Ideas for Necromancer improvements (2024 edition)

StarOfElyon

I'm making an updated version of my Necro ideas thread from 2023 (https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/633137/suggestions-for-necromancer-changes). One thing that ZOS has been doing lately is making skills require less micromanagement and loading them with multiple functions:

Cephaliarch's Flail:
Infuse your arm with abyssal magic to form tentacles that lash out at your foes dealing 1939 Physical Damage, healing yourself for 969, and generating Crux. Enemies are immobilized for 3 seconds and marked with Abyssal Ink for 20 seconds. Deals up to 100% more damage to enemies with less than 50% Health. You deal 5% increased damage to enemies drenched in Abyssal Ink.

Tome-Bearer's Inspiration:
Etch a series of runes onto your weapon that pulse with power once every 5 seconds. Each pulse enhances your class abilities, and striking an enemy with one deals an additional 1161 Magic Damage and generates Crux if you have none. While slotted on either ability bar, gain Major Brutality and Major Sorcery, increasing your Weapon and Spell Damage by 20%.

The Necro needs this same treatment.

Blighted Blastbones: cost determined by the highest resource.
(I have mourned the loss of Stalking Blastbones and I have accepted that fact that I'm just going to have to change my Necro)

Death Scythe:
As I have seen suggested on the forums, both morphs of the Necro scythe should get execute scaling. I agree that this would be a great and very needed addition.
- Hungry Scythe: should also apply life steal to all enemies hit.


Skeletal Arcanist/Archer: grants major sorcery/brutality when slotted on either bar. Increase the damage that their attacks do.

Shocking Siphon: while slotted on either bar grants major prophecy/savagery and increases damage done by 3%. The AOE remains on the ground even if the tether breaks early. *Increase the radius size.
- Mystic Siphon: the increased Health, Magicka, and Stamina Recovery persists even if the tether breaks early.
- Detonating Syphon: the damage AOE now sticks to you.

Flame Skull:
- Riccochet Skull/Venom Skull: applies burning/poisoned status effects. (Increase travel speed)

Spirit Mender: when active, applies minor cowardice to attackers.

Bone Totem: summons an effigy of bones up to 28 meters away. After 1 second, the totem begins fearing nearby enemies every 2 seconds, causing them to cower in place for 4 seconds. (Changed to allow both morphs to be targeted)
- Warding Totem: (Formerly Remote Totem) grants minor protection when standing in the area of effect.
- Agony Totem: afflicts enemies in the area of effect with minor vulnerability.

Restoring Tether: the effects persist on the player even if the tether breaks early.

Render Flesh:
- Resistant Flesh: (remains unchanged)
- Blood Sacrifice: consumes a corpse to grant you Major Courage (or Major Berserk) for 10 seconds.

Expunge: reduces the cost of all your abilities by 3% while slotted on either bar.

Bitter Harvest: when slotted on either bar, reduces your damage taken by 3%.


ULTIMATES:
Frozen Colossus: Unleash a decayed Flesh Colossus to pulverize enemies in the area. The Colossus smashes the ground three times over 3 seconds. Dealing damage applies Major Vulnerability to any enemy hit for 12 seconds.
- Glacial Colossus: does frost damage and stuns enemies on the second hit instead of the third.
- Pestilent Colossus: smashes the ground only once and does disease damage. Afflicts enemies with a pestilence that does damage over time.

Animate Blastbones: instead of resurrecting allies, this ultimate summons up to three blastbones to attack the nearest opponent. Summoned Blastbones are immune to being crowd controlled (other than by another ultimate). Reduce the cost of this ultimate to 200, down from 320, to make it more usable.

(3-15-2024: a video discussing these ideas)

https://youtu.be/s03c5jlZhaQ?si=wZUIjM1YkDQSMqnC

yadibroz

I pay 1k for this to happen

StarOfElyon

really, these feel like the bare minimum to me.

Deimus

You've been fighting the good fight for a while now.

