[PC NA] My patience has run out with the harassment in PvP

xylena_lazarow

edward_frigidhands wrote: »

You shouldn't be wasting your time or energy being upset about pixels on a screen.

Imagine someone using this defense in court for a cyber criminal. "Your Honor, it wasn't fraud, it was just pixels on a screen." Sorry but the way people completely forget there's another very real person on the other end... that's what's messed up about this whole thing. I used to bag and think it was funny, but when I noticed it really bothered some people, I stopped. It's really no skin off my back to stop doing that. There's better ways to celebrate your wins.

CompM4s

Marcus684 wrote: »

CompM4s wrote: »

I get zerged on by 20+ and get emoted and bagged for minutes lol. Right or wrong, its just kind of something you have to shrug off in online pvp gaming. Most doing the bagging are not great players and I recommend not to take it to heart.

Why would you lay there for minutes after dying? As soon as I die, I'm hitting the respawn key and looking at where I'm going to rez, or maybe checking the death recap.

*Points to forehead* You can't get offended by t-bagging if you don't see it.

I usually run in a 2-4 man group. So i’m waiting for someone in my group to set up a camp to respawn. Usually we are far from nearby friendly keeps.

Marcus684

CompM4s wrote: »

Marcus684 wrote: »

CompM4s wrote: »

I get zerged on by 20+ and get emoted and bagged for minutes lol. Right or wrong, its just kind of something you have to shrug off in online pvp gaming. Most doing the bagging are not great players and I recommend not to take it to heart.

Why would you lay there for minutes after dying? As soon as I die, I'm hitting the respawn key and looking at where I'm going to rez, or maybe checking the death recap.

*Points to forehead* You can't get offended by t-bagging if you don't see it.

I usually run in a 2-4 man group. So i’m waiting for someone in my group to set up a camp to respawn. Usually we are far from nearby friendly keeps.

Oh right. I didn't consider that since I'm basically always solo in Cyrodiil these days. I'm guessing as a small-group player you get more than your fair share of hate tells and bags, mostly from those that did the least to finally take your group down.

KiltMaster

Teabagging is just straight up not creative, but emotes?

I rarely stop to emote over someone but a /trebuchet or a /sweep gives me a chuckle.

cuddles_with_wroble

the problem with the whole tbagging is against ToS if they tell you to stop is that its often used to abuse the system. often times i get tbagged and then when i tbag them back they whisper to me to stop bcs its harassment which is very annoying.

i think its dumb that anyone can get banned for tbagging but if your gonna ban people for it than ban everyone for it. its way to hard to police whether your allowed to tbag or someone or not based on their consent.

id prefer if tbagging was just straight up bannable so that no one could it rather than how it is now where you can tbag someone as long as you have friends willing to mass report them if they tbag you back

Galeriano

Marcus684 wrote: »

CompM4s wrote: »

I get zerged on by 20+ and get emoted and bagged for minutes lol. Right or wrong, its just kind of something you have to shrug off in online pvp gaming. Most doing the bagging are not great players and I recommend not to take it to heart.

Why would you lay there for minutes after dying? As soon as I die, I'm hitting the respawn key and looking at where I'm going to rez, or maybe checking the death recap.

*Points to forehead* You can't get offended by t-bagging if you don't see it.

Sometimes people wait to be revived by ally or for camp coooldown to end because next possible spawn location is pretty far.

Galeriano

xylena_lazarow wrote: »

edward_frigidhands wrote: »

You shouldn't be wasting your time or energy being upset about pixels on a screen.

Imagine someone using this defense in court for a cyber criminal. "Your Honor, it wasn't fraud, it was just pixels on a screen." Sorry but the way people completely forget there's another very real person on the other end... that's what's messed up about this whole thing. I used to bag and think it was funny, but when I noticed it really bothered some people, I stopped. It's really no skin off my back to stop doing that. There's better ways to celebrate your wins.

Imagine taking tbagging into a court. "Your honor his virtual character was doing squats on my virtual character".

People forget that game is just a game and take silly things too seriously.

Vetixio

Tbagging and emotes are gamer culture and you just laugh it off, if someone is sending you hate tells then block and report if it is offensive. Don't react back or get upset as that is what these type of players want.

Rogue_WolfESO

Reporting people who stream snipe? How would this even be a thing? If someone decides to literally stream their game play for anyone to watch, expect some people to take advantage. You are showing the world where you are in game.

Rogue_WolfESO

Also, game emotes are put in the game by the developer for a reason. Their descriptions show their intended use.

Marcus684

Rogue_WolfESO wrote: »

Reporting people who stream snipe? How would this even be a thing? If someone decides to literally stream their game play for anyone to watch, expect some people to take advantage. You are showing the world where you are in game.

