I hate AwA

Dragonnord

Sorry for this post, but I just wanted to say that.

I hate AwA. It completely destroyed replayability for me. It killed a lot of fun I was having.

I realized I have been playing 10 times less than I was playing before (I have my main and 10 alts).

I knew this was going to happen.

Soarora

Don’t we all… (I know we don’t all). It should’ve been account wide and individual. Every new useless achievement rubs salt in my wounds. I saw dungeon endgame die that day. It’ll most likely never be the same.

shadyjane62

Agreed.

Cloudtrader

I love AwA. I want all the achievements on my main, but sometimes my group needs me to play a tank or a healer. This way, it still shows completed on all my characters, and I love that. It doesn't make me play less; it makes me less frustrated.

Soarora

Cloudtrader wrote: »

I love AwA. I want all the achievements on my main, but sometimes my group needs me to play a tank or a healer. This way, it still shows completed on all my characters, and I love that. It doesn't make me play less; it makes me less frustrated.

Are you only progging new achievements or are you running any back? It looks like a great concept until you start running out of trifectas and realize there’s no point in running them repeatedly unless you just want to help other people. I’ve tried to keep track and it’s difficult and it’s not the same.

robwolf666

It's not completely evil, at least I don't have to do WB's over and over.
But, yeah, it's a big demotivator for replayability. Earning the stuff again with each alt kept me interested in making new character.
Auto max level at 50+ also demotivates.

Cloudtrader

Soarora wrote: »

Cloudtrader wrote: »

I love AwA. I want all the achievements on my main, but sometimes my group needs me to play a tank or a healer. This way, it still shows completed on all my characters, and I love that. It doesn't make me play less; it makes me less frustrated.

Are you only progging new achievements or are you running any back? It looks like a great concept until you start running out of trifectas and realize there’s no point in running them repeatedly unless you just want to help other people. I’ve tried to keep track and it’s difficult and it’s not the same.

I guess I'm not sure what you're asking here? I play every Sunday, Monday, and Friday with my guild members (and occasionally in between) and we do stuff someone asks for. I play it even if I have all achievements and full sticker book just to hang out with friends and enjoy grouping. If I haven't done a dungeon or trial on a character, I know that I haven't because I haven't gotten the skill point (for dungeons) or because I haven't collected the lore/paper (for trials). I have add-ons that tell me if a character needs the skillpoint or lore/paper.

The best thing about AwA for me was specifically the trophy collector achievements. That unlocked a bunch of dyes for me.

OsUfi

On the flip siude, the achievement spam that we have had this last few years has put me off playing. ESO has gone from a game I felt I could complete, motivated a bit by the addition of AWA, then crushed with ToT and the addition of all three alliances Cyro achievements. I don't think I could ever "finish" the game, so it's contributed to me not playing.

I vaguely remember Guild Wars 1 doing something similar back in the day.

AzuraFan

OsUfi wrote: »

On the flip siude, the achievement spam that we have had this last few years has put me off playing.

I like that term: achievement spam. It hasn't put me off playing, but they're annoying. I mean, anyone who's been playing for longer than a year or two has completed those activities, but now we have to do busywork again. Or not. I'm an achievement hunter, but I haven't completed the ones they added in the last update. I want new stuff, not achievement spam (love that!).

ETA: I don't hate AwA in theory. I just wish ZOS had implemented it thoughtfully, rather than in the easiest way possible that ruined replayability for a lot of players, and ruined the map for alts.

Deserrick

It would have been better (and may still be doable for some of them) if the achievements that unlock things were account-wide, while the others, like crafting and scrying were character wide. Enchantment achievements unlock for the account but also have a person icon, allowing for individualized rewards. Scrying should be like that as well, with the achievements going back to adding their points as xp for the skill line.

Tandor

I also hate it.

I also hate that ZOS never gave a real explanation of why they did it or why they implemented it in the way that they did, and that they never had any real interaction with the feedback they got on the PTS forum. I still harbour a hope that they learnt something from that experience but they've never given any indication of having done so.

