My rankings of PvP classes

lonnml

S Tier: MagDK, StamDK, MagPlar
A Tier: StamSorc, StamPlar
B Tier: StamBlade, StamCro, MagCro, StamDen
C Tier: MagSorc, MagBlade
D Tier: MagDen

My thoughts: I just got this game 6 months ago. I started with MagDen which was a good intro class but it massively i
underperforms in PVP (BGs at least, it’s also fine as a tanky healer). Please add an offensive stun and please please please actually make our ultimates useful. The next patch needs more WD to northern storm. The Bear is such a terrible end game ultimate, why we have to slot it on both bars is beyond me. It’s so bad especially in PvP.

It’s no secret DK is OP. The most powerful class ultimates in the game leap and corrosive are insane.

MagPlar’s nerf to living dark will get it moved down a tier imo. I’m surprised DK is remaining unchanged next patch.

StamSorc is obviously getting a big buff next patch.

MEBengalsFan2001

The devs wonder why the damage in PVE keeps climbing up and up and up. On the PVP side players continue to complain about 1 or 2 classes being OP compared to other classes and this typically changes every mod or every other mod.

The issue is that the devs continue to BUFF each class without realizing that the changes are making classes stronger and is raising the damage bar in PVE and causing issues in PVP.

Devs need to stop adjusting damage upward and simply adjust skills primary function (debuff, buff, cc effect, Dot vs Burst, defensive, etc... and if anything adjust damage down while maybe increasing the primary usage of the skill instead. This way damage is lower but the buff/debuff or CC effect last longer.

The other thing is if you have a defensive ability it should not act as an offensive ability. If an ability primary focus is to do a CC effect the damage of said ability should be much lower or non-existence. If an ability is used to add a dot or can cause a dot its base burst damage should be much lower. Abilities that have a chance to be interrupted should have a bigger damage hit at the end of the channel with smaller ticks at the start etc... This game mechanic for damage is all over and there are more skills I wonder if the development that tweaked them are using that class vs. making adjustments that make actual sense.

This game like all other MMOs I have played seem to have classes in PVE and PVP that are FotM and it is getting old seeing such things in a game like this.

ZOS_Hadeostry

Greetings,

This thread has been moved to the PvP Combat & Skills, as it is better suited there.

Thanks

geonsocal

thanks for sharing your insight in to some of the upcoming changes, it's hard to keep up with all the changes, all the time...

lonnml

MEBengalsFan2001 wrote: »

The devs wonder why the damage in PVE keeps climbing up and up and up. On the PVP side players continue to complain about 1 or 2 classes being OP compared to other classes and this typically changes every mod or every other mod.

The issue is that the devs continue to BUFF each class without realizing that the changes are making classes stronger and is raising the damage bar in PVE and causing issues in PVP.

Devs need to stop adjusting damage upward and simply adjust skills primary function (debuff, buff, cc effect, Dot vs Burst, defensive, etc... and if anything adjust damage down while maybe increasing the primary usage of the skill instead. This way damage is lower but the buff/debuff or CC effect last longer.

The other thing is if you have a defensive ability it should not act as an offensive ability. If an ability primary focus is to do a CC effect the damage of said ability should be much lower or non-existence. If an ability is used to add a dot or can cause a dot its base burst damage should be much lower. Abilities that have a chance to be interrupted should have a bigger damage hit at the end of the channel with smaller ticks at the start etc... This game mechanic for damage is all over and there are more skills I wonder if the development that tweaked them are using that class vs. making adjustments that make actual sense.

This game like all other MMOs I have played seem to have classes in PVE and PVP that are FotM and it is getting old seeing such things in a game like this.

I agree with all of this. I guess it’s hard to balance the “every class every role” mentality while still making classes have a “unique” feel. I feel like they did this with necro and it was kinda haphazard. In my opinion classes should (loosely) define the roles that are being played.

gariondavey

You can't just give classes rankings and not say what environment you are in.

Small scale open world
Solo
Large group
Bg
Ic
Solo

There are many factors at play.

divnyi

What is StamDK and why it is this high?

lonnml

gariondavey wrote: »

You can't just give classes rankings and not say what environment you are in.

Small scale open world
Solo
Large group
Bg
Ic
Solo

There are many factors at play.

