Objections toward the new "Adventure Zone" (Group only content)

Salacious

Is their a reason for the new zone to be group content only? ES games are typically single player based and a lot of the content in this game is geared towards people like me: Solo Players.

I don't mind grouping up for dungeons or group based world content like anchors. That's fine. and I don't mind some group content but to be FORCED to get into a group of 4-12 people JUST TO EXPLORE is sad and pathetic.

I don't mind if you keep your challenges and your group content in the new zone but for the love of god don't segregate those of us who like to play solo, who like the feeling that "Yes I saved the town, I did this" (thank you phasing!!!!).

I was so excited for a new zone, but the fact I have to group up completely turns me off. It's as bad as GW2's "you made it to the end of the game, now to completely finish the story you must group up and do a dungeon" - NO.

You might be thinking - Just group up or don't do the content.

- One: I like new content, I like exploring, I like going off on my own down some path and finding a random quest not have 4 people dictate what direction I can or cannot go in.
- Two: I hate groups. They are full of trolls, chest stealer's and "dictators". as mentioned in point one I like just wondering off the beaten path encountering a ghost and helping him redeem his wifes past.

As stated before, keep your group content but don't limit a whole zone to ONLY group content, regardless of how small the groups are. I don't play dps, healer or tank. I play my way - I experiment with my class and just wonder around doing what ever I want. What are level 50's like me suppose to do in this instance? Sit there and twiddle our thumbs?

Help me understand that.

mutharex

Sorry I didn't read all that but the only thing I can say is they will be releasing different kind of content, both group oriented and more solo. The Adventure Zones are all group oriented. Some other stuff (like Thieves Guild, Crime and Punishment system) will be more solo oriented, but don't forget this is a MMORPG so, you know, it's not weird that they think about.. groups of people playing together

Nooblet

Sounds like you would prefer single player games.

If you limit yourself to single player in an mmo, there will be content you are unable to defeat. That's pretty much just the way it is. Keep in mind, there are many that enjoy competitive group content.

KerinKor

I too am less than happy that this new content is entirely group-only, and like you it seems the notion that ESO is single-player friendly is as flawed as GW2's for the same reasons.

I don't mind grouping when it's optional but I hate forced-grouping simply to follow the core content. Turbine learned that with LOTRO a long time ago, I'd hoped Zenimax had also got the point, sadly though it seems they followed those who say "why do soloers play an MMORPG which stand more MASSIVELY MULTIPLAYER": the answer to that of course is to point out that the 'G' doesn't stand for GROUP.

And in ESO it's made hugely worse because the whole notion of guilds as places where folks can form closer-knit relationships to do group content is entirely undermined by the requirement for trading to be Guild-only, so now it's impossible to find 'small, content guilds' because they're all trying to get massive so they can trade and do PVP to conquer keeps so they can trade even more.

Shimond

Most of the game is designed around single player, and aren't the standard leveling zones only 1/3 of the full picture anyway (ability go to into the other faction zones at 50+)? Seems to me there was a shortage of group content, that this patch fills.

So there, "stupidity" explained :P

Melian

You're going to get flamed for this, but you have a point.

I like group content, but still, I don't spend all of my time doing it and don't want to. No, I don't want to go play another game so I can, either, and I doubt that's what ZOS wants. As it is, most of us are probably spending at least as much time questing by ourselves as we are in dungeons, and it's working out just fine. Once I get to VR 10, though, I imagine I'll have finished all or most of that solo content. What am I going to do when I'm *not* doing group content? I seriously don't believe most players want to spend all their play time in group dungeons/raids/equivalent.

Pang

mutharex wrote: »

Sorry I didn't read all that but the only thing I can say is they will be releasing different kind of content, both group oriented and more solo. The Adventure Zones are all group oriented. Some other stuff (like Thieves Guild, Crime and Punishment system) will be more solo oriented, but don't forget this is a MMORPG so, you know, it's not weird that they think about.. groups of people playing together

Yep this. Everything doesn't have to be all things to all players. There is plenty of content to go around. Not every update is going to contain things that you will like. I prefer group/raid content but you'll never see me or anyone else really complain that some new solo content has to have group elements in them.

