It's time for a battlegrounds only event

FeedbackOnly

To increase the population we should have a battlegrounds only short even like how undaunted event but for battlegrounds

This will promote new people into battlegrounds so we can have new modes or even more queues someday

gariondavey

Great idea!

FeedbackOnly

Such event would also shows zos cares about pvp community too.

Make it like explorer event nothing major but promoted joining content

mmtaniac

Yup and grant easy farm for good players.

FeedbackOnly

mmtaniac wrote: »

Yup and grant easy farm for good players.

It would balance out with population boosts. A lot of bad players would be against each other.

It would give them a chance to see the joys of pvp

Dem_kitkats1

That would be fantastic. It would be a great way to add an element of fun for new players, which is severely lacking at the moment, and incentivize the whole community.

mmtaniac wrote: »

Yup and grant easy farm for good players.

Great mindset to have in trying to grow the population...

DaggersKid

make bgs playable again before asking for a event, meaning make deathmatches only a thing and / or fixing the horrible objectives…

FeedbackOnly

DaggersKid wrote: »

make bgs playable again before asking for a event, meaning make deathmatches only a thing and / or fixing the horrible objectives…

It can't happen if we don't increase the population

DaggersKid

you can‘t increase population without deathmatch only or fixing objectives. so yeah seems like bgs are done for…

also i don‘t mind waiting 20 min instead of 10min to play smth i enjoy, because atm i wouldn‘t wait 1 second for an objective bg…

FeedbackOnly

DaggersKid wrote: »

you can‘t increase population without deathmatch only or fixing objectives. so yeah seems like bgs are done for…

Doom and gloom mindset isn't the answer either. We have tried deathmatch only. It actually decreased the population.

So let's get a lot more people playing battlegrounds then we can talk about splitting queues again.

One step at a time for change

Necrotech_Master

DaggersKid wrote: »

you can‘t increase population without deathmatch only or fixing objectives. so yeah seems like bgs are done for…

also i don‘t mind waiting 20 min instead of 10min to play smth i enjoy, because atm i wouldn‘t wait 1 second for an objective bg…

there are also those of us who dislike or dont prefer deathmatch

i would hate to see "DM only" be the only queue option again and would stop playing BGs again, and would rather play any objective mode over deathmatch (not saying objective modes are perfect, mainly due to issues with the maps themselves such as geometry cheesing with chaosball, or huge maps requiring too much running between the objectives in which it feels more like mini cyrodiil)

FeedbackOnly

Necrotech_Master wrote: »

DaggersKid wrote: »

you can‘t increase population without deathmatch only or fixing objectives. so yeah seems like bgs are done for…

also i don‘t mind waiting 20 min instead of 10min to play smth i enjoy, because atm i wouldn‘t wait 1 second for an objective bg…

there are also those of us who dislike or dont prefer deathmatch

i would hate to see "DM only" be the only queue option again and would stop playing BGs again, and would rather play any objective mode over deathmatch (not saying objective modes are perfect, mainly due to issues with the maps themselves such as geometry cheesing with chaosball, or huge maps requiring too much running between the objectives in which it feels more like mini cyrodiil)

That's why we need to work on increasing our population. We can have more breakdowns after that

We need a small event that puts focus on inviting players to see the joys of battlegrounds

Tommy_The_Gun

What you would get most likely is "afk bgs" event...

xDeusEJRx

FeedbackOnly wrote: »

Necrotech_Master wrote: »

DaggersKid wrote: »

you can‘t increase population without deathmatch only or fixing objectives. so yeah seems like bgs are done for…

also i don‘t mind waiting 20 min instead of 10min to play smth i enjoy, because atm i wouldn‘t wait 1 second for an objective bg…

there are also those of us who dislike or dont prefer deathmatch

i would hate to see "DM only" be the only queue option again and would stop playing BGs again, and would rather play any objective mode over deathmatch (not saying objective modes are perfect, mainly due to issues with the maps themselves such as geometry cheesing with chaosball, or huge maps requiring too much running between the objectives in which it feels more like mini cyrodiil)

That's why we need to work on increasing our population. We can have more breakdowns after that

We need a small event that puts focus on inviting players to see the joys of battlegrounds

The reason population can't increase is because two groups of players are forced to play game modes they hate and therefore clash with each other. People hated TDM only because they were forced to play tdm when they didn't want to and would avoid BGs entirely because of this, and the problem is the exact same with current BGS.
TDM players will either dodge BG's or throw every game turning every one into TDM.