@ZOS_Kevin @ZOS_GinaBruno Do you have a response to this user's constant dedication of feedback, or plans to clearly communicate your intentions for the future of the Necromancer class to the players?

If there is a roadmap for a Necromancer class overhaul communicating that will do a lot to alleviate the frustration of players. Especially those with 100s or 1000s of hours dedicated to a class that is continuously stripped of it's capabilities and feels like it's lagging behind. Many issues with the new skill were pointed out on day 1 with no changes until week 3 that many players feel adds more complexity to the rotation.

So is this the first change of many and we are not yet able to see the full picture, or if there is no class overhaul planned why have the years of feedback and ideas to ease the pain points gone ignored?

My final inquiry as a *whispers* pvp enjoyer what are your expectations and plans for Necro especially Magcro in this environment as a class with no reliable stuns or cc and now no burst damage in their class kit?

You've mention multiple times of wanting to improve communication. Opening a dialogue and creating a level of transparency of your intentions for the class and how it could remedy these issues will be a great step forward to re-establishing goodwill and meet the expectations of the community.

StarOfElyon

I decided to turn my mic on and try to better explain the problems with the class. I hope ZOS will listen.

https://youtu.be/s03c5jlZhaQ?si=wZUIjM1YkDQSMqnC

AvidNecro

@ZOS_Kevin @ZOS_BrianWheeler @ZOS_MattFiror

StarOfElyon

While something is better than nothing, Necromancer needs a lot more work than this and I'm surprised that after all the feedback that has been given since update 41 this is all we see.

yadibroz

StarOfElyon wrote: »

While something is better than nothing, Necromancer needs a lot more work than this and I'm surprised that after all the feedback that has been given since update 41 this is all we see.

Why keep trying, just forget it and rework warden and templar then and delete necromancer.

CameraBeardThePirate

StarOfElyon wrote: »

While something is better than nothing, Necromancer needs a lot more work than this and I'm surprised that after all the feedback that has been given since update 41 this is all we see.

Why are you surprised? It is literally the same song and dance every patch. Expect nothing.

yadibroz

CameraBeardThePirate wrote: »

StarOfElyon wrote: »

While something is better than nothing, Necromancer needs a lot more work than this and I'm surprised that after all the feedback that has been given since update 41 this is all we see.

Why are you surprised? It is literally the same song and dance every patch. Expect nothing.

It something but useless for pvp like we need some changes that work for pvp but again it ge better if increase meter.

StarOfElyon

I'm one of the few clowns who still uses mystic siphon in PVP. 😂

CameraBeardThePirate

StarOfElyon wrote: »

I'm one of the few clowns who still uses mystic siphon in PVP. 😂

It's decent as a utility since it provides an unnamed % damage and unnamed recovery... but if you check damage logs, you're pretty much never landing the actual damage portion in PvP.

alexj4596b14_ESO

✭✭
@ZOS_Kevin @ZOS_BrianWheeler @ZOS_MattFiror

With the release of the arcanist class, its truly time to revamp the older classes to mirror how the arcanist is built.

StarOfElyon

CameraBeardThePirate wrote: »

StarOfElyon wrote: »

I'm one of the few clowns who still uses mystic siphon in PVP. 😂

It's decent as a utility since it provides an unnamed % damage and unnamed recovery... but if you check damage logs, you're pretty much never landing the actual damage portion in PvP.

I know. No one is just going to stand in stupid in PVP. But I use it and other class skills to feel like I'm actually playing the Necromancer class.

Yamenstein

alexj4596b14_ESO wrote: »

✭✭
@ZOS_Kevin @ZOS_BrianWheeler @ZOS_MattFiror

With the release of the arcanist class, its truly time to revamp the older classes to mirror how the arcanist is built.

Don’t bother. They don’t really listen or acknowledge anything the community is bringing up. Unless it’s crown store related or a bug. Go figure.

Maybe we should raise bugs - your class is busted.