Also if you watch the Craglorn vid pretty sure they state there are some things that are open to the public. But yes the group content will require being in a group, nothing odd, weird or stupid about that.

Vikova

It's to counteract the phasing issues that can cause problems for group play early on.

Also, MMO.

SinBad

its not sad and pathetic, its for the people who like large scale pve, there is none of that as of now. Just 4 man dungeons is not enough there needs to be high end large scale group content and that's what adventure zones bring to the table. I understand a lot of people like solo like yourself, I like my share of soloing as well. But there are also people who love grouping with their friends and guilds.

There will be plenty of more content added to this game be patient. Like someone said above thieves guild possibly dark brotherhood, those will most likely be solo content.

Twistedmind

Salacious wrote: »

Is their a reason for the new zone to be group content only? ES games are typically single player based and a lot of the content in this game is geared towards people like me: Solo Players.

That is all I bothered to read.
Welcome to MMO games.

Salacious

mutharex wrote: »

Sorry I didn't read all that but the only thing I can say is they will be releasing different kind of content, both group oriented and more solo. The Adventure Zones are all group oriented. Some other stuff (like Thieves Guild, Crime and Punishment system) will be more solo oriented, but don't forget this is a MMORPG so, you know, it's not weird that they think about.. groups of people playing together

You're right it's not. But a whole zone with new story? with new content? with dungeons, tows, cities and so on ..... that's ridiculous. Give us more of that solo. Let me explore a bit before I have to group up. maybe this zone could have more group based content - but at least have some solo stuff. I want to explore - just not with any one else unless its a dungeon or an anchor.

Don't limit new zones to ONLY group content.

KerinKor wrote: »

I too am less than happy that this new content is entirely group-only, and like you it seems the notion that ESO is single-player friendly is as flawed as GW2's for the same reasons.

I don't mind grouping when it's optional but I hate forced-grouping simply to follow the core content. Turbine learned that with LOTRO a long time ago, I'd hoped Zenimax had also got the point, sadly though it seems they followed those who say "why do soloers play an MMORPG which stand more MASSIVELY MULTIPLAYER": the answer to that of course is to point out that the 'G' doesn't stand for GROUP.

And in ESO it's made hugely worse because the whole notion of guilds as places where folks can form closer-knit relationships to do group content is entirely undermined by the requirement for trading to be Guild-only, so now it's impossible to find 'small, content guilds' because they're all trying to get massive so they can trade and do PVP to conquer keeps so they can trade even more.

No but the two M's in the abbreviation do. Which is another argument. How ever I agree - forced grouping for a new zone, as stated numerous times is ***. Again I am not opposed to group content, I like it and welcome it. How ever - as stated - weather its an adventure zone or not. Do NOT ever make me have to group up to explore a new zone. That is unfair and unjust.

Shimond wrote: »

Most of the game is designed around single player, and aren't the standard leveling zones only 1/3 of the full picture anyway (ability go to into the other faction zones at 50+)? Seems to me there was a shortage of group content, that this patch fills.

So there, "stupidity" explained :P

That's why you have dungeons, veteran dungeons and to extend adventure zones and some world content like anchors. I don't think you guys need a whole zone to your selves. That seems a bit much.

RakeWorm wrote: »

It's to counteract the phasing issues that can cause problems for group play early on.

Also, MMO.

Phasing is what makes this game so unique and stand out from the rest of the failed MMO's (or slowly failing with their 60$ for a lv 90). Phasing is what keeps me so interested.

SinBad wrote: »

its not sad and pathetic, its for the people who like large scale pve, there is none of that as of now. Just 4 man dungeons is not enough there needs to be high end large scale group content and that's what adventure zones bring to the table. I understand a lot of people like solo like yourself, I like my share of soloing as well. But there are also people who love grouping with their friends and guilds.

