ESO/ZOS consider...

madman65 · August 21

You can help the gamers that want to run Cyrodiil and Imperial City but only to get achievements or maybe dailies. I am currently in The Infinite Panoptican were no one can attack each other, can the devs have something like this in Cryodiil and Imperial City? Thank you.

EnerG · August 23

No thanks, it's NOT a pve zone, if you want to quest there you play by pvp rules. Point blank and periodt

TaSheen · August 23

It is what it is. When I need to go there for whatever (fishing mostly - anything else I need is available in the gate areas) I pick a campaign with almost no one there....

Ah.... I don't give a rat's patoot for achievements or skyshards, so.... and the only dailies I do are writs. No use for the rest of it.

kargen27 · August 23

Players going to those areas to do quests, dailies and other things is how PvP attracts new players. Some would never try PvP if they didn't have other reasons to go. Sometimes those players discover they like PvP and stick around. Making a PvE only Cyrodiil would hurt PvP.

TaSheen · August 23

kargen27 wrote: »

Players going to those areas to do quests, dailies and other things is how PvP attracts new players. Some would never try PvP if they didn't have other reasons to go. Sometimes those players discover they like PvP and stick around. Making a PvE only Cyrodiil would hurt PvP.

You may be right. But personally.... not happening. I don't pvp any more and won't ever do so again. There's nothing in this world that would prompt me to think of pvp as "fun". And the only reason I play a game is for fun.

LunaFlora · August 23

kargen27 wrote: »

Players going to those areas to do quests, dailies and other things is how PvP attracts new players. Some would never try PvP if they didn't have other reasons to go. Sometimes those players discover they like PvP and stick around. Making a PvE only Cyrodiil would hurt PvP.

i and plenty of other players just aren't interested in PvP.
i only go to Cyrod and imperial city to do quests for the rewards.
There is nothing in fighting and killing players that will ever be fun to me.
They're not calm zones, they cause stress, and there's a reason people occasionally request PvE campaigns or complain about Mayhem.

at this point i don't know how much i need a PvE campaign for Cyrodiil and imperial city, but if it did happen it would only cause people uninterested in PvP to go there. and i really cannot see how that hurts PvP.
All you get from us is a few alliance points as i don't enjoy fighting players.

OsUfi · August 23

Not all content is for all people. I accepted a long time ago I'll never get the Vet Trial stuff as I'm generally bad at PvE. I'll also never get vet arena gear.

Though I strangely like archive. Even in crafted no proc gear I find I blitz through the first two thoats. Never hitting arc ten or anything, but eh, again, not or me.

Oh, and wild dogs couldn't drag me into a ToT match.

PvE players need to accept not all content is aimed at them.

Anifaas · August 23

TL;DR Sell us more Cyrodiil but don't jeopardize the current PvP experience. Also, Cyrodiil is too important to be left like it is currently.

--

PvP is fine, but it always seems to be niche in MMOs. Most players in MMOs cannot be incentivized to PvP, it is impossible. That's fine. However, it helps explain why PvP MMOs are not as popular as their counterparts. Personally I don't care for PvP in ESO because I find it somewhat sloppy and imprecise compared to my favourite: 3v3 Arena in WoW. But I digress.

Nobody in WoW asks for a PvE mode of PvP zones because the zones are not particularly exclusive in and of themselves. PvE folks can explore the zones in which the PvP instances originate, get the story and appreciate the artwork while they let their minds wander. This is a good thing because familiarity helps to drive engagement.

There is no question, Cyrodiil is an area of extreme significance in the world of The Elder Scrolls. Cyrodiil is an icon of the franchise. So given its importance, it is not surprising many customers would question why access to Cyrodiil is gated behind a niche activity.

I haven't seen anyone who simply wants to see the zone (without risk of other players ruining the experience) asking for the zone rewards or participation trophies. That seems to be a strawman argument others offer to belittle such requests. Most of these requests just want to see the pretty zone and nothing more.