I believe ZOS put out a statement that stream-sniping is against the TOS, probably because they want to encourage players to stream and not have them be at a disadvantage. Probably hard to prove that you're doing it if you don't brag about it, though.

cuddles_with_wroble

Marcus684 wrote: »

Rogue_WolfESO wrote: »

Reporting people who stream snipe? How would this even be a thing? If someone decides to literally stream their game play for anyone to watch, expect some people to take advantage. You are showing the world where you are in game.

I believe ZOS put out a statement that stream-sniping is against the TOS, probably because they want to encourage players to stream and not have them be at a disadvantage. Probably hard to prove that you're doing it if you don't brag about it, though.

the people who get stream sniped the most are the streamers that make it fun to stream snipe them. if you go on a 20 min rant and get super angry than people will just keep doing it. if you dont react and just dont care then they wont lmao

nublife01

as a defender and staunch advocate for gaming culture, i said this in the other post and ill say it in this one. if nobody else will be, i will be gandalf in the defense of gaming culture and every cod 4 lobby against the balrog that is trying to change gaming culture into some words hurt digital pixels are irl serious relateable escrimate along with whatever else it is trying to indoctrinate nowadays. YOU SHALL NOT PASS. anyways.

teabagging has been a part of gaming since its inception. it is a huge aspect of gaming culture and it is only really toxic if you view it as being toxic. if someone defeats you by even the most unfair of means or even simply stumbles upon your corpse it is their right to do the crouch dance of shaming upon your lifeless digital corpse and shall always be so. if you do not like it you should not play pvp games with a crouch funtion because there is absolutely no stopping it players will always find a way. instead of complaining on the forums and trying to demonize a core cultural aspect of pvp gaming culture that will never change, you yourself should change in your perspective and realize whenever you or anyone else is being bagged the person doing the bagging is simply expressing their love and joy for pvp in videogames and you respectively should parade and celebrate that others such as this teabagger love pvp in videogames, because it is this love of pvp in videogames that keeps its existance as a hobby in this reality we call human life. realize that "haha i beat you" is love not hate and choose to spread love not hate just as these humble baggers do.

edit: YOU SHALL NOT PASS

SkaraMinoc

nublife01 wrote: »

teabagging has been a part of gaming since its inception

You forgot 30 years of multiplayer gaming (1970's to early 2000's) where people didn't do this. But let's assume you meant online gaming only. You still have 10+ years (early 90's to early 2000's) where people didn't do this. It first started in the early-to-mid 2000's with screeching 12-16 year olds playing Halo on console.

Marcus684

SkaraMinoc wrote: »

nublife01 wrote: »

teabagging has been a part of gaming since its inception

You forgot 30 years of multiplayer gaming (1970's to early 2000's) where people didn't do this. But let's assume you meant online gaming only. You still have 10+ years (early 90's to early 2000's) where people didn't do this. It first started in the early-to-mid 2000's with screeching 12-16 year olds playing Halo on console.

Before teabagging I'm sure the 12-year-olds found other ways to taunt, troll and grief their opponents.

SeaGtGruff

.

cuddles_with_wroble wrote: »

Marcus684 wrote: »

Rogue_WolfESO wrote: »

Reporting people who stream snipe? How would this even be a thing? If someone decides to literally stream their game play for anyone to watch, expect some people to take advantage. You are showing the world where you are in game.

I believe ZOS put out a statement that stream-sniping is against the TOS, probably because they want to encourage players to stream and not have them be at a disadvantage. Probably hard to prove that you're doing it if you don't brag about it, though.

the people who get stream sniped the most are the streamers that make it fun to stream snipe them. if you go on a 20 min rant and get super angry than people will just keep doing it. if you dont react and just dont care then they wont lmao

Yeah, I always just ignore mudballs and t-bagging and so on.

But that said, if someone deliberately does something over and over again to someone else because they know the person is reacting strongly to it, that is harassment, pure and simple-- and harassment is against the game's TOS and COC.

SkaraMinoc

Marcus684 wrote: »

SkaraMinoc wrote: »

nublife01 wrote: »

teabagging has been a part of gaming since its inception

You forgot 30 years of multiplayer gaming (1970's to early 2000's) where people didn't do this. But let's assume you meant online gaming only. You still have 10+ years (early 90's to early 2000's) where people didn't do this. It first started in the early-to-mid 2000's with screeching 12-16 year olds playing Halo on console.

Before teabagging I'm sure the 12-year-olds found other ways to taunt, troll and grief their opponents.

Sure, I can describe this for you since I was there.

I played Quake, Counter-Strike, and Team Fortress competitively in the 90's. The closest thing to griefing was spawn camping and if you wanted to taunt or troll someone, it was done via chat.

In Everquest, there was a scumbag way to grief players by dragging their corpse with the Necro class to places that were unrecoverable. Eventually the corpse would decay and the player would lose all their items. Additionally, players lost experience when they died and resurrecting other players had no Accept prompt. So you could drag mobs to AFK players, kill them so they lost experience, then resurrect them and repeat until they de-leveled.

