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Please remove the quests from the old dungeons, ZOS
Dax_Draconis
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Something really needs to be done about the old, non-dlc dungeons. Speedsters are constantly making it difficult to do the quests in them. It took me 3 attempts to do the quest in Vaults of Madness while waiting for the long dialogue as the group ignored me and ran ahead.
I also had an issue in Volenfell where 3 of us doing the quest got deprived when the lone speedster, who was not doing the quest, pulled the lever and bugged it for the rest of us. I had to go back and solo the dungeon just to do the quest, which I guess is ok since I am an experienced player, but what about new people to ESO? Is it really supposed to be on them to create groups just to experience the dungeons as intended for the first time through? That's a really messed up design.
If you aren't willing to put in any speedbumps to discourage this behavior, ZOS, then please remove the quests interactions since the default seems to be speedruns every time no matter who in the group needs the quest.
I also had an issue in Volenfell where 3 of us doing the quest got deprived when the lone speedster, who was not doing the quest, pulled the lever and bugged it for the rest of us. I had to go back and solo the dungeon just to do the quest, which I guess is ok since I am an experienced player, but what about new people to ESO? Is it really supposed to be on them to create groups just to experience the dungeons as intended for the first time through? That's a really messed up design.
If you aren't willing to put in any speedbumps to discourage this behavior, ZOS, then please remove the quests interactions since the default seems to be speedruns every time no matter who in the group needs the quest.
1
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SilverBride✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭They should just make them auto complete the steps as you do them and not have to talk to the quest givers.PCNA11 -
MidniteOwl1913✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Yeah they really do need to do something about the endless banging on. Not only does it mean you can't keep up with even a normal speed group after hearing 7-8 times it gets old.
And even if finishing the quest for the skill point is all you are after you might not make it to the end to complete it before the timer runs out after everyone else leaves.
Very frustrating.
PS5/NA0 -
Dax_Draconis✭✭✭✭SilverBride wrote: »They should just make them auto complete the steps as you do them and not have to talk to the quest givers.
Yeah, it should be an automatic skill point for completion of the dungeon without any need to stop and click on an NPC.1 -
Dax_Draconis✭✭✭✭And now was forced into a speed run of City of Ash 1 with no chance to get the skill point. This is ridiculous.0
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tincanman✭✭✭✭✭
✭Zos have already provided the tools for this via the new group finder options for those who won't otherwise pre-group.
An alternative for some base game dungeons is to port in solo and get the quest from the quest-giver and either solo the dungeon or store the quest for when the dungeon appears in your random queue. ok, that won't help with vom (other than soloing) but may with others; admittedly, I think the delays with npcs could be improved/reduced with vom.
vote-kick option - OP mentions a single speed-runner in one instance; this would seem an easy vote.
It still seems imperative to state your quest need at start of dungeon but with RANDOMs the result, I imagine, will be unpredictable.
But, above all, don't rely on RANDOM groups if looking to complete dungeon quests for skill points - pre-group or solo them.
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tincanman✭✭✭✭✭
✭Dax_Draconis wrote: »And now was forced into a speed run of City of Ash 1 with no chance to get the skill point. This is ridiculous.
'forced'? In what way?
1 -
Dax_Draconis✭✭✭✭Dax_Draconis wrote: »And now was forced into a speed run of City of Ash 1 with no chance to get the skill point. This is ridiculous.
'forced'? In what way?
“Forced” in the sense that my only choices were to get left behind and fight everything they skipped by myself, quit the group and sit in another long queue or keep up with them.
The dungeons are seriously abused and broken now because of this new normal of rushing through them and skipping a lot of stuff. I don’t remember it ever being this bad a couple years ago. ZOS needs to just award the skill point for finishing with the group.0 -
tincanman✭✭✭✭✭
✭Dax_Draconis wrote: »Dax_Draconis wrote: »And now was forced into a speed run of City of Ash 1 with no chance to get the skill point. This is ridiculous.
'forced'? In what way?
“Forced” in the sense that my only choices were to get left behind and fight everything they skipped by myself, quit the group and sit in another long queue or keep up with them.
The dungeons are seriously abused and broken now because of this new normal of rushing through them and skipping a lot of stuff. I don’t remember it ever being this bad a couple years ago. ZOS needs to just award the skill point for finishing with the group.
That's not forced, that's your choice. Did you state you needed the quest at the dungeon start? Was this for a random dungeon or did you specifically queue for CoA1 (in which case at least go in solo first and pick up quest so you have it in your journal if/when that dungeon comes up as a random later)?
Seriously, please consider either soloing them if looking for skill pts or pre-form a group that wants story/quest/skill points - once you do this, you'll wonder why you put up with the random queue for so long. Social guilds are good for this sort of thing or use the other options introduced to the group finder tool to find 1 or more like-minded individuals or ask in zone chat.
