Caluurion's was stealth nerfed in PTS

lean

I see several threads discussing Cal, so I just wanted to confirm and show the PTS values. This is while wearing Oakensoul and having 5597 weapon damage.

Personally I think it's a great change. There are other burst sets out there, but they can be dodged and counterplayed.

AdamLAD

BEAUTIFUL ! Oakensoul nerf was BEAUTIFUL TOO. Although I do think they should specific PvE buffs to it. Too many people one shotting with these items. Glorious! Gankers had it far to easy for too long.

ShadowProc

Gankers will always find a way….

Complainers will always find an excuse….

xylena_lazarow

ShadowProc wrote: »

Gankers will always find a way…

Yea, skillfully landing your execute after the target responds to the initial burst, not letting Caluurion's do half your job.

Excellent change, the lower burst and shorter cooldown make it comparable to Ashen Grip, which still sees play.

Cuddlypuff

We must fight to keep the gank meta alive. The game needs more low HP archetypes to serve as VD grenades.

Shadowasrial

This is some bs. Nightblades can’t have anything can they? Babies got to whine about getting ganked instead of learning to counter and defend

sharquez

HISSSSS NOOOO DONT TOUCH MY PRECIOUS XD

ON TOP OF THAT IMBUE WEAPON TAKES YOU OUT OF STEALTH!
THIS ISN'T THE WAY!

React

Very glad that this set received a much needed nerf.

Solariken

Praise be

sharquez wrote: »

HISSSSS NOOOO DONT TOUCH MY PRECIOUS XD

ON TOP OF THAT IMBUE WEAPON TAKES YOU OUT OF STEALTH!
THIS ISN'T THE WAY!

Love the Caluurion nerf, but the Imbue Weapon NB nerf is a bummer.

OnGodiDoDis

Shadowasrial wrote: »

This is some bs. Nightblades can’t have anything can they? Babies got to whine about getting ganked instead of learning to counter and defend

You can thank me and others for that nerf. Read my "Rework Caluurion's Legacy" thread. Maybe learn how to use more than two skills from now on.

Tommy_The_Gun

Tbh. They buffed NB substantially this update, so I can see why they are nerfing Caluurion.

I would much rather have a solid class skills over having the need to use a proc set that acts kinda like a prosthesis for having a weak class combo.

And... is it just me or they kinda nerfed NB's gank builds (Caluurion merf + Oaken minor force) while still buffing NB's toolkit ? Because it kinda looks like this might be the case.

Btw.... *looks at buffed Plaguebreak & upcoming Nocturnal’s Ploy set*... um.... who else is moving to no-cp / no-proc after next update ?

Master_Kas

Tommy_The_Gun wrote: »

Tbh. They buffed NB substantially this update, so I can see why they are nerfing Caluurion.

I would much rather have a solid class skills over having the need to use a proc set that acts kinda like a prosthesis for having a weak class combo.

And... is it just me or they kinda nerfed NB's gank builds (Caluurion merf + Oaken minor force) while still buffing NB's toolkit ? Because it kinda looks like this might be the case.

Btw.... *looks at buffed Plaguebreak & upcoming Nocturnal’s Ploy set*... um.... who else is moving to no-cp / no-proc after next update ?

Nah I will play the way ZOS wants me to. Kyne+nocturnals with lightattacks and snipe from a zerg. Maybe with cost increase poisons aswell. :P

ShadowProc

OnGodiDoDis wrote: »

Shadowasrial wrote: »

This is some bs. Nightblades can’t have anything can they? Babies got to whine about getting ganked instead of learning to counter and defend

You can thank me and others for that nerf. Read my "Rework Caluurion's Legacy" thread. Maybe learn how to use more than two skills from now on.

It has nothing to do with you. Lol. Zos does what zos does.

etchedpixels

Tommy_The_Gun wrote: »

Btw.... *looks at buffed Plaguebreak & upcoming Nocturnal’s Ploy set*... um.... who else is moving to no-cp / no-proc after next update ?

Some of us moved in the dark convergence mess and haven't moved baack.

But they are really different games, different strategies and techniques and neither hold a candle up to minecraft bedwars.

DigiAngel

I'm confused. How was this nerfed?



if anything it looks buffed with the reduced cooldown? Am I missing something?

Hayblinkin

ShadowProc wrote: »

Gankers will always find a way….

Complainers will always find an excuse….

