knew what ur talking about u would have mentioned DAoC and Darkfall instead ^^

So, mentioning the most recent(SW:TOR) and most succesful(WoW) mmo's that do this means I know nothing?? lol You're starting to look more and more like an entitlement person, wanting something for nothing.

most recent doesnt mean *** tho. WoW just as SW:TOR are both *** horrible games. always been always will be. no competitive mmo player has ever even considered them cos the skill ceiling is just way too low. truely competitive mmos are DAoC, Darkfall, to some extend Darkfall Unholy Wars, EvE and good old UO.

First, I never said that TOR or WoW had good pvp, because they don't. They employ the "fair" pvp you're looking for, so go play them. I was, by no means, trying to state the MMO's that did it best lol. Oh and you forgot to mention SWG. Oh yeah, that's right SWG was an open world pvp mmo that didn't give babies a sucker just because they weren't at the same character level as another person.

idd i forgot about SWG. it was only amazing pre CU tho.

At least we agree on something. Although the pvp did get "good" later in the NGE....but still couldn't compare to pre-cu.

savinel

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