Edited by tincanman on 23 February 2024 12:390 -
Dax_Draconis✭✭✭✭Dax_Draconis wrote: »Dax_Draconis wrote: »And now was forced into a speed run of City of Ash 1 with no chance to get the skill point. This is ridiculous.
'forced'? In what way?
“Forced” in the sense that my only choices were to get left behind and fight everything they skipped by myself, quit the group and sit in another long queue or keep up with them.
The dungeons are seriously abused and broken now because of this new normal of rushing through them and skipping a lot of stuff. I don’t remember it ever being this bad a couple years ago. ZOS needs to just award the skill point for finishing with the group.
That's not forced, that's your choice. Did you state you needed the quest at the dungeon start? Was this for a random dungeon or did you specifically queue for CoA1 (in which case at least go in solo first and pick up quest so you have it in your journal if/when that dungeon comes up as a random later)?
Seriously, please consider either soloing them if looking for skill pts or pre-form a group that wants story/quest/skill points - once you do this, you'll wonder why you put up with the random queue for so long. Social guilds are good for this sort of thing or use the other options introduced to the group finder tool to find 1 or more like-minded individuals or ask in zone chat.
That is not healthy for the game when the people that need to run the dungeon as designed have to be the ones to jump through the hoops just to run them. It’s the speed runners who should be the ones that need to spend the effort to form groups of likeminded individuals. What a broken experience these dungeons are turning out to be.3 -
colossalvoids✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭It's a player made problem. If you don't want to be forced to go the group's way you'd better be forming your own group and not using random groop finder tool which is, obviously, random selection of players with completely different aims.
There's also new grouping tool for exactly that reason, if majority can't satisfy your needs you can for the group you desire. I'd still recommend guilds instead as it's a closer group of people generally.5 -
tincanman✭✭✭✭✭
✭Dax_Draconis wrote: »Dax_Draconis wrote: »Dax_Draconis wrote: »And now was forced into a speed run of City of Ash 1 with no chance to get the skill point. This is ridiculous.
'forced'? In what way?
“Forced” in the sense that my only choices were to get left behind and fight everything they skipped by myself, quit the group and sit in another long queue or keep up with them.
The dungeons are seriously abused and broken now because of this new normal of rushing through them and skipping a lot of stuff. I don’t remember it ever being this bad a couple years ago. ZOS needs to just award the skill point for finishing with the group.
That's not forced, that's your choice. Did you state you needed the quest at the dungeon start? Was this for a random dungeon or did you specifically queue for CoA1 (in which case at least go in solo first and pick up quest so you have it in your journal if/when that dungeon comes up as a random later)?
Seriously, please consider either soloing them if looking for skill pts or pre-form a group that wants story/quest/skill points - once you do this, you'll wonder why you put up with the random queue for so long. Social guilds are good for this sort of thing or use the other options introduced to the group finder tool to find 1 or more like-minded individuals or ask in zone chat.
That is not healthy for the game when the people that need to run the dungeon as designed have to be the ones to jump through the hoops just to run them. It’s the speed runners who should be the ones that need to spend the effort to form groups of likeminded individuals. What a broken experience these dungeons are turning out to be.
It's just 'random' - it's what you get if you use the tool that way. No one is obliged to play any other way in which they choose to and, unfortunately, that means the speed-runners will use the random tool as it's the fastest way to accomplish their goal (fastest xp & transmutes).
If you have other objectives not satisfied by pure random groups then you should find like-minded players - this is totally healthy, particularly if getting constantly frustrated with purely random groups. Much better to go for your 'random's with known players where you can be confident the only random will be the dungeon selected and that if you need the quest or some other objective your group will wait.
If you still insist on using the random group finder as is and need skill points from dungeon quests you should say so in chat: 'hi...need quest' should suffice; no one else will know for sure otherwise. It's still not a guarantee, though.0 -
svendf✭✭✭✭Zos have already provided the tools for this via the new group finder options for those who won't otherwise pre-group.
An alternative for some base game dungeons is to port in solo and get the quest from the quest-giver and either solo the dungeon or store the quest for when the dungeon appears in your random queue. ok, that won't help with vom (other than soloing) but may with others; admittedly, I think the delays with npcs could be improved/reduced with vom.
vote-kick option - OP mentions a single speed-runner in one instance; this would seem an easy vote.
It still seems imperative to state your quest need at start of dungeon but with RANDOMs the result, I imagine, will be unpredictable.
But, above all, don't rely on RANDOM groups if looking to complete dungeon quests for skill points - pre-group or solo them.
What´s wrong in getting a skill point by clearing the dungeon ?0 -
Araneae6537✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭I wouldn’t want the quests removed, although some of the NPCs do go on a bit and it would be nice if the player had options to have a quick minimal interaction with the NPC to move the quest along or go through a longer conversation.