In Ultima Online, players would sell runes and gates (portals) to other places in the world. Players would spam the Britain bank with "selling portal to Vesper for 200 gold". Someone would pay up and enter the gate only to discover they've been ported to the bottom of a dungeon to get killed by liches and dragons. Or even worse, get ported to a tiny island in the middle of the ocean where 4 of their friends ganked you and took all your gear. Now you're dead and stuck in the middle of nowhere while players taunted you and you could only respond with OOoooOooOooo, which was the ghost language.

https://www.imanewbie.com/imatoons/ima04.html
https://www.imanewbie.com/imatoons/ima16.html
https://www.imanewbie.com/imatoons/ima27.html

pedrogonzalez

SkaraMinoc wrote: »

Or even worse, get ported to a tiny island in the middle of the ocean where 4 of their friends ganked you and took all your gear. Now you're dead and stuck in the middle of nowhere while players taunted you and you could only respond with OOoooOooOooo, which was the ghost language.

Oh mate, what a cool content. That’s lit. I’d like to do that in eso everyday. But we don’t have this cool mechanics
We did something similar in wow. Looked for dps to “run a dungeon”, summon him with warlock under the water, where we all already was prepared to use nzoth knife, so we can kill allied side characters. Was fun as hell.

Rowjoh

Completely agree that T-bagging and 'Push-Ups' over a fallen player represents an obscene gesture and is therefore offensive.

But I completely fail to see in an 18 rated game, how the majority of emotes such as sweeping or dancing or clapping etc can constitute anything other than banter.

cuddles_with_wroble

Rowjoh wrote: »

Completely agree that T-bagging and 'Push-Ups' over a fallen player represents an obscene gesture and is therefore offensive.

But I completely fail to see in an 18 rated game, how the majority of emotes such as sweeping or dancing or clapping etc can constitute anything other than banter.

i get how it could be seen as sexual maybe but is it really offensive to you even tho its pixels in a video game? 99.9% of the time its a joke or a taunt and you do it to someone who either got outplayed really hard or most often when it happens to me its some person who got the last hit in a fight that didnt involve them for the first half. normally when i get tbagged i just laugh hunt them down and give them one back, i like to send em a cheeky smiley face in whispers too after haha

WreckfulAbandon

I mean it's one thing to tea-bag since FPS gaming culture has been pretty "steeped" 🥁 in it for a long time now. If a taunt gets under your skin, guess what, that's what it's supposed to do and you just got played like a fiddle.

OTOH the pushups emote (obviously in a very specific alignment with the dead player) is pretty messed up and I think it's a low class, borderline evil thing to do. That said, I don't get bothered by pixels on a screen and getting bagged/taunted only provides me with motivation to pay the person back with interest.

Erissime

OBJnoob wrote: »

I respect everyone's right to express discomfort with the act and file reports on an individual basis, depending on the longevity and severity of the harassment.

In a more general sense though I encourage everybody to have thicker skin about the issue. People are toxic in life... It is unfortunately not isolated to video games much less only ESO. I think it's a little over the top to link it to real life acts of ***, literal t-bagging, or even bullying. It's really no different from little kids flipping the bird or telling yo mamma jokes. It's distasteful and certainly not a part of culture we should be proud of but also not something we should take too seriously.

Trying to have a crusade against it really might just waste your own time and accidentally glorify their actions in a way.

And I'm not saying this pretending to be a "higher road," type of guy. Quite the opposite-- I generally tell people exactly how I feel and sometimes get in trouble for it. I get upset sometimes when I'm bagged, sure. But not for long. Not for as long as it would take to gather some clips and produce a report, is my point. Much less become the defender of everyone around me.

It is unfortunately an emotional "crime," that has two solutions. Ban everyone who does it... Or stop letting it bother you emotionally. As such it becomes a matter of philosophy -v- practicality. Which method will solve your problem fastest? And which solution will solve your problem more permanently and extend beyond ESO to similar instances you might encounter?

Exactly this! There are bigger problems to be solved in pvp (such as lack of balance between classes, desync, exploits of all manner and sorts one sees but doesn't have the time or the inclination to go out of their way to either record or report) - stuff who really bothers the game-flow as intended. Let emotes be emotes and leave the devs do the job they really need to instead of wasting their time for childish things - especially for someone else.

If nobody asks for your help learn that most of the time when forced like this on to them is a bother rather than genuine help.

Just because someone is new doesn't mean they are immature.

Erissime

And one last thing about this never-ending T-bagging thing. Just because someone, at some point, had a dirty enough mind to compare a simple animation of crouching then raising up and repeating it (which by and by in other games it has a totally different meaning, quite friendly and brother-like attitude!) - with what you all are describing above, it doesn't make it so.