DeadlySerious

I think what most people wanted was "Account Wide Titles", not so much account wide achievement tracking.

The AWA system could have gone a lot better too with better implementation. How ZOS did it radically reduced the play time for many people because they stopped playing their alt toons, so it was a big shot to their own foot when they did it too.

It's how AWA was implemented, U35 and other major update fumbles that have many of us really scared for the future of ESO right now because of vengeance and subclassing changes are just too much change from the original game.

Hypertionb14_ESO

heh, ya I only go for achievements for any potential rewards like skins or dyes.. most are meaningless. AwA complaints where something I didn't even know was a thing because when i started playing again i was just glad for it and cannot see any reason why it would bother people.

Wanna do an alt? nothing about AwA prevents this. I did 2 new full play through of the og main stories in the last half year. Never bothered me once to not see achievements pop up for every benign thing.

Working to clear HMs purely for the fun, that's how i play. That is how i played in the decade before Achievements were even a thing, and how i probably always will. I just do not understand this line of complaint at all.

old_scopie1945

Dragonnord wrote: »

Sorry for this post, but I just wanted to say that.

I hate AwA. It completely destroyed replayability for me. It killed a lot of fun I was having.

I realized I have been playing 10 times less than I was playing before (I have my main and 10 alts).

I knew this was going to happen.

You are not alone my friend.

old_scopie1945

Tandor wrote: »

I also hate it.

I also hate that ZOS never gave a real explanation of why they did it or why they implemented it in the way that they did, and that they never had any real interaction with the feedback they got on the PTS forum. I still harbour a hope that they learnt something from that experience but they've never given any indication of having done so.

It is that, that I now take everything ZOS says with a grain of salt.

ADarklore

Tandor wrote: »

I also hate it.

I also hate that ZOS never gave a real explanation of why they did it or why they implemented it in the way that they did, and that they never had any real interaction with the feedback they got on the PTS forum. I still harbour a hope that they learnt something from that experience but they've never given any indication of having done so.

I thought ZOS said they implemented it because of server bloat and to reduce the amount of server data that it was storing.

LunaFlora

ADarklore wrote: »

Tandor wrote: »

I also hate it.

I also hate that ZOS never gave a real explanation of why they did it or why they implemented it in the way that they did, and that they never had any real interaction with the feedback they got on the PTS forum. I still harbour a hope that they learnt something from that experience but they've never given any indication of having done so.

I thought ZOS said they implemented it because of server bloat and to reduce the amount of server data that it was storing.

yep
https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/598865/account-wide-achievements-q-a

joergino

I wanted it. What I didn't want is the horrible mess we got where there are still character achievements and sometimes the character who contributed the least to an achievement is the one listed as earning it.

TaSheen

LunaFlora wrote: »

ADarklore wrote: »

Tandor wrote: »

I also hate it.

I also hate that ZOS never gave a real explanation of why they did it or why they implemented it in the way that they did, and that they never had any real interaction with the feedback they got on the PTS forum. I still harbour a hope that they learnt something from that experience but they've never given any indication of having done so.

I thought ZOS said they implemented it because of server bloat and to reduce the amount of server data that it was storing.

yep
https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/598865/account-wide-achievements-q-a

I always felt that was a "late copout", personally.

Now, fair is fair: AWA didn't/doesn't affect me at all because I despise achievements in games (makes me think of gold stars in kindergarten), and I've never looked at any of them or used them for anything. Tracking alt progress? Oh hell no. My alts are progressing as I play them in their own backstories, and none of the garbage of achievements has anything to do with that. I also don't need something to "track" what alts are doing as I always know where I left them and where they need to go next.

Tandor

ADarklore wrote: »

Tandor wrote: »

I also hate it.

I also hate that ZOS never gave a real explanation of why they did it or why they implemented it in the way that they did, and that they never had any real interaction with the feedback they got on the PTS forum. I still harbour a hope that they learnt something from that experience but they've never given any indication of having done so.