I guess i should have been more clear. I mentioned BG’s in my original post. I mostly mean small groups or solo, not zergs.

PvP_Exploiter

Fairly accurate, wouldn't make any strong argument against any placement except would take StamDK down to A or B.

Reverb

lonnml wrote: »

gariondavey wrote: »

You can't just give classes rankings and not say what environment you are in.

Small scale open world
Solo
Large group
Bg
Ic
Solo

There are many factors at play.

I guess i should have been more clear. I mentioned BG’s in my original post. I mostly mean small groups or solo, not zergs.

Then you specifically mean No-CP small scale. This doesn’t necessarily translate to CP open world pvp, although magplar and magDK are still on top right now in that environment, and magden is still on bottom.

lonnml

Reverb wrote: »

lonnml wrote: »

gariondavey wrote: »

You can't just give classes rankings and not say what environment you are in.

Small scale open world
Solo
Large group
Bg
Ic
Solo

There are many factors at play.

I guess i should have been more clear. I mentioned BG’s in my original post. I mostly mean small groups or solo, not zergs.

Then you specifically mean No-CP small scale. This doesn’t necessarily translate to CP open world pvp, although magplar and magDK are still on top right now in that environment, and magden is still on bottom.

I’d move magden up to A tier for CP large scale pvp. The group utility is some of the best in the game.

TheS1X

I think all classes should be nerfed to oblivion.

xDeusEJRx

Don't see an SS-tier for Restoration staff, list should be re-visited

ResidentContrarian

Gear still playing the game right now, so no list for me

PhoenixGrey

I m not sure why do we need tiers. Some of them are viable for pvp and some aren’t as the gap is pretty huge rn

TheS1X

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YmKK7kSojig

OBJnoob

divnyi wrote: »

What is StamDK and why it is this high?

In no proc cyrodiil my stamdk really only dies to magdks and templars. And only templars that are probably better players than me anyway. I’ve died to a stamsorc once or twice… definately better players than me though. I think it’s a pretty solid a tier.

Again, in no proc cyrodiil, id say magblade is in a decent space right now. I say that tentatively, as someone without much knowledge of the class, but having fun on one. B+ tier.

Can’t say much about the rest… don’t playm, don’t see them much. Necros are around, they might be the ‘average.’

xHotguy6pack

For just CP Cyrodiil I'd put MDK at a low A Tier possibly B. Mag Templar and Mag Nerco are the best. Both counter MDK and both are way too easy to play and have way more utility, damage and defense for any kind of play in Cyrodiil.

MEBengalsFan2001

lonnml wrote: »

Reverb wrote: »

lonnml wrote: »

gariondavey wrote: »

You can't just give classes rankings and not say what environment you are in.

Small scale open world
Solo
Large group
Bg
Ic
Solo

There are many factors at play.

I guess i should have been more clear. I mentioned BG’s in my original post. I mostly mean small groups or solo, not zergs.

Then you specifically mean No-CP small scale. This doesn’t necessarily translate to CP open world pvp, although magplar and magDK are still on top right now in that environment, and magden is still on bottom.

I’d move magden up to A tier for CP large scale pvp. The group utility is some of the best in the game.

Maiden as a healer more than a dps they r useful even stamden using a few magika abilities

WordsOfPower

If you can get relatively good on a Malcolm Sorc build they play as A Tier or above.

The medium armour one does very well in BGs.

CharlieFreak

xHotguy6pack wrote: »

For just CP Cyrodiil I'd put MDK at a low A Tier possibly B. Mag Templar and Mag Nerco are the best. Both counter MDK and both are way too easy to play and have way more utility, damage and defense for any kind of play in Cyrodiil.

They're all easy. Way too much gets said about templars simply sweeping endlessly. That skill is very obvious, visually, and it might look like that's all they do, but it's really not that simple. There is no class in this game that's particularly difficult to play. All have their little 3/4 skill burst combo, etc.

The main skill to learn in this game for easy play is how to run around a rock/tree/tower for 20 minutes and frustrate/bore people to the point that they get lazy about their defense and you can burst them down one at a time.