Arcanist is so OP and pretty compared to any class that came before it. Will they release improvements to older classes ? When it can be tied into a chapter so they can sell more content and keep long term players on the hook.

CameraBeardThePirate

StarOfElyon wrote: »

CameraBeardThePirate wrote: »

StarOfElyon wrote: »

I'm one of the few clowns who still uses mystic siphon in PVP. 😂

It's decent as a utility since it provides an unnamed % damage and unnamed recovery... but if you check damage logs, you're pretty much never landing the actual damage portion in PvP.

I know. No one is just going to stand in stupid in PVP. But I use it and other class skills to feel like I'm actually playing the Necromancer class.

Oh not disagreeing there, the abilities feel cool.

I'm moreso trying to point out the fact that whatever calculations the server does to determine if people are in the tether are wack - it often won't register the damage even if it seems people should be in the tether.

This was made even worse when ZOS changed the tick rate to once every .66 seconds instead of .33 seconds - the server now "checks" for targets less frequently, causing you to "miss" more ticks.

OsUfi

StarOfElyon wrote: »

While something is better than nothing, Necromancer needs a lot more work than this and I'm surprised that after all the feedback that has been given since update 41 this is all we see.

I'm not surprised and I'm happy with this approach. Necro doesn't need a rework like many call for, it just needs a lot of little buffs. I'd rather have them patch-by-patch than a mass overhauling of entire skills that don't work afterwards. Heck, even one skill overhauled has apparently been enough to throw necros to poop.

Little buffs, patch-by-patch, please keep that up ZoS!

yadibroz wrote: »

Why keep trying, just forget it and rework warden and templar then and delete necromancer.

Possibly the silliest suggestion I've read so far. Stop being a drama llama.

yadibroz

OsUfi wrote: »

StarOfElyon wrote: »

While something is better than nothing, Necromancer needs a lot more work than this and I'm surprised that after all the feedback that has been given since update 41 this is all we see.

I'm not surprised and I'm happy with this approach. Necro doesn't need a rework like many call for, it just needs a lot of little buffs. I'd rather have them patch-by-patch than a mass overhauling of entire skills that don't work afterwards. Heck, even one skill overhauled has apparently been enough to throw necros to poop.

Little buffs, patch-by-patch, please keep that up ZoS!

yadibroz wrote: »

Why keep trying, just forget it and rework warden and templar then and delete necromancer.

Possibly the silliest suggestion I've read so far. Stop being a drama llama.

Is true, what they do is making the class much worse than it is which should not take months to add new things to the class, [snip]

[edited for bashing]

yadibroz

OsUfi wrote: »

StarOfElyon wrote: »

While something is better than nothing, Necromancer needs a lot more work than this and I'm surprised that after all the feedback that has been given since update 41 this is all we see.

I'm not surprised and I'm happy with this approach. Necro doesn't need a rework like many call for, it just needs a lot of little buffs. I'd rather have them patch-by-patch than a mass overhauling of entire skills that don't work afterwards. Heck, even one skill overhauled has apparently been enough to throw necros to poop.

Little buffs, patch-by-patch, please keep that up ZoS!

yadibroz wrote: »

Why keep trying, just forget it and rework warden and templar then and delete necromancer.

Possibly the silliest suggestion I've read so far. Stop being a drama llama.

The class need to use one bar for all buff because the class don't have no aegis,brutally,courage and so one like all other classes do which feel incomplete.

OsUfi

yadibroz wrote: »

OsUfi wrote: »

StarOfElyon wrote: »

While something is better than nothing, Necromancer needs a lot more work than this and I'm surprised that after all the feedback that has been given since update 41 this is all we see.

I'm not surprised and I'm happy with this approach. Necro doesn't need a rework like many call for, it just needs a lot of little buffs. I'd rather have them patch-by-patch than a mass overhauling of entire skills that don't work afterwards. Heck, even one skill overhauled has apparently been enough to throw necros to poop.

Little buffs, patch-by-patch, please keep that up ZoS!

yadibroz wrote: »

Why keep trying, just forget it and rework warden and templar then and delete necromancer.

