Bots vs. Inks

Grendalism

Dear ZOS,

Please, sort out the bot situation on consoles….it’s getting ridiculous!

Pretty much any place you go in the starter zones or Craglorn, or other ‘well used’ node harvesting route is dominated by bots now.

The ink drop rate isn’t great (yes, I know it’s being updated in u43), so the players are losing out to bots.

It’s not rocket science in spotting them…you could easily get an intern or two to do this…(if ZOS isn’t sure how to spot them, feel free to contact me and I’ll group up with an official ZOS rep to talk you through it).

You take action against players that exploit crown stores etc, so hopefully you are taking same/similar action against player IDs that have the bots
(Yes, I am aware of the various conspiracy theories on this topic too, which, I won’t touch on here).

Had you considered publishing a weekly number of bots deactivated ?
(Maybe as an updated thread here?)
I just report probably 20+ per week of these things, time/effort I’d rather spend elsewhere..

reiverx

In Haven, Grahtwood, if you go to the beach there's a bot ball group that farms mudcrabs. It's insane how coordinated it is.

XSTRONG

I have seen fishing bots in some random places, no wonder there so much Perfect Roe on the market lol

theoverseer

Sanguine Barrows, Rivenspire, bots farming skeevers 24/7 on PS NA and EU.

Stafford197

Sorry but you’re completely wasting your time.

There is no point in reporting this - players have already reported all of these bots for a very long time and yet nothing ever changes.

darvaria

^ The ink just gives them more incentive so you see a lot more of them now. That's why ink should be in things players earn like dungeons, tot, rewards, etc. We did not need another incentive for "gatherers". TBH I really didn't know real players gathered very much now.

TaSheen

I gather all the time on every character I'm playing. I never need to buy ANYTHING.... thank the Divines! Currently I'm getting about 1 ink an hour. Since I don't need it for anything at this point, I don't really worry about it.

Ishtarknows

darvaria wrote: »

^ The ink just gives them more incentive so you see a lot more of them now. That's why ink should be in things players earn like dungeons, tot, rewards, etc. We did not need another incentive for "gatherers". TBH I really didn't know real players gathered very much now.

You know you have to own Gold Road and complete theWing of the Netch to have ink drop from material nodes? I can't see bot accounts spending that much irl cash and time for an account that can be banned at any moment.

Grendalism

Ishtarknows wrote: »

darvaria wrote: »

^ The ink just gives them more incentive so you see a lot more of them now. That's why ink should be in things players earn like dungeons, tot, rewards, etc. We did not need another incentive for "gatherers". TBH I really didn't know real players gathered very much now.

You know you have to own Gold Road and complete theWing of the Netch to have ink drop from material nodes? I can't see bot accounts spending that much irl cash and time for an account that can be banned at any moment.

Yes, I know, but each node harvested by a bot = less ink drop opportunity for players
(Though it wouldn’t surprise me if some of the bad actors here don’t “invest” and hour of time to get through netch quest on their “principle” toon that their bot accounts run from (as the achievement is account based).

But likewise, why is it that ZOS take such strong actions against players, as we’ve seen in the past quoting T&C, but not the same level of activity against the people behind the bots?

…ultimately Bots drives players away, thus indirectly affecting ZOS monetisation.

Grendalism

I’d REALLY love to see a clear statement from ZOS about their stance on bots, and action plan to tackle them…but I guess that’s too much to hope for.

Elric_665

A Question (I have no Console, so I don't know)

How does botting function on a Console?
On a PC it's clear. External Programs, Macros, etc.
But on a Console? You can't install any Mods, Programs, …

How does it work?

DenverRalphy

Grendalism wrote: »

Ishtarknows wrote: »

darvaria wrote: »

^ The ink just gives them more incentive so you see a lot more of them now. That's why ink should be in things players earn like dungeons, tot, rewards, etc. We did not need another incentive for "gatherers". TBH I really didn't know real players gathered very much now.

You know you have to own Gold Road and complete theWing of the Netch to have ink drop from material nodes? I can't see bot accounts spending that much irl cash and time for an account that can be banned at any moment.

Yes, I know, but each node harvested by a bot = less ink drop opportunity for players
<snip>

A bot harvesting a node doesn't prevent (or steal an opportunity from) players being able to harvest.

