Twilight Tormentor active ability tweak/suggestion

Dr_Con

hi here are some graphs

I would like to see twilight matriarch have more impact on low hp targets. Once you get to 50% hp there's no reason to activate the ability again, it becomes a slotted passive that only means anything for the first half of the target's hp. I believe it would be more healthy for the class if the damage was parabolic rather than L-shaped.

OBJnoob

Why the curve? Seems weird to me... And weird isn't bad, but I'm curious why you're going with that suggestion instead of simply just switching the original. Making it weak at high health but strongest in execute range.

Dr_Con

OBJnoob wrote: »

Why the curve? Seems weird to me... And weird isn't bad, but I'm curious why you're going with that suggestion instead of simply just switching the original. Making it weak at high health but strongest in execute range.

As we can see the active ability only works to increase the dps of the bird until 50% of a target's hp then the dps increase vanishes, making the active skill into a dead skill that punishes you if you use it after that point. Additionally, the tormentor also benefits from class passives like amplitude, making sorcs strong in the first 100-50% of life on a target.

The specific point where the dps drops off on this skill is at this point. This is part of the class identity of a sorc, to do more damage in this part of a target's hp.

However, we have come to realize that there is a visceral payoff to using skills the less the hp of a target has. It is not within any class's identity to do more damage the lower health a target has- it is simply expected.

https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/251063/pc-mac-patch-notes-v2-3-5

This morph and ability came out in 2016 and with traits like Bloodthirsty coming out much later (summerset?) and being encouraged on every dps build we all start to do more damage the lower hp a target gets. Sorcs also lack a class executable until a target gets to 20%. This means there's a significant dropoff from class abilities between the 50-21% range that isn't in the overall design of the class. The tormentor, which makes up for 2/10ths of the skill bar of a sorc for these reasons, should do more damage at low hp while retaining some increased damage at high hp to retain class identity. No activatable ability should do no damage at certain hp of a target- yes I will say that there should be reduced damage at certain hps (like executes doing 2000 damage + 6k if they are below an amount) but the twilight tormetor active doesn't have that base damage being done, by making the damage it does be parabolic there will be an incentive to have the skill be active at all/most times, rather than for just half of the fight. Additionally, the early phases of a fight are arguably the most easy, some may say the dps is not even needed early on in the fight. By shifting the class this way we can have our dps early fight boost our dps late in the fight at the same time.

additionally, by having it start off at high damage and only increase even further at 50%, the graph would instead look like this which would break the spell and the class in pve. there has to be a dip in the damage it does.



but if you are instead suggesting this



I believe it goes against the class identity of the sorc and many would prefer just leaving things as-is if this was the proposed change (I would see about half being for, half being against, making this a controversial change).

Overall, my proposed change in the original post increases resource utilization for sorcs but it won't ruin rotations. The tormentor will do its highest damage at 100 and close to 0% while doing the least damage at 50%.

Pelanora

Sorcs need an execute improvement yes, but please don't (only?) build it into flappy. Really hate that thing.

Dr_Con

Pelanora wrote: »

Sorcs need an execute improvement yes, but please don't (only?) build it into flappy. Really hate that thing.

Whilst I agree, they have to start somewhere with the twilight tormentor.

Them improving this ability to function at both ends of a mob's HP wouldn't be considered paying lip-service to a sorc execute, this skill has been relatively untouched for so long and needs to be touched up. A well thought out topic on the sorc execute could help the devs in their decision-making, but this is more of a light change that won't negatively impact users of the ability, and wouldn't break the class in either pve or pvp.

tsaescishoeshiner

I'd like to add that most builds I've seen recommend not even USING the Twilight Tormentor's active ability. even when the target is above 50% health.

In the picture of the tooltip above, you pay 2400 magicka (standard) for an increase of:

1400 x 60% = 840 every 2 seconds
840 / 2 = 420 DPS
Or, 8400 damage over 20 seconds.

So if you think of it as a standard DoT, it deals really, really low damage to activate. Might as well use another Force Pulse instead. In other words, it's due for a rework or buff anyway, but the current numbers would still underperform even if it had increased damage to low health targets.