The reason BG's cant grow is because the players aren't given the ability to play the game how they want. This is literally like what happened during Flames of Ambition no proc, everyone who hated no proc just fled to imperial city/bgs permanently because they didn't want to play no proc.

Not giving players freedom of choice results in stagnation or population drop-off

M0ntie

Good idea to encourage people back to BGs after many were driven away during the period where they were only DM.

LurgidBean

I just got into BGs during the most recent PvP event and I've already seen the population decline since the initial drop off.
I'd love to see a BGs only event! Seriously would love it. As a newer PvP player, I enjoy some of the objectives and death match. I feel like the fights during Crazy King or Domination are almost more fun than full on death match, because it's so responsive. Lots of fun in most modes! (Side eye for Relic Runner)

-
Probably another thread topic, but as a former PvE mostly player, with lots of PvP-only-for-fast-horse-or-caltrops player friends, giving the random daily XP bonus (or some percentage of it) to the losing team would encourage them to queue for the dailies, regularly. It'd definitely get new blood flowing!
I've convinced them to queue with me (Swap to Lady mundus for their PvE divines gear & sugar skulls for most basic, S&B if they wanna prep) after they realize it's just as good XP as a random normal. But, losing multiple times and not getting the XP boost is disheartening. And they're not going to keep going back if they're getting slaughtered and also NOT getting XP. They won't get any better without practice, and they're not going to practice or dump mats into a set of armor or time into new skills, if there is no reward, because it's a video game and rewards are how it's structured.

I'm sure that rule is there to prevent people from just standing at the base, so perhaps achieving a medal score of at least XXX even if you're on the losing team grants you the bonus. That way work is rewarded and you're not punished for lazy or bad teammates who stealth in a corner or spawn camp. I don't wish to dumb it down, or benefit people not playing but make it just a little bit more rewarding, particularly when you're still learning, since there is some level of "access" needed for PvP that PvE doesn't have.

I don't have a screen shot but as an example, we did a full 15 minute death match and the scores were all within 30ish points of each other. New friend was digging it, feeling pumped that they scored so high in BGs, but got a blue Cowards Gear belt and a trickle of AP for their trouble. Even getting rewarded 70% of that XP bonus would have probably convinced them to come back the next day, and get better so they get the full XP next time! Instead, they went back to cycling through all 14 of their characters in Stormhaven, running random normals for the guaranteed XP boost vs a chance.

(I know- get gud, you don't need rewards, the game is its own reward, don't be a whiney PvE player, chasing XP is stupid, the XP grind is easy just BRP bro, get better goals, get gud...have I covered it all?)

Amottica

Mayhem includes BGs. As such the desired effect is taken care of via the BGs.

FeedbackOnly

LurgidBean wrote: »

I just got into BGs during the most recent PvP event and I've already seen the population decline since the initial drop off.
I'd love to see a BGs only event! Seriously would love it. As a newer PvP player, I enjoy some of the objectives and death match. I feel like the fights during Crazy King or Domination are almost more fun than full on death match, because it's so responsive. Lots of fun in most modes! (Side eye for Relic Runner)

-
Probably another thread topic, but as a former PvE mostly player, with lots of PvP-only-for-fast-horse-or-caltrops player friends, giving the random daily XP bonus (or some percentage of it) to the losing team would encourage them to queue for the dailies, regularly. It'd definitely get new blood flowing!
I've convinced them to queue with me (Swap to Lady mundus for their PvE divines gear & sugar skulls for most basic, S&B if they wanna prep) after they realize it's just as good XP as a random normal. But, losing multiple times and not getting the XP boost is disheartening. And they're not going to keep going back if they're getting slaughtered and also NOT getting XP. They won't get any better without practice, and they're not going to practice or dump mats into a set of armor or time into new skills, if there is no reward, because it's a video game and rewards are how it's structured.

I'm sure that rule is there to prevent people from just standing at the base, so perhaps achieving a medal score of at least XXX even if you're on the losing team grants you the bonus. That way work is rewarded and you're not punished for lazy or bad teammates who stealth in a corner or spawn camp. I don't wish to dumb it down, or benefit people not playing but make it just a little bit more rewarding, particularly when you're still learning, since there is some level of "access" needed for PvP that PvE doesn't have.

I don't have a screen shot but as an example, we did a full 15 minute death match and the scores were all within 30ish points of each other. New friend was digging it, feeling pumped that they scored so high in BGs, but got a blue Cowards Gear belt and a trickle of AP for their trouble. Even getting rewarded 70% of that XP bonus would have probably convinced them to come back the next day, and get better so they get the full XP next time! Instead, they went back to cycling through all 14 of their characters in Stormhaven, running random normals for the guaranteed XP boost vs a chance.