I thought ZOS said they implemented it because of server bloat and to reduce the amount of server data that it was storing.

They announced it at ESO Live as being something everyone wanted. When they discovered everyone didn't want it they came up with a different reason. When testers then queried that and criticised the decision they went silent. We've never had a convincing explanation for it.

Soarora

Cloudtrader wrote: »

Soarora wrote: »

Cloudtrader wrote: »

I love AwA. I want all the achievements on my main, but sometimes my group needs me to play a tank or a healer. This way, it still shows completed on all my characters, and I love that. It doesn't make me play less; it makes me less frustrated.

Are you only progging new achievements or are you running any back? It looks like a great concept until you start running out of trifectas and realize there’s no point in running them repeatedly unless you just want to help other people. I’ve tried to keep track and it’s difficult and it’s not the same.

I guess I'm not sure what you're asking here? I play every Sunday, Monday, and Friday with my guild members (and occasionally in between) and we do stuff someone asks for. I play it even if I have all achievements and full sticker book just to hang out with friends and enjoy grouping. If I haven't done a dungeon or trial on a character, I know that I haven't because I haven't gotten the skill point (for dungeons) or because I haven't collected the lore/paper (for trials). I have add-ons that tell me if a character needs the skillpoint or lore/paper.

The best thing about AwA for me was specifically the trophy collector achievements. That unlocked a bunch of dyes for me.

I’m glad you’re enjoying yourself then (genuinely). What AWA meant to me is that overnight the motivation to achieve dungeon trifectas on each character and get HM for mask farms on every role… dissolved. Not just for me, not just for friends. The dungeon guild I’m in went from multiple runs happening at once, always people looking for runs to… not being able to fill runs. Only literally last month did we get back to seeing good activity and that’s just by chance of new people coming in at once needing clears. Aside from a few people here and there, most members who have achieved everything no longer run with the guild until new dungeons drop. People talk about how U35 killed trial guilds. AWA was that for dungeons.

Hypertionb14_ESO wrote: »

heh, ya I only go for achievements for any potential rewards like skins or dyes.. most are meaningless. AwA complaints where something I didn't even know was a thing because when i started playing again i was just glad for it and cannot see any reason why it would bother people.

Wanna do an alt? nothing about AwA prevents this. I did 2 new full play through of the og main stories in the last half year. Never bothered me once to not see achievements pop up for every benign thing.

Working to clear HMs purely for the fun, that's how i play. That is how i played in the decade before Achievements were even a thing, and how i probably always will. I just do not understand this line of complaint at all.

AWA doesn’t stop anyone from running content back but why prog a trifecta you already have? Why try to use a different character when you already have one that works? Personal challenge, sure, but it cannot be denied the community impact. Not everyone wants to achieve without the achievement. And it really does get hard to keep track. I had to make a SPREADSHEET because a guild I’m in ranks by role and theres no way I’m remembering what role I did vet/hm on. Tri I of course I mostly remember but I’m at the point of my eso career now that some dungeons I’ve lost count of how many tris I’ve done there. That is not a brag, it is unfortunate. I can’t be proud of what I’ve done when I can’t even remember what I’ve done.

DenverRalphy

I could argue both the virtues and the pitfalls of AWA. I get the goal they were striving for, regardless whether or not they achieved it.

My personal criticism about it is that it was only half-arsed done. The way they weave in character specfic achievements is flawed. ie.. Unlocking the services in Tideholm is/are tied to character achievements. Yet the daily lootable chest is limited to once per day per account. I get why it's limited per account becauses of what it drops. But more than a few players view that as a kick in the shorts after doing all the quests (the quest line does take a while, and then all the dailies).

tsaescishoeshiner

I love account-wide achievements. It's given me so much flexibility and freedom to play the way I want without being forced to use one particular character to do every part of one achievement.

People who completely relied on individual character achievements for replayability have more of a spreadsheet approach to the game, as in just checking a large amount of things off a list. And I much prefer a game and a community that doesn't approach game time that way.