Most groups will wait if you say something, although you may have to more than once as the rest of the group won’t know when you have to stop and talk to an NPC. You might also consider forming a group for the purpose through group finder (and I would recommend doing a “story run” of each dungeon at least once, where you listen to all the dialogue and explore everything). Depending on your comfort level, most of the base game dungeons can also be soloed or done with one other player and companions.0 -
Dax_Draconis✭✭✭✭Zos have already provided the tools for this via the new group finder options for those who won't otherwise pre-group.
An alternative for some base game dungeons is to port in solo and get the quest from the quest-giver and either solo the dungeon or store the quest for when the dungeon appears in your random queue. ok, that won't help with vom (other than soloing) but may with others; admittedly, I think the delays with npcs could be improved/reduced with vom.
vote-kick option - OP mentions a single speed-runner in one instance; this would seem an easy vote.
It still seems imperative to state your quest need at start of dungeon but with RANDOMs the result, I imagine, will be unpredictable.
But, above all, don't rely on RANDOM groups if looking to complete dungeon quests for skill points - pre-group or solo them.
What´s wrong in getting a skill point by clearing the dungeon ?
I would like to know the answer to that as well. They reward transmutes and keys for bare minimal effort in the dungeons, so why not the skill point too?0 -
Dax_Draconis✭✭✭✭Araneae6537 wrote: »I wouldn’t want the quests removed, although some of the NPCs do go on a bit and it would be nice if the player had options to have a quick minimal interaction with the NPC to move the quest along or go through a longer conversation.
Most groups will wait if you say something, although you may have to more than once as the rest of the group won’t know when you have to stop and talk to an NPC. You might also consider forming a group for the purpose through group finder (and I would recommend doing a “story run” of each dungeon at least once, where you listen to all the dialogue and explore everything). Depending on your comfort level, most of the base game dungeons can also be soloed or done with one other player and companions.
I could have worded the title better. They shouldn't remove the quests but should remove the mandatory interactions to get the skill point. Then if someone wants to form their special group or endure the uncomfortable task of joining a social guild just to see the story later, then they can.
My experience has been to be ignored most times when I say I need to stop for the quest. Some of the base games dungeons are more forgiving than others with getting the skill point, but since the culture has changed to just speed through, then the skill point should be awarded for the first clear of the dungeon automatically.
I don't understand why anything is being rewarded, transmutes and keys, without a complete clear of the dungeon. Players shouldn't be rewarded for skipping a lot of stuff in the dungeons.1 -
tincanman✭✭✭✭✭
✭Dax_Draconis wrote: »Zos have already provided the tools for this via the new group finder options for those who won't otherwise pre-group.
An alternative for some base game dungeons is to port in solo and get the quest from the quest-giver and either solo the dungeon or store the quest for when the dungeon appears in your random queue. ok, that won't help with vom (other than soloing) but may with others; admittedly, I think the delays with npcs could be improved/reduced with vom.
vote-kick option - OP mentions a single speed-runner in one instance; this would seem an easy vote.
It still seems imperative to state your quest need at start of dungeon but with RANDOMs the result, I imagine, will be unpredictable.
But, above all, don't rely on RANDOM groups if looking to complete dungeon quests for skill points - pre-group or solo them.
What´s wrong in getting a skill point by clearing the dungeon ?
I would like to know the answer to that as well. They reward transmutes and keys for bare minimal effort in the dungeons, so why not the skill point too?
At the expense of removing the dungeon quest as per the thread title ["Please remove the quests from the old dungeons, ZOS"] request? No thanks.6 -
Braffin✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭I'd rather like to see repeatable dungeon quests (rewards only once of course).
I'm regularily doing "story modes" with players interested in slowly playing the quest and sometimes it's quite difficult not to "break" their quest accidentally.
It's just bad design. Players doing an activity together should be able to share the same quest.
So just make them optionally repeatable.
Never get between a cat and it's candy!
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Overland difficulty scaling is desperately needed. 9 years. 6 paid expansions. 24 DLCs. 40 game changing updates including One Tamriel, an overhaul of the game including a permanent CP160 gear cap and ridiculous power creep thereafter. I'm sick and tired of hearing about Cadwell Silver & Gold as a "you think you do but you don't" - tier deflection to any criticism regarding the lack of overland difficulty in the game. I'm bored of dungeons, I'm bored of trials; make a personal difficulty slider for overland. It's not that hard.2 -
RealLoveBVB✭✭✭✭✭Enter with friends, guildies or open a group finder, mentioning you want a slow questing run. Problem solved.0 -
thegreeneso✭✭✭People keep saying "Random groups are going to be random" when this topic comes up, but that is precisely why something has to change. Other players shouldn't have the power to ruin your experience like this. And expecting new players to manually create groups to experience dungeons for the first time is insane.
At the very least, skill points should be separated from dungeon quests.3