(I know- get gud, you don't need rewards, the game is its own reward, don't be a whiney PvE player, chasing XP is stupid, the XP grind is easy just BRP bro, get better goals, get gud...have I covered it all?)

Maybe we just need more ap rewards. Even third place gets you good amount of ap.

_adhyffbjjjf12

Ultimately its gameplay issues that's at the heart of the problems with BG, and until they are resolved there is no real point having events. If the game felt fun and fair with decent rewards then new players would stay. Its the same as cyrodill it has had many events over the years, and population has gradually declined despite them, and in some cases because of them i suspect as players are exposed to the issues.

FeedbackOnly

_adhyffbjjjf12 wrote: »

Ultimately its gameplay issues that's at the heart of the problems with BG, and until they are resolved there is no real point having events. If the game felt fun and fair with decent rewards then new players would stay. Its the same as cyrodill it has had many events over the years, and population has gradually declined despite them, and in some cases because of them i suspect as players are exposed to the issues.

There's emotes, 6 different outfit styles, even if you get last place you get ap rewards. Not mention rewards of worth mail after each bg.There's also a vendor with housing rewards and motif

My conclusion is battlegrounds need exposure as such event to increase population

LurgidBean

FeedbackOnly wrote: »

LurgidBean wrote: »

-
Probably another thread topic, but as a former PvE mostly player, with lots of PvP-only-for-fast-horse-or-caltrops player friends, giving the random daily XP bonus (or some percentage of it) to the losing team would encourage them to queue for the dailies, regularly. It'd definitely get new blood flowing!

Maybe we just need more ap rewards. Even third place gets you good amount of ap.

FeedbackOnly wrote: »

_adhyffbjjjf12 wrote: »

Ultimately its gameplay issues that's at the heart of the problems with BG, and until they are resolved there is no real point having events. If the game felt fun and fair with decent rewards then new players would stay. Its the same as cyrodill it has had many events over the years, and population has gradually declined despite them, and in some cases because of them i suspect as players are exposed to the issues.

There's emotes, 6 different outfit styles, even if you get last place you get ap rewards. Not mention rewards of worth mail after each bg.There's also a vendor with housing rewards and motif

My conclusion is battlegrounds need exposure as such event to increase population

As a healer my AP scores are more of a trickling brook than bubbling stream, so I have no problem with that!
I agree 100% with the exposure. Battlegrounds are over-shadowed by Cyrodil during Mayhem events. Particularly for PvE players because the FOMO & the push is there to ride the double AP trains and zerg in Cyro.
My suggestion for the percentage of the bonus XP (or automatically getting the full daily XP bonus if you've completed 3 BG matches, even if you came in 3rd) came more from the idea of adding perceived value for PvE players. The "chance" at the bonus, for the inexperienced PvP players feels cheap. As I mentioned, that's 97% of my ESO friends/guldies. I'm regularly asking if anyone wants to join my random BGs, but don't often get takers, since I'm definitely not the one carrying the team to 1st or 2nd place.
The carrot of outfit style pages and emotes is very, very appealing for PvE players. They are just afraid of the stick because it turns out it was actually Volendrung all along. But the fashion lures them slowly.

Extra AP rewards as you suggest may work, but if you're trying to increase the population of BGs through people already playing the game, you're talking PvErs and that daily purple bonus XP is HUGE (plus transmutes). While that player is on to do their random normal, if you can also get them to queue for a random BG before they character swap to run the next random normal for the XP Bonus, you've increased the population. If they start running both randoms on multiple characters, instead of just the dungeon, you get variety of classes too.

Side note- Next PvP event ZOS should offer a small discount on armory slots to encourage people to create a PvP specific build.

_adhyffbjjjf12

FeedbackOnly wrote: »

_adhyffbjjjf12 wrote: »

Ultimately its gameplay issues that's at the heart of the problems with BG, and until they are resolved there is no real point having events. If the game felt fun and fair with decent rewards then new players would stay. Its the same as cyrodill it has had many events over the years, and population has gradually declined despite them, and in some cases because of them i suspect as players are exposed to the issues.

There's emotes, 6 different outfit styles, even if you get last place you get ap rewards. Not mention rewards of worth mail after each bg.There's also a vendor with housing rewards and motif

My conclusion is battlegrounds need exposure as such event to increase population

Just like cyrodill, exposure to bad gameplay helps nothing, and does do long term damage. That aside rewards are a side aspect only , but that aspect has to be interesting and encourage repeat play, e.g ladders, engaging visualisations of progress, multiple layers of rewards not just daily rewards and a notification or 2.