It would be nice if players could still track their achievements on a per-character basis, even if the award progress is still tracked by the account. Only way now would be with an addon for PC players.

Edit: Forgot a space.

Xarc

Even though many of us dislike AWA, I think a large majority of players still prefer this change.

Furthermore, I believe it lightens the load on the game's databases.

That said, if an ESO Classic is ever to see the light of day, I hope this system won't be part of it.

Jestir

AwA is one of the things they did right

Mostly

moderatelyfatman

Dragonnord wrote: »

Sorry for this post, but I just wanted to say that.
I hate AwA. It completely destroyed replayability for me. It killed a lot of fun I was having.
I realized I have been playing 10 times less than I was playing before (I have my main and 10 alts).
I knew this was going to happen.

Yep, a lot of people are responding by creating alt accounts and then redoing their favourite achievements. They will then play through the game again before abandoning it after they reach a certain level.
I have guildies who are on their 4th, 5th or 6th account because of this.
It's kind of ironic because ZOS's main reason for AwA was to save up memory space for Tales of Triumph cardgame.

amig186

For me it's the opposite, I'm more likely to make an alt, especially if it's going to be a new main, knowing I won't have to do the grindy achievements all over again. Or the ones that require your side to own the map of Cyrodiil and are just something you want to knock out as soon as possible for the associated reward. On the other hand I do understand that it makes it harder to keep track of which content each character can beat, that's a downside, no doubt. I guess it also enables people to lie to the raid leader by linking an achievement they got on a different character, which can potentially ruin a run. But I don't really get why you absolutely need to be earning achievements to have fun. If you need a shiny dangled in front of you to be motivated to do something, that sounds more like work than fun.

spartaxoxo

I enjoyed AWA. I see why people don't. But I like not feeling like I'm messing up something if I do something on whichever character would be best suited rather than the one I want the achievement on.

Pixiepumpkin

TaSheen wrote: »

LunaFlora wrote: »

ADarklore wrote: »

Tandor wrote: »

I also hate it.

I also hate that ZOS never gave a real explanation of why they did it or why they implemented it in the way that they did, and that they never had any real interaction with the feedback they got on the PTS forum. I still harbour a hope that they learnt something from that experience but they've never given any indication of having done so.

I thought ZOS said they implemented it because of server bloat and to reduce the amount of server data that it was storing.

yep
https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/598865/account-wide-achievements-q-a

I always felt that was a "late copout", personally.

Now, fair is fair: AWA didn't/doesn't affect me at all because I despise achievements in games (makes me think of gold stars in kindergarten), and I've never looked at any of them or used them for anything. Tracking alt progress? Oh hell no. My alts are progressing as I play them in their own backstories, and none of the garbage of achievements has anything to do with that. I also don't need something to "track" what alts are doing as I always know where I left them and where they need to go next.

I don't mind AWA. I don't reallly pay attention to achievements to start with, but I do like to farm the ones that give dyes as rewards.

Rkindaleft

I know AwA has positives to some people, but as someone who now nearly exclusively runs PvE achievements such as trifectas I definitely prefer the old system. From a superficial standpoint AwA sounds like it would be a good thing, but it negatively affected high level PvE on the whole as it largely ruined the replayability of the content. Before AwA way more people were progging things like trifectas multiple times in order to obtain the titles on other classes/roles and it was one of the reasons endgame PvE was generally healthier.

WuffyCerulei

There’s definitely pros and cons to AwA. Pros being like working things on different toons, have to worry less about who has what, and reasons like time saving and accessibility. Cons being lack of reason to repeat content, stale content from lack of replayability, and similar issues.

Tbh I’d add content to the older dungeons, arenas, and trials by adding character-only achievements while keeping the OG account-wide achievements. And then have the same thing for upcoming content to encourage those who want either more basic achievements for goods like titles and collectibles, while having special titles for specific characters if the content is repeated.