Werewolf and Vampire are not equals.

jaron_edow

I've seen a lot of rants about how weak and useless the werewolf form is, and up until I got the chance to play it I didn't see it. But most are right that you grind for 10 minutes to get 30 seconds of this extremely novel idea that only does decent damage in pve, sure at the end of the skill line you can probably get it relatively fast maybe 5 minutes of grinding and if you kill a lot of humans you can keep adding time to your transformation but that's after the skill line is fully developed.

YOU CAN'T MAKE EVERYONE HAPPY BUT YOU CAN MAKE IT FAIR...

In the spirit of making the two races as equal as possible I propose this solution. Add humanoid form boosts and here is why. Don't quote me on this because I may be mistaken but my active effects tells me lycanthropy gives 50% weakness to poison. So it appears to me that I'm taking extra poison damage while in humanoid form, but literally getting none of the benefits of being a werewolf, that seems like a huge flaw logically. If this is untrue and you don't take increased poison damage then why not? Give us the weakness of poison and add some benefits too. The vamps take extra fire damage 100% of the time but also get benefits 100% of the time so it only makes sense to me. That is my two cents, it seems like a very fair solution. Instead of making the werewolf OP just make it equal, thanks for reading.

AlexDougherty

Sounds fair, they should have some balance in these things.

Valdavia

jaron_edow wrote: »

I've seen a lot of rants about how weak and useless the werewolf form is, and up until I got the chance to play it I didn't see it. But most are right that you grind for 10 minutes to get 30 seconds of this extremely novel idea that only does decent damage in pve, sure at the end of the skill line you can probably get it relatively fast maybe 5 minutes of grinding and if you kill a lot of humans you can keep adding time to your transformation but that's after the skill line is fully developed.

YOU CAN'T MAKE EVERYONE HAPPY BUT YOU CAN MAKE IT FAIR...

In the spirit of making the two races as equal as possible I propose this solution. Add humanoid form boosts and here is why. Don't quote me on this because I may be mistaken but my active effects tells me lycanthropy gives 50% weakness to poison. So it appears to me that I'm taking extra poison damage while in humanoid form, but literally getting none of the benefits of being a werewolf, that seems like a huge flaw logically. If this is untrue and you don't take increased poison damage then why not? Give us the weakness of poison and add some benefits too. The vamps take extra fire damage 100% of the time but also get benefits 100% of the time so it only makes sense to me. That is my two cents, it seems like a very fair solution. Instead of making the werewolf OP just make it equal, thanks for reading.

Well here is the thing...vampires and werewolves are NOT equals in lore why should they be equals in fantasy? I can see already you carebear bluebies are gonna cry this game into a pitiful state. You don't deserve to have anything just handed to you other than the basic class at character creation...earn the rest and stop the crying.

Phoenix99

It's not WWs that are a problem (they are balanced, they just need fixes to some of the skills) it's the vampire skillset that is really strong, especially when you combine that with the fact that generally they released the game in the state where magicka > stamina.

jaron_edow

Valdavia wrote: »

Well here is the thing...vampires and werewolves are NOT equals in lore why should they be equals in fantasy? I can see already you carebear bluebies are gonna cry this game into a pitiful state. You don't deserve to have anything just handed to you other than the basic class at character creation...earn the rest and stop the crying.

Who's crying? This is simply a solution to something forums are talking about. Also it just makes sense logically that if your were in fact a werewolf you'd have some type of natural boosts in your abilities even in humanoid form. i.e. stamina.

MasterLanz

Valdavia wrote: »

Well here is the thing...vampires and werewolves are NOT equals in lore why should they be equals in fantasy? I can see already you carebear bluebies are gonna cry this game into a pitiful state. You don't deserve to have anything just handed to you other than the basic class at character creation...earn the rest and stop the crying.

In the lore werewolves are far more dangerous than vampires. Vampires are dangerous because they're insidious and cunning, but in a straight fight a rampaging werewolf is supposed to be one of the more terrifying mortal creatures to encounter in Tamriel.

The game doesn't reflect that. Werewolves should be murder-machines in their beast form.

Trenyt

I agree, werewolves should inherit the benefits of the blood in humanoid form as well as the negatives. I wouldn't say werewolves are 'balanced' either, considering they can't dodge, can't break out of crowd control, lose all character passives/armour boosts and only get 2 skills on their toolbar.

Sleepydan

I'm not a werewolf, nor have I yet encountered a werewolf in combat, but I disagree with the humanoid buff suggestion.


It's lame and not what a werewolf represents.

If the transform is found lacking, the transform should be brought up to par. Simple as that. Either make it closer to toggle god mode or reduce the charge time, or do something else.

Someone above me said that a rampaging werewolf is supposed to be one of the most terrifying mortal creature you could encounter. That rings true.

I expect terrifying power.

Laura

or just fix the werewolf bugs.