Possibly the silliest suggestion I've read so far. Stop being a drama llama.

Is true, what they do is making the class much worse than it is which should not take months to add new things to the class, [snip]

OK, so say they make a load of changes at once, then necro becomes OP and needs a nerf. Then they have to decipher what went wrong amongst a dozen changes instead of one at a time. Little buffs, patch-by-patch is the most sensible thing to do and will leave us with a better necro at the end.

[edited to remove quote]

StarOfElyon

Updated ideas again now that Grave Grasp has been changed.

Death Scythe: (both morphs)
Deals more damage based on the enemy's missing health.
- Hungry Scythe: should also apply life steal to all enemies hit, in addition to healing the caster over time.

Shocking Siphon: The AOE should remain on the ground even if the tether breaks early. (Increase the radius size too)
- Mystic Siphon: the increased Health, Magicka, and Stamina Recovery persists even if the tether breaks early.

Flame Skull:
- Riccochet Skull/Venom Skull: applies burning/poisoned status effects. (Increase travel speed)

Bone Totem: summons an effigy of bones up to 28 meters away. After 1 second, the totem begins fearing nearby enemies every 2 seconds, causing them to cower in place for 4 seconds. (Changed to allow both morphs to be targeted)

Restoring Tether: the effects persist on the player character even if the tether breaks early.

Grave Grasp:
- Empowering Grasp: Summon three patches of skeletal claws from the ground in front of you dealing 898 frost damage. Enemies in the first area are stunned for 3 seconds, immobilized in the second area for 4 seconds, and snared in the final area by 50% for 5 seconds. Each patch applies Minor Maim to enemies hit for 10 seconds, reducing their damage done by 5%. Grants Empower to your allies, and enhances the damage and healing of your summons by 1000. Each effect lasts 10 seconds.

- Ghostly Embrace: Summon three patches of skeletal claws from the ground in front of you, dealing 1742 Frost Damage and an additional 1635 Frost Damage over 5 seconds. The initial hit applies the Chilled status effect. The final area creates a corpse if at least one enemy was hit.

Expunge: reduces the cost of all your abilities by 3% while slotted on either bar.

Bitter Harvest: when slotted on either bar, reduces your damage taken by 3%.

Boneyard increase the radius to 8 meters.

PASSIVES:
Corpse Consumption: When you consume a corpse, you generate 10 Ultimate. This effect can occur once every 16 seconds. You also gain Major Savagery and Prophecy for 20 seconds, increasing your Weapon and Spell Critical rating by 2629.

Undead Confederate: While you have a Sacrificial Bones, Skeletal Mage, or Spirit Mender active, your Health, Magicka, and Stamina Recovery is increased by 200. You also gain Major Brutality and Sorcery for 20 seconds, increasing your Weapon and Spell Damage by 20%.

ULTIMATES:
Frozen Colossus: Unleash a decayed Flesh Colossus to pulverize enemies in the area. The Colossus smashes the ground three times over 3 seconds. Dealing damage applies Major Vulnerability to any enemy hit for 12 seconds.
- Glacial Colossus: does frost damage and stuns enemies on the second hit instead of the third.
- Pestilent Colossus: smashes the ground only once and does disease damage. Afflicts enemies with a pestilence that does damage over time.

StarOfElyon

This was supposed to be the week that any more big changes were going to be made and we got a big fat nothing. I'm struggling to understand how the bare minimum buffs Necros got could be considered enough for an entire update. What exactly is update 43 if this is all we got? How about some communication finally? What's going on with ZOS? This could have been the update that so many pain points with classes could have been addressed? What else was the team busy with? I mean how....why...

I'm just baffled and concerned. I'm been afraid to speculate about Microsoft being a problem

Perashim

I really don't understand the "thematic" feel to Gravelord's Sacrifice/SacBones.

Still think that idea should be scrapped entirely.