Truly, there should be about 10x more activities available for Cyrodiil. It is more significant than places like High Isle and a host of others. Two chapters have been devoted to Ithelia and she's a nothingburger while Cyrodiil gets a niche pvp mode. What?? The art, assets, history and 1000s of developer hours poured into Cyrodiil are not fully utilized and as such, Cyrodiil is an unrealized asset. It is just so puzzling to me why such an important and iconic asset is left to its current fate.

Don't get me wrong, I'm happy that PvPers get to romp in such a cool zone and I would never advocate taking away the exclusivity of their rewards. I love ganking people in Cyrodiil when the opportunity presents itself. Being a stealthy ganker has provided me the ability to see the zone at my pace but it is a play-style that isn't for everyone. The PvP requirement is not a barrier for me but it is for so many others and I would like for them to have the opportunity to see and interact with Cyrodiil as well. So they can "play as they like".

Cyrodiil deserves its own chapter. It would "slay". Elder Scrolls Online: Cyrodiil. A tragic story about the painful path to rebuilding Cyrodiil, leaving us with the notion the rebuilding will take muck longer than our lifetimes. The conclusion of the chapter would set the stage for the rest of the, often, convoluted timeline of the franchise The same tried and tested formula could be spread across three smaller zones without much thought. No new assets are required! Separate rewards from pvp, re-purposed delves, sky shards, etc. The trial takes place in Imperial city. All new housing-related crown-store items made from assets that are were already made years ago. Rebrand current Cyrodiil as "classic" and add in some modifications based on player feedback. Accounting is happy. PvE crowd is happy. PvP crowd is happy. The chapter writes itself.

But no, instead we squabble among ourselves over significant franchise icons while the development now focuses on forgettable (particularly the case with Prince Nothingburger) characters and stories.

Thank you if you've read this far, even if you vehemently disagree. I promise I won't dump any more walls of text on the topic again.

LPapirius · August 23

Why do people who hate PvP so much log in to play a game where the feature end game content is PvP?

Kisakee · August 23

LPapirius wrote: »

Why do people who hate PvP so much log in to play a game where the feature end game content is PvP?

That's just your opinion, not everyone elses.

LPapirius · August 23

Kisakee wrote: »

LPapirius wrote: »

Why do people who hate PvP so much log in to play a game where the feature end game content is PvP?

That's just your opinion, not everyone elses.

It was ZOS' opinion for the first few years of the game. ESO was advertised as a PvP game before, during and after release.

valenwood_vegan · August 23

LPapirius wrote: »

Why do people who hate PvP so much log in to play a game where the feature end game content is PvP?

To do vet dungeons and trials, housing, trading, RP, to socialize, or any of the number of other things people can do in this game? One could just as easily ask why people log in to pvp when it's been neglected for years and is the subject of constant complaints... but I wouldn't ask that because I respect that many players do enjoy pvp and I'm glad that they have the opportunity to log in and do what they enjoy.

I'm not interested in arguing about whether pvp was the "original intent" of the game, but it quite obviously is not the "featured endgame content" of the game in 2024.

As to the original topic - I don't think they should mess with the current iteration of Cyrodiil, but as another poster mentioned - the zone is in some ways the heart and soul of the Elder Scrolls franchise, and I would love to someday experience an actual, fully fleshed-out pve Cyrodill (perhaps in the past before the war, the future after it, or an alternate timeline). Not a "pve version" of the current zone (which has rather minimal non-pvp content) and not a "replacement" for the pvp zone, but a totally different zone without any of the pvp rewards and with actual lively cities and real pve quests. Nostalgia sells! I doubt we'd ever get this, but one can dream

As for the current pvp zones of Cyrodiil and IC, well they're for pvp... and they exist to both allow pvp'ers to do their thing, and to promote pvp to other players, some of whom may find that they enjoy it... so love it or hate it, if you want the rewards you gotta take the risk, imo. I do not enjoy pvp, but I've still managed to pretty painlessly complete the things in those zones. It's fine. Again, imo.

SeaGtGruff · August 23

kargen27 wrote: »

Players going to those areas to do quests, dailies and other things is how PvP attracts new players. Some would never try PvP if they didn't have other reasons to go. Sometimes those players discover they like PvP and stick around. Making a PvE only Cyrodiil would hurt PvP.