Also you will start seeing a lot less vampires in veteran dungeons most bosses have fire mechanics (some unavoidable) and as a healer I can tell you now seeing three vampires in my party makes me want to leave. Never fails at least a couple of them will get one shot and actually wonder why it happened.

7788b14_ESO

Like someone else said. Way to many bugs on both sides before considering balance. Shouldn't rebalance then fix bugs.

Rizzit

Valdavia wrote: »

Well here is the thing...vampires and werewolves are NOT equals in lore why should they be equals in fantasy? I can see already you carebear bluebies are gonna cry this game into a pitiful state. You don't deserve to have anything just handed to you other than the basic class at character creation...earn the rest and stop the crying.

you are the biggest *** i have ever seen writing in these forums. Back to azeroth with you!

Zromguy_ESO

Laura wrote: »

Also you will start seeing a lot less vampires in veteran dungeons most bosses have fire mechanics (some unavoidable) and as a healer I can tell you now seeing three vampires in my party makes me want to leave. Never fails at least a couple of them will get one shot and actually wonder why it happened.

And why can't people just use jewelery with fire/ poison resistance to prevent themselves from getting one-shot? I swear some of the people playing this game probably couldn't even take a p*ss without somebody holding it for them.

Spriggen

Zromguy_ESO wrote: »

Laura wrote: »

Also you will start seeing a lot less vampires in veteran dungeons most bosses have fire mechanics (some unavoidable) and as a healer I can tell you now seeing three vampires in my party makes me want to leave. Never fails at least a couple of them will get one shot and actually wonder why it happened.

And why can't people just use jewelery with fire/ poison resistance to prevent themselves from getting one-shot? I swear some of the people playing this game probably couldn't even take a p*ss without somebody holding it for them.

This post x 1000

Seriosly, you people need to understand that this game ( I'm talking about the lore) is not like the comics/movies or other vamp and WW games you have played. One is stronger then the other in some means.

Buff yourself with resist enchants. A friend of mine in my guild has every possible fire resist on his vamp character, that he can go toe to toe with a pyromancer and Win. He has even fraps it and will make a video on YouTube, haven't check if he has completed it.


I have poison resist on all my jewels and I havent died yet in PvP from that. I've had fights were the gank squads I've come up against have even change primary to me and I still come out the victor going werewolf form.

Crying to the devs to make your WW or vamp balanced when it is already is starting to get annoying and the moderators here need to be more strict on this.

tordr86b16_ESO

I'm curing myself but first I'm going to sell my bite to some sucker as I need the gold for respec.

Why?

The increased fire damage is not worth it. If you meet one VT boss with fire attacks then you're a goner. I've literally been 1-shot by a boss mob in a shared dungeon , and to top it off. The passives bug out after a time and the only way to fix them is to log out of the game and back in again.

If you ask me the debuff should be lowered, the same should be applied for werewolfs.

Brittany_Joy

Spriggen wrote: »

Zromguy_ESO wrote: »

Laura wrote: »

Also you will start seeing a lot less vampires in veteran dungeons most bosses have fire mechanics (some unavoidable) and as a healer I can tell you now seeing three vampires in my party makes me want to leave. Never fails at least a couple of them will get one shot and actually wonder why it happened.

And why can't people just use jewelery with fire/ poison resistance to prevent themselves from getting one-shot? I swear some of the people playing this game probably couldn't even take a p*ss without somebody holding it for them.

This post x 1000

Seriosly, you people need to understand that this game ( I'm talking about the lore) is not like the comics/movies or other vamp and WW games you have played. One is stronger then the other in some means.

Buff yourself with resist enchants. A friend of mine in my guild has every possible fire resist on his vamp character, that he can go toe to toe with a pyromancer and Win. He has even fraps it and will make a video on YouTube, haven't check if he has completed it.


I have poison resist on all my jewels and I havent died yet in PvP from that. I've had fights were the gank squads I've come up against have even change primary to me and I still come out the victor going werewolf form.

Crying to the devs to make your WW or vamp balanced when it is already is starting to get annoying and the moderators here need to be more strict on this.

Are you a dragonknight? Or is everyone you fighting against unable to cast a CC on you?Or do you have a pocket healer and gank squad behind you and claim to do all the work yourself? Lastly, are you vet ranked 10 going against lvl 10s?

Spriggen

@‌Brittany_Joy
I just don't get why everyone is so against me on this topic. All I'm doing is trying to explain that there are tools in the game that makes that grind a whole lot easier. Crying to no one about lowering the ultimate point amount is not going to change. Maybe, just maybe they might take 100 points off but I doubt the devs will do that.

I'm a templar, yes when I PvP, I'm with a small kill team of mates from RL. 7 of us. A couple healers, one tank, rest are dps. I don't claim that I do all the work. I think we are quite the team from what we have been through. It's just myself and another that's a WW. My mate (Sorcerer) with all the sets he is wearing and passives , he just needs 320 points to transform and I need 470 after all my set gear.