WordsOfPower

FeedbackOnly wrote: »

Doom and gloom mindset isn't the answer either. We have tried deathmatch only. It actually decreased the population.

Only because the random queue backfilled into DM.

You can't blame DM only queue for something that wasn't its fault.

The player base is divided in its fundamental mentality. That can't be fixed. Some people like game modes where running to empty flags is a viable strategy, and some people like fighting each other.

These cannot be reconciled. So accept the division, and fix the queue system.

As for the event suggestion by the OP, if the queues were split again and then ZoS made an event, it would still be a bad idea without educating the BG-curious player base as to what they need to be competitive.

Didgerion

FeedbackOnly wrote: »

To increase the population we should have a battlegrounds only short even like how undaunted event but for battlegrounds

This will promote new people into battlegrounds so we can have new modes or even more queues someday

..and they will be out of there the moment the event ends.

The only way to populate battlegrounds (that I can think of) is to give us a proper reward chart. Like a guaranteed legendary mat on the first battleground run, with a lower rate for the following runs, I'd definitely prefer battlegrounds over daily writs.

Or let them give us special tokens that we can exchange for any gear that exists in the game - PVP players will be delighted to farm in there instead of doing pledges or trials or other PVE stuff.

FeedbackOnly

Didgerion wrote: »

FeedbackOnly wrote: »

To increase the population we should have a battlegrounds only short even like how undaunted event but for battlegrounds

This will promote new people into battlegrounds so we can have new modes or even more queues someday

..and they will be out of there the moment the event ends.

The only way to populate battlegrounds (that I can think of) is to give us a proper reward chart. Like a guaranteed legendary mat on the first battleground run, with a lower rate for the following runs, I'd definitely prefer battlegrounds over daily writs.

Or let them give us special tokens that we can exchange for any gear that exists in the game - PVP players will be delighted to farm in there instead of doing pledges or trials or other PVE stuff.

Newer players don't know about battlegrounds. There's no mail like cydrolli

Didgerion

FeedbackOnly wrote: »

Didgerion wrote: »

FeedbackOnly wrote: »

To increase the population we should have a battlegrounds only short even like how undaunted event but for battlegrounds

This will promote new people into battlegrounds so we can have new modes or even more queues someday

..and they will be out of there the moment the event ends.

The only way to populate battlegrounds (that I can think of) is to give us a proper reward chart. Like a guaranteed legendary mat on the first battleground run, with a lower rate for the following runs, I'd definitely prefer battlegrounds over daily writs.

Or let them give us special tokens that we can exchange for any gear that exists in the game - PVP players will be delighted to farm in there instead of doing pledges or trials or other PVE stuff.

Newer players don't know about battlegrounds. There's no mail like cydrolli

A short event won't fix that. They should create a similar email for battlegrounds describing all the awesome rewards you can get.

RedTalon

Didgerion wrote: »

FeedbackOnly wrote: »

Didgerion wrote: »

FeedbackOnly wrote: »

To increase the population we should have a battlegrounds only short even like how undaunted event but for battlegrounds

This will promote new people into battlegrounds so we can have new modes or even more queues someday

..and they will be out of there the moment the event ends.

The only way to populate battlegrounds (that I can think of) is to give us a proper reward chart. Like a guaranteed legendary mat on the first battleground run, with a lower rate for the following runs, I'd definitely prefer battlegrounds over daily writs.

Or let them give us special tokens that we can exchange for any gear that exists in the game - PVP players will be delighted to farm in there instead of doing pledges or trials or other PVE stuff.

Newer players don't know about battlegrounds. There's no mail like cydrolli

A short event won't fix that. They should create a similar email for battlegrounds describing all the awesome rewards you can get.

What cool rewards I sell most of them and dismantle the rest for crafting

Vaoh

Definitely not lol. Most players have tried BGs and then quit for various reasons. The population in there is abysmal for those same reasons. Nothing changed.

A BG’s event is the one chance ZOS gets where a steady population will queue back into BGs. If these players see that nothing improved, it only reinforces their reasoning for why they originally quit BGs. Cyrodiil is already in this position which is why the population skyrockets during Midyear Mayhem. The players are there.... the PvP content just sucks too much to care about atm.

Improve PvP, then have an entire PvP chapter imo.

FeedbackOnly

Vaoh wrote: »

Definitely not lol. Most players have tried BGs and then quit for various reasons. The population in there is abysmal for those same reasons. Nothing changed.

