Healer builds unviable for leveling

Weevah

I believe I speak for most healers when I say we are disappointed to discover that healing in dungeons rewards us with no exp.

Killing mobs in dungeons currently gives no exp. You cannot level in TESO by healing dungeon groups. Some people thought this was a bug.

This makes a dedicated heal build unviable for leveling. Your best option currently is to pick the DPS flavor of your choice and quest to 50.

Then, respec and start healing again.

I want to ask Zenimax why this has to be? Why can't I practice my art until I hit 50?

Proposed solution: Make the current dungeon quests repeatable. Requires minimal recoding. May still be slower leveling than standard questing, but allows healers and tanks to develop their play skills properly.

Zordrage

you realy want that 3 XP we are getting in Dungeons ?

let them fix the whole Dungeon XP 1st........

trust me you don't miss out ANYTHING lol

Weevah

Zoliru wrote: »

you realy want that 3 XP we are getting in Dungeons ?

let them fix the whole Dungeon XP 1st........

trust me you don't miss out ANYTHING lol

What I want Zoliru is exp from healing in dungeons. I don't care how I get it.

dnotecmb16_ESO

You do get experience for healing in dungeons, but the experience is so small it won't make any difference at all.

Of course, you need to actually heal to get contribution reward... I'm not sure how much health that is, but if no one is taking damage then it could just be that you aren't healing enough to get the contribution.

Either way though, experience from dungeons is the worst in the game, you'd be insane to try and level up that way.

Weevah

dnotecmb16_ESO wrote: »

You do get experience for healing in dungeons, but the experience is so small it won't make any difference at all.

Of course, you need to actually heal to get contribution reward... I'm not sure how much health that is, but if no one is taking damage then it could just be that you aren't healing enough to get the contribution.

Either way though, experience from dungeons is the worst in the game, you'd be insane to try and level up that way.

When an outside mob gives a few hundred exp, the difference between 3 exp and 0 exp per kill is undetectable.

The noob pug groups I ran with seemed to enjoy red floor candy. If I didn't "actually heal" we would wipe quickly. But that's not what happened during my runs.

I worked to keep the group alive. I just wasn't getting paid.

Zordrage

Weevah wrote: »

the difference between 3 exp and 0 exp per kill is undetectable.

thats what we are trying to tell you

you DID got XP but its soo small you did not saw it on your XP bar its BROKEN everyone is getting the same XP that is basicaly nothing lol

or are you talking abbout loots now ???

Weevah

Zoliru wrote: »

Weevah wrote: »

the difference between 3 exp and 0 exp per kill is undetectable.

thats what we are trying to tell you

you DID got XP but its soo small you did not saw it on your XP bar its BROKEN everyone is getting the same XP that is basicaly nothing lol

or are you talking abbout loots now ???

Neither my good man.

This post is about that fact that healer builds are unviable for leveling.

Because I love healing, and I am disappointed that I cannot use my healing skills to level up.

I am not alone in this.

PurpleMango0416

I'm not quite sure what you mean in terms of overall leveling. Are you exclusively playing dungeons? What is this "healer build"? I'm currently playing a templar and have one dps tree, restoration tree, destruction staff, and restoration staff all at very comparable levels (restoration staff is falling a bit behind, but that's just for now).

I have zero problem leveling and being able to stand my ground when questing outside of dungeons and am able to heal dungeons without much difficulty.

Unless, of course, you want to rush through the leveling experience and hit end game ASAP... but what's the point in doing that for a game that just came out a few weeks ago?

Layenem

I know 4 healers who are leveling as healers. They picked up one dps ability and use that to do damage and that's it. They were smart and picked a magicka based ability since healers use magicka as a primary resource for healing.

You don't have to spec raw dps... And you DON'T want to see a healer in Cyrodiil who can also DPS... SWTOR did this and they had to nerf it hard because they couldn't be killed but they could wreck your face. No thank you.

Weevah

PurpleMango0416 wrote: »

I'm not quite sure what you mean in terms of overall leveling. Are you exclusively playing dungeons? What is this "healer build"? I'm currently playing a templar and have one dps tree, restoration tree, destruction staff, and restoration staff all at very comparable levels (restoration staff is falling a bit behind, but that's just for now).

I have zero problem leveling and being able to stand my ground when questing outside of dungeons and am able to heal dungeons without much difficulty.

Unless, of course, you want to rush through the leveling experience and hit end game ASAP... but what's the point in doing that for a game that just came out a few weeks ago?