The idea is that he transforms ( when the transformation works that is ) first as his ultimate allows allies to get points faster for me to get my form on.
Without him I've been able to gather points with out him as 470 isn't that much of a grind. Especially if we are sitting at a nice spot to take out the enemy.

Sure I have been CC'd a lot but my method in PvP is that I tent to transform when I'm in the thick of the fight as that will fear everyone and when the fight is over I will revert back to my humanoid form as I can't go into stealth.

AlexDougherty

MasterLanz wrote: »

Valdavia wrote: »

Well here is the thing...vampires and werewolves are NOT equals in lore why should they be equals in fantasy? I can see already you carebear bluebies are gonna cry this game into a pitiful state. You don't deserve to have anything just handed to you other than the basic class at character creation...earn the rest and stop the crying.

In the lore werewolves are far more dangerous than vampires. Vampires are dangerous because they're insidious and cunning, but in a straight fight a rampaging werewolf is supposed to be one of the more terrifying mortal creatures to encounter in Tamriel.

The game doesn't reflect that. Werewolves should be murder-machines in their beast form.

Agreed, werewolves should be better in game, although balance between them, Vampires, and players who choose to be neither should be maintained ideally. Weapons effective against Vampires and Werewolves exists in lore, silver weapons, especially swords, should be easily obtainable.

Brittany_Joy

Spriggen wrote: »

@‌Brittany_Joy
I just don't get why everyone is so against me on this topic. All I'm doing is trying to explain that there are tools in the game that makes that grind a whole lot easier. Crying to no one about lowering the ultimate point amount is not going to change. Maybe, just maybe they might take 100 points off but I doubt the devs will do that.

I'm a templar, yes when I PvP, I'm with a small kill team of mates from RL. 7 of us. A couple healers, one tank, rest are dps. I don't claim that I do all the work. I think we are quite the team from what we have been through. It's just myself and another that's a WW. My mate (Sorcerer) with all the sets he is wearing and passives , he just needs 320 points to transform and I need 470 after all my set gear.

The idea is that he transforms ( when the transformation works that is ) first as his ultimate allows allies to get points faster for me to get my form on.
Without him I've been able to gather points with out him as 470 isn't that much of a grind. Especially if we are sitting at a nice spot to take out the enemy.

Sure I have been CC'd a lot but my method in PvP is that I tent to transform when I'm in the thick of the fight as that will fear everyone and when the fight is over I will revert back to my humanoid form as I can't go into stealth.

I am actually only complaining about not being able to dodge and CC break in werewolf form. I think they should at least give us the ability to dodge because no skill can get rid of roots except dodging out of it. Also the ultimate randomly disappearing is annoying. Having a short duration of time in werewolf form is annoying too. I think they seriously need to allow us to be werewolves as much as possible by increasing the time of devour and getting rid of the internal CD. The damage and the skills in werewolf form are fine.

I mean why shouldn't werewolf form be toggled on and off at will, so players can be in form for how long they want. ESO is all about playing the way you want and taking away the form from actual werewolves seem to be against that motto.

I personally hate the grind for werewolf form because it takes me a few minutes and randomly disappears so I have to grind again. I don't want to grind for a short duration in werewolf form. ESO should allow me to be in werewolf form for as long as I want because that is the way I want to play.


Also what set are you using to reduce it to 470? I think I saw a vet ranked Akaviri dragonguard set but I am not sure if the full set exists for vet rank. I know about the salvation set because I am currently using it.

ariella321

It isn't as good as a dodge, but I've used the pounce attack to get out of a rooting effect.

Hodorius

There is a set ( forgot the names and cant log in right now to check ) that lowers the required ultimate points by 20% and another one that reduces the ult points for werewolf transformation by 30%.

Both do drop only... I am trying to obtain the full set and make it epic or perhaps legendary and sell it for millions of gold...

Then you are able to skill an increased gain of ult points... veil of blades ( 200 ) are about two grps in a dungeon to get rdy.

Pls correct me if the numbers are wrong and/or tell the set´s names if you know them.

blackwolf7

Vampire is currently fine because the tradeback is pretty hard. I eat vampires spamming ults and mistforms in pvp as a DK with silverbolts and fire spells.

All you cry babies saying vamp is op needs to go play other mmorpg that is designed for kids. This game needs careful planning before engaging and everything can be countered. L2p.


I do agree though that werewolves needs buff. They are soo much weaker compared to vamps.

Brittany_Joy

blackwolf7 wrote: »

Vampire is currently fine because the tradeback is pretty hard. I eat vampires spamming ults and mistforms in pvp as a DK with silverbolts and fire spells.

All you cry babies saying vamp is op needs to go play other mmorpg that is designed for kids. This game needs careful planning before engaging and everything can be countered. L2p.


I do agree though that werewolves needs buff. They are soo much weaker compared to vamps.

You should rename your character to Van helsing.

Skellan

Just want to point out that lore is not a valid reason for imbalance in skill lines, game play should always trump it