There will be plenty of more content added to this game be patient. Like someone said above thieves guild possibly dark brotherhood, those will most likely be solo content.

That's right they will add new solo content, my argument here is the fact that their adding a whole new zone JUST for group content only. Which means possibly new armor and stuff.

Twistedmind wrote: »

Salacious wrote: »

Is their a reason for the new zone to be group content only? ES games are typically single player based and a lot of the content in this game is geared towards people like me: Solo Players.

That is all I bothered to read.
Welcome to MMO games.

Uh .... That's pretty poor pathetic response, considering this game has the title of ES on it which stipulates large solo content and they also stated the game is more geared towards solo players.

Again I am not opposed to group content, just don't force me to do it for zone exploration ...

SinBad

well the entire game is solo aside from the dungeons, which you will eventually be able to solo the lower level ones once you level up, if your good enough , but adding a pretty much just a group zoned area is amazing imo, the harder the better is what I always say I for one am going to try and solo the adventure zones as much as I can because I like challenges.

Pang

The bottom line here is the game is still an MMO regardless of it being based on TES. If you're going to complain every time they add multiplayer content to an MMO then you're in for a long rough road.

Vikova

Salacious wrote: »

Uh .... That's pretty poor pathetic response, considering this game has the title of ES on it which stipulates large solo content and they also stated the game is more geared towards solo players.

You forgot the "o" in the title.

This thread is nothing more than another "I don't like it because I don't like it" thread.

Shimond

Salacious wrote: »

That's why you have dungeons, veteran dungeons and to extend adventure zones and some world content like anchors. I don't think you guys need a whole zone to your selves. That seems a bit much.

Don't make the assumption that because I can understand their design that the content they're creating is for me - I'm pretty much a solo player myself these days. I may see the 4 man content but I have no illusions about the 12 man. That said, it doesn't bother me. This is normal MMO stuff. What this game does differently is give us a ton of solo content to begin with. There's no indication this upcoming patch is the only patch they intend to ever add. I'll be content with what's in the game for quite some time.

Also, just like Cyrodiil it doesn't sound like you're being forced to group to zone in (they mention in the trailer that central city hub to form groups in). There's nothing stopping you (just like in Cyrodiil) from exploring to your heart's content...there will be danger though.

Strigoimare

I'm not crazy about group areas, but I understand that one of the perks in the MMO is the 2 "Ms". So, I'll take it in stride, since you can go solo for pretty much everything now.

Khenarthi

I feel the same way - I love to explore by myself without having to group. So far my experience with groups involve people rushing everywhere and I hate to feel rushed.

Maybe people like us coming from the single player games will find a guild or group with likeminded folk - then we can "group" to enter the zone and once in, do whatever we wish to do?

Bweefk

this is what we have to put up with now. rember when the only way you could level up was to get a full group go out and get the XP yourself? I like the solo quests but guys this is an MMO solo people aren't going to be able to see every part of this game. nor should they.

Lazarus_Long

Think about it from the opposite view to gain the understanding you seek. If a new area were tooled for solo play then anybody who wanted to team up with their RL friends, spouses, or guild mates would get nerfed XP and rewards. Guilds would revolt en masse.

While I too love solo play, I also love being part of a well oiled machine more, as do most players. The hardest part of any game for me is finding that well oiled machine. Teamwork requires compromises and leadership, and those are things a lot players have trouble submitting to. But once they do it's the start a successful group. Don't give up on it. Just keep looking. Also remember that you have never met someone that couldn't teach something, ever if it's just how to be a move effective ***.