On that line, if people enjoy continuing that tradition of flawed thinking instead of seeing things for what they really are ( a 3d animation in a game!) - and choose to give it real-life connotations, imo that's on them!

With that in mind, I actually know someone in that same real life who recently joined eso from play-station, and was mighty glad to join pvp. When he got first t-bagged he got happy! He said that person is friendly and is thus acknowledging their sportsmanship by crouching and raising, and he respects players like that! Go figure! (I had to explain to them what it is that it really means in eso, and stop him from doing it to others, while he meant to be ... friendly!).

So please stop the drama with something so elusive and meaningless!

boi_anachronism_

If i meet someone who ive beaten and it was a good fight i like to use the "offer weapon" emote. Sign of respect i guess. If they are being a total D, especially in chat they get a "kiss this" lol dont do that to newbies though. No point tbh. Feels cheap.

OBJnoob

When I win a good fight against somebody I thought gave me a tough match I walk up to their body and jump once. In my mind, that's the opposite of bagging. I have definitely had people misunderstand though hahaha. Had one guy, admittedly much better than me, follow me all over the map in a BG. I dunno if he ran himself out of stam (cuz I was booking it!) Or let his buffs drop or what... But I turned around at a chokepoint and gave him a shweet 4 or 5 hit warden combo. The gods saw fit to render me briefly lag-free... Because every hit landed, every light attack, every proc, every CC... And I won't say I deleted him but he died. And I ran over to him and jumped once. He played the entire rest of the BG chasing me... Managed to kill me once... And bagged the crap out of me. LOL.

Mostly just a funny story. But also... Sometimes, when you think you're due more respect than you really are, you take things the wrong way and become toxic yourself.

DaisyRay

I will never understand why bagging or emotes anger people so much. I usually laugh at it even if they aren't the ones to get the kill. I don't know, it seems weird to get so huffy and puffy about it, it's a game. Everyone is entitled to their own feelings and opinions though.

Also... that is you in that video lol so maybe practice what you preach.

EF321

DaisyRay wrote: »

I will never understand why bagging or emotes anger people so much. I usually laugh at it even if they aren't the ones to get the kill. I don't know, it seems weird to get so huffy and puffy about it, it's a game. Everyone is entitled to their own feelings and opinions though.

Also... that is you in that video lol so maybe practice what you preach.

It's not the emotes or crouching or whatever words, it's the intent to insult/offend/harass other players by any means possible.

ZOS_Icy

Greetings,

We have recently removed some unnecessary back and forth from this thread. This is a reminder to keep the discussion civil and constructive. Please keep our Community Rules in mind moving forward.

Thank you for your understanding.

Oblivion_Protocol

Regarding banning emotes, let me tell you a story. In Star Wars: The Old Republic (SWTOR), there are explosive banners you can deploy, similar to an emote. In PvP, for a long time, people would set up these banners on players they’d killed as a way of taunting them. The players who were subjected to this complained to the devs, citing harassment similar to teabagging (which you can’t do in SWTOR because there is crouch function in the game).

In response to this, the devs completely removed the ability to place explosive banners in PvP, because that was the more efficient option. The taunted players rejoiced, obviously.

However, the banner players were furious. Why? Because explosive banner was a reward they got from countless hours of ranked PvP, and now you couldn’t use it in PvP zones even if you never once taunted someone with it.

The point is, getting rid of emotes in PvP will only stir up anger in people who’ve earned those emotes and want to maybe roleplay with them or show them off. There is no good solution to this issue that doesn’t involve directly punishing the players doing it with suspensions and permanent account bans. Because even if you get rid of some game functionality that could be used to taunt someone:

If it’s not teabagging, it’s emoting.

If it’s not emoting, it’s jumping up and down.

If it’s not jumping up and down, it’s rapidly moving back and forth.

If it’s not rapidly moving back and forth, it’s spamming an ability.

If it’s not spamming an ability, congratulations, your toon is a statue that can’t interact with the world in any way.

Players are going to find ways to be toxic no matter what. Instead of attacking the ways to be toxic, you need to deal with the players. Because you know what happened in SWTOR after the banners got banned? Toxicity seemed to go up in other ways. The same thing will happen here if the issue is not addressed correctly.

Cloudrest

SkaraMinoc wrote: »

If I see you bagging ANYONE, you will be screenshotted and potentially warned based on whether the targeted player considers it harassment. If so, and the behavior continues, I will report you on behalf of the targeted player if they need help.[/s] I will not report anyone on behalf of another player, but I may guide them through the process if they need help. This mostly applies to new players. The goal is to make sure they feel welcome in ESO PvP and aren't being harassed.

This type of repeated harassment does not belong in the Elder Scrolls Online. Either stop or go play something else.

How curious that OP can't practice what they preach...

<snipped video due to naming/shaming>