Are you exclusively playing dungeons? Yes.

What is this "healer build"? Level 12, Light armor, Breath of Life, Lingering Ritual, Illustrious Healing, Mutagen, Practiced Incantation, all relevant passives, 4 crafting skills. 1 spare point for unmorphed Sun Fire.

I'm glad you can 'stand your ground' but with the above dedicated healing build my dps and survivability outside group situations are low.

Eventually, you have to leave the dungeon to level.

For solo questing I'm much better off respecced into heavy armor and a dps tree. All those healing skills are useless. That's what makes it unviable.

If you want to slowly kill quest mobs using restoration staff attacks and self heals that's your call. I got tired of it.

Weevah

Layenem wrote: »

I know 4 healers who are leveling as healers. They picked up one dps ability and use that to do damage and that's it. They were smart and picked a magicka based ability since healers use magicka as a primary resource for healing.

You don't have to spec raw dps... And you DON'T want to see a healer in Cyrodiil who can also DPS... SWTOR did this and they had to nerf it hard because they couldn't be killed but they could wreck your face. No thank you.

The fact that your healer friends have to do dps in order to level is the central issue here.

They aren't specialized dps, but they still have to do it to level.

We healers should be free to level by healing groups in dungeons. Currently we cannot.

fantom

This isn't wow, you're not supposed to be able to faceroll your way through the game even if you have a *** build and no idea what you're doing.

Your build sucks, and trying to level with a static set of spells that never changes is stupid. You have to adapt to the situation, the game isn't going to adapt to you. That's why it gives you so much freedom to choose between skills, weapons, and armor types.

Get your head straight and invest in proper spells to level, use a magicka dump and a stamina dump. Make use of both weapon sets.

Weevah

fantom wrote: »

This isn't wow, you're not supposed to be able to faceroll your way through the game even if you have a *** build and no idea what you're doing.

Your build sucks, and trying to level with a static set of spells that never changes is stupid. You have to adapt to the situation, the game isn't going to adapt to you. That's why it gives you so much freedom to choose between skills, weapons, and armor types.

Get your head straight and invest in proper spells to level, use a magicka dump and a stamina dump. Make use of both weapon sets.

That's just a rude and badly thought out post that I don't have to respond to.

Dual.sphereeb17_ESO

Hi there!

Wanted to comment on this, since I do not understand what the problem is.

I am a healer. I level with cloth armour, and I heal dungeons with ease. When I am soloing, I use a bow and DPS skills.

Why are you respeccing_? you got weapon swap unlocked at lvl15..

And even before that, you can use the leveling "trick"for multiple weapons...

disexistencenub19_ESO

Don't put all your eggs in one basket, as they say.

I have been leveling a healer myself, though I am a bit more hybrid dps with most of my points still focused towards healing and magicka regen and I am having no trouble at all.

I don't believe they designed the game to work the way you are thinking and dungeons aren't meant to be grinded repeatedly.

gen.jaxb14_ESO

I agree with everything the OP said. I am currently playing a Templar healer and was very disappointed to find out that repeating dungeons earned next to no XP. I have since had to spec into DPS and solo quest to 20 currently. I am looking forward to the next set of dungeons even though I know that fun will be short lived after the first run through. I sincerely hope Zenimax lessens the penalty of repeating dungeons because at this point in time I feel like I will just be solo questing outside of dungeons all the way to 50, and have no real healing experience.

I understand that this penalty was put in place for power levelers and people rushing to 50, but this has ruined group dungeons for everyone in the process.

I agree with the proposed solution stated in the original post as well. I would be more than happy leveling slightly slower than other people that are grinding on mobs outside or questing, as long as it did not feel like a complete waste of time.

I wanted to add that this does not feel like an Elder Scrolls game in its current state. When I think of an ES game I think of freedom, and exploration. I feel like Zenimax is funneling everyone down one path (quests). I am sure they are great, but after the 500th, "Oh please, would you go save my friend that got lost in this cave that's right behind me and only has one exit" dialog, I can't take it anymore.

Kaiem

I have several healers in my guild who have leveled with only one or two dps skills unlocked at all and the rest of their skill points invested into purely healing skills and Passover. One of them hasn't even ever used any weapon other than a restoration staff! You can happily level using a healing build you just have to be prepared to put one or two points into some sort of dps.

As for the claim that this is an example of them straying from the elders scrolls format, are you serious?

flarefireb16_ESO

Well having 4 crafting skills and every healing tool available is a bit excessive. You'd have no problem questing if you diversify your skillset a bit.