Ohioastro

Come on. I take the approach that people play games for many different reasons, and I don't demand that the game should just cater to me. Other people enjoy group activities; why should they be omitted because you don't like them?

tallenn

I can help you understand: MMOs have some group-oriented content. Most also have some large group oriented content. The amount or size of that content varies game by game, but I don't believe there are any where all of the content can be soloed.

beriiel

Salacious wrote: »

- One: I like new content, I like exploring, I like going off on my own down some path and finding a random quest not have 4 people dictate what direction I can or cannot go in.
- Two: I hate groups. They are full of trolls, chest stealer's and "dictators". as mentioned in point one I like just wondering off the beaten path encountering a ghost and helping him redeem his wifes past.

Help me understand that.

If we were playing any other game I'd agree and I usually feel the exact same way. Have you tried grouping here? I'm asking because I've found every group I've been in to be real nice with people that are so helpful I just about don't know how to respond.

Anyway, standard response. It's an MMO not single player, make friends, join a guild, bla, bla, bla.

We all have a tendency to bring our attitude where ever we go. Food for thought.

aegis156

Welcome to MMOs solo until endgame then forced RAID grouping. DIfferent name same feature

Shimond

aegis156 wrote: »

Welcome to MMOs solo until endgame then forced RAID grouping. DIfferent name same feature

Well that might apply to this game if they removed the other faction zones and Cyrodiil, and of course weren't offering 4 man in the adventure zone. But otherwise, spot on!

gimmethecreepsb14_ESO

I mean, I think honestly ESO has really succeeded in giving "solo players" plenty of wiggle room to get some good story and exploration without infringing. This is an MMO, it has group only dungeons, raids later on, etc. The PVP is pretty much group or be ganked, which is fine...I get that you're an ES player and not really an MMO player, but what were you expecting? I'm sure when big content expansions are released, you'll get more zones with more storyline progression...but to your point, there's no point to play this game after level 50 if you beat the storyline progression and then what...

Pretext

Massive Multiplayer Online, OP you seem to want Massive Soloplayer Online. These games are not for you.

Thete

Salacious wrote: »

ES games are typically single player based and a lot of the content in this game is geared towards people like me: Solo Players.

That is all.

Salacious

Pang wrote: »

The bottom line here is the game is still an MMO regardless of it being based on TES. If you're going to complain every time they add multiplayer content to an MMO then you're in for a long rough road.

You're missing the point - the issue is with them releasing a NEW ZONE ONLY to groups. That's unfair to the rest of us. This isn't a dungeon. or a raid. This is a whole zone, with towns, NPC's and quests.

RakeWorm wrote: »

Salacious wrote: »

Uh .... That's pretty poor pathetic response, considering this game has the title of ES on it which stipulates large solo content and they also stated the game is more geared towards solo players.

You forgot the "o" in the title.

This thread is nothing more than another "I don't like it because I don't like it" thread.

Uh no, this thread dis a" I don't think its fair that they are releasing a whole zone as group only content.

Ohioastro wrote: »

Come on. I take the approach that people play games for many different reasons, and I don't demand that the game should just cater to me. Other people enjoy group activities; why should they be omitted because you don't like them?

Again this is not about, NOT liking it, its about how a whole zone should not be group only. Release your group content all you want, but keep it to the typical dungeons, raids and over world stuff so I can explore what I want and not be bothered by the fact that "oh no you cannot enter that zone because you are not in a group so you have to miss out on all new quests and story ... "

Shimond wrote: »

Salacious wrote: »

That's why you have dungeons, veteran dungeons and to extend adventure zones and some world content like anchors. I don't think you guys need a whole zone to your selves. That seems a bit much.

Don't make the assumption that because I can understand their design that the content they're creating is for me - I'm pretty much a solo player myself these days. I may see the 4 man content but I have no illusions about the 12 man. That said, it doesn't bother me. This is normal MMO stuff. What this game does differently is give us a ton of solo content to begin with. There's no indication this upcoming patch is the only patch they intend to ever add. I'll be content with what's in the game for quite some time.

Also, just like Cyrodiil it doesn't sound like you're being forced to group to zone in (they mention in the trailer that central city hub to form groups in). There's nothing stopping you (just like in Cyrodiil) from exploring to your heart's content...there will be danger though.