A BG’s event is the one chance ZOS gets where a steady population will queue back into BGs. If these players see that nothing improved, it only reinforces their reasoning for why they originally quit BGs. Cyrodiil is already in this position which is why the population skyrockets during Midyear Mayhem. The players are there.... the PvP content just sucks too much to care about atm.

Improve PvP, then have an entire PvP chapter imo.

What's wrong with it?

Vaoh

FeedbackOnly wrote: »

Vaoh wrote: »

Definitely not lol. Most players have tried BGs and then quit for various reasons. The population in there is abysmal for those same reasons. Nothing changed.

A BG’s event is the one chance ZOS gets where a steady population will queue back into BGs. If these players see that nothing improved, it only reinforces their reasoning for why they originally quit BGs. Cyrodiil is already in this position which is why the population skyrockets during Midyear Mayhem. The players are there.... the PvP content just sucks too much to care about atm.

Improve PvP, then have an entire PvP chapter imo.

What's wrong with it?

I’ll try to summarize but I still wrote a few things off the top of my head.

Leaderboard/Medal Scoring. May as well rename leaderboards to “Matches Played” since this matters most. Also if you play the correct build aka a Crit Heal medal spammer you can get consistently insane points.

MMR is a mess. Did you play too much on one character? Now you can barely play on them anymore. I have a Magden who barely finds matches but my Mag Sorc finds them easily when there are other people playing. Also, not true visible BGs rank.

Bad Objective modes. There are modes which incentivize avoiding PvP to win due to the size of maps and small team sizes. It’s almost always better to run to the next flag rather than defending one. Some objective modes are so obnoxious that players turn the game into a fake Deathmatch so they can get some enjoyment out of it.

Only 4v4v4......
I hope I don’t need to tell anyone why this is horrible but I’ll list just a few things:
1. Deathmatch. Team A and Team B are full of skilled players. Team C has bad players. This means Team C has now turned into a score farm for the other teams. The match is now ruined.
2. Objective. Team A and Team B understand their best chance to win is to avoid PvP. Team C does not understand this and drags Team A into a battle on one flag. Great, now Team B wins the game because they grabbed all flags, avoiding PvP. Terrible experience.
3. Where is 4v4? 5v5? These along with competitive leaderboards based on victory are huge incentives for PvP popularity. What about 12v12? 2v2v2v2? There are many unique situations present in other games which do not exist here. We get only one way to play and it is a weird 4v4v4.

Rewards. This is an issue in endgame PvE too but it is especially an issue for PvP. Where’s the Mounts? Costumes? Unique ability skins? It’s just sad and not worth it for the sake of rewards.

Lastly.... Loadouts. Not everyone will agree with this one at first but this is how you create balance. It also allows the Devs to create fun game modes where maybe everyone it a permanent Bone Goliath, or maybe all we get to use are Templar radiant destruction beams with massive Spell Damage. In other words the game is balanced since we have a selection of possible skills/sets, and also there is room fun.

Just my thoughts.

People tend to forget this game has a massive population. You don’t see it in BGs or Cyrodiil though.

My favorite memories of PvP are from Halo 3 and Modern Warfare 2... both of these games found their own recipe for success when it comes to multiplayer.

All ESO does is enable/disable CPs or which game modes you can queue for lol.

_adhyffbjjjf12

FeedbackOnly wrote: »

Vaoh wrote: »

Definitely not lol. Most players have tried BGs and then quit for various reasons. The population in there is abysmal for those same reasons. Nothing changed.

A BG’s event is the one chance ZOS gets where a steady population will queue back into BGs. If these players see that nothing improved, it only reinforces their reasoning for why they originally quit BGs. Cyrodiil is already in this position which is why the population skyrockets during Midyear Mayhem. The players are there.... the PvP content just sucks too much to care about atm.

Improve PvP, then have an entire PvP chapter imo.

What's wrong with it?

there is a saying , no smoke without fire. New players don't stay and the population is low and decreasing.

Issues you don't see in other games:

performance issues/input lag
Build issues every release, e.g Dark convergance.
Gameplay issues, 3 teams, poor map layout etc.
No split between PVP and PVE skills/builds
Heavily build dependant, ie perversely vets have a build advantage over new players (other games standardise builds)
Animation cancelling
Poor reward systems, poor visualisation of reward systems

and as a result, in addition:

Poor choice (catch-22 - caused by above)
Poor MMR and matchmaking, i.e vets v new players (catch-22 - caused by above)