If you want to deal with the current situation, drop a craft or few heals (you really don't need them and can get them back later anyway). Use the points to pick up some damage dealing powers. I'd suggest grabbing Poison Arrow and Solar Flare at least. Alternatively, group up with some friends whenever you're out questing.

Of course it's plain stupid that dungeons give such crap XP. I really hope they'll be fixing that ASAP, and daily dungeon quests are a reasonable fix (if not a perfect one). But right now the simple reality is that pure healing builds take forever to level.

7788b14_ESO

They only want us to level by questing. All other xp nerfed for everyone. Though a few quests give less xp then some mob kills do.

Frail_Old_Man

One of the silliest threads ever, the dungeon exp is a valid point but respeccing etc, loool, no need for that.
If you want be 100% pure dedicated healbot, group up with someone outside of the dungeons. You wont be able to heal mobs till they explode from overheals.

Weevah

Dual.sphereeb17_ESO wrote: »

Hi there!

Wanted to comment on this, since I do not understand what the problem is.

I am a healer. I level with cloth armour, and I heal dungeons with ease. When I am soloing, I use a bow and DPS skills.

Why are you respeccing_? you got weapon swap unlocked at lvl15..

And even before that, you can use the leveling "trick"for multiple weapons...

Hi Dual!

Thanks for your comment.

It sounds like you're using a hybrid heal/dps spec which is defiantly good thinking. You'd have no trouble questing with that.

My pure healing build was designed for leveling by doing dungeons. I have respeced because you can't play TESO that way. The build is useless outside of a dungeon.

Weapon swap requires points invested in a dps weapon.

Weevah

disexistencenub19_ESO wrote: »

dungeons aren't meant to be grinded repeatedly.

Quests are though.

I'd rather grind dungeons than quests.

Weevah

gen.jaxb14_ESO wrote: »

I will just be solo questing outside of dungeons all the way to 50, and have no real healing experience.

This is a valid concern that all TESO healers are facing. It won't just affect us healers, all veteran groups will suffer from our initial lack of experience.

Jen.jaxb14 you are probably the only poster to fully comprehend the issues I am trying to raise.

Weevah

Kaiem wrote: »

I have several healers in my guild who have leveled with only one or two dps skills unlocked at all and the rest of their skill points invested into purely healing skills and Passover. One of them hasn't even ever used any weapon other than a restoration staff! You can happily level using a healing build you just have to be prepared to put one or two points into some sort of dps.

As for the claim that this is an example of them straying from the elders scrolls format, are you serious?

People talk about their friends leveling from 1-50 using a single dps skill.

Anybody that's actually tried to do it, like Jen.jaxb14 and I, respecs into dps. Spamming 1 skill over and over while heavily armored 2-h swordsmen charge past you is pretty soul destroying.

Most devoted healers want to complete the required questing as fast as possible and get back to healing.

Weevah

flarefireb16_ESO wrote: »

Well having 4 crafting skills and every healing tool available is a bit excessive. You'd have no problem questing if you diversify your skillset a bit.

If you want to deal with the current situation, drop a craft or few heals (you really don't need them and can get them back later anyway). Use the points to pick up some damage dealing powers. I'd suggest grabbing Poison Arrow and Solar Flare at least. Alternatively, group up with some friends whenever you're out questing.

Of course it's plain stupid that dungeons give such crap XP. I really hope they'll be fixing that ASAP, and daily dungeon quests are a reasonable fix (if not a perfect one). But right now the simple reality is that pure healing builds take forever to level.

Thanks for your post!

Most of what you have said is correct. A pure healing build is not viable for leveling. It is required to "drop a few heals" and "pick up some damage dealing powers."

Being required to do that is the issue - I want to heal dungeon groups and level from it. I don't want to be outside dps questing.

And I agree that repeatable dungeons quests are a reasonable fix, not a perfect one.

"Having every healing tool available" is often desired by dedicated (non-hybrid) healers and allows skill exploration while leveling. Sadly, as you mentioned, it is not viable pre-50.

Weevah

Frail_Old_Man wrote: »

One of the silliest threads ever, the dungeon exp is a valid point but respeccing etc, loool, no need for that.
If you want be 100% pure dedicated healbot, group up with someone outside of the dungeons. You wont be able to heal mobs till they explode from overheals.

You've made some decent posts in the past Frail but this is not one of them.