Baconlad

Go run a few BGs, magplar very rarely top 700k damage overall. Even less likely to get huge killing blow count. DKs mag or Stam consistently top 700k upwards to 2mil I've seen. Necro Stam or mag (is there a difference?) Get higher numbers as well. Stamblade get consistently over a mil. Magsorc does less but can be as high more times than not.

People keep placing magplar in top S tier ranking. But it's most definitely not accurate. Magplar is and has always been the class that can pack up scrubs. We lack oppressive damage, you can build anyway you like but a good player of any class will never feel like the damage from a templar is so much that all they can do is stay defensive. The reason I think people put them so high is that they can defend better than almost every class. Their defense can be incredibly irritating either built for damage or defense, very high defense. But it's incredibly hard to pull off "turn and burn" on templar.

Stop placing templar on top...please...zenimax keeps nerfing templar over and over due to this crap. Templar has among the worst burst in the game. I mean sweeps in ok, but that damage is overall even less than some other classes spammable, even though jabs is channeled!

I don't know...templar is not that great of a class people keep saying it is. Magden or stamen is worse than us for sure...but we don't rate S or even A tier.

xDeusEJRx

Baconlad wrote: »

Go run a few BGs, magplar very rarely top 700k damage overall. Even less likely to get huge killing blow count. DKs mag or Stam consistently top 700k upwards to 2mil I've seen. Necro Stam or mag (is there a difference?) Get higher numbers as well. Stamblade get consistently over a mil. Magsorc does less but can be as high more times than not.

People keep placing magplar in top S tier ranking. But it's most definitely not accurate. Magplar is and has always been the class that can pack up scrubs. We lack oppressive damage, you can build anyway you like but a good player of any class will never feel like the damage from a templar is so much that all they can do is stay defensive. The reason I think people put them so high is that they can defend better than almost every class. Their defense can be incredibly irritating either built for damage or defense, very high defense. But it's incredibly hard to pull off "turn and burn" on templar.

Stop placing templar on top...please...zenimax keeps nerfing templar over and over due to this crap. Templar has among the worst burst in the game. I mean sweeps in ok, but that damage is overall even less than some other classes spammable, even though jabs is channeled!

I don't know...templar is not that great of a class people keep saying it is. Magden or stamen is worse than us for sure...but we don't rate S or even A tier.

Battlegrounds is not a metric to determine a classes efficiency. DK tops damage because they're consistently putting out dot damage even when they're forced off the offensive. They still do dot damage. And while templars have a decent DoT toolkit as well, most templars aren't kitted out with multiple dots. On my magplar using entropy, solar barrage, damage morph of ritual(ritual of retribution), and crescent/empowering sweep, plus your burning light procs from spamming jabs, you have tons of AOE dot damage going out(especially if you toss bloodthirsty on top of it) which can push up those numbers. Problem is templars more often than not don't go for dot based specs, they go for what can burst down faster which is why they don't top numbers. Either way, BG's is hardly anyway to measure a classes standing. Templar is easily S tier, you downplay them a lot if you don't think they sit at the same level as mag DK.

Templar does not have some of the worst burst, this is just straight up not true lol. Clearly haven't played Magblade or Magden or even Magcro without using harmony trying to line up burst. Even mag sorc can be tough if you don't use overload. Basically Templar even at it's worst, running off meta skills/combos is better than every mag class except Mag DK doing the same and not running a meta setup or procs. The worst templar is better than the worst magblade, magden, magsorc.

Udrath

Problem is magden and magblade have like 1 good niche set each lol... otherwise every other set is just better on another class. Caluurion for example is better on stamblade now

rbfrgsp

The YouTube fashion for putting an "S" class above "A" class really disproportionately boils my ***. Just start at A.

Cadbury

rbfrgsp wrote: »

The YouTube fashion for putting an "S" class above "A" class really disproportionately boils my ***. Just start at A.

I've seen some add double and triples S's to their lists, too.
It just makes their tier list seem all the more arbitrary.

"Gotta switch out my class. It went down to A tier "

xDeusEJRx

rbfrgsp wrote: »

The YouTube fashion for putting an "S" class above "A" class really disproportionately boils my ***. Just start at A.

I think the reason it's normalized to do that is based on rarity systems in games. Where S-tier rarity is usually better than A-tier rarity and therefore it's just been normalized to have S above A and then it goes down the ladder as such. S-tier to D-tier