I don't remember why I first went to IC-- possibly to craft a master writ at one of the three set-crafting stations there, possibly to collect the skyshards, and possibly to try doing the zone storyline quests-- but I got turned off from it when I went down a ladder into the sewers to try to make my way back to base and got ganked while looking at my map to figure out where I was and find a path back to the DC base.

Then I discovered that it was possible to queue out of IC by selecting a different campaign as a "guest," and started using that method whenever I went to IC to craft a master writ. There are no longer any "guest" campaigns, but it's still possible to leave IC by queuing for a Cyrodiil campaign. That encouraged me to visit IC more, farm a bit of Tel Var-- which eventually let me buy some TV-only PvP set gear-- spend some time becoming familiar with the sewers, and collect all of the skyshards. I never did manage to do the zone questline-- I couldn't kill the quest boss and kept getting ganked whenever I tried-- but if I were to try again now then I might be able to kill the quest boss.

I'm still not fond of PvP in IC, and will generally just let the other players kill me, but every so often I'll fight back-- and in a few cases I've actually managed to win the fight, or at least fight to a draw and have the other player give up and move on.

Cyrodiil was similar in some ways and different in others; I originally went there just to check it out, collect the skyshards, do the PvE quests, and earn the achievements for doing all of the delves and dolmens. At first I tried to avoid any chance of PvP and had fun sneaking around, but eventually I found myself getting ganked in delves or at dolmens, or spotted and attacked while trying to sneak across Cyrodiil for a scouting mission, which more or less turned me off.

But with Cyrodiil I wasn't driven off entirely, probably because there was no risk of losing anything when killed, and over time I began to participate in various AvA activities-- capturing resources (rather than merely scouting), sieging keeps, defending keeps, capturing scrolls, and defending scrolls. I even got to run a couple of scrolls back to base, which was fun. And once I completely got over my fear of being killed in PvP, I started jumping into situations where death was certain, such as jumping off of a keep wall to try to burn the enemy's siege.

I still stink at PvP, mostly because I'm too lazy and casual to try to farm for BIS/meta gear or practice skill rotations against a target dummy. I've made almost no changes to my build in years, and have managed to acquire only a few mythics. But I have found that I do enjoy going to IC for the daily district quests or to farm a bit of TV in the sewers, and enjoy going to Cyrodiil to do resource missions and join in the PvP battles.

So yes, sometimes players who go to IC and Cyrodiil for PvE reasons can end up getting interested in the PvP there.

Adaarye · August 23

kargen27 wrote: »

Players going to those areas to do quests, dailies and other things is how PvP attracts new players. Some would never try PvP if they didn't have other reasons to go. Sometimes those players discover they like PvP and stick around. Making a PvE only Cyrodiil would hurt PvP.

Quests, Skyshards, and Achievements locked inside the PvP world does one thing.

The thing it does is populate the zone with unwilling but goal driven PvE players that become cannon fodder for the PvPrs to get points, satisfaction, and whatever else PvP players get from killing players.

Edit: Grammar Error

ApoAlaia · August 23

Adaarye wrote: »

kargen27 wrote: »

Players going to those areas to do quests, dailies and other things is how PvP attracts new players. Some would never try PvP if they didn't have other reasons to go. Sometimes those players discover they like PvP and stick around. Making a PvE only Cyrodiil would hurt PvP.

Quests, Skyshards, and Achievements locked inside the PvP world does one thing.

The thing it does is populate the zone with unwilling but goal driven PvE players that become cannon fodder for the PvPrs to get points, satisfaction, and whatever else PvP players get from killing players.

Edit: Grammar Error

I mean, there is a (7 page and counting) thread about essentially how PvP players in IC only want to PvP if they're 'winning', if they lose the upper hand they get out of dodge faster than you can say 'scooby doo' (allegedly).

Imagine the travesty if there weren't PvE piñatas (not my words, just quoting a friendly neighbourhood district ganker) around to 1-2GCD and it was just people of comparable skill level engaging in proc vs proc PvP.

The_Boggart · August 24

If basically a pve player try and group up and take resources whilst the main battle goes on

ThelerisTelvanni · August 24

Well I did some PvP from time to time in the past but the interest in PvP is completely lost to me for some time now.