"respeccing etc, loool, no need for that" - why?

And why would I group to heal a player doing quests I can solo myself?

Your post is rude and holds aloft the obvious as insightful.

BKTHNDR

Redguard Templar here (light armor/resto staff):

I'm currently level 27 and I'm not having the same experience as you are, OP. In between heals, you should be doing damage with your resto staff, if for nothing else but the magicka regen you receive upon using your heavy attack. You're not supposed to just stand in the background and spam heals anyway. You should be doing some sort of damage in between healing to help the group. So, between your healing and your damage contribution, you should be receiving the same exp as everyone else.

Weevah

BKTHNDR wrote: »

Redguard Templar here (light armor/resto staff):

I'm currently level 27 and I'm not having the same experience as you are, OP. In between heals, you should be doing damage with your resto staff, if for nothing else but the magicka regen you receive upon using your heavy attack. You're not supposed to just stand in the background and spam heals anyway. You should be doing some sort of damage in between healing to help the group. So, between your healing and your damage contribution, you should be receiving the same exp as everyone else.

Thanks for the post BKTHNDR.

The thread regards the fact that NO-ONE (tank, dps, heals) gets exp for dungeon kills anymore (see thread forums.elderscrollsonline.com/discussion/63619/monsters-in-dungeons-give-3-exp#latest)

I am surprised that some people are still unaware of this.

It particularly affects dedicated healer builds with low dps which is why I started the thread.

Ahnuk

Hi Weevah,

I'm leveling a healer as well and i do understand your concerns.
I tried a pure heal build before which made me delete my first character as it was an unbearable experience.

The actual state of the group dungeons makes it so that, players run them just once, which, for pve, leaves us the only one which is questing.
The problem for a healer is that, you can't learn how to group/raid heal from this experience even if you are grouped up with a friend.

I'm using a hybrid build with a resto staff for both questing and dungeons, and i think it's working fine, though, i can almost guarantee it will fail on higher level dungeons/raids.

My build:
esohead.com/calculator/skills#cokzvvrFTl8rFTc8heam8ffdV8frrv8rFyV8heam8heaj8ffqC8ffdV8frrv8ffdJ8L7JcdoQr6MdoQC6MdoQF6MdoQJ6MdoQK8j7DLSZ6rU06rUM6MrJO16MrJPr6MrJPh6MrJPu8n7DrWQ6LWZ6LW26rW36MfwgO6MfwgU6Mfwg26Mfwe08v7HLanU6LanW6Mhy3D6Mhx0n6Mhx0y6Mhx0l6Mhx0B8O7zzAZqS8P7zzLp4d847pzxLCe6cxLDm6cxLDo6cxLDs

Weevah

Ahnuk wrote: »

Hi Weevah,

I'm leveling a healer as well and i do understand your concerns.
I tried a pure heal build before which made me delete my first character as it was an unbearable experience.

The actual state of the group dungeons makes it so that, players run them just once, which, for pve, leaves us the only one which is questing.
The problem for a healer is that, you can't learn how to group/raid heal from this experience even if you are grouped up with a friend.

I'm using a hybrid build with a resto staff for both questing and dungeons, and i think it's working fine, though, i can almost guarantee it will fail on higher level dungeons/raids.

My build:
esohead.com/calculator/skills#cokzvvrFTl8rFTc8heam8ffdV8frrv8rFyV8heam8heaj8ffqC8ffdV8frrv8ffdJ8L7JcdoQr6MdoQC6MdoQF6MdoQJ6MdoQK8j7DLSZ6rU06rUM6MrJO16MrJPr6MrJPh6MrJPu8n7DrWQ6LWZ6LW26rW36MfwgO6MfwgU6Mfwg26Mfwe08v7HLanU6LanW6Mhy3D6Mhx0n6Mhx0y6Mhx0l6Mhx0B8O7zzAZqS8P7zzLp4d847pzxLCe6cxLDm6cxLDo6cxLDs

Hi Ahnuk

Thanks for your post, I appreciate your support.

I agree that our pve questing experience will not prepare us for healing at veteran level and all will suffer as a result.

I agree that a hybrid dps/heal spec for leveling will work but am saddened that you had to discard your pure healing build in favor of it.

Ahnuk

The worst thing is that, the lack of experience is affecting us all and not just us healers. In most of my dungeon runs i felt that the tanks weren't doing their job properly.

I just hope Zenimax finds a way soon to make people want to play together again, otherwise, in the long run, this may turn into a big problem.