While I agree with you, I came here to post this

DaisyRay

I literally just stopped using this armor set in favor of something with more crit damage. It appears that I got lucky twice. Nothing that I really rely on in my builds has been nerfed. Still,  I feel bad for the gankers. Even though I get ganked frequently, I usually don't mind unless it's IC and I have a lot of telvar. It is not their fault that I got caught slipping though. This game, in my opinion, needs a diverse set of fighters. Gankers, tanks, healers, and other players all contribute to the unique and challenging nature of pvp. With all of these nerfs flying around, pve will be more difficult than pvp. Which sucks, that is the whole reason I play pvp. You never know what will happen, how challenging an opponent will be. Will I get too scared and mess up or will I actually try and surprise myself. It's exciting, but I don't want to beat people because all their best sets are now ruined. To become the best, you have to beat the best. That's all. 

lean

DigiAngel wrote: »

I'm confused. How was this nerfed?



if anything it looks buffed with the reduced cooldown? Am I missing something?

You have to look at the set while on a geared and buffed character to see more realistic damage output.

The reality is that the set now procs every 5s, but does 1/2 the damage that it used to do.

Here's what the damage looks like on LIVE, with similar stats (5321 WD):

DrNukenstein

RIP sweet angel

Getting your jewels golded was worth the obscene amount of gold

Getting all your weapons was worth the shameful number of Fang Lair runs

You were the 3rd skill that protected me from needing skill

Forever in our hearts

Caluurion's Legacy

Akinos

Shadowasrial wrote: »

This is some bs. Nightblades can’t have anything can they? Babies got to whine about getting ganked instead of learning to counter and defend

Can't have anything? LOL, nightblades already have it all and then some.
Good gankers will adapt and gank without caluurions...not that ganking the way most people do is hard to begin with.
Caluurion wasn't just a ganker set either btw.

Wing

Shadowasrial wrote: »

This is some bs. Nightblades can’t have anything can they? Babies got to whine about getting ganked instead of learning to counter and defend

the pot calling the kettle black

the irony

its so great

maybe learn to play a class or style and you yourself learn how to counter and defend, you know, fight?

then your only method of fighting wont require:

-attacking unaware foes
-from stealth or invisibility
-maybe with a friend
-the target having no ability to counter
-the target having no ability to defend
-hopefully with enough proc sets and damage stacked that it just deletes them before ping catches up
-perhaps while they are already in a fight?
-a losing fight?
-an outnumbered fight!
-perhaps even getting a treasure chest?
-hmmmmm
-IC even perhaps?
-then i can literally gank PvE'rs!
-they totally should not be able to fight back!
-i can wait till there already in combat with a tough boss. . .
-maybe they get low on hp. . .
-getting some Tel var adds to the salt. . .

. . . .

sorry, i got caught up in the headspace of your average NB ganker.

xxslam48xxb14_ESO

DaisyRay wrote: »

It is not their fault that I got caught slipping though. This game, in my opinion, needs a diverse set of fighters. Gankers, tanks, healers, and other players all contribute to the unique and challenging nature of pvp. 

I remember in a past patch notes zos themselves referred to an "assassin" role in pvp. Really doesn't feel like they actually want that role in pvp though and if they do they might not know how to balance it. If they don't want the big massive burst damage assassin/gankers we currently have, then maybe they could make the role focused more on heal denial or tank busting. Instead of instantly dying you would get debuffed to hell with viable anti healing effects that would make healing through the damage impossible. You would still die eventually from the lack of heals, but you would have much more time to react and fight back. More sources of oblivion or irresistible damage on top of better heal reducing debuffs would work to whittle down even the most annoying tanks. Just my thoughts on what the assassin/ganker role in pvp should be if zos really wants to remove large burst and not kill the role entirely. Assassin's typically target the VIPs, so I think having it be focused on killing healers and tanks would make sense.

xylena_lazarow

xxslam48xxb14_ESO wrote: »

Instead of instantly dying you would get debuffed to hell with viable anti healing effects that would make healing through the damage impossible.

You mean like the original Death Stroke ult before Defiles effectively got deleted from the game?

It's hard to balance an assassin role to where the play pattern is burst -> response -> execute, and not just no-counterplay instakills like we have on live, or wet noodles that can't kill anything like it'll probably be next patch.

I'm surprised it took them so long to nerf Caluurion's, given how much players hated when Viper burst procs dominated the meta, and the lengths that the devs have gone to dismantle burst proc stacking in general.

Necrotech_Master

DigiAngel wrote: »

I'm confused. How was this nerfed?



if anything it looks buffed with the reduced cooldown? Am I missing something?

on PTS the cooldown was cut in half, but so was the dmg

5 sec cooldown but it only hits like 5-6k tops

Amerises

This is a good change, though not just because of night blades. I actually appreciate where NB is at right now. Only the very good ones can combo me down. This set is used by many people, and coupled with oakensoul, everyone’s burst is ridiculous.