Honestly I'd love to explore Cyrodiil and the Imperial City undisturbed by other players. I love to do so in a PvE mode or on an alternate Version of the Area that might lore wise be set after the war. That way the zone might get a complete set of fresh models and textures and some needed story quests.

I love the Cyrodiil map for its vastness without loading screens. Something I am missing within the rest of the game that sometimes feels claustrophobic within the small zones.

kargen27 · August 31

LPapirius wrote: »

Kisakee wrote: »

LPapirius wrote: »

Why do people who hate PvP so much log in to play a game where the feature end game content is PvP?

That's just your opinion, not everyone elses.

It was ZOS' opinion for the first few years of the game. ESO was advertised as a PvP game before, during and after release.

Even in the early advertising PvP was only a part of the overall emphasis. It was featured as an Elder Scrolls game with PvP.

LPapirius · September 1

kargen27 wrote: »

LPapirius wrote: »

Kisakee wrote: »

LPapirius wrote: »

Why do people who hate PvP so much log in to play a game where the feature end game content is PvP?

That's just your opinion, not everyone elses.

It was ZOS' opinion for the first few years of the game. ESO was advertised as a PvP game before, during and after release.

Even in the early advertising PvP was only a part of the overall emphasis. It was featured as an Elder Scrolls game with PvP.

No it wasn't. If it were advertised as just being an Elder Scrolls game I never would have bought the game. Does someone need to post the picture of the back of the original box the game originally came in again for proof?

Theist_VII · September 1

You can already make an unkillable tank, if you don’t want combat, or set-backs, make one.

kargen27 · September 1

LPapirius wrote: »

kargen27 wrote: »

LPapirius wrote: »

Kisakee wrote: »

LPapirius wrote: »

Why do people who hate PvP so much log in to play a game where the feature end game content is PvP?

That's just your opinion, not everyone elses.

It was ZOS' opinion for the first few years of the game. ESO was advertised as a PvP game before, during and after release.

Even in the early advertising PvP was only a part of the overall emphasis. It was featured as an Elder Scrolls game with PvP.

No it wasn't. If it were advertised as just being an Elder Scrolls game I never would have bought the game. Does someone need to post the picture of the back of the original box the game originally came in again for proof?

Didn't use the word "just". I have seen the image of the back of the box many many times. I have also read the pre release press drops, descriptions and concept hype many times. Everything points to PvP being a part of a comprehensive game based on Elder Scrolls.
This is from the very first post on the official Elder Scrolls site: "For the last several years, all of us at ZeniMax Online Studios have been working on making The Elder Scrolls Online. As a studio comprised of gamers and long-time Elder Scrolls fans, our paramount goal is to create a fun and immersive Elder Scrolls experience. The end result is a massively multiplayer online game that we believe seasoned and new Elder Scrolls fans alike will love and feel right at home in. We’re looking forward to unveiling all that awaits you in The Elder Scrolls Online in the coming months, and that begins now."

Almost the first thing said in the introductory video "Elder Scrolls Online, everything you need to know about it is right in the name. It's Elder Scrolls but it's online".
The video is 9.5 minutes long and PvP isn't mentioned until more than seven minutes in and only for one minute. That is the introduction video to the game so no ESO wasn't a PvP centric game that got morphed.

Mik195 · September 1

LPapirius wrote: »

kargen27 wrote: »

LPapirius wrote: »

Kisakee wrote: »

LPapirius wrote: »

Why do people who hate PvP so much log in to play a game where the feature end game content is PvP?

That's just your opinion, not everyone elses.

It was ZOS' opinion for the first few years of the game. ESO was advertised as a PvP game before, during and after release.

Even in the early advertising PvP was only a part of the overall emphasis. It was featured as an Elder Scrolls game with PvP.

No it wasn't. If it were advertised as just being an Elder Scrolls game I never would have bought the game. Does someone need to post the picture of the back of the original box the game originally came in again for proof?

That was a decade ago. Time to accept the current reality that pvp doesn't really work and ZOS isn't likely to make pvp "the" end game. And they aren't adding an auction house any time soon or forcing every to group so the ESO is a proper MMO.