StarOfElyon

Perashim wrote: »

I really don't understand the "thematic" feel to Gravelord's Sacrifice/SacBones.

Still think that idea should be scrapped entirely.

I don't either, to be completely honest. I have yet to see anyone use GLS in PvP. I am leveling my second Necro and I plan to make a build without Blastbones, but I won't use GLS because honestly I feel it would be a waste of a skill slot. We've already stated in numerous threads the many problems that can occur in a pvp environment when movement is key and crowd control exists. I wish they would humble themselves and listen to people who actually play the class. So no, I'm not even leveling that skill and I'm almost at level 30 now.

Perashim

I would rather have a short term melee undead or a tweaked stalking blastbones back (something to take into account that it leaps instead of chases).

fedouva

I think the zos will only need to recycle the necromancer when they stop buying it, not before that time.

StarOfElyon

As much as I enjoy the challenge of the class, the tether minigame and unreliable summons have me thinking twice about leveling my second necromancer character. This class just needs so much work before it can hold a candle to other classes. You can see in this gameplay that it's extremely hard to turn a fight even with strong sets. Sometimes, I just couldn't get off my backbar. Maybe I'm just a bad player though.

https://youtu.be/weCIbUrH_6c

StarOfElyon

Perhaps this is the fix for the major and minor buffs that will make everyone happy. Suggested changes to passives follow:

Corpse Consumption: When you consume a corpse, you generate 10 Ultimate. This effect can occur once every 16 seconds. You also gain Major Savagery and Prophecy for 20 seconds, increasing your Weapon and Spell Critical rating by 2629.

Undead Confederate: While you have a Sacrificial Bones, Skeletal Mage, or Spirit Mender active, your Health, Magicka, and Stamina Recovery is increased by 200. You also gain Major Brutality and Sorcery for 20 seconds, increasing your Weapon and Spell Damage by 20%.

I will be adding these to my earlier post.

The_Isatope8

StarOfElyon wrote: »

Perhaps this is the fix for the major and minor buffs that will make everyone happy. Suggested changes to passives follow:

Corpse Consumption: When you consume a corpse, you generate 10 Ultimate. This effect can occur once every 16 seconds. You also gain Major Savagery and Prophecy for 20 seconds, increasing your Weapon and Spell Critical rating by 2629.

Undead Confederate: While you have a Sacrificial Bones, Skeletal Mage, or Spirit Mender active, your Health, Magicka, and Stamina Recovery is increased by 200. You also gain Major Brutality and Sorcery for 20 seconds, increasing your Weapon and Spell Damage by 20%.

I will be adding these to my earlier post.

I like the idea of having buffs attached to passives, it definitely gives Necro some more wiggle room with their skill choices and expands their kit a little.

Necro is in the same boat as Templar with their passives, they need to reworked or expanded upon to bring them more in line with the other classes who have great passives for the most part. I also think that Necro should be given the resurrection speed boost that's on Templars Master Ritualist passive, it just fits Necro better and would be a nice little thematic change. Maybe the effect could go on their Near Death Experience passive.

Midohka

Im so hopeful on what could be next now that we FINALLY have the barely minimum of offensive self buffs.


Id like the necromancer to be treated as the sorcerer recently and to get tools for healcro to now be a decent option that doesnt require you to insist its working bc people dont get its use (it has none actually)... Id like for exemple the ressources regen of the healing siphon to be transmitted to each ally in the group, or the bone sacrifice to give a healing bonus with class heals, etc

Please healcro deserves so much better

StarOfElyon

It still feels like a lot more work to use Necromancer skills than it does to not use Necromancer skills. While I'm summoning in somebody's face, they're either healing or slicing me up. The reward for working twice as hard as players on other classes just isn't there.

Edit: I'm not asking for the class to be like Nightblade or Sorc (capable of winning with just one button). I'm just saying that there are gaping holes in Necromancer design that makes it hard to compete without getting fatigued. Skills need to do more. The class needs to be played by the devs so they can see for themselves.