Having played the “assassin” in other games, to be good, you need to have skill. NB is no different. You should be able to burst someone down, but not handed to you. And if 1 in 5 are able to do that, that’s balance.

Assassins have to get in AND get back out. If you can take out 1 and then get clobbered, it’s not much of win.

xxslam48xxb14_ESO

xylena_lazarow wrote: »

xxslam48xxb14_ESO wrote: »

Instead of instantly dying you would get debuffed to hell with viable anti healing effects that would make healing through the damage impossible.

You mean like the original Death Stroke ult before Defiles effectively got deleted from the game?

It's hard to balance an assassin role to where the play pattern is burst -> response -> execute, and not just no-counterplay instakills like we have on live, or wet noodles that can't kill anything like it'll probably be next patch.

I'm surprised it took them so long to nerf Caluurion's, given how much players hated when Viper burst procs dominated the meta, and the lengths that the devs have gone to dismantle burst proc stacking in general.

Yes. Why did they nerf defile into irrelevance anyways?

They just need to make two test characters, one a pure healer and the other an assassin that can apply major and minor defile. Tweak the numbers on it until the assassin can over power the healer with damage. It isn't good enough until that is possible. If you actually apply both effects to someone and they don't remove it they should straight up not be able to out heal an assassin. You could argue an assassin should be able to out damage a healer even without the debuffs, so its a pretty bad situation we find ourselves in right now.

ShadowProc

xylena_lazarow wrote: »

xxslam48xxb14_ESO wrote: »

Instead of instantly dying you would get debuffed to hell with viable anti healing effects that would make healing through the damage impossible.

You mean like the original Death Stroke ult before Defiles effectively got deleted from the game?

It's hard to balance an assassin role to where the play pattern is burst -> response -> execute, and not just no-counterplay instakills like we have on live, or wet noodles that can't kill anything like it'll probably be next patch.

I'm surprised it took them so long to nerf Caluurion's, given how much players hated when Viper burst procs dominated the meta, and the lengths that the devs have gone to dismantle burst proc stacking in general.

Nbs were inherently weak before Cal became a thing. They did not perform the assassin role very well and lacked burst. I am worried that is where they are headed again. Building up a bow proc is not assassin playstyle. So where does the burst come from besides incap and surprise attack? They needed the crap out of half of the burst from Cal and heavy attacks.

I agree there should be counter play with everything except assassination. I mean it’s assassination. Lol. Removed that risk and make pvp more predictable and mark my words it will become stale again.

I cannot believe all the threads about nbs when dks and ball groups are a far worse problem. Tanking performance is okay but let’s remove the ability to take one player out at a time but also due most of the time. Lol

sharquez

I mean Luckily there are other traditional ganking methods that still work. But Caluurions felt nice. it was really just another path to take to get to the same result.

Back to Snipe/Onslaught/whatever-the-vampire-ability-is-called...

Or Just Bombing again.

Durham

Shadowasrial wrote: »

This is some bs. Nightblades can’t have anything can they? Babies got to whine about getting ganked instead of learning to counter and defend

So you like sets actually killing you? Proc sets are the bane of this game!

Durham

ShadowProc wrote: »

xylena_lazarow wrote: »

xxslam48xxb14_ESO wrote: »

Instead of instantly dying you would get debuffed to hell with viable anti healing effects that would make healing through the damage impossible.

You mean like the original Death Stroke ult before Defiles effectively got deleted from the game?

It's hard to balance an assassin role to where the play pattern is burst -> response -> execute, and not just no-counterplay instakills like we have on live, or wet noodles that can't kill anything like it'll probably be next patch.

I'm surprised it took them so long to nerf Caluurion's, given how much players hated when Viper burst procs dominated the meta, and the lengths that the devs have gone to dismantle burst proc stacking in general.

Nbs were inherently weak before Cal became a thing. They did not perform the assassin role very well and lacked burst. I am worried that is where they are headed again. Building up a bow proc is not assassin playstyle. So where does the burst come from besides incap and surprise attack? They needed the crap out of half of the burst from Cal and heavy attacks.

I agree there should be counter play with everything except assassination. I mean it’s assassination. Lol. Removed that risk and make pvp more predictable and mark my words it will become stale again.

I cannot believe all the threads about nbs when dks and ball groups are a far worse problem. Tanking performance is okay but let’s remove the ability to take one player out at a time but also due most of the time. Lol

No they were not! NBs have been strong for sometime. They just took a higher skill level then someone playing a DK. NB have some pretty cool and awkward abilities including burst that take some time to learn.

Kory

Caluurion's proc was free damage that adds to any nightblade combo, so the nerf to the set's damage is good I think. It was great while it lasted because nightblades can proc calurrions so easily and it hits so hard for an armor set....