the1andonlyskwex wrote: »Memory_In_Motion wrote: »i chose to refund the money and let them keep the motifs. This person has been very kind to me and so i'm gonna give them all the benefits.
It wasn't particularly clear from your original post whether the buyer was a friend or just some random person from zone chat.
My vote would have been "all sales final" for a random person, and one of the other options for a friend.
ZiggyTStardust wrote: »The buyer (and you) probably didn't know about the undaunted event that would finally drop the opal illambris weapons again after a few years. They were incredibly rare and probably worth the 13-17 millions before the event, but during the event the price obviously dropped significatly
TTC does not suggest anything. Only show listed prices.
No one asked him to buy at the start of the event when prices are crazy, just a hard learned lesson.
I think this is more than a little unfair. It's impossible for any addon to have a live feed to all transitions in the game. Markets shift and addons update within a day or two. TTC, you could go to the site and do a price check for a given date range, same with UESP. MM/ATT have specific date range options you can set where you can hold Shift or Ctrl or Shift+Ctrl. TTC isn't lousy, it's just one possible data point.Memory_In_Motion wrote: »i have determined that ttc is a lousy addon and is not at all trustworthy.
I think this is more than a little unfair. It's impossible for any addon to have a live feed to all transitions in the game. Markets shift and addons update within a day or two. TTC, you could go to the site and do a price check for a given date range, same with UESP. MM/ATT have specific date range options you can set where you can hold Shift or Ctrl or Shift+Ctrl. TTC isn't lousy, it's just one possible data point.Memory_In_Motion wrote: »i have determined that ttc is a lousy addon and is not at all trustworthy.
Addons are not fast with updating for market trends. It's not even that they're not trustworthy. The trends fluctuate with supply and demand. When the demand is scarce, people can list style pages for multiple millions and they will sell because everyone is doing the same thing. When a market is flooded, people compete for fast sales. If anything, the people listing at 200k~400k are the outliers until the market stabilises again around a new average which is much lower than what it was.
Another point to make is that addons are not infallible. If someone lists an item for sale at 200k, something which is listed by others at 15M, they can make a fast sale and then limit their addon's timeframe output (e.g. "sales in the last day"), thus skewing the data. This can work both ways. But it's not necessarily the addon's fault, and has little if anything to do with its trustworthiness.
You can't use a median for an item trend in one day, the much lower prices are the outliers until the average number of items being listed for substantially lower becomes the new median. No addon can do that as they are not a live feed, so it's not that TTC is being untrustworthy. "Suggested" prices are as close to median as you can get, since they remove outliers, while averages are, indeed, fallible. However, even averages will bounce around as more people list for less. You'll see both average and suggested prices dip over the coming days in all pricing addons. To call the addon lousy or untrustworthy is quite simply unfair, you just need to wait a day or two to see the results trickle in as they're not live/instant. That's not a design flaw with the addons, that's an access/API issue (it's not an issue).Memory_In_Motion wrote: »The addon use averages which are strongly skewed by extreme highs and lows. They chose to use averages rather than median prices so it is their faulty design that is the issue afaik, ergo their fault.
You can't use a median for an item trend in one day, the much lower prices are the outliers until the average number of items being listed for substantially lower becomes the new median. No addon can do that as they are not a live feed, so it's not that TTC is being untrustworthy. "Suggested" prices are as close to median as you can get, since they remove outliers, while averages are, indeed, fallible. However, even averages will bounce around as more people list for less. You'll see both average and suggested prices dip over the coming days in all pricing addons. To call the addon lousy or untrustworthy is quite simply unfair, you just need to wait a day or two to see the results trickle in as they're not live/instant. That's not a design flaw with the addons, that's an access/API issue (it's not an issue).Memory_In_Motion wrote: »The addon use averages which are strongly skewed by extreme highs and lows. They chose to use averages rather than median prices so it is their faulty design that is the issue afaik, ergo their fault.
Master Merchant clips outliers (it's an option in the addon settings) and TTC clips outliers in its suggested pricing (but not for average). Here's an item for example:
You can see here from this graph that the line is definitely not just an average (though you cannot see the actual values in this image: 12027, 12222, 18000, 1000, 6892, 5549, 7982, 3500). If it were an average, it would say MM: 8396. It says 6697. Same thing with TTC's pricing, you can see that the suggested price is wildly different from the average.
Memory_In_Motion wrote: »You can't use a median for an item trend in one day, the much lower prices are the outliers until the average number of items being listed for substantially lower becomes the new median. No addon can do that as they are not a live feed, so it's not that TTC is being untrustworthy. "Suggested" prices are as close to median as you can get, since they remove outliers, while averages are, indeed, fallible. However, even averages will bounce around as more people list for less. You'll see both average and suggested prices dip over the coming days in all pricing addons. To call the addon lousy or untrustworthy is quite simply unfair, you just need to wait a day or two to see the results trickle in as they're not live/instant. That's not a design flaw with the addons, that's an access/API issue (it's not an issue).Memory_In_Motion wrote: »The addon use averages which are strongly skewed by extreme highs and lows. They chose to use averages rather than median prices so it is their faulty design that is the issue afaik, ergo their fault.
Master Merchant clips outliers (it's an option in the addon settings) and TTC clips outliers in its suggested pricing (but not for average). Here's an item for example:
You can see here from this graph that the line is definitely not just an average (though you cannot see the actual values in this image: 12027, 12222, 18000, 1000, 6892, 5549, 7982, 3500). If it were an average, it would say MM: 8396. It says 6697. Same thing with TTC's pricing, you can see that the suggested price is wildly different from the average.
TTC records posted asking prices not actual sales prices. Also none of these addons do it across all guilds for all sales.
The addon use averages which are strongly skewed by extreme highs and lows. They chose to use averages rather than median prices so it is their faulty design that is the issue afaik, ergo their fault.
The addon use averages which are strongly skewed by extreme highs and lows. They chose to use averages rather than median prices so it is their faulty design that is the issue afaik, ergo their fault.
Why is it their fault if they are designed that way and tell YOU that in their description and settings etc.?
It's no fault because it's working as intended and the only fault was you guys not paying attention, and now ranting about it!
As always others are the ones doing the errors and you never are wrong? It's just unfair what you write here and in the end you should just live and paly without addons then as they are faulty and wrong...
And this is not off topic, you have started that thread and should live with the feedback too.
You could create your own addon for your personal needs. Howtos a nd tutorials exist, ressources to contact others devs too.
Instead you go the easy way and just blame the existing ones to be wrong because they do not exactly follow your ideas and best practices you assume they should follow
Maybe there exist "reasons" why they did it that way, maybe even technical reasons because of missing API, missing access to other data, server becoming slow and unresponsive if addons read each guild sales and data too often(what was the case and ZOs changed the access for servers performance), etc.
SilverBride wrote: »I've left off a 0 before and sold gold mats for a real bargain for the player who found them, but I didn't go after them and demand more gold because I had made a mistake listing the item. Why should someone who overpaid get their gold back?
If we make a mistake we are the only one responsible.
chessalavakia_ESO wrote: »If they haven't actually bound the motifs already, unwind the transaction as it's kind of clear neither of you really knew what you were getting into. If you are asking here, you probably didn't intend to give them a bad deal it's just the way it happened to go.
If they have, refund them the difference between the value now and what they paid.
When you look up a price on TTC for any big ticket item use the website not the addon so you can get a view of the more current listings for the item. The addon in game at times seems to overrate older data.
Yeah, it will stink to mess out on a large profit but, do you really want to live with knowing at the back of your mind how you got that large profit?