Cyrodiil makes sense since that's a PVP zone and its designed specifically towards PVP, yes I can solo that and do quests and save people and so on and so forth. and I can ignore the PVP part, but I cannot explore this new zone at all on my own because its specifically geared towards group only, where as Cyrodiil is geared towards both.

beriiel wrote: »

Salacious wrote: »

- One: I like new content, I like exploring, I like going off on my own down some path and finding a random quest not have 4 people dictate what direction I can or cannot go in.
- Two: I hate groups. They are full of trolls, chest stealer's and "dictators". as mentioned in point one I like just wondering off the beaten path encountering a ghost and helping him redeem his wifes past.

Help me understand that.

If we were playing any other game I'd agree and I usually feel the exact same way. Have you tried grouping here? I'm asking because I've found every group I've been in to be real nice with people that are so helpful I just about don't know how to respond.

Anyway, standard response. It's an MMO not single player, make friends, join a guild, bla, bla, bla.

We all have a tendency to bring our attitude where ever we go. Food for thought.

I have yes, hence my statement about chest stealer's, trolls and people who like to just sit in chat and spam all day. Even grouping with guild member's is iffy, because they can act the same way - but they don't get kicked from the guild - you do. So my solution is to do only solo content with a couple anchors here and there. I like to explore, not be trolled.

aegis156 wrote: »

Welcome to MMOs solo until endgame then forced RAID grouping. DIfferent name same feature

Never had to RAID in WOW or Rift. I could just continue exploring. Gear means nothing in this game from what I have seen so far. I don't feel pressured to get the latest purples. I believe MMO's are moving away from that line of thinking.

gimmethecreepsb14_ESO wrote: »

I mean, I think honestly ESO has really succeeded in giving "solo players" plenty of wiggle room to get some good story and exploration without infringing. This is an MMO, it has group only dungeons, raids later on, etc. The PVP is pretty much group or be ganked, which is fine...I get that you're an ES player and not really an MMO player, but what were you expecting? I'm sure when big content expansions are released, you'll get more zones with more storyline progression...but to your point, there's no point to play this game after level 50 if you beat the storyline progression and then what...

What was I expecting? To explore. To not be forced to do something I don't want to do. To get access to the same content every one else has and to explore in a group or not.

Weather this is an MMO or not, I dont want to be excluded from a new zone because I don't want to be forced to go the route the group does. Dungeons and raids are meant for groups. Zones are not.

Pretext wrote: »

Massive Multiplayer Online, OP you seem to want Massive Soloplayer Online. These games are not for you.

You seem to be missing the point - which is not understandable, since I have been saying - I am not opposed to group content, I am opposed to group zone content. meaning I cannot explore a zone unless I am in a group.

Eris

Salacious wrote: »

Is their a reason for the new zone to be group content only? ES games are typically single player based and a lot of the content in this game is geared towards people like me: Solo Players.
Help me understand that.

The adventure zones are designed for Veteran players looking for something like end game content. It is designed for 4 players. That does not mean that all future content and that new zones will be adventure zones, it just means that adventure zones will be adventure zones. There will likely also be regular quest zones and such.

Considering the game has only been out for 9 days, I think you're jumping just a little ahead of yourself by worrying about this.

In my experience, most of the time when you design something for 4 players eventually someone will figure out a build/gear combination that allows them to solo it anyways.

kitsinni

REGARDLESS of how many times you CAPITALIZE and bold your words there will always be parts of Massivley Multiplayer Online games that are not going to be done SOLO. I kind of thought that would be OBVIOUS.

Salacious

kitsinni wrote: »

REGARDLESS of how many times you CAPITALIZE and bold your words there will always be parts of Massivley Multiplayer Online games that are not going to be done SOLO. I kind of thought that would be OBVIOUS.

They should not be zones. that is the argument here. do NOT make zones group only.