Resource nodes are infinite. They're not a static or limited resource. There aren't any barren wastelands out there where the resources nodes are just gone. They're everywhere, easy to find, and spawn rather quickly. Any player at any given time can harvest a node within a couple/few seconds if they so choose.

AnduinTryggva

darvaria wrote: »

^ The ink just gives them more incentive so you see a lot more of them now. That's why ink should be in things players earn like dungeons, tot, rewards, etc. We did not need another incentive for "gatherers". TBH I really didn't know real players gathered very much now.

My thoughts exactly. Ink should in no way be side drops pf ressources. Even before scribing the bot situation was far from good. Now it is insane. Go around capitals (EU PC): It is NAKED and stripped from ressources whenever I check out.

Ink should drop from activities that cannot be automatized like dungeon bosses. It would do no harm to increase number of inks dropped as boss loot.

But it should never ever be placed inside basic ressources that are already farmed like hell.

Orbital78

AnduinTryggva wrote: »

Ink should drop from activities that cannot be automatized like dungeon bosses. It would do no harm to increase number of inks dropped as boss loot.

But it should never ever be placed inside basic ressources that are already farmed like hell.

They do drop from bosses now, and also I get them a fair bit from the Archive now. Almost every trial I do I see a few inks drop between the guild group. Resources are fine, I think the console situation is a issue with their system that allows easy account creation. Though PC gave away thousands of free accounts on Epic too.

opalcity

DenverRalphy wrote: »

Grendalism wrote: »

Ishtarknows wrote: »

darvaria wrote: »

^ The ink just gives them more incentive so you see a lot more of them now. That's why ink should be in things players earn like dungeons, tot, rewards, etc. We did not need another incentive for "gatherers". TBH I really didn't know real players gathered very much now.

You know you have to own Gold Road and complete theWing of the Netch to have ink drop from material nodes? I can't see bot accounts spending that much irl cash and time for an account that can be banned at any moment.

Yes, I know, but each node harvested by a bot = less ink drop opportunity for players
<snip>

A bot harvesting a node doesn't prevent (or steal an opportunity from) players being able to harvest.

Resource nodes are infinite. They're not a static or limited resource. There aren't any barren wastelands out there where the resources nodes are just gone. They're everywhere, easy to find, and spawn rather quickly. Any player at any given time can harvest a node within a couple/few seconds if they so choose.

Some of the bots in starter zones can harvest a node before you can see them. You can be stood at a spot before it spawns and the bot will get it before you are able to.

Veinblood1965

It's not a matter of banning them. They just create a new basic account within minutes and viola, their automated programs are back to botting.

DenverRalphy

opalcity wrote: »

DenverRalphy wrote: »

Grendalism wrote: »

Ishtarknows wrote: »

darvaria wrote: »

^ The ink just gives them more incentive so you see a lot more of them now. That's why ink should be in things players earn like dungeons, tot, rewards, etc. We did not need another incentive for "gatherers". TBH I really didn't know real players gathered very much now.

You know you have to own Gold Road and complete theWing of the Netch to have ink drop from material nodes? I can't see bot accounts spending that much irl cash and time for an account that can be banned at any moment.

Yes, I know, but each node harvested by a bot = less ink drop opportunity for players
<snip>

A bot harvesting a node doesn't prevent (or steal an opportunity from) players being able to harvest.

Resource nodes are infinite. They're not a static or limited resource. There aren't any barren wastelands out there where the resources nodes are just gone. They're everywhere, easy to find, and spawn rather quickly. Any player at any given time can harvest a node within a couple/few seconds if they so choose.

Some of the bots in starter zones can harvest a node before you can see them. You can be stood at a spot before it spawns and the bot will get it before you are able to.

You really have to not be paying attention if a bot beats you to a resource node when you're both going after the same node. During the uncommon occasions I find myself in starter and decide to farm nodes while I'm there, it's easy as pie to just trot one step ahead of bots and beat them to the nodes along the route. Heck, sometimes I have to slow down just to see which node they're going to next.

Don't get me wrong. I'm in no way defending bots. I hate them. Can't stand 'em. But for a lot of other reasons that's outside the scope of this thread.

Orbital78

DenverRalphy wrote: »

You really have to not be paying attention if a bot beats you to a resource node when you're both going after the same node. During the uncommon occasions I find myself in starter and decide to farm nodes while I'm there, it's easy as pie to just trot one step ahead of bots and beat them to the nodes along the route. Heck, sometimes I have to slow down just to see which node they're going to next.

I don't think you understood what he meant, low levels that are in certain quests or haven't completed quests (i think) have areas where they don't render to some players. They can interact with the nodes, but you cannot see them. It happens in Betnik around the start of the metal wall farm area.

There are weird instancing/zoning areas in that place in general. Like you can see a treasure chest but when you cross the "zone" it disappears.

Thankfully it isn't terribly bad on PC-NA, but I have ran into nodes disappearing and the someone else is interacting with that message and it took me a bit to figure out what was going on.

BXR_Lonestar

There is an easy way to fix the bot issue:

Make it so that you can only get gold mats and luminous ink from the CP 160 materials. Then, if a botter wants to be effective in gathering raw materials to be refined to get gold mats and ink, they would have to level up the character's crafting on every bot in order to get materials that can even have a chance of yielding gold mats.

This instantly makes it so that you can't simply get a new account and benefit from botting on a level 2-3 character with zero risk if the account gets banned.

I'm sure there will still be some people who will still bot, but the reality is that if you make it so you can't start a junker account just for the purposes of botting, it will help cut down on this practice in a big way because the botters would then be forced to invest time and effort into the "bot" account before it could be valuable to them.

BXR_Lonestar

AnduinTryggva wrote: »

darvaria wrote: »

^ The ink just gives them more incentive so you see a lot more of them now. That's why ink should be in things players earn like dungeons, tot, rewards, etc. We did not need another incentive for "gatherers". TBH I really didn't know real players gathered very much now.

My thoughts exactly. Ink should in no way be side drops pf ressources. Even before scribing the bot situation was far from good. Now it is insane. Go around capitals (EU PC): It is NAKED and stripped from ressources whenever I check out.

Ink should drop from activities that cannot be automatized like dungeon bosses. It would do no harm to increase number of inks dropped as boss loot.

But it should never ever be placed inside basic ressources that are already farmed like hell.

IMO, they should make ink have a chance of of dropping in chests, a relatively low chance from dropping from trashmobs, and a relatively high chance (10%) from world bosses. The drop chance should increase slightly in dungeons and trials to encourage those activities.

Orbital78

BXR_Lonestar wrote: »

IMO, they should make ink have a chance of of dropping in chests, a relatively low chance from dropping from trashmobs, and a relatively high chance (10%) from world bosses. The drop chance should increase slightly in dungeons and trials to encourage those activities.

https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/662078/pts-patch-notes-v10-1-0#latest

Luminous Ink
To better align with other specialty crafting materials, we have added additional sources for Luminous Ink.
If you have the Dragon Luminary’s Blessing, you now have a low chance for Luminous Ink to drop with Treasure Chests.
If you have the Gryphon Luminary’s Blessing, you now have a low chance for Luminous Ink to drop in Heavy Sacks.

PTS added two more sources for ink, which goes live Monday if I'm not mistaken. You can get ink from any trash mob currently. I get them randomly, not often but I do get them passively just aoe farming (during Gilded event I was getting a few in Reapers March PD).

Ishtarknows

BXR_Lonestar wrote: »

There is an easy way to fix the bot issue:

Make it so that you can only get gold mats and luminous ink from the CP 160 materials. Then, if a botter wants to be effective in gathering raw materials to be refined to get gold mats and ink, they would have to level up the character's crafting on every bot in order to get materials that can even have a chance of yielding gold mats.

This instantly makes it so that you can't simply get a new account and benefit from botting on a level 2-3 character with zero risk if the account gets banned.

I'm sure there will still be some people who will still bot, but the reality is that if you make it so you can't start a junker account just for the purposes of botting, it will help cut down on this practice in a big way because the botters would then be forced to invest time and effort into the "bot" account before it could be valuable to them.

That also means that genuine players won't get ink while levelling new characters and they'd also have to farm for skill points to put into crafting in order to have the same